Gauntlet

On 7/31/2023 at 12:17 PM, LoneWolf said:

Diamonds are harder than steel, but are very brittle.   I am not sure they would actually have more defense than steel.   You can cut a diamond with a blow from steel.   Diamond should probably not have more defense than steel and might have the ablative limitation.   

 

Don’t forget that it is not that hard to make artificial diamonds.  Despite that they are not used in modern armor.  If they were effective armor the military would use artificial diamonds for protection.   
 

While I agree diamonds being useless verse Physical Attacks, it is possible that they could give better defense against energy type attacks. And considering that currently in real life the majority of attacks are physical in nature, it may change as direct energy attack become more available. Of course I am not a physics major so this is a guess on my part.

I will say that no figured characteristics does make it easier for new players. But then again, I am so used to having them they are very hard to get rid of.

If you were to purchase Desolidification based on density, what would you think would effect it?

So, I am checking to see what people think about the change from 5th Edition to 6th Edition. Do you prefer having figured characteristics that will increase based on the primary characteristics, or do you prefer all characteristics to be purchased separately.

Can anyone tell me what this one is?

How about something like this:

Character has a base speed of 5 and then the following:

+7 SPD (70 Active Points); Missile Deflection/Reflection Only (-1)

Now the character has the option to deflect/reflect attacks every phase without penalties other than multiple attacks on the same segment.

Can desolidification be turned on and turned off in the same phase. For this I mean can a character go desolid, move through a wall, and then turn desolidification off and attack? Or is it with Desolidificaton do you have to turn it on and leave it on for the entire phase?

On 6/29/2023 at 12:21 PM, LoneWolf said:

You only need to put the no skill roll required if you want to be able to change the powers in combat.  From the description of the power in the other post this looks like something that is not done in combat.  If that is the case, it drops the control cost to 8 making the VPP cost 58 points.  

 

As to being abusive any power in the game can do that.  If a character wanted the ability to turn into anything he wanted with no limitations that would definitely be something that should be vetoed.  But with some restrictions I could see allowing it.  If I have to kill and be able to read deep into the persons subconscious or kill and consume the character I am becoming, that is not as bad.  Also if all you gain are the skills and memories, but not the powers that also makes it less troublesome.  Something like this the GM should look over and check before allowing, but in the right circumstances is ok.  
 

I am looking to create a character that when it kills its target it becomes them for a limited period of time. Getting all their skills, knowledges, and powers. Then when they kill the next person, they become that person.

Checking to see if the power Multiform can be used in and Elemental Control, a Multipower, or a Variable Power Pool. It does show as a Standard and is even in the same class as Growth and Density Increase but I have seen a bit of controversy on this. Was hoping to see what people think.

Interesting, didn't think you could put Multiform in a VPP.

Anyone know of a way that you could use Multiform. I am making basically a monster who would kill and eat their victims and in doing so gain all of their memories and skills for a period of time. Then when it kills and eats someone else it loses all the previous skills/memories and gains the ones from its new victim. I wouldn't work if you had to purchase a new multiform each time but would it be okay to have the multiform change for each use based on what was consumed?

I actually would say that Reflection would be the best way. It is considered a thrown object and would be vulnerable to Deflection/Reflection.

This of course would mean that it is thrown in your hex or one hex from hit. If it is not you would need to dive for cover to the hex where it was thrown to or have stretching or perhaps TK.

16 hours ago, LoneWolf said:

If a character can stand inside a wall and only expose the hand making the attack, they are getting more benefit than others can get out of the wall.  I can purchase a penetrating sense and take no penalty from being inside the wall.  That character should pay to be able to do that.  The character that can move through barriers that are not solid like the T1000 in T2 can still be attacked when they are desolid.  That character I could see not having to pay extra to do that. 

 

If you can attack you should be able to be attacked back.  A normal character cannot stand behind a 10’ stone wall and fire through it.  They have to be able to fire over or around the wall in order to attack.  A character with desolidification can usually stand behind or in the 10’ stone wall and fire through it.  The wall hinders the first character, but not the second.  

 

A lot of it is going to depend on the special effect of the desolidification and how much protection it gives you.   The character that cannot hide in the wall is not getting as much benefit from the desolidification as the character that can.  The first character has to pay more for the ability to attack his opponents because he can do so from a much more favorable circumstance.   
 

If your desolidification does not protect against attacks, then to be able to attack someone you would have to be able to attack back. Now you might be able to get some cover but that is no different than anyone else utilizing cover such as a large rock, or a doorway, or edge of a wall. So much of the time there would not be a more favorable circumstance.

In order for someone to attack through a wall they would have to have the indirect advantage on the attack and a since allowing them to be able to see target. Just because you have desolidification does not mean that your attacks go through solid objects.

I do have one question through, when using Desolidification do you have to have it on the entire phase or could you use it for part of a phase. For example, would you be able to in a single-phase turn Desolidification on, move through a wall, turn it off, and then attack?

Would anyone be able to state what would be the best way for something to be able to steal the skills and memories of something they killed? I had thought of using VPP but you cannot put skills in a VPP.

That definitely is the best way to do it.

Not sure why it is even an issue. If you do grab something you can simply hold onto it without it counting as an action, you just pay END. A person with TK could grab a villain and hold onto him/her and on the next phase make a full move or even a different attack type (such as an Energy Blast) while still holding onto the villain. Even if you have the limitation full phase action on TK, you still can hold something after you have started the grab. As long as the target does not escape, you do not have to use any more phases, just END to maintain.

But if it is the case stating that if you have Desolidification that does not give any protection then wouldn't the limitation be more than a -1 as it is making your character gain no additional defense with no means of attacking back (without paying an incredible amount of points and END that is - as a simple 8d6 normal attack would cost 120 points and cost 12 END)?

As for using a wall as cover, any character can find and utilize cover with things as simple as doorways or a car or anything else.

Note: I just wanted to let everyone be sure that this is just a discussion for fun, not an argument.

Just wanted to see what peoples' thoughts on this are:

If someone (or something) has desolification with the limitation that it does not protect against any attack, does that character have to purchase affects solid to be able to utilize any of their own attacks while desolid?

On 6/16/2023 at 5:59 PM, assault said:

It would be worth looking at the point cost for such a big attack.

 

The character will probably be stacking Talents, Martial Arts, Skill Levels and Strength. It all adds up in a modest point total game.

Actually not that expensive. It would be as follows:

• Short Sword which is a 1d6 HKA with a STR Min of 10
  This would be no points in a standard heroic game where equipment is free or 5 points if it is not.
• STR bought up to 15 for 5 points.
• Martial Arts with Swords, say about 15 points (and many times would be less)
• 4 Skill Levels with Martial Arts which would be 12 points in 5th Edition and 20 points in 6th Edition (assuming there are more than three Maneuvers)
• Deadly Blow with Swords Only for 7 points

This would allow a character to be able to do 3d6 Killing Damage and would only cost about 39 points (43 if you have to pay points for equipment) in a 5th Edition game and about 47 points (or 52 if you have to pay points for equipment) in a 6th Edition. Not all that much for a character setup in 5th Edition as even if only a competent normal you are allowed 100 points (50 Base & 50 Disadvantages), and even easier for a standard heroic which allows 150 points total with 75-point base and 75 in Disadvantages. In 6th Edition it would be just as easy as 6th Edition characters usually start with more points.

One thing though, I don't allow characters to purchase both Combat Luck and Armor Mastery. They can have one or the other, not both.

59 minutes ago, LoneWolf said:

Neither of these gives the impenetrable advantage.  Was this intentional?

   

You should also specify that the character must not only be aware of the attack but also be maneuver.  This might be worth more of a limitation.  
 

Yes, Impenetrable is not part of it as Penetrating damage is not stopped.

And you are right I did forget Restrainable changing it to the following:

Armor Mastery I

Armor (4 PD/4 ED) (12 Active Points); Only Half as Much as Worn Armor (-½), OIF (-½), Must be Aware of Attack (-½), Restrainable (-½), Not verse Critical Hit (-¼), Not verse AE (-¼)

3 Points

Armor Mastery II

Armor Mastery II:  Hardened (+¼) for up to 36 Active Points of Worn Armor (9 Active Points); OIF (-½), Must be Aware of Attack (-½), Restrainable (-½), Not verse Critical Hit (-¼), Not verse AE (-¼)

3 Points

12 minutes ago, greypaladin_01 said:

I agree that this seems like a very fun idea, and great for giving characters ways to specialize.   But how does it balance against the damage output in the game.

While I am still studying Fantasy Hero, it seems to me that most attacks are going to fall in the 1d6 to 2d6 range.    With Plate already being DEF 8 and as pointed out above, these skills adding could take you to DEF 12.   Meaning that other than a bit of STUN attacks will do nothing at all to a character.   Especially if with DEF 12 and then say a normalish PD of 5 or so.    That gives 17 defense against STUN attacks... even a 2d6 max roll of 12 with max STUNx of 3 would only take 19 STUN.

 

While this would (probably) be enough to Stun the character... it will certainly not be enough to KO them alone.   And if you HAVE to get a max damage roll just to have any real effect... is it TOO much then?

 

This is part of what I am trying to work through on the non-superhero side of HERO.   Things get very tight and I am curious how other people see something like this working in play.

It definitely depends on the game. In my game I have found that attacks many times can get over 3d6 KA and even 4d6 KA with use of STR, Skill Levels, and Martial Arts. And since we utilize hit locations, the STUN Multiplier can go up to x5. Below is an example.

Fighter with 2 Handed Sword

2d6 HKA with 17 STR Min

Offensive Strike ads 4 Damage Classes making the damage 2&1/2d6

Utilizing 4 Skill Levels increases the damage to 3d6+1

Average Damage with Chest Shot: 12 BODY and 36 STUN

In addition, you are assuming that a character is wearing Full Plate Mail. Normally due to STR and Price in Gold, most are wearing Chain which is only 6 DEF making the total DEF with the Talent 9.

Should the exact same hit be in the head the damage would be 12 BODY and 60 STUN and if the character isn't wearing 8 DEF Armor the BODY taken is doubled.

On 6/14/2023 at 11:18 AM, bluesguy said:

How is this different than Combat Luck?

It is rather similar in many ways but the big difference is that this does require armor to be worn and will not only make the added DEF bonus hardened but the armor itself hardened as well. So if a character has purchased both I and II and is wearing full plate they will have 12 points of hardened resistant defense rather than just 3.

I definitely would have to say that Transform is the best but another option might be drain both Recovery and Regeneration with an advantage to make it take much longer to return. I have used it in one of my games with the following writeup:

Ray of UnHealing

Drain REC & Regeneration 2d6, Expanded Effect (REC & Regeneration) (+½), Delayed Return Rate (points return at the rate of 5 per Season; +3) (90 Active Points); OAF Expendable (Very Difficult to obtain new Focus; Flesh from Undead Creature; -1 ½), Side Effects (Same Power on Caster; -1), Extra Time (Full Phase, -½), Requires A Roll (Magic roll; -½), Gestures (-¼), Incantations (-¼), Unified Power (-¼), Can Be Deflected (-¼)

Cost: 16

END: 9

Of course, this is assuming that you require all spell casters to have a magic roll.

12 hours ago, Ninja-Bear said:

Would not the Hero rule of Round in character’s favor apply? I would think so.

Yea, that definitely makes sense.

Anyone else have any interesting FH Talents?

Not sure of one thing though, with Armor Mastery I would it be better to round up or round down for the armor bonus.

For example

Would 7 Defense Armor gain either 3 Def (round down) or 4 Def (round up)?