Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

[Wanderer]

OK, having done it with for four-color, let's done it with its opposite number: Iron Age, Realistic, Gritty, Grim, Dark, Post-Modern, Shades of Grey, Ultimate, Image you know what I mean.

 

Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

Corrupt intelligence or government high-ranking officials/cabals trying to manipulate the heroes

 

Supers burdened with mystical/ultra-technological power sources that are as much as a curse as a blessing

 

Alternatively: Mutants. A lot of feared and misunderstood mutants. With the public hysteria to boot

 

Revealing and sexy, or *really* skintight, costumes, with a lot of leather and metal

 

The hunk/supermodel body types to fit them

 

Multiple layers of Truth, Half-Truth, and Falsehood. The real deal about the character's origin, past history, the supporting characters' real motives, is never actually what it seems to be.

 

Skyrocketing crime rates, and a thoroughly corrupt, inept, or binded in red tape police.

 

Dramatic socio-economic divides: the have-nots literally live in gutters, and are legion. The haves live existences of ostentatious opulence.

 

Crumbling city streets

 

Overarching crime syndacates

 

Conspiracies everywhere

 

Supers that kill those they deserve it

 

Villains with motivations just only one step from heroic - or so thoroughly evil that any means feels justified vs. them

[Mentor]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

Every hero's parents are supervillains, archcriminals, or secret government conspirators.

 

The base computer is an evil/corrupted/possessed AI.

 

Vampires, Psychopathic loners, unstable virus infected androids, and sociopathic angst filled teens are all viable character concepts.

 

Police, security and military organizations are all rogue or corrupted formations.

 

The average citizens are generally protected despite the fact that they will form xenophbic, bigoted anti mutant/super mobs at the behest of the most unlikely politician.

 

One of the PCs will have their costume, power armor or focus take on an independently evil personality far outstripping the capabilities it possessed when in the character's possession.

[nexus]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

"Heroes" and "Villians" whos methods, movtivations and appearance are so interchangable if one of them didn't have their name on the cover you'd never know which was which.

 

"Realistic" costumes which, for women, tend to boil down to two dots and dash.

 

Heroes with some form of sexual dysfunction or at least a "kink".

 

Gratious foul language

 

"Complex" plots that are typically resolved via bone crushing violence and bloodshed.

 

A surprsingly black and white world under all the grit, just "black" is winning or at least dominant.

 

edit:Cleaned up some typos

[Doug McCrae]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

A surprsingly black and white under all the grit' date=' just "black" is winning or at least dominant.[/quote']Abso-fucking-lutely. I think people get the 'shades of grey' idea from Watchmen. It is to be found nowhere else in the Iron Age.

[nexus]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

Post Modern and down right surreal characters with weird weird powers.

 

Code names with the words "Blood, Death, Kill, Stryke (Y replaces I allot in the Iron Age)"

 

No Codename at all, but a "real name" that sounds remarkably like one

 

Major Cities utterly devastated, millions of people killed and the next week or so no one seems to remeber or care.

[Wanderer]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

Nexus- play nice, please.

 

Do notice that I didn't post in the four color thread about all those things that make it ridiculous, annoying and laughable IMO.

 

Please return the favor. If you despise the genre, abstain from commenting.

[nexus]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

I thought I was pointing out silly cliched things about Four Color settings when I started that thread, my friend. The point was illustrate cliches AND conventions of the setting.

[nexus]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

And for what its worth, I actually like a few "Iron Age" comics that I do enjoy (Marvel's Ultimates line is promising), but it does have its cliches and some absolute drek, IMO.

[AngryBug]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

I thought I was pointing out silly cliched things about Four Color settings when I started that thread' date=' my friend. The point was illustrate cliches AND conventions of the setting.[/quote']

A cliche is usually just an overused convention, isn't it?

[nexus]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

A cliche is usually just an overused convention' date=' isn't it? [/quote']

 

Its a redundant Oxymoron.

 

Another definition is aconvention is something you like and a cliche is something you don't.

[AngryBug]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

Its a redundant Oxymoron.

 

QUOTE]

 

Okay, I don't know what an "Oxy" is, but I don't appreciate being called "moron"...

[Wanderer]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

I thought I was pointing out silly cliched things about Four Color settings when I started that thread' date=' my friend. The point was illustrate cliches AND conventions of the setting.[/quote']

 

OK, sorry if I overreacted. It's just that it seemed to me there was a definite bias in favour of four-color and against iron-age on these boards, and me being definitely of the opposite conviction, I have started to feel more than a bit defensive (expecially after our heated debate on world-taking-over supers last month, and the amount of hate currently being poured on my favourite comic -Authority-). But I excuse for having misinterpreted you. Please feel free to contribute as much as you can.

 

Let's go on with the cliches!

[AngryBug]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

Guns, guns, guns and guns

 

Hero whose headquarters is a dirty old run-down warehouse

 

DNPCs whose only purpose is to be killed, sending hero out for revenge

 

Heroes who never smile unless someone is about to be horribly killed

 

The sun almost never comes out, and if it does it's only seen through dark, dramatic-shadow-casting venetian blinds

 

A hero with barbed wire or spikes stuck into/through his arm

[Guest Worldmaker]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

What a good non-four color comic book needs:

 

So-called "heroes" who are, in actuality, mass-murdering psychopaths and sociopaths.

 

So-called "heroes" who, because they are too powerful for any police force to handle, not to mention because they, themselves, consider themselves to be above the laws of civilized man, committ the most heinous of crimes at will with no fear of punishment.

 

So-called "heroes" who, in a drive to murder some so-called "villains", are quite cheerfully willing to rack up thousands and thousands of cilivian casualties if doing so means they kill the villains.

 

So-called "heroes" for whom "arrest, followed by a trial by jury and lawfully mandated punishment" is not only a "quaint, if ridiculous sentiment", but an absolute alien concept.

 

The only moral difference between the "heroes" and the "villains" is that the "heroes" consider themselves the good guys, despite lacking any sense of morality, compassion, or any value of human life.

 

A background universe in which every assumption is geared to make the actions and opinions of the so-called "heroes" correct, regardless of how evil and vile these actions or opinions truly are.

 

Countries whose governments are so corrupt that the "heroes" have "no choice" but to murder everyone in government and take over, combined with general populations who absolutely do not mind suddenly being put under the absolute iron thumb of a metarchy despite the "heroes" in question being as sadistic and facistic in their motives as any of the murdered politicians.

 

The assumption that anyone who disagrees with the "heroes" is either a criminal so vile that he is thus worthy of being murdered by the "heroes", is self-deluded about "the way the world works" and is swiftly murdered by the "villains", or else is simply too weak to be effective and is swiftly killed by the "villains". Under no circumstance will the person disagreeing with the heroes be allowed to do anything that might call into question the morals of the so-called "heroes".

 

 

Hey, Wanderer... is this any better? I don't want you to think I'm being too critical or anything.

[Doug McCrae]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

You're going too far now, Worldmaker. There's much more to the Iron Age than just the Authority. I can't stand the Authority, either (well Millar's Authority - Ellis was good), but there's loads of Iron Age stuff I do like - DKR, Watchmen, Marshal Law and all the 90s retro/postmodern comics for example.

[Guest Worldmaker]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

You're going too far now' date=' Worldmaker. There's much more to the Iron Age than just the Authority. I can't stand the Authority, either, but there's loads of Iron Age stuff I do like - DKR, Watchmen, Marshal Law and all the 90s retro/postmodern comics for example.[/quote']

 

Oh, I agree... I absolutely agree. One of my favorites was always the first Punisher mini-series.

 

As for my previous post... maybe I should save it for the "Name several reasons why the Authority is not only utterly ridiculous, but could only really be enjoyed by sociopaths with no moral sense." discussion.

[Doug McCrae]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

Superheroes deposing heads of state - Youngblood #1, The Authority

 

Superheroes then going on to set themselves up as rulers of the world - Squadron Supreme, Miracleman, The Order

 

Proactive superheroes - Force Works

 

Villain to hero side switching even more common (Venom, Magneto, Sabretooth, Rogue), heroes can become villains now (Hal Jordan, Archangel)

 

Asshole superheroes, often rightwing - USAgent, Guy Gardner, Lobo

 

Big crossovers involving hundreds of superheroes happen at least once per year.

 

Universal reboots - Crisis, Zero Hour, Heroes Reborn

 

Normals in a world of superheroes - Astro City, Powers, Alias (sort of)

 

Steroid monsters - Bane, Venom

 

The supernatural - Ghost Rider, Spawn, Vertigo

 

Cyborgs

Ninjas

Psychics

Women with colossal hooters

Psychic cyborg ninja babes with colossal hooters

 

The cowled urban vigilante becomes a totally grim uber-badass - he was just one of the guys before

 

A resurgence of old GA/SA heroes - Supreme, Kingdom Come

[Guest Worldmaker]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

Does Kingdom Come qualify? I thought it was a very four-color story.

[nexus]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

Does Kingdom Come qualify? I thought it was a very four-color story.

 

Thats an odd thing. Sometime the difference between Four Color and "Iron Age" is a matter of opinion, or very slight indeed.

 

But please, lets keep this pleasant joking. I mean when you boil it down we're all grown people reading stories about power fantasies that wear their underwear on the outside.

[nexus]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

Women with colossal hooters

Psychic cyborg ninja babes with colossal hooters

 

 

Lets be fair Colossal hooters are no rare visitor in Four Color. Power Girl, anyone?

[Guest Worldmaker]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

One good cop in a sea of corruption.

 

An asylum for the criminally insane that is as much a horror show as the psychotics that are imprisoned there.

 

No bystander is truly innocent.

[Doug McCrae]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

Gangbangers with superpowers - Blood Syndicate, Marshal Law

[freakboy6117]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

women with collosal hooters and soem sort of liquid spine that allows them to pose with huge guns in ways that wouldn';t be possible for the worlds greatest contortionists

[zornwil]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

What a good non-four color comic book needs:

 

So-called "heroes" who are, in actuality, mass-murdering psychopaths and sociopaths.

(snip)

 

Bitter, much?

 

Sounds like bad experiences!

[zornwil]

Re: Any Good Non-Four Color Super Game Needs:

 

Does Kingdom Come qualify? I thought it was a very four-color story.

I can KIND of see that, but I thought it was more non- than 4-. However, I'd have to go back and reread it, I can't recall it well enough but it seemed rather in a different pond. Now I'll have to see.