In need of help!

[MidnightLich]

Hello! I'm going to be running a Hero game for my group of players, starting sometime in the next few weeks. We're all experienced gamers, but we've never played Hero before - always D&D or other d20 variations.

 

I have a good grasp of the rules, but I'm having a lot of difficulty figuring out how to create "encounters." In d20, they have a nice system for gaging the difficulty of a fight in regards to the players abilities - maybe I'm just too dependant on it.

 

We'll be playing in the Champions universe, and the characters will be standard superheroes (200 points, 150 disadvantage points). I guess I'm just looking for advise from experienced game masters on what to do (or not to do)...

 

Thanks,

-crp

[Trebuchet]

Re: In need of help!

 

Hero combat is complicated compared to D&D, so I'd ease into it. For new players, I like to start out with a battle against gang members or terrorists. Supers are generally tough enough to survive mistakes against bad guys armed with pistols and AK-74s, and it will reinforce in their minds how much more powerful they are than normal humans. Use three or four thugs per hero, or use fewer but have them strike from ambush.

[Supreme Serpent]

Re: In need of help!

 

Try this old thread:

 

Balancing villains

[CourtFool]

Re: In need of help!

 

You could also run a combat session just so your players are familiar with the rules and such. It would give you a chance to try out a few opponents. Throw some thugs at them, then have them battle each other and then throw a big baddie at them.

[Sean Waters]

Re: In need of help!

 

There's a lot to be said for using goons/mooks/agents as the first opponents - not least because it means there's still that thrill to come when the face a 'real' villain.

 

On the other hand, the advantage of using a single villain that is slightly more powerful than any one group member is that:

 

a. Less work for the GM, especially if you are not experienced with the rules

b. Any hero could take out several mooks, but it will take a team to taje out a villain - it encourages a team spirit right from the start

c. The players may well be expecting a superpopwered threat - unless you are playing an 'origins' story and this really is theri first time on the streets.

 

If you do use a villain, unless you have one in mid for an ongoing story arc, can I suggest a Hulk type, but scaled down? It has several advantages:

 

1. It is tough enough to take a few hits and strong enough to be scary

2. It isn't quick enough or smart enough to be in any real danger of taking out the whole team

3. There are limited basic combat actions but myriad opportunities to tear up scenery and throw heavy objects, which is always impressive

4. It is an easy archetype for the GM to run: tactics and options are pretty basic

 

The power level should depend on the size and power of the team. You mention 300 point heroes: if so I'd make a single villain between 50 and 100 points more powerful, but that is very much a guideline. Look at PC damage classes - they should all be able to cause some damage or effect to the Hulk-clone. Also look at PC defences - make sure you won't be killing them with one punch.

 

Seriously consider giving the Hulk-clone Damage Resistance, which will keep him on his feet without making him impossible to hurt.

 

If there is a PC mentalist, that is a problem: they tend to have an all or nothing effect on single opponents. You could try this though:

 

6d6 Aid to EGO, self only, only following a Mind Control or Mental Illusions, gradual effect (1 turn)

 

- basically you can control the damn thing, but it will only be effective for a couple of phases - making the mentalist useful but not a scenario smasher.

 

Anyway, that's my suggestion: have fun whatever you do.

[Vondy]

Re: In need of help!

 

I would create a situation where you can start of with some weak opposition, just to see how it goes, and then increase the opposition as the story continues. This will help you guage the pcs abilities without hitting them with something out of their league by accident.

[MidnightLich]

Re: In need of help!

 

Thank you all for the suggestions. All of the players and myself have a good understanding of the rules, and we ran a sample combat recently to make sure we understood things.

 

I'm definitally familiar with the tricks of "adding" powers or "Suddenly, the door opens, and 5 more guys come running out." I was just wondering what you guys (that have a lot more Hero GM experience) used as a benchmark.

 

Any other friendly advice? I'm nervous!

 

-crp

[Supreme Serpent]

Re: In need of help!

 

Another thing I did in the past: Master villain with variable speed, depending on how many heroes present. 3-4 heroes=Spd 6, 5 heroes=Spd 7, etc. up to Spd 9. Was able to keep him as a credible opponent without having to add too many other villains/agents as the # of heroes increased.

[Trebuchet]

Re: In need of help!

 

Any other friendly advice? I'm nervous!

Don't be. This isn't an exam; the worst that can happen is that it won't be quite as much fun as it would if everything goes absolutely perfectly (and I can assure you that everything won't). Don't sweat the small stuff, because this is all just for fun.

 

At least you'll probably do better than I did the first time I GM'd Champions (about 24 years ago). I'd built a giant Godzilla-like reptile which I figured would keep the team occupied all evening because that critter was tough. I was utterly confident until the first PC, Thark, stepped up with his giant sword and swung for 7d6 HKA. He rolled all '5' and '6's; then a '6' for his Stun Multiplier: 38 BODY; 190 Stun!

 

My giant "unstoppable" reptile went down in the first Phase of combat; from the very first attack. Total duration of that evening's game: 3 minutes.

 

I survived, although I didn't try to GM again for a couple of years...

[Supreme Serpent]

Re: In need of help!

 

Especially for the first few sessions, it's probably better to err on the side of making the villains weaker, to help ensure the players don't get stomped while they're learning the game. If they're successful, they're more likely to want to come back for next time.

 

"The first one's free..."

 

Another guide you could use...take the PC's - note down their main combat attributes - Dex/Spd, levels, defenses, attack damage. Make a villain team with roughly these same attributes. Don't have to be mirror images, mix&match as you go, adjust one up by adjusting one down, etc.

 

So if you have 4 PC's:

#1: Dex 18, Spd 5, 30/20 Defenses, 12d6 (brick), 2 levels

#2: Dex 23, Spd 5, 25/30 Defenses, 14d6 (EP), no levels

#3: Dex 30, Spd 6, 18/15 Defenses, 10d6 (MA), 2 levels

#4: Dex 23, Spd 5, 20/20 Defenses, 12d6 (archer), 2 levels + range levels

 

You could design a villain team:

#1: Dex 17, Spd 5, 30/30 Defenses, 14d6 (brick), 2 levels

#2: Dex 24, Spd 5, 20/25 Defenses, 12d6 (EP) 2 levels

#3: Dex 29, Spd 6, 20/13 Defenses, 10d6 (MA) 3 levels

#4: Dex 24, Spd 5, 20/20 Defenses, 12d6 (teleporting MA w/staff) 2 levels

 

Should be roughly equivalent to each other.

[Silbeg]

Re: In need of help!

 

Another thing I did in the past: Master villain with variable speed' date=' depending on how many heroes present. 3-4 heroes=Spd 6, 5 heroes=Spd 7, etc. up to Spd 9. Was able to keep him as a credible opponent without having to add too many other villains/agents as the # of heroes increased.[/quote']

 

Definately an interesting idea. However, you need to be careful with that, as increased SPD really does increase effectiveness tremendously, if only for the fact that it gives the master villain more opportunities to use mobility, defensive actions, plaster the random hero accross the board.

 

Think about it... if most characters are SPD 5, and the villain is SPD 7, then after seg5, he goes in both 6 & 7, before the average hero reacts (and if the hero is SPD 4, the villain may get an action in seg9 before the hero).

 

The villain could attack a hero in 6 (or group of heroes?), and then throw the finishing blow seg7. Or, alternatively... perform a Move-Through, plastering the hero in 6, and then be able to act again in 7, so wouldn't risk the lowered DCV due to the Move-Through.

 

In some ways, perhaps a sliding scale for damage reduction would be a safer way to handle this.

 

So, perhaps

• 3-4 heroes 25% reduction (still a good idea with a Master Villain)
  
• 5-6 heroes 50% reduction
  
• 7+ heroes 75% reduction
  

Or something like that. This gives the advantage that the villain will be extremely tough to "one-punch" (as a master-class villain should be), or STUN, but the heroes will still be able to affect him.

[MidnightLich]

Re: In need of help!

 

These comments have actually inspired another question: what's the best way to "track" a battle? With 12 segments per turn, and multiple people having different Dexterity values, how do you (as a GM) keep track of all of it?

 

-crp

[Supreme Serpent]

Re: In need of help!

 

I generally use a d12 to keep track of segments, and have a sheet with everyone (heroes, villains, agents) listed in Dex order and what phases they go on. New segment, start going down dexes.

 

Another GM in my group uses index cards - each card has name, dex, and phases on it. Sort cards by dex order, go through cards each segment. Someone leaves the fight or gets KO'd, pull their card out. Has another stack of cards with 1-12 on them, flips through them to keep track of segments.

[Tae Kwon Dan]

Re: In need of help!

 

I'm a relatively new Champs GM myself (don't let the join date fool you, I put the game down for about 9-12 months due to personal time constraints.) But I've been able now after many trial and errors to actual get my PC's through the first two sections of Champion Battlegrounds and a stand-alone get together and duke it out adventure of my own devising.

 

Here's some general rules of thumb I've seen.

 

1. Look at AP totals for your PC's attack powers. When I first started I allowed 70 AP's for my PC's, but kept using the CKC villians straight out of the books which mostly assume 60 AP powers out of the 350 point villians. My guys were walking straight through the baddies. So I had rebuilds of concepts on 60 AP's and now things are much more fair.

 

2. Compare average stun and body rolls to the PD\ED of the villians you select to make sure that at least somebody in the body can hurt them.

 

3. IMHO if you're going the solo villian route his speed should be equal to the fastest person in your group, but as pointed out before not too much faster (unless you want him to win which you might.) I had a single speed 4 villian in a group of villians I was running and he got jumped pretty nastily before he got two phases in by all of my SPD 5 heroes.

 

4. Look at any disads or limitations your players have and decide if you want to mess with them. E.g. I have a character who can manipulate metal perfectly as long as he is touching it; however, a magentic field effect shuts all of his powers down (basically turning him into a normal with some MA skills.) So when I threw Lodestone at the group he had the potential for a bad day. Since this was an earlier adventure I had Lodestone concetrate on other characters during the fight (he didn't know he could shut the PC down with a single attack), but it's something to consider if you want to screw with your PC's or not.

 

As for keeping track of things. I use a laptop while gaming and make an Excel sheet with a chart of everyone's segments and sorted in order of Dex and Dex rolls if necessary. I just color-code segments where somebody aborted to dodge, how long until flash lasts, are they entangled, etc.

 

I also keep all of my baddies basic information END, STUN, BODY, OCV\DCV, and defenses on this sheet for quick reference when the PC's are attacking them. I made a sheet for the PC's to keep track of their STUN\END with beads during the game.