Serial killers...

[umbra]

I'm wondering how being in a super powered world would effect serial killers... Would Ted Bundy have to have super powers to avoid capture as long as he did, or would there still be non-superpowered serial killers. I ask this because a) I've been watching to many Forensic Files on TV and I think a scenario based on trying to track down a serial killer would be cool. For example, what if someone who had only minor super powers got the crazy idea that by killing children exibiting superpowers would increase his own... Any thoughts, ideas, coments?

[TheEmerged]

Depends primarily on one thing: how common sensory powers and sensory extentions are.

 

I've made a conscious decision in my NeoChampion campaign that sensory powers are "uncommon" -- they exist, but aren't so common that every nova out there has a full suite. In fact, one of the Class 1 nova types I've defined for the world -- the Hound -- is built around senses.

 

In games terms, the ones you most need to worry about are...

• Telepathy. Obviously, in a world were telepathic evidence is admissible in court -- or your telepathic vigilante doesn't care -- criminals in general are in for a rough go of it without significant balancing elements.
  
• N-Ray ("Penetrating") Vision. Go watch some of the old Superman TV show to see a good example of what this power does to mysteries.
  
• Retrocognition. Underestimated but dangerous -- consider that theoretically you could always identify the killer if you have a corpse.
  
• Tracking. Many a newbie HERO GM discovers too late that this simple little adder can turn most mysteries on their head.
  
• Microscopic. Surprised? Don't be. It gives you the ability to find fingerprints significantly faster -- without dust that might corrupt DNA samples. Taken to extremes, it allows you to examine DNA without a lab.
  
• Nova Detects. This is another one that might bite a newbie GM on the butt. It sounds very innocous -- the ability to detect people with powers, or the ability to detect the use of powers. Be warned however that these can *really* make things messy for a GM. Consider that any "impossible" crime in a superheroic campaign is probably going to be a nova/superpowered person -- a detect like this can almost certainly reduce your list of suspects, or point out a suspect that would otherwise be under the radar.
  

[Spideyguy]

Curious

 

Emerged,

 

In your post, you mention a Class 1 Nova type called "The Hound". Do you classify your supers into types or categories, and if so, what is the backstory for your world?

 

I'd be curious to know more, as it sounds very interesting. Drop me a private message if you'd like to share. Thanks!

[Ranxerox]

Superhero can be devided into two types - local heroes and global heroes. Global heroes tend to keep their eyes on the big picture and not try to catch every single crook or even murderer. Local heroes do go after non-super murders and often have good detective skill, powers and or contacts to help them solve mysteries.

 

Because local heroes will concern themselves with serial killers, one would have a hard time making it in Gotham if they are not as resourceful as the Joker. Therefore, if you would like to do an adventure with an established Joe Serialkiller you need to take the action somewhere that doesn't already have any local heroes.

 

In other words, for that one adventure move the game out to the sticks and you can introduce a serial killer who has been preying upon a small community for years.

[umbra]

Originally posted by TheEmerged

Depends primarily on one thing: how common sensory powers and sensory extentions are.

 

I've made a conscious decision in my NeoChampion campaign that sensory powers are "uncommon" -- they exist, but aren't so common that every nova out there has a full suite. In fact, one of the Class 1 nova types I've defined for the world -- the Hound -- is built around senses.

 

I was thinking the serial killer would be the classic "nondiscript" type guy, i.e. his superpowers such as they were would only help him disguise himself from the detection of others. Sort of a "not my problem" field. And since his (or her) powers would be so non-lethal, he would prey on children instead of adults. I find that champions usually doesn't include a lot of "serial killer" or "stalker" type villians in their source books. Frankly, some unpowered serial killers would probably scare me more then the normal meglomania types.

[TheEmerged]

Re: Curious

 

Originally posted by Spideyguy

Emerged,

 

In your post, you mention a Class 1 Nova type called "The Hound". Do you classify your supers into types or categories, and if so, what is the backstory for your world?

 

I'd be curious to know more, as it sounds very interesting. Drop me a private message if you'd like to share. Thanks!

 

It's an outgrowth from the "Brave New World" material I absorbed into the campaign. And I'm refering to the low-powered Superheroic RPG by that name, not the Huxley novel. There were aspects of that game's world that I liked and translated over to my NeoChampions campaign.

 

In the NeoChampions universe, 6 out of 7 novas ("people with superpowers") are "Class 1", meaning they're 150/100-pt characters in a world in which the average beat cop is a 50/50-pt character. The PC's for the record are "Class 2", 200/150-pt characters.

 

Borrowing from BNW's templates, I decided that Class 1 novas tend to fall into certain broad types. I'm in the process of writing these broad types up in HEROmaker -- with incredibly creative names like Generic Flame Guy, Generic Ice Guy, Generic Big Guy, Generic Stretch Guy, Generic Smart Guy...

 

When it becomes necessary to create a Class 1 as a character for an adventure, I start by defining what template they follow -- quite often, they end up splitting the difference between two other templates. For example, in the current adventure one such NPC is defined as being part-Savant part-Charm, with the Charm part inverted so he terrifies people instead. On the other hand, a different NPC was defined as Feral-Shark...

 

When deciding how nova powers have affected the world (powers begin appearing in 1972), I found it useful to decide how common the "types" are. Some types (like Hounds and Savants/Smarts) need to be kept in check or they have too great an affect on the world. This means that Trace is a major asset for PSI in my campaign, for example.

[TheEmerged]

Originally posted by umbra

I was thinking the serial killer would be the classic "nondiscript" type guy, i.e. his superpowers such as they were would only help him disguise himself from the detection of others. Sort of a "not my problem" field. And since his (or her) powers would be so non-lethal, he would prey on children instead of adults. I find that champions usually doesn't include a lot of "serial killer" or "stalker" type villians in their source books. Frankly, some unpowered serial killers would probably scare me more then the normal meglomania types.

 

Ah! Sorry, completely misread what you were asking for.

 

First, I'd actually give him Invisibility to Nova Detects (as Unusual/Targetting) and Sense Talents (Unusual/Targetting), Always On Inherrent. This makes him especially terrifying for characters (NPC or PC) that depend on their Combat/Danger Sense to cover them. In fact, this by itself creates a great Closed Room mystery for your PC's -- "How did they manage to kill (such and such) without triggering his Danger Sense?" It would also keep him beneath suspicion for PC's dependent on the ability to detect people with super powers...

 

If I was feeling particularly evil, I'd top this off with Darkness to Nova Detects, self only Usable As Attack, Always On Inherrent. This way he could even use powers within the range without triggering a Detect Active Use of Powers. Of course you'd have to buy this IPE to keep someone from noticing their Detect was being jammed/spoofed.

 

Next up would have to be Shape Shift bought Cellular, only to leave false fingerprints/DNA/blood samples (-1/2 tops, -1/4 more likely). Feeling particularly evil, full-blown Shape Shift makes for a dangerous criminal period.

 

The next obvious suggestions would be a Nova Detect himself -- especially with the Tracking adder. He knows that you're a nova, and you can't hide from him for long

 

Whatever his attack power, it should definitely have at least some level of IPE on it. A BODY transfer might be especially appropriate...

 

How to fit into a superheroic campaign? Make his victims members of IHA/Genocide instead of children. Suddenly the PC's have to hunt a serial killer that thinks he's on their side

[umbra]

Originally posted by TheEmerged

Ah! Sorry, completely misread what you were asking for.

 

Your reply was great, I was asking for both powered or nonpowered serial killer types : )

 

How to fit into a superheroic campaign? Make his victims members of IHA/Genocide instead of children. Suddenly the PC's have to hunt a serial killer that thinks he's on their side

 

I was also thinking of a unique way to bring those DNPC's into play... Could your child/brother/sister be at risk? Might the villian think that your DNPC has super powers because you do? How do you protect DNPC when your off hunting the Super Villain flavor of the day?

[BarryB]

A lot of enhanced senses can be duplicated by modern forensic techniques. I think the one "sense" that would be a sure-fire capture for any non-powered killer would be retro/pre-cognition. Okay, technically, that's two senses.

 

No one in my past or current campaign has retro or precognition, though one character could justify it at some point. I think that there are ways a GM who is quick on his feet can make useless most enhanced senses. I would think making retro or precognition useless would require a good bit of preparation. But I've never had to GM it, so what do I know.

[zornwil]

Sort of on-topic, there's a Hellblazer from its early years where Constantine goes after this killer called the Family Man who likes to kill families. It is probably in a trade paperback - I could tell you issue numbers if interested. The killer is normal, no special powers. Constantine if I recall uses a few magical tricks but not much and in fact...well this gets into spoilers that I shouldn't if you read it and haven't yet. Anyway, it might give you some good ideas on this.

[Lord Liaden]

Dean Shomshak presented an interesting essay on the serial killer in a supers setting in his Champs book Creatures of the Night: Horror Enemies (recommended BTW). Dean pointed out that there would be little benefit to a serial killer having superpowers: most serial killers are subtle and stealthy, preferring to prey on the weak or unsuspecting. A destructive or lethal paranormal ability would have small use in those circumstances - in fact if a serial killer used such an ability, the pool of suspects would immediately be narrowed. As TheEmerged pointed out, unless heroes have access to reliable Clairsentience, Telepathy or other extraordinary sensory abilities which the killer would have to protect himself from, a normal human would make more sense.

 

Dean Shomshak did present one intriguing alternative take on a serial killer, though. He pointed out that most serial killers are skilled at leading a double life, often doing charity work, attending church regularly and otherwise appearing to be a "pillar of the community". Serial killers crave recognition and validation, and tend to have delusions of omnipotence. So, what would such a person do if he suddenly acquired superpowers?

 

Why, he'd become a superhero.

[Dr. Necropolis]

Ooohh... shades of Marshall Law. It's been reprinted recently. You should take a look.

 

The story features a super-powered serial killer. But I haven't read it in years and have no idea how well it has aged.

["V"]

In my last Champions campaign the Mentalist from London's "other" (ie npc) superhero team was also a serial killer, using his mental powers to trap his victims and play havoc with any witnesses.

 

The PC team managed to apprehend someone (a normal) they thought was the serial killer but had no hard evidence. Deciding to find out for sure they swallowed their pride and went to ask the npc team for help: basically "can we borrow your mentalist?"

 

Said Mentalist happily turned up and did a deep mind probe of the perp. Announced (truthfully) "He's not your man," and then took the pc team ruthless-hardcase to one side and let him know discreetly "This *is* the guy, he's guilty as sin, but you know your buddies will hand him over to the courts and he may well walk."

 

Naturally team ruthless-hardcase decides to take the law into his own hands and stalks the hapless perp home where he witnesses said perp (acting on Mind Control cues planted while the Mentalist was supposed to be probing his memories) stashing all his carving knives in a hold-all...

 

It took a while to entangle but the Mentalist was exposed a few sessions later and gleefully pounded.

[Trebuchet]

Serial killers tend to be very cautious and secretive. Often their murders are not discovered for many months or even years after they are perpetrated. Ted Bundy hid his victim's bodies in out of the way wooded areas, others preyed on runaways and prostitutes that could disappear without causing notice. Lord Liaden pointed out how serial killers also often assume protective coloration by acting as pillars of the community. How well one would survive in a superhero universe would likely depend on the nature of the heroes. A serial killer could probably operate for years with impunity in Metropolis, but would have a very short career in Gotham City. It's all a matter of the "scale" the heroes operate at. In my own campaign our team MidGuard is a global-spanning group like the Avengers, so a serial killer in Berlin is unlikely to appear on our team's crime radar. We deal with a bigger picture.

 

Very few powers except Retrocognition would help solve such crimes directly. Sure Mind Scan might work, but how do you pick out a particular unknown mind out of a city with a population of over 1 million? People are murdered every day without a serial killer being involved, so what would be the cue that you've got the right killer? In Juarez, Mexico, just across the border from El Paso over 300 (Yes, 300!) young women have been murdered over the last decade by person or persons unknown despite the efforts of both the Mexican police and even the American FBI to apprehend the killer(s). They aren't even certain if it's one man, a gang, copycats, or some combination thereof.

 

Powers such as Microscopic Vision and the like simply allow a superhero to use detective-like skills without needing to resort to a crime lab. I think that would be an excellent opportunity for role-playing, especially if one of the victims is a friend or DNPC of one of the heroes. But superpowers are not going to make such crimes go away, any more than the presence of Superman means that no one robs banks in Metropolis anymore.

 

If you are interested in serial killers and how they operate, I highly recommend any of the numerous books by former FBI agent Robert D. Keppel, or by John Douglas, one of the FBI's best former profilers. Between them they've written about a dozen books on the subject of serial killers, all of them quite fascinating.

[BobGreenwade]

Going back to a part of the original question that doesn't seem to have been addressed (except by Lord Liaden's citation of Dean Shomshak's take), I don't think serial killers in a superpowered world would necessarily have to be superpowered themselves. I have several reasons for thinking so.

 

First, I think back on the old Superman TV show (with George Reeves) and recall how none of the criminals on that show had superpowers. Supes could be completely stymied by a bit of good planning, though of course that only went so far (since he had to be able to catch the bad guys at the end of the program).

 

Second, a serial killer might tend to not attract the attention of superpowered detectives unless he either exhibited superpowers himself, or was pretty successful at eluding the non-super authorities (like the Green River Killer was until relatively recently). This depends on how such things work in the super-world in question, of course, but it's worth considering.

 

Third, serial killers tend to think outside the "commit crimes but don't get caught" paradigm usually seen among criminals. They may be compulsive killers, compulsive rapists or pedophiles who kill to eliminate their victims as witnesses, have dlusions of superiority (or even delusions of superpowers, though this may be more or less frequent in a world with actual superpowers), or have some other mental illness that leads them to kill without considering the implications of a superpowered investigator.

 

So I think the proportion of serial killers with superpowers to those without would probably be roughly the same as in the general population, or at most only slightly higher. That's not to say that a team of superpowered investigators wouldn't run into many superpowered killers; if they're given the toughest cases, most if not all of those they pursue could be superpowered.

[zornwil]

Originally posted by Lord Liaden

Dean Shomshak presented an interesting essay on the serial killer in a supers setting in his Champs book Creatures of the Night: Horror Enemies (recommended BTW). Dean pointed out that there would be little benefit to a serial killer having superpowers: most serial killers are subtle and stealthy, preferring to prey on the weak or unsuspecting. A destructive or lethal paranormal ability would have small use in those circumstances - in fact if a serial killer used such an ability, the pool of suspects would immediately be narrowed. As TheEmerged pointed out, unless heroes have access to reliable Clairsentience, Telepathy or other extraordinary sensory abilities which the killer would have to protect himself from, a normal human would make more sense.

 

Dean Shomshak did present one intriguing alternative take on a serial killer, though. He pointed out that most serial killers are skilled at leading a double life, often doing charity work, attending church regularly and otherwise appearing to be a "pillar of the community". Serial killers crave recognition and validation, and tend to have delusions of omnipotence. So, what would such a person do if he suddenly acquired superpowers?

 

Why, he'd become a superhero.

 

That's a really interesting idea for an NPC (a bit too dark for my tastes for a PC), a "reformed" serial killer whose reformation started merely as a "I have powers, let everyone know how great I am!" and transformed over time to "Oh my God, I'm sick, I need help," (whether he's seeking help or not) particularly if set in the kind of world that tolerates Punisher-style "justice" so that the character's killing in the name of justice, which also allows him some psychological/possibly sexual gratification, is not immediately obvious as the severe pathology that it is. Lot of food for thought.

[zornwil]

Originally posted by Trebuchet

In Juarez, Mexico, just across the border from El Paso over 300 (Yes, 300!) young women have been murdered over the last decade by person or persons unknown despite the efforts of both the Mexican police and even the American FBI to apprehend the killer(s). They aren't even certain if it's one man, a gang, copycats, or some combination thereof.

 

I've heard of this, pretty tragic. They strongly suspect it's become a sort of magnet for killers, that the many failures of local authorities first to respond and then to do so in an effective manner has encouraged others to go down there for "killing vacations". There was apparently some bus drivers that were arrested but their convictions failed purportedly due to police procedural problems. Allegedly the bus drivers worked in a ring where they would cover for each other; a bus driver would take any sole passenger who stayed on until the end of the line and instead of letting her off the bus would drive somewhere secluded to rape and kill her, apparently with some other members of the ring. But even this case, if in fact it wasn't entirely mistaken, only accounted for a minority of the killings.

[umbra]

Originally posted by zornwil

I've heard of this, pretty tragic. They strongly suspect it's become a sort of magnet for killers, that the many failures of local authorities first to respond and then to do so in an effective manner has encouraged others to go down there for "killing vacations". There was apparently some bus drivers that were arrested but their convictions failed purportedly due to police procedural problems. Allegedly the bus drivers worked in a ring where they would cover for each other; a bus driver would take any sole passenger who stayed on until the end of the line and instead of letting her off the bus would drive somewhere secluded to rape and kill her, apparently with some other members of the ring. But even this case, if in fact it wasn't entirely mistaken, only accounted for a minority of the killings.

 

Now see right there that is darn scary. Super power stalkers would also be a hoot to run for a game. I played in a Amber game where a stalker was a Chaosian... Shapeshifting and the ability to travel just about anywere... burrrrrr!

[Klytus]

Originally posted by Lord Liaden

Dean Shomshak did present one intriguing alternative take on a serial killer, though. He pointed out that most serial killers are skilled at leading a double life, often doing charity work, attending church regularly and otherwise appearing to be a "pillar of the community". Serial killers crave recognition and validation, and tend to have delusions of omnipotence. So, what would such a person do if he suddenly acquired superpowers?

 

Why, he'd become a superhero.

Hmm. If you buy this theory, I could see "Former Serial Killer" being used as a Social Limitation by a "reformed" hero. Suppose this guy turns out to be a fine, noble hero, if a bit of a glory hound. Then one of those super-detectives discovers that years ago, he was the "Infamous Taunting the Police Serial Killer".

[umbra]

Personally I don't see some guy going from serial killer to super hero and stop murdering cold turkey. There would have to be some major therapy or mind control stuff going on. Now a former serial killer with some sort of implant (i.e. like Spike in the Buffy TV show) I could see. Any one see the first X-man movie? When Sabertooth was fighting Storm? That was some stalking behavior... "you owe me a scream". Kinda tame vs. some real life stalkers but a good start.

[Siberian Tiger]

Another take on this issue is to have the serial killer stalking and targetting superhumans - maybe as a result of some deluded belief that he has to prove that normal humanity is superior to these superfreaks. If I was going to run this, I'd introduce a few super NPCs, get the characters to interact with them and them have the NPC killed off. I'd also have an apparently normal character like a secretary, relative, the guy who runs the bar down the road, killed off by the same serial killer and have it revealed that he/she was also a superhuman.

 

I have run a campaign where England was struck by fear at the rampage of a super-strong serial killer whom the PCs had to track down. Twist was that the victims were not random but rather retired superhumans from the Golden and Silver Age. Killer in fact was a former teammate and patriotic hero sent mad by spending time trapped in another dimension.

[zornwil]

Originally posted by umbra

Personally I don't see some guy going from serial killer to super hero and stop murdering cold turkey. There would have to be some major therapy or mind control stuff going on. Now a former serial killer with some sort of implant (i.e. like Spike in the Buffy TV show) I could see. Any one see the first X-man movie? When Sabertooth was fighting Storm? That was some stalking behavior... "you owe me a scream". Kinda tame vs. some real life stalkers but a good start.

 

Killing is a severe psych addiction for serial killers - I agree, I think the issue is they'd be a killing super hero, either in super hero guise always in the name of justice or (more realistically) still killing in their "off" time but a great hero otherwise. I sort of think that's what Lord was saying, but he'd have to answer that.

[umbra]

Originally posted by zornwil

Killing is a severe psych addiction for serial killers - I agree, I think the issue is they'd be a killing super hero, either in super hero guise always in the name of justice or (more realistically) still killing in their "off" time but a great hero otherwise. I sort of think that's what Lord was saying, but he'd have to answer that.

 

Could you imagine that pysic disad "addicted to killing in non-superhero id." You would get some major points for that one though. Hmmm some other disads could be:

Psy Lim: Must take trophy from victims ("Hey Harry, look what I found in your locker at the Justice League."

Psy Lim: Eventually kills family and finds new one ("Boy Harry, villians always seem to find out your secret id and wipe out your family, are you sure you wanna get married again?"

[Lord Liaden]

Originally posted by zornwil

Killing is a severe psych addiction for serial killers - I agree, I think the issue is they'd be a killing super hero, either in super hero guise always in the name of justice or (more realistically) still killing in their "off" time but a great hero otherwise. I sort of think that's what Lord was saying, but he'd have to answer that.

 

Imagine the reactions by Captain Victory's teammates when they discover what he does on his days off...

 

There's no reason to assume that a serial killer would stop killing because he adopted a superheroic identity. Remember that these people often lead double lives and can appear highly respectable to the general public. They may compartmentalize their motives as a hero and a killer so that they see no fundamental conflict between them.

 

While having a former serial killer try to reform and hide his past could make for interesting interactions with a NPC (or even PC if he's a good roleplayer), serial killers are seriously sick people who are very unlikely to stop unless compelled to. The payoff would be greater if the character's friends/allies discover the truth, perhaps as a result of their investigation of the killings: they have to deal with their radically changed perception of a person they thought they knew, not to mention having to catch someone who knows their strengths and weaknesses.

[umbra]

Of course you could always toss in the "alternate personality" i.e. Dr Jekyll and Mr. Hyde.