Alternative Healing Rules - Public input requested

[dsatow]

I dislike the current healing rules. I understand why they were implemented but believe these do not fit in the 99% of genres I run with/play in. Many times, the players will just use Aid instead (coming up with a justification that matches the Aid use instead of the Healing) usually with no argument from the GM. That being the case, I have several ideas on how to correct the issue, but I'd like to hear other people's ideas and reasons as well as comments on my own ideas to resolve the issue.

 

To state my concerns first on how healing currently works

 

Basic healing:

Under my understanding healing costs 10 points per d6 and you must exceed what you rolled to have any effect within the reuse duration which is 1 day.

healing is based on active points and heals a specific ability. Healing as is, is good against drains with huge recovery delays and prevents the neverending battle.

 

Problem:

The mechanics are not similar in use to any other rule and throws new players off.

If you have two people with different reuse cycles say one with 24 hours and 1 with 1 turn, which power prevails and how do you bookkeep?

Why buy healing when you can buy Aid for about the same cost or less and get the same general result?

 

Solution 1: Reduce the cost of healing to 5 pts per d6 and keep everything else the same.

This makes healing more effective than aid in healing people without the neverending battle scenario cropping up. It also keeps it easily compatible with people using Hero Designer or players at a convention. However, you still have the reuse cycles problem and the mechanics problem.

 

Solution 2: Treat Healing like Aid.

In this solution, while healed points don't fade, you have a maximum number of points you can heal per target just like aid. Your maximum amount recovers at 5 points per turn just like Aid; so if you max out in one turn against one patient, the next turn you can heal that patient a maximum of 5 points more in that turn. You can buy down the fade rate to decrease the cost of the healing. You can also buy up the maximum points you can heal just like Aid. All other adders stay the same (regrow limbs, resurrection). This method has the advantage of a known mechanic for new players. The neverending battle is mitigated somewhat though a large number of healers becomes a problem. Also, Hero Designer doesn't work this way* and players at conventions may not easily adapt.

 

Solution 3: Get rid of healing/bring back regen.

This solution basically means get rid of healing and produce the 1/2 limitation on Aid only to restore character to starting values. This is similar to the way the game was played prior to the advent of healing. We would also keep the adders for Regen or Aid. Hero Designer can be coaxed to simulate* this however many younger players would not know this from early HERO days and again players at conventions may not easily adapt.

 

What are people's feelings or are there other ways out there that people have come up with healing. Maybe I am misguided about how the current healing works, if so please enlighten me. I would love to hear feedback.

 

*HERO designer can be modified to accept the new values but this requires some editting to the configuration files for HERO designer and not every player who has HERO designer feels safe doing this.

[Steve Long]

Re: Alternative Healing Rules - Public input requested

 

Since this isn't a rules question, it's been moved.

[Chris Goodwin]

Re: Alternative Healing Rules - Public input requested

 

Basic healing:

Under my understanding healing costs 10 points per d6 and you must exceed what you rolled to have any effect within the reuse duration which is 1 day.

healing is based on active points and heals a specific ability. Healing as is, is good against drains with huge recovery delays and prevents the neverending battle.

 

The reset time is an unofficial addition by Steve Long. Officially, it's per wound, and once you've maxed it that's it.

 

What are people's feelings or are there other ways out there that people have come up with healing. Maybe I am misguided about how the current healing works, if so please enlighten me. I would love to hear feedback.

 

*HERO designer can be modified to accept the new values but this requires some editting to the configuration files for HERO designer and not every player who has HERO designer feels safe doing this.

 

It used to be I would allow players to buy Cumulative Healing if they took something like -3 1/2 in various Limitations including Extra Time, Increased Endurance Cost, Charges, and/or Expendable Focus. Now I just allow them to buy Cumulative Healing.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Alternative Healing Rules - Public input requested

 

The reset time is an unofficial addition by Steve Long.

 

A rule put in by the game designer IS official by definition.

 

Decreased Re-use Duration

(Hero System Fifth Edition Rule Book, Revised, page 188)

This Advantage allows a character to apply Healing more than once a day.

 

25 Solution 4a: Repeatable Healing: Healing BODY 1d6, Decreased Re-use Duration (1 Turn; +1 1/2) (25 Active Points) - END=2

 

37 Solution 4b: Repeatable Healing that Can Heal Limbs: Healing BODY 1d6, Can Heal Limbs, Decreased Re-use Duration (1 Turn; +1 1/2) (37 Active Points) - END=4

[Sean Waters]

Re: Alternative Healing Rules - Public input requested

 

I dislike the current healing rules. I understand why they were implemented but believe these do not fit in the 99% of genres I run with/play in. Many times, the players will just use Aid instead (coming up with a justification that matches the Aid use instead of the Healing) usually with no argument from the GM. That being the case, I have several ideas on how to correct the issue, but I'd like to hear other people's ideas and reasons as well as comments on my own ideas to resolve the issue.

 

To state my concerns first on how healing currently works

 

Basic healing:

Under my understanding healing costs 10 points per d6 and you must exceed what you rolled to have any effect within the reuse duration which is 1 day.

healing is based on active points and heals a specific ability. Healing as is, is good against drains with huge recovery delays and prevents the neverending battle.

 

Healing is an adjustment power and ,as such, for an advantage, can apply to more than one specific ability, or to groups of abilities linked by sfx.

 

Problem:

The mechanics are not similar in use to any other rule and throws new players off.

If you have two people with different reuse cycles say one with 24 hours and 1 with 1 turn, which power prevails and how do you bookkeep?

Why buy healing when you can buy Aid for about the same cost or less and get the same general result?

 

The mechanics working differently may be seen as an advantage - if it was the same you would not need healing. This might be your point, of course

 

To answer the question you pose, Victim takes a 10 Body wound

 

Healer A has 2d6 healing

Healer B has 1d6 healing that resets every turn

 

Healer A can keep rolling to heal each phase, and, say he manages 7,3,4,8 in one turn, he heals 8 Body as that is the highest he rolled. He can keep rolling each phase until he gets10 or more, in which case the wound is fully healed. If he waits a day he can roll again and any result will ADD tot he previous healing roll.

 

Healer B can also keep rolling each phase, and rolls 2 and 6, at which point he might as well stop because he has healed 6 points and he can't do better than that this turn BUT if he waits a turn he can roll again and add the reult to the healing, so assuming he can roll a 4 next turn the wound is completely healed.

 

Both can roll to heal Victim, but their results do not add. Perhaps they should buy a multipower with Heal and Aid Heal, so that one can assist the other?

 

The reason buying Aid is not helpful is that the points added go away quickly. Heal's main difference is that the points added do not fade. With Aid, you could buy the fade rate down to be slower than the normal heal rate of Victim, and if you are working 'per wound' then this would do just fine....but it will be more expensive than Heal then.

 

Solution 1: Reduce the cost of healing to 5 pts per d6 and keep everything else the same.

This makes healing more effective than aid in healing people without the neverending battle scenario cropping up. It also keeps it easily compatible with people using Hero Designer or players at a convention. However, you still have the reuse cycles problem and the mechanics problem.

 

Cost of powers is often a thorny issue. in some games, Fantasy Hero, for example, where groups are often away in the wilderness and cannot rest for a week at a time, healing is incredibly useful and easily justifies its cost. personally I do not feel that 10 points per 1d6 is a problem, but it used to be cheaper and it was never a problem then either

 

Actually, come to think of it, Aid costs 10 points per 1d6, so it is nice and consistent with that....

 

Solution 2: Treat Healing like Aid.

In this solution, while healed points don't fade, you have a maximum number of points you can heal per target just like aid. Your maximum amount recovers at 5 points per turn just like Aid; so if you max out in one turn against one patient, the next turn you can heal that patient a maximum of 5 points more in that turn. You can buy down the fade rate to decrease the cost of the healing. You can also buy up the maximum points you can heal just like Aid. All other adders stay the same (regrow limbs, resurrection). This method has the advantage of a known mechanic for new players. The neverending battle is mitigated somewhat though a large number of healers becomes a problem. Also, Hero Designer doesn't work this way* and players at conventions may not easily adapt.

 

The problem with this 'quick reapplication' approach is that it makes buying a big, expensive heal pretty pointless, if a 1d6 heal can do the job if you take a couple of extra turns. The current approach really does differentiate between a 1d6 heal and a 4d6 heal.

 

Solution 3: Get rid of healing/bring back regen.

This solution basically means get rid of healing and produce the 1/2 limitation on Aid only to restore character to starting values. This is similar to the way the game was played prior to the advent of healing. We would also keep the adders for Regen or Aid. Hero Designer can be coaxed to simulate* this however many younger players would not know this from early HERO days and again players at conventions may not easily adapt.

 

What are people's feelings or are there other ways out there that people have come up with healing. Maybe I am misguided about how the current healing works, if so please enlighten me. I would love to hear feedback.

 

*HERO designer can be modified to accept the new values but this requires some editting to the configuration files for HERO designer and not every player who has HERO designer feels safe doing this.

 

 

At present you are supposed to buy 'self only' with regeneration, but there is no reason that you cannot remove that requirement if you like.

 

I mean, for 25 points you can buy a perfectly book legal heal that will give back up to 6 character points of Body to a target per turn, or you could buy a heal that gievs 2 1/2d6 character points of Body back (up to 15 character points) in a single applciation. I like the variety. Different healers have different uses. The first one is great for getting characters back up to max between battles, the second one great IN a battle for keeping them ont heir feet.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Alternative Healing Rules - Public input requested

 

Cost of powers is often a thorny issue. in some games, Fantasy Hero, for example, where groups are often away in the wilderness and cannot rest for a week at a time, healing is incredibly useful and easily justifies its cost. personally I do not feel that 10 points per 1d6 is a problem, but it used to be cheaper and it was never a problem then either

 

Actually, come to think of it, Aid costs 10 points per 1d6, so it is nice and consistent with that....

 

Aid does not cost END and Heal does, so making the two comparable, Heal costs 15 per d6 compared to 10 for Aid.

 

The problem with this 'quick reapplication' approach is that it makes buying a big' date=' expensive heal pretty pointless, if a 1d6 heal can do the job if you take a couple of extra turns. The current approach really does differentiate between a 1d6 heal and a 4d6 heal.[/quote']

 

There were significant problems with the "old way". Let's take a look at a simplistic construct using the "Aid heals; only to starting limit is a -1/2 limitation" structure:

 

1d6 Aid, all characteristics (+2), Persistent (+1/2), Only to starting max (-1/2), self only (-1/2), Always on (-0 - what's the drawback?). That costs 17 points.

 

The character now recovers 1d6 points of every stat he's down every phase. Ignoring adjustment powers to focus solely on normal combat, and assuming a 4 Speed (high heroic or low superheroic), the character recovers an average of 7 BOD, 14 Stun and 28 END per turn, ignoring any use of his Recover stat. Note that he recovers these points even if his STUN is at -50. Good luck keeping this character down for any length of time.

 

Hey, shell out 35 points and double it. You can make it up by making all his powers 2x END, since he recovers an average of 56 END (plus recoveries) every turn. He can spend 14 END per phase on an ongoing basis and never get tired.

 

Let's make him a Speedster with an 8 Speed and a fast-healing metabolism. That 35 point investment now averages 28 BOD, 56 STUN and 112 END recovered every turn. And that Brick thought his 30 REC was impressive!

 

While this can be done under the current system by reducing the reapplication rate for a Heal to once per phase is considerably more expensive.

 

The one thing I dislike about the current structure is the "behind the curtains" mechanic that allows Regeneration to escape the maxima. If you math it out, 1 BOD regen is really 2/3 of 1d6 healing (standard effect is 2, instead of 3). Working that into the equation "Reapply once per turn" is a +1 advantage. I would have liked to see that reflected in the "Reduced reapplication time" pricing, so that Regen could be replicated with the "reduced reapplication time" advantage.

 

I wouldn't mind seeing an advantage for Aid that allows it to recover points below starting max with no fade rate, making it combine healing and aid. Simialrly, an option making Absorb and Transfer work like Healing instead of Aid would also be welcome.

[Sean Waters]

Re: Alternative Healing Rules - Public input requested

 

Aid does not cost END and Heal does' date=' so making the two comparable, Heal costs 15 per d6 compared to 10 for Aid.[/quote']

 

...and only to restore to starting levels is -1/2, so presumably 'does not fade' is +1, and they cost the same

 

 

 

There were significant problems with the "old way". Let's take a look at a simplistic construct using the "Aid heals; only to starting limit is a -1/2 limitation" structure:

 

1d6 Aid, all characteristics (+2), Persistent (+1/2), Only to starting max (-1/2), self only (-1/2), Always on (-0 - what's the drawback?). That costs 17 points.

 

The character now recovers 1d6 points of every stat he's down every phase. Ignoring adjustment powers to focus solely on normal combat, and assuming a 4 Speed (high heroic or low superheroic), the character recovers an average of 7 BOD, 14 Stun and 28 END per turn, ignoring any use of his Recover stat. Note that he recovers these points even if his STUN is at -50. Good luck keeping this character down for any length of time.

 

Hey, shell out 35 points and double it. You can make it up by making all his powers 2x END, since he recovers an average of 56 END (plus recoveries) every turn. He can spend 14 END per phase on an ongoing basis and never get tired.

 

Let's make him a Speedster with an 8 Speed and a fast-healing metabolism. That 35 point investment now averages 28 BOD, 56 STUN and 112 END recovered every turn. And that Brick thought his 30 REC was impressive!

 

While this can be done under the current system by reducing the reapplication rate for a Heal to once per phase is considerably more expensive.

 

The one thing I dislike about the current structure is the "behind the curtains" mechanic that allows Regeneration to escape the maxima. If you math it out, 1 BOD regen is really 2/3 of 1d6 healing (standard effect is 2, instead of 3). Working that into the equation "Reapply once per turn" is a +1 advantage. I would have liked to see that reflected in the "Reduced reapplication time" pricing, so that Regen could be replicated with the "reduced reapplication time" advantage.

 

I wouldn't mind seeing an advantage for Aid that allows it to recover points below starting max with no fade rate, making it combine healing and aid. Simialrly, an option making Absorb and Transfer work like Healing instead of Aid would also be welcome.

 

I like the 5ER approach to healing, with the same caveat about regeneration you mentioned.

 

The only thing I might consider is allowing heal to add, up to the maximum rollable. I know that is a shortcut to munchkinism, but it is more consistent with the general approach Hero takes to these things. The current approach (sort of) penalises you for buying more: getting a max roll on 1 or 2 or even 3 dice is justa matter of patience: acheiving it on 4 or more is cause for a party.

 

One possible option would be a disadvantage that allowed you to take an extra level on the time chart (or 2) and acheive a maximum result, say + 1/4...so you could buy 4d6 Heal (max acheiveable) and take 1 turn to get a 24 result without rolling, or 5d6...which could roll that or more theoretically but would only do so 3.24% of the time...or not. Up to you.

[dsatow]

Re: Alternative Healing Rules - Public input requested

 

Thanks for all the input and thanks Steve for moving the message.

 

Chris Goodwin: Most players tend to have troubles keeping per wound hits. It makes record keeping annoying. Most players I know of rather keep only running tallies.

 

Hyper-Man: I agree, whether official or not, many people look to Hero Designer as by default keeping to the official rules.

 

Sean Walters: You have an error in your statement.

 

Assuming

Healer A = 2d6 healing

Healer B = 1d6 Healing Decreased Delay (per turn)

 

Then if healer A does 7 points of healing, by the revised 5th edition, Healer B can not heal the target since healer B must also exceed the roll of healer A. But Healer B has a different Decreased Delay, how does that play into it. Does this mean Healer B only waits 1 turn before he can consider that null and void? What if healer A goes first? Does the advantage only benefit him or all healers in the party?

 

lets make it more complicated.

Healer A = 3d6 Healing (per day)

Healer B = 1d6 Healing (per turn self only always on)

Healer C = 2d6 Healing (per minute)

 

Healer B takes 5 stun one phase and heals 2 points. Healer B then takes another 4 stun and heals another 1 (rolling a 3) point. A turn goes by, does he have to beat a 2 on the first phase or a three?

 

Healer B is taking a lot of stun (they hate him). Healer C heals him for 7 points of stun. Because Healer B has been constantly recovering, what is healer C's target number? What would healer A's target number be considering the heals of Healer B and C?

 

I think I'll copy this back to the 5th edition rules clarification for comments from Steve.

Hugh Neilson: Your scenarios have two problems. Aid has an upper cap. Your designed aid would max out at 3 body, 6 stun, and 12 end.

 

The second problem is per Steve (and I remember it being in the book), End can not be healed (though I figure drained End can be healed, used End can not.) This would apply to both End Batteries and Normal End. This is probably to prevent a cheap End recovery though I think the point is moot. You can easily use aid to do just about the same thing.

[Sean Waters]

Re: Alternative Healing Rules - Public input requested

 

.......................Sean 'Noel' Walters: You have an error in your statement.

 

Assuming

Healer A = 2d6 healing

Healer B = 1d6 Healing Decreased Delay (per turn)

 

Then if healer A does 7 points of healing, by the revised 5th edition, Healer B can not heal the target since healer B must also exceed the roll of healer A. But Healer B has a different Decreased Delay, how does that play into it. Does this mean Healer B only waits 1 turn before he can consider that null and void? What if healer A goes first? Does the advantage only benefit him or all healers in the party?

 

I did not get what you meant at first, but this is actually a really good point:

 

Healer X rolls 8 points

Healer Y rolls 4 points

 

....in the first turn.

 

In the second turn Healer Y rolls 4 points; does this:

 

1. Add to the 8 points that were already healed, or

2. Add to the 4 points HE already healed?

 

I'd go with the second scenario, personally - roll each set of healing independently, and only worry when one total exceeds the other, but I can definitely see the other side too and would be willing to be persuaded by a cunning argument. Anyone?

 

lets make it more complicated.

Healer A = 3d6 Healing (per day)

Healer B = 1d6 Healing (per turn self only always on)

Healer C = 2d6 Healing (per minute)

 

Healer B takes 5 stun one phase and heals 2 points. Healer B then takes another 4 stun and heals another 1 (rolling a 3) point. A turn goes by, does he have to beat a 2 on the first phase or a three?

 

Healer B is taking a lot of stun (they hate him). Healer C heals him for 7 points of stun. Because Healer B has been constantly recovering, what is healer C's target number? What would healer A's target number be considering the heals of Healer B and C?

 

I think I'll copy this back to the 5th edition rules clarification for comments from Steve.

.......................

 

I hear you: it is not easy.

 

Let's see...

 

If HN and HM have 2d6 and 1d6 healing respectively, and on day 1, HA heals Victim of 12 points, come day 2, only HM is available...can he heal any more?

 

I'd say he can...

 

So, logically after the reset period of your own healing power, anyone else can heal you as if the only injury you ever had was your current level of injury.

 

The reset period is the important thing...

 

That would mean the oder of healing IS important.

 

Healer K has 1d6 healing (turn reset)

Healer L has 2d6 healing (day reset)

 

Healer K heals victim of 6 points THEN healer L heals Victim of 12 points that same turn. Even if HL has another go next turn he can't get a higher total, or add any more.

 

Final result, Victim is healed of 12 character points.

 

Now if HK heals Victim of 6 points, the HL waits 1 turn and heals him, getting a total of 12, Victim will have been healed of 18 character points of power.

 

OK.

 

So, the rule (if I have this right) would be that where two or more heals are applied, they only add if the reset period of one of the heals has been reached.

 

This would eman that the order heals are applied in COULD be relevant...

 

Back to HK and HL, if HL goes first, and heals 12, anything HK can heal does not add to that, if the healing is applied within 1 day: he has to keep his own running total - so he would need 3 turns at least to make any difference tot he healing HL applied.

 

Cool: really good point I'd never pereviously considered.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Alternative Healing Rules - Public input requested

 

Hyper-Man: I agree, whether official or not, many people look to Hero Designer as by default keeping to the official rules.

 

Actually, it IS official in 5er:

 

from page 188

 

Decreased Re-use Duration (varies):

The default rule is that a character can only use his Healing on a character he has already Healed one Day (24 hours) after he last applied the Healing. For a +¼ Advantage, Decreased Re-use Duration, the time between Healings moves one level up on the Time Chart (to 6 Hours, 1 Hour, and so on). However, characters cannot buy their Healing to be used more frequently than one Healing per Turn. For example, to be able to apply Healing every 5 Minutes would be a +1 Advantage.

So if you want to be able to heal BODY with a re-use of once/turn it costs 25 or 37* points per dice before any Limitations. (*With Can Heal Limbs).

 

Is there a particular reason that this doesn't solve your problem?

[Sean Waters]

Re: Alternative Healing Rules - Public input requested

 

..............................

lets make it more complicated.

Healer A = 3d6 Healing (per day)

Healer B = 1d6 Healing (per turn self only always on)

Healer C = 2d6 Healing (per minute)

 

Healer B takes 5 stun one phase and heals 2 points. Healer B then takes another 4 stun and heals another 1 (rolling a 3) point. A turn goes by, does he have to beat a 2 on the first phase or a three?

 

The turn reset has occurred: he heals whatever he rolls, he does not need to beat anything. If he rolls within a turn he has to beat 3.

 

...of course this answer would be diferent if you apply healing per injury. Then the question becomes 'What order do you apply healing to injuries in, and do you have to heal old injuries before new ones?'

 

Certainly if you apply per injury and you can decide which injuries to apply to you could do this:

 

Takes 5 stun, heals 2 (at -3).

Takes 4 more stun (at -3 and -4), heals 3 points from the new injury (full effect as seperate injury) (now at -4). If he has any more phases that turn and rolls again he could heal the first injury if he exceeds a roll of 2, or either if he exceeds a roll of 3.

 

That is, using those parameters, he could heal the full 5 points rolled in a single turn!

 

Then you have the question if you apply healing per injury, whether, if you completely heal one injury, can any points carried over apply to a second injury, and how do you apply them if the second injury is already partly healed?

 

 

Healer B is taking a lot of stun (they hate him). Healer C heals him for 7 points of stun. Because Healer B has been constantly recovering, what is healer C's target number? What would healer A's target number be considering the heals of Healer B and C?

 

...........................

 

Right assuming Healer C waits a turn since the last heal, and gets in just before the next one, he heals the full 7 points (but HB's heal for that turn will not do anything extra. Indeed HB's own heal power will not have any additional effect until HB exceeds 7 points, which may take several more turns of healing).

 

HA would need to exceed 7 points to have additional effect IF he used his heal within 1 minute of HC's heal. Outside that time he would apply the full effect of his power, less anything HB rolled within a turn!.

 

That's what I think, anyway

[dsatow]

Re: Alternative Healing Rules - Public input requested

 

LOL

 

All this specialized accounting is why I dislike the current version of healing:thumbdown.

 

"If the healer of the first part heals without the consent of the healer of the second said healer shall construe said heal invalid unless the healer of third part ... etc. etc. etc."

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Alternative Healing Rules - Public input requested

 

Actually, it IS official in 5er:

 

from page 188

 

So if you want to be able to heal BODY with a re-use of once/turn it costs 25 or 37* points per dice before any Limitations. (*With Can Heal Limbs).

 

Is there a particular reason that this doesn't solve your problem?

 

I meant this as a house-rule minimum purchase for your game.

 

Anyone who wants Healing must at a minimum purchase it with the re-use at once/turn Advantage (+1 1/2).

 

2d6 Healing BODY (3 actual BODY per use with Standard Effect) would be 50 active points. Wound record keeping is then kept at a minimum.

[Sean Waters]

Re: Alternative Healing Rules - Public input requested

 

LOL

 

All this specialized accounting is why I dislike the current version of healing:thumbdown.

 

"If the healer of the first part heals without the consent of the healer of the second said healer shall construe said heal invalid unless the healer of third part ... etc. etc. etc."

 

Steve was a lawyer

 

Despite the problems healing is one of those things that can get very silly: DnD healing for example is silly: two first level healing spells are more effective than second level healing spell - for most purposes why bother with a more effective version of the spell? You can avoid most of the problems by not allowing the Reduced Reset limitation. Mind you, if you do, then (if I may correct your caveats; I'm a lawyer too):

 

If the party of the first part (hereinafter called Boffo the Magnificent) attempts to heal the party of the second part (hereinafter called William the Bloody) after the party of the third part (hereinafter called Hands On Harry) has healed the party of the second part and before the reset period of the healing of the party of the third part has expired then his attempt at healing shall only be effective to the extent that it exceeds the healing of the party of the third part but if the reset period of the healing of the party of the third part has been concluded, then the healing of the party of the first part shall take effect in full.

 

What's dificult about that, I ask you?

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Alternative Healing Rules - Public input requested

 

Hugh Neilson[/b]: Your scenarios have two problems. Aid has an upper cap. Your designed aid would max out at 3 body' date=' 6 stun, and 12 end.[/quote']

 

In 4e, Aid only capped at a given amount above the starting max. If your Aid only brought the target back to starting max, it lacked any fade rate. My assumption was that your suggestion #3:

 

Solution 3: Get rid of healing/bring back regen.

This solution basically means get rid of healing and produce the 1/2 limitation on Aid only to restore character to starting values. This is similar to the way the game was played prior to the advent of healing. We would also keep the adders for Regen or Aid.

 

was intended to restore the system to 4e, when (IIRC) Aid and Healing were not separate, and Aid had no fade rate or max when only restoring to starting maxima. If your Aid solution retains the cap, you have the same issues with Aid used as healing that you are critquing for healing now.

 

The second problem is per Steve (and I remember it being in the book)' date=' End can not be healed (though I figure drained End can be healed, used End can not.) This would apply to both End Batteries and Normal End. This is probably to prevent a cheap End recovery though I think the point is moot. You can easily use aid to do just about the same thing.[/quote']

 

Page reference? The FAQ does note that Healing does not work on Long Term Endurance, but that's another animal entirely. That question actually indicates you CAN heal END:

 

Q: Can a character use Healing to counteract the loss of Long-Term Endurance?

 

 

 

A: As a default, Healing has no effect on Long-Term Endurance loss; that could prove unbalancing in games that use the LTE rules. Assuming the GM wishes to allow it anyway (which is certainly his right), he’s got to figure out what to charge for it; he might, for example, require the character to buy a dedicated form of Healing (Healing LTE) instead of using a normal Healing END, or establish a point cost for LTE as if it were its own Characteristic.

 

Emphasis mine

 

 

Frankly, there's nothing wrong with healing END, any more than healing STUN, IMO.

[Sean Waters]

Re: Alternative Healing Rules - Public input requested

 

You can't heal lost END?

 

What?

 

I really ought to read this stuff sometime.....

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Alternative Healing Rules - Public input requested

 

You can't heal lost END?

 

What?

 

I really ought to read this stuff sometime.....

 

You ought to read the previous poster's FAQ quote on the subject as well.

[dsatow]

Re: Alternative Healing Rules - Public input requested

 

You can't heal lost END?

 

What?

 

I really ought to read this stuff sometime.....

 

Yup you can't heal END. See the following threads

 

http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42556&highlight=Healing+End

 

http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42568&highlight=Healing+End

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Alternative Healing Rules - Public input requested

 

Yup you can't heal END. See the following threads

 

http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42556&highlight=Healing+End

 

http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42568&highlight=Healing+End

 

Those are both about applying Healing END to an Endurance Reserve. They say nothing about applying Healing to the characteristic END.

[Sean Waters]

Re: Alternative Healing Rules - Public input requested

 

Thank goodness for that: feet back on ground....