Is Find Weakness considered an attack?

[Demonsong]

Is Find Weakness considered an attack?

 

Is it obvious when the power is being used?

 

Thanks

[lemming]

Re: Is Find Weakness considered an attack?

 

Originally posted by Demonsong

Is Find Weakness considered an attack?

 

Is it obvious when the power is being used?

I haven't looked at 5th edition's Find Weakness too much. (I actually don't use it in my games anymore...)

So this may be wrong, but it's how I remember it.

 

1) No. So you could make two FW rolls in one phase. (Or find one, then attack)

 

2) No, however, the target's Danger Sense would probably go off. A perception roll could be made to notice the studying that is happening. "Hey quit looking at me!"

[Demonsong]

(I actually don't use it in my games anymore...)

 

Why?

 

Did you find it unbalancing or something?

[Killer Shrike]

It is not an Attack, but it is a "Danger". Its basically a special kind of Perception check mechanically.

[Vondy]

Half phase skill/perception roll. Not an attack.

[lemming]

Originally posted by Demonsong

Why?

 

Did you find it unbalancing or something?

 

I tend to run more high powered games and some lucky rolls just wind up getting messy.

[Killer Shrike]

Originally posted by lemming

I tend to run more high powered games and some lucky rolls just wind up getting messy.

In higher powered games Lack of Weakness (and Knockback Resistance, some level of Damage Reduction, and Combat Luck) become good point sinks to drain off some of those excess points.

[Demonsong]

Thanks all !

[lemming]

Originally posted by Killer Shrike

In higher powered games Lack of Weakness (and Knockback Resistance, some level of Damage Reduction, and Combat Luck) become good point sinks to drain off some of those excess points.

That they do, but it got to the point where everyone needed 10-20 LoW in order not to have a 1 pd against some martial artists.

 

I had characters on both sides of the equation. It was just easier to drop the Find Weakness and add other abilities.

 

One of Sam Bell's villians, Stalker, a rather high end martial artist used to always have a high FW roll. Sam replaced it with the illegal AVLD does body. The defense: 1

 

Since she would normally get people down to 1 anyway, it wasn't as unbalancing as it looks on paper. Plus all the bricks had it in for her. If she attacked anyone, there was usually a large object then heading toward her hex.

 

The few characters I had with Find Weakness I modified.

Calico does have a FW skill that LoW works against. However, for everytime she makes the roll, she gets to add 1d6 to her damage against said target. Not as good ripping away all the defenses, but given time, she really has a good wallop.

 

The other characters just put those points into other abilities.

[Hugh Neilson]

Originally posted by lemming

That they do, but it got to the point where everyone needed 10-20 LoW in order not to have a 1 pd against some martial artists.

 

One of Sam Bell's villians, Stalker, a rather high end martial artist used to always have a high FW roll. Sam replaced it with the illegal AVLD does body. The defense: 1

 

Since she would normally get people down to 1 anyway, it wasn't as unbalancing as it looks on paper. Plus all the bricks had it in for her. If she attacked anyone, there was usually a large object then heading toward her hex.

 

Maybe I'm missing the point, but how long did these characters just stand around getting Weakness found? Every roll is a 1/2 phase action.

 

If you want to get around it, buy an Invisible force field - he can't find a weakness if he can't see the Defense. Or buy Damage Reduction instead - no FW for that!

[lemming]

Originally posted by Hugh Neilson

Maybe I'm missing the point, but how long did these characters just stand around getting Weakness found? Every roll is a 1/2 phase action.

 

If you're right next to the character, you don't have to half move, so you might as well see if you can find another weakness before attacking.

 

The advantages I've found after dropping FW.

1) No standing around looking at everybody

2) The GM has one less defense to worry about for the villians.

 

YMMV

[Hugh Neilson]

While you're standing around looking, what's your opponent doing? If he has FW, probably sizing you up as well. If not, maybe he might strike at you (or just move away - encounter over, so all existing FW effects are gone at the start of the next encounter).

 

Works great if you can size up the opposition for a turn or so without being noticed, but how often should that happen? And if you just stand there sizing up the Brick, why doesn't he grab a hunk of pavement and wrap it around you (1 hex area grab) or just smack you away (knockback and 1 hex area concrete slab). So much for Joe Martial Artist!

[Hugh Neilson]

Another thought: how many points are these characters spending on FW? At -2 for each successive roll, getting an opponent of (say) 32 DEF down to 1 needs a lot of points to work consistently. One miss, no more chances.

 

To get 11- on that 5th roll, with a related group of attacks (martial maneuvers) is 40 points, and the odds of 5 successes still isn't good.

 

What if his opponent spent that many points on additional EB dice? [Or additional OCV with his EB - let's see the Martial Artist dodge an OCV 30 (base 10 + 20 2 point levels) EB at "campaign standard" damage.

[Alibear]

edit.

 

Learn to read post.

 

edit.

 

A thing to remember is that if the campaign has active points limits you need to address the implications of Find weakness. Perhaps add the points spent on FW to the points in the attack to get an active point total. Or perhaps call it a +1/2 modifier and leave it at that.

[lemming]

Originally posted by Alibear Thing to remember is that if the campaign has active points limits you need to address the implications of Find weakness.

 

Yep. I'm not anti Find Weakness. I just found it to be more of a wild card for balancing at high power levels with many players. And now I just find it easier to not bother with it. Kind of a cop out, but it works for me.

[Tech]

Originally posted by lemming

The few characters I had with Find Weakness I modified.

Calico does have a FW skill that LoW works against. However, for everytime she makes the roll, she gets to add 1d6 to her damage against said target. Not as good ripping away all the defenses, but given time, she really has a good wallop.

 

Hey, I like this idea. Maybe I'll suggest it to my players.

[VictorVonDoom]

In MSH (marvel) there was a power that was called "create weakness" also: this is an attack

 

Find Weakness is a attemp to look at somebody like a crying spell or a spying apparatus looking at a someone

 

suppose you have a villan with a Invulnerability vs cold : double damage from cold (x2 damage)

then with the find weakness you can find it or scan him out

and use cold attacks against him