Alibear Posted February 1, 2008 Report Share Posted February 1, 2008 Re: Ground Tentacle Attack! Does this happen instantly or would you take slightly extra time? Would it leave the guy with his arm stuck in the ground less mobile? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Waters Posted February 1, 2008 Report Share Posted February 1, 2008 Re: Ground Tentacle Attack! Well, no, it doesn't rumble, not at all. Part of the concept... you only see the guy inserting the thing into the ground near his feet... then all of a sudden, next thing you know, you're getting stabbed from below. The moving through a certain DEF or less is a good idea. It's certainly not meant to go through steel, for example. =) It still needs 3 visible sfx. You can see it, is one, albeit what you can see is usually obscured by the ground, but it needs more, and a little last minute vibration might be the very thing. Matter for you though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Democracy Posted February 1, 2008 Report Share Posted February 1, 2008 Re: Ground Tentacle Attack! The moving through a certain DEF or less is a good idea. It's certainly not meant to go through steel' date=' for example. =)[/quote'] A good example of a limited advantage! It is only indirect if it does not have to go through materials of a certain density... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonio Posted February 1, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2008 Re: Ground Tentacle Attack! Does this happen instantly or would you take slightly extra time? Would it leave the guy with his arm stuck in the ground less mobile? Instantly. Well, I might go with Full Phase, or maybe just Delayed Phase. But certainly not Extra Segment or anything higher. It still needs 3 visible sfx. You can see it' date=' is one, albeit what you can see is usually obscured by the ground, but it needs more, and a little last minute vibration might be the very thing. Matter for you though.[/quote'] Well, the visible SFX's are there, they're just seen at both endpoints, not in the middle, because it's underground. Imagine a guy with an Indirect RKA defined as shooting arrows that can turn corners. If you're behind a brick wall, you won't perceive the first half of the arrow's trajectory. Same thing here. The thing'll be visible, it'll make a sound, and you can touch it. Just not while it's underground. =) A good example of a limited advantage! It is only indirect if it does not have to go through materials of a certain density... Dunno... don't think it gets a limitation for this. Hell, it's almost an advantage to be able to go through ground, I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Democracy Posted February 1, 2008 Report Share Posted February 1, 2008 Re: Ground Tentacle Attack! Dunno... don't think it gets a limitation for this. Hell' date=' it's almost an advantage to be able to go through ground, I think.[/quote'] Course its an advantage - thats the indirect you are paying for. If the attack disappeared a metre after it left a gun then appeared just in front of the target then indirect works for you. Why should SFX that the indirect part is going through the ground make any difference. If something limits the effectiveness of that indirect advantage - such as a particular type of barrier or density of ground that you happen to be standing on - then why not get a cost break? You wouldn't have questioned that the example above should get a cost break just because they happened to be standing on concrete would you? Same difference... Doc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonio Posted February 1, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2008 Re: Ground Tentacle Attack! Course its an advantage - thats the indirect you are paying for. If the attack disappeared a metre after it left a gun then appeared just in front of the target then indirect works for you. Why should SFX that the indirect part is going through the ground make any difference. If something limits the effectiveness of that indirect advantage - such as a particular type of barrier or density of ground that you happen to be standing on - then why not get a cost break? You wouldn't have questioned that the example above should get a cost break just because they happened to be standing on concrete would you? Same difference... Doc Ah ok, I see where you're coming from. You're assuming I'll be paying for Indirect at the +3/4 level, Any Origin, Any Direction. KS convinced me "Same Origin, Any Direction" (+1/2) is appropriate (that being the same one used for mortar-type attacks, or arrows that can turn corners, "stretching"-type attacks, etc.). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Democracy Posted February 1, 2008 Report Share Posted February 1, 2008 Re: Ground Tentacle Attack! Ah ok' date=' I see where you're coming from. You're assuming I'll be paying for Indirect at the +3/4 level, Any Origin, Any Direction. KS convinced me "Same Origin, Any Direction" (+1/2) is appropriate (that being the same one used for mortar-type attacks, or arrows that can turn corners, "stretching"-type attacks, etc.).[/quote'] Hmm. dont have my book. However I am assuming that your attacks always have the same origin - even in my example the attack was always the same origin. Will look at the rules and see if I change my mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonio Posted February 1, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2008 Re: Ground Tentacle Attack! Hmm. dont have my book. However I am assuming that your attacks always have the same origin - even in my example the attack was always the same origin. Will look at the rules and see if I change my mind. Well, SFX vs mechanics. If I define an attack as creating a portal with one endpoint 2 feet in front of me, the other endpoint wherever I want, oriented however I want, and firing a normal EB through it (Hey Sean... NPA, Indirect for up to XX APs of EB!), it still "originates" at me, but in actual game mechanics, it originates at the 2nd portal, which I can put wherever I want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Waters Posted February 1, 2008 Report Share Posted February 1, 2008 Re: Ground Tentacle Attack! Well' date=' SFX vs mechanics. If I define an attack as creating a portal with one endpoint 2 feet in front of me, the other endpoint wherever I want, oriented however I want, and firing a normal EB through it (Hey Sean... NPA, Indirect for up to XX APs of EB!), it still "originates" at me, but in actual game mechanics, it originates at the 2nd portal, which I can put wherever I want.[/quote'] You're a funny....Cartman toon. The confusion that the current version of indirect engenders in my poor little brain is why I suggested the alternative model earlier in the thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Democracy Posted February 1, 2008 Report Share Posted February 1, 2008 Re: Ground Tentacle Attack! Well' date=' SFX vs mechanics. If I define an attack as creating a portal with one endpoint 2 feet in front of me, the other endpoint wherever I want, oriented however I want, and firing a normal EB through it (Hey Sean... NPA, Indirect for up to XX APs of EB!), it still "originates" at me, but in actual game mechanics, it originates at the 2nd portal, which I can put wherever I want.[/quote'] I dont agree with that. It does not, in game mechanics terms originate at the second portal. If someone was to restrain you then you would not be able to fire the EB through the first portal and so the attack could not come through the second one. You could be tackled at the originating point. If it could originate at any point then regardless of being restrained, entangled etc, I could fire it and it could come at my opponent from any direction... Doc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonio Posted February 1, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2008 Re: Ground Tentacle Attack! I dont agree with that. It does not, in game mechanics terms originate at the second portal. If someone was to restrain you then you would not be able to fire the EB through the first portal and so the attack could not come through the second one. You could be tackled at the originating point. If it could originate at any point then regardless of being restrained, entangled etc, I could fire it and it could come at my opponent from any direction... Doc I'd think that'd make it Restrainable, not less Indirect. I don't think you can fire off an Indirect power when you couldn't fire a non-Indirect one, ceteris paribus. Could be wrong, tho! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boomer Posted February 1, 2008 Report Share Posted February 1, 2008 Re: Ground Tentacle Attack! Well, no, it doesn't rumble, not at all. Part of the concept... you only see the guy inserting the thing into the ground near his feet... then all of a sudden, next thing you know, you're getting stabbed from below. The moving through a certain DEF or less is a good idea. It's certainly not meant to go through steel, for example. =) It sounds like the attack has some Desolid aspects then. I think of real World instances when I think up powers so I'm wondering why no rumble? Or how the no rumble is achieved? Like I said if I was building it I'd be thinking how to overcome the obvious ground vibration from something pushing through solid earth.... but hey that's me.... Just curious how you guys are doing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonio Posted February 1, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2008 Re: Ground Tentacle Attack! It's thin and smooth enough not to rumble? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boomer Posted February 3, 2008 Report Share Posted February 3, 2008 Re: Ground Tentacle Attack! It's thin and smooth enough not to rumble? Works for me....like I said just curious....my GM's would always impose real world circumstances on you....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casualplayer Posted February 3, 2008 Report Share Posted February 3, 2008 Re: Ground Tentacle Attack! So this is just elongating a limb to make a Surprise Attack? Sounds like Stretching to me, with the intrinsic "Indirect"-ness that is built into the power. I mean, is there anything mandating the slither-through-the-ground aspect of the power or is that just the habitual SFX? Could the attack travel through a ventilation duct? Down an artillery barrel? Through a sewer line? Over a wall? Around a wall? BTW, as described, the origin of this power is the character because it's his limb reaching out to touch someone. If there is an uncircumventable barrier between the character and the target, the attack doesn't get there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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