What if spells were like weapons?

[Vondy]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

You know, I'd just use Resource Pools for the entire campaign.

 

the limit being how many "spell crystals" (which is an idea I think is cool) can be in proximity before they interfere with each other and break down.

 

Call it a Spell Resource Pool and be done.

 

Someone beat me to the punch.

[Lucius]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

I hear voices chanting

 

 

A spell is a process, not a thing.

 

A spell is a process, not a thing.

 

A spell is a process, not a thing.

 

 

Lucius Alexander

 

Probably just the palindromedary

[Vondy]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

I hear voices chanting

 

 

 

Lucius Alexander

 

Probably just the palindromedary

 

I hear dogmatic repetition of one narrow conceptualization of a common fantasy trope. A spell is whatever the writer says it is.

[Lezentauw]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

Here is the basis to my system, that I refer to as a skilled based system...

 

Channeler

 

In my campaign spellcasters are called Channelers. They take the ambient magical energy and draw it into themselves, molding it into the form they wish to use and then expel it as a spell.

 

This is a supremely difficult task, one that the vast majority of people cannot perform. There are a few that are born with the talent for such things, but even they must use foci, chants, complex gestures or any number of other crutches to properly massage the magical energy into the forms they wish. On top of this, not all Channelers are born equal. Some require more crutches than others, there are even rumors of those so powerfully attuned, that they do not need any.

 

All potential Channelers must choose one of the Magical Aptitude talents listed below.

 

• Magical Aptitude: Minor – 5 points

o Must have a total of -2 points worth of Limitations on all spells. All of which must chosen at character creation. The limitations must be the same across all known spells.

• Magical Aptitude: Major – 10 points

o Must have a total of -1 points worth of Limitations on all spells. All of which must chosen at character creation. The limitations must be the same across all known spells.

• Magical Aptitude: Superior – 15 points

o Must have a total of -1/2 points worth of Limitations on all spells. All of which must chosen at character creation. The limitations must be the same across all known spells.

• Magical Aptitude: Supreme – 20 points

o Does not require any mandatory Limitations

 

All potential Channelers must also purchase the Magesight talent as described in Fantasy Hero for 5 points.

 

The above choices give you the ability to cast spells, but not the knowledge or actual skill to do so. To make this happen you must understand the following.

 

All spells are formed into groupings, called Sources. Each Source has its own methods for manipulation and use, a practitioner of Necromancy casts spells much differently than a practitioner of Elementalism. So, for each Source that you are able to utilize you must have a Power Skill and a Knowledge Skill that is representative of it.

 

• Power: [Power Source] (EGO based) – 3/2 cost structure (Represents the characters actual ability to cast spells from that school)

• KS: [Power Source] (INT based) – 3/2 cost structure (Represents the characters knowledge of that school)

 

Once a Channeler has determined which Source or Sources they wish to manipulate, the Channeler must purchase a Spell Familiarity for each spell he wishes to cast. These Spell Familiarities operate in the same way as Weapon Familiarities do and cost 1 point each. The Channeler does not pay points for the spells themselves, only for the Familiarities associated with them.

 

 

Spells

 

When building spells for your Channeler you must keep the following in mind.

• No Spell may have the Reduced Endurance advantage

• All spells must have the following limitations, over and above the limitation requirements for your level of Magical Aptitude.

o Costs Endurance

o Requires Skill Roll (-1 per 10 AP)

o Side Effects

 

When you selected your Magical Aptitude level you had to choose a set of limitations that represent your characters particular crutches for casting spells. These do not change, ever. They are ALWAYS applied to all spells that you know and they are in addition to the limitations listed above.

 

Spells have no limit on their Active Point cost.

 

Spell Casting

 

In order to cast a spell, a Channeler must have the Spell Familiarity for it, or suffer a -3 to the skill roll. The Channeler must make a successful “Power: [Power Source]” skill roll after subtracting the AP modifier. In order to cast a spell without a SF, the character must have "seen" it cast before. Each step down the time chart from the time seen is another -1 to the skill roll.

 

If the roll fails, then the Channeler will suffer the Side Effects listed for that spell.

 

If the GM deems it appropriate the Channeler can also use his “KS: [Power Source]” skill in a complimentary fashion.

 

The limitations on the spells can also be tweaked in order to increase the chance that the Channeler will cast the spell. To do this, the Channeler can add on limitations at the time of casting. For each additional -1 point worth of limitations, the Channeler gains a +1 to the skill roll. As always the GM has final say as to whether or not a given limitation is appropriate.

 

The reverse can also happen. Should a Channeler find himself in a situation where a standard limitation completely stops him from casting or slows him down too much, he can skip that part of his routine. However, for every -1/2 of limitations removed in this fashion, the Channeler suffers a -1 to the skill roll. The GM has final say as to whether or not a particular limitation can be temporarily removed.

[CTaylor]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

Who came up with the first spells?

[Markdoc]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

Who came up with the first spells?

 

Religion 101: "Who make sky?"

 

cheers, Mark

[ghost-angel]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

Who came up with the first spells?

 

I was thinking about this actually... and I came up with the sketches of a fantasy world. Possibly a Sword&Sorcery or Post-Apocalypse flavor.

 

The Spell Crystals are a left over remnant of a previous age. No one knows how to make more, but some have figured out how to recharge them - some recharge slowly on their own, some require outside effort. Spell Crystals are rare and coveted things, almost artifacts.

 

The other idea I had was - how do you model a Blacksmith creating armor or weapons? Usually a Professional Skill and Weaponsmith (or Armorsmith) Skills.

 

Just add a Spellsmith skill.

 

Perhaps break it down, if you feel the need for that kind of detail, into some kind of distinction of types of spells - Fire Spells or Offensive Spells, or whatever works for your world. But I would only break it down like that if the Weapon and Armorsmith Skills were similarly divided out.

[CTaylor]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

Well, the reason I asked that wasn't a broad metaphysical question, but in direct response to the spell system posted by Lezentau. If I'm reading it correctly, people can only learn spells by seeing others do so or being taught. So... where did those first ones come from?

[Shadowsoul]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

I would probably go with the spellsmith idea. I was thinking that it would be interesting to have Mages separate from the people who create spells. Like the relationship between a gunsmith and a soldier.

 

I was also thinking of having places that generate fully formed spell crystals spontaneously. They'd be known colloquially as Spell-Wells. I'd leave it as a mystery as to whether this phenomenon was the work of gods or spirits or the legacy of some ancient civilisation. Conflict over Spell-Wells would be fierce of course.

 

One possible further refinement of spell crystals is that it is necessary to harvest or mine certain raw materials to create them. Natural mineral/crystal formations would do it. They might grow fast enough to be 'farmed' after a fashion or they might be mined like coal. Alternatively there is the idea used in Skies of Arcadia; there are six moons orbiting the planet and they periodically shower it with chunks of moonstone ore. These moonstones can be used as a kind of fuel or refined and used as permanent artefacts which allow the use of magic.

[Lucius]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

Well' date=' the reason I asked that wasn't a broad metaphysical question, but in direct response to the spell system posted by Lezentau. If I'm reading it correctly, people can only learn spells by seeing others do so or being taught. So... where did those first ones come from?[/quote']

 

In some cases there will be a historical figure who first worked out a given technique.

 

For older techniques or rituals, a "culture hero" will probably be credited with originating them. That is, there will be a myth relating how a God or ancestor first taught the secret to others. Whoever's running the game may decide that the myth is essentially true, or that one or more forgotten geniuses were responsible, or that the oldest and commonest techniques have been so refined over the generations that no one person could be credited as having "invented" them.

 

 

In other words - just exactly like any other skill that is passed down master to student in any given cultural context. In this respect magick is no different than writing or agriculture or flint knapping or horseback riding.

 

 

 

Lucius Alexander

 

Invented the palindromedary

[Vondy]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

Personally, I want to see a farce based magic system: magical effects result from the perpetuation of a farce. Further, its not just a question of making a skill roll - you have to role-play it.

[CTaylor]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

In other words - just exactly like any other skill that is passed down master to student in any given cultural context.

 

Every skill can, in theory, be learned on your own by anyone. I could over time learn how to make a watch, it would take a long time but I could in theory work it out. The magic system proposed seemed to make that impossible (only learn by example) sort of like the World of Warcraft enchantment system that requires the destruction of enchanted items in a rather heavy ratio to make new ones.

 

So where did those original enchanted items come from??

[Lucius]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

Personally' date=' I want to see a farce based magic system: magical effects result from the perpetuation of a farce. Further, its not just a question of making a skill roll - you have to role-play it. [/quote']

 

I did that when I played a magician in Toon.

 

His name was Michael (pronounced Mick-high-yell) Mouse.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The palindromedary notes that he threatened to make a magician like that in Mage: The Ascension too

[Shadowsoul]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

Every skill can, in theory, be learned on your own by anyone. I could over time learn how to make a watch, it would take a long time but I could in theory work it out. The magic system proposed seemed to make that impossible (only learn by example) sort of like the World of Warcraft enchantment system that requires the destruction of enchanted items in a rather heavy ratio to make new ones.

 

So where did those original enchanted items come from??

 

It WoW? I expect that either gods or godlike entities turned up and said. "Look what we can make. Now you try it." Either that or some Elf was playing around with this sweet new thing called Arcane Magic and worked out that you could pour it into objects and make them do cool stuff like Mana Burn. The sorcerous equivalent of a pre-historic hunter working out that you can stab animals to death with a sharp piece of flint.

[CTaylor]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

I figure they are dragon poop. They fly over, crap out a mace or a sword or something.

[Lezentauw]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

Who came up with the first spells?

 

Hmmmm, interesting question. Though I will have to say that players are always allowed to come up with new spells of their own, in the same manner as others have created spells.

 

To do that you can either just use the KS[Magic Source] or have another skill called Spell Research as others have suggested. Either one though I would modify the roll by the AC of the spell.

[AmadanNaBriona]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

good for a Mordheim style setting... hmmm....

[CTaylor]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

A magic system I'm toying with works like this:

 

There are different groups of magic such as Elemental, Scholarly, and Dark, and characters buy levels of power in each of these (Novice, Apprentice, Journeyman, etc). The points paid for these power levels gives them access to spells within these power levels. The spells themselves are paid for with money or learned otherwise: they're free.

[Ryhope Wood]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

I have also used a spell skill system for my conversion of the Conan RPG from Mongoose. My guidelines for sorcery can be found here:

 

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/idmartin/Hyborian%20Hero/Characters/hero_conan_sorcery.htm

 

New spells can still be invented but usually by sorcerers way beyond the skill level of the PCs. Most PC level sorcery is learned from the fragments of knowledge that survived the great cataclysm.

[Evil Steve]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

I figure they are dragon poop. They fly over' date=' crap out a mace or a sword or something.[/quote']

 

That would explain why Dragons are so aggessive. I'd be disagreable too if I had to pass a spiked mace every so often.

[Kal'El Wayne]

Re: What if spells were like weapons?

 

Ooh, this just gave me a great idea for a kind of spell/telepath thingy. The world is just naturally full of magic, which usually just floats around. But when sentient people think/dream, they shape the magic around them. So it's just a case of which thoughts make what happen. If you practice/meditate on it long enough, you can find the exact right spell to use, then you can make it happen as much as you want. (That is your typical Fantasy Hero buying powers with points and calling it wizardry.) But there are some people who have learnt several spells and have developed a spell that takes a thought from their mind and plants it into the brain of someone else, letting them cast the spell. They often charge large amounts for a spell, and people can generally only remember a certain number of spells at once before they start getting mixed up and flooding their house instead of lighting a campfire. (That is, some people have the Aid Another ability to give you a spell, you can only hold X number of spells based on your Intelligence, and may need to make spellcasting skill rolls.) And then there are those who can make spells and embed them in objects, like gems that glow for six hours a day, or swords that almost always hit. (Normal Fantasy Hero ability in a focus.)