Dragon-riders of Pern

[AlHazred]

I'm wondering if anyone has statted out Pern dragons or made a package deal for the Dragon-riders or their culture. It's been years since I read the first book (and only the first book), but I'll give it a shot if no-one has anything.

[RexMundi]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

Back in the day, oh, 4e or so I had a solid Dragon Riders game going. It's actually not to tough to set up but requires a LOT of research to get all the additional weyr critters in there, especially with all the new books. It's a very rich and detailed setting, which reminds me since I've gotten to that box I may sit down and read them all again.

 

~Rex

[AlHazred]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

So, you're telling me, "Read the books, man."

 

FWIW, TBoD looks like a good starting point. May be just a simple case of starting with a Juvenile Dragon and paring down the non-canonical stuff.

 

Would you guys consider dragons Animal intelligence, Near-Human, or Human-like? I always got the sense they were Near-Human, like chimps or dolphins, though way smarter than those examples.

[RexMundi]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

The Dragons are as smart as people, some of them are even smarter (Ruth for example). They tend not to think LIKE humans though, and are subject to Instinctive drives. The Fire Lizards, are about as smart as a chimp, but more focused intellect wise, like a Parrot. DOLPHINS, are revealed to be REALLY freaking smart beyond the norm of thinking, in later books, but their Mindset uses different frames of reference.

 

The nice thing about the book series, is it's segmented off. So you can easily get all the Dragon Info, from one set the Fire Lizard from another set the Watch Weyr's from another set the Planet itself from another series , THEN, you can get the Prequel material that really goes into detail on the origin of the species so to speak, then the Dolphins, and a few other odds and ends here and there.

 

Best thing to, is you can get your hands on all the books at the Library, so you don't have to actually BUY them.

 

~Rex

[Blue Jogger]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

 

I'll take a stab at it. It looks to be Enormous size category. Although I don't know how fast they fly without going "In Between". They also Psychic Bonded with their riders, but that only gave vague emotions and physical responses rather than telepathy.

[RexMundi]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

No, the Dragons can speak quite well to their riders.....Fully 50% of The White Dragon for example, is conversation between Ruth and Jaxom. They're on the high end of telepathy, and Empathy, as well as Teleportation and Time Travel. Hence why it is VERY important, to actually read all of the novels.

 

Fire Lizards, tend to be strictly Empathic though. That trait was developed into full blown telepathy over the course of the Dragons being made.

 

~Rex

[AlHazred]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

Or, you know, we can make wild stabs at it, post the results, and modify them according to how outraged you get.

 

I'll be stabbing at it as well. Good to get some more 6E statting practice in.

[AlHazred]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

And just so my stuff doesn't seem inexplicably out-there, I've only ever read one book of the first trilogy. And that was 10+ years ago.

[RexMundi]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

Heh.....well if it's stab central, not a problem. We can make a grand contest of it if you wish.

 

~Rex

[RexMundi]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

For those not intimately familiar with the series (As there are something in the neighborhood of 20 books), there is a rather good wiki for just the basic information (though a few pieces of it are a bit twitchy, I may hop in and correct those) http://pern.wikia.com/wiki/Main_Page. Just remember. Pern Dragons poop out of their Tails. It's all in the little details.

 

~Rex

[AlHazred]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

And the idea that they poop Between was long and gloriously debated by ecologically-minded Perniacs (no, really) until it was canonically shown otherwise.

 

Herophiles = no different.

[The Suave]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

Aw man I completely forgot about this series! I read a bunch of these books 5+ years ago but I remember them being very setting oriented, which would make statting everything out a breeze.

 

If only I remembered enough to take part in this grande olde conteste. Maybe I'll pick these up again over winter break...

[AlHazred]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

Here's what I got so far. More when I'm not at work and can refer to the books.

 

Green Dragon

 

 

VAL CHA Cost Roll Notes

40 STR 30 17- HTH Damage 8d6 END [8]

18 DEX 16 13-

20 CON 10 13-

8 INT -2 11- PER Roll 11-

10 EGO 0 11-

20 PRE 10 13- PRE Attack: 4d6

3 OCV 0

3 DCV 0

3 OMCV 0

3 DMCV 0

2 SPD 0 Phases: 6, 12

8 PD 6 8 PD (0 rPD)

8 ED 6 8 ED (0 rED)

4 REC 0

20 END 0

16 BODY 6

32 STUN 6

 

Movement Cost Meters Notes

RUNNING 0 36m/72m END [3]

SWIMMING 0 4m/8m END [1]

LEAPING 0 4m 4m forward, 2m upward

 

 

TELEPORTATION 12m/24m

 

 

Characteristics Total: 88

 

Cost Powers

12 Heavy: Knockback Resistance -12m - END=0

2 Reach: Stretching 3m, Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (4 Active Points); Cannot Do Damage (-1/2), no Noncombat Stretching (-1/4), No Velocity Damage (-1/4), Limited Body Parts (wings and tail only; -1/4) - END=0

24 Long Legs: Running +24m (36m total) - END=2

12 Rider Impression: Mind Link , Human class of minds, One Specific Mind, Psychic Bond, Unlimited range in this dimension (15 Active Points); Unified Power (Psionic Powers; -1/4) - END=0

11 Go Between: Teleportation 12m, MegaScale (1m = 10,000 km; +2) (36 Active Points); Side Effects (without a clear destination image in mind, both dragon and rider will never emerge from Between; -1), Extra Time (Extra Phase, -3/4), Concentration (1/2 DCV; -1/4), Unified Power (Psionic Powers; -1/4) - END=4

7 Go Between: Extra-Dimensional Movement (Single Dimension, Any Time) (25 Active Points); Side Effects (without a clear destination image in mind, both dragon and rider will never emerge from Between; -1), Extra Time (Extra Phase, could be much higher depending on amount of Time Travel; -3/4), Increased Endurance Cost (x2 END; -1/2), Concentration (1/2 DCV; -1/4), Unified Power (Psionic Powers; -1/4) - END=4

 

Powers Total: 68

 

 

 

 

Cost Talents

20 Universal Translator 11-

 

Talents Total: 20

 

Value Complications

15 Physical Complication: Enormous (up to 8m tall) (Frequently; Slightly Impairing)

 

Complications Points: 15

 

Base Points: 200

Experience: 0

Experience Unspent: 0

Total Character Cost: 176

[Susano]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

I'll be glad to host any finished material on my site.

 

Just sayin'.

[Blue Jogger]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

Here's my attempt to rate the other dragons based on Green as a template. I didn't know if intelligence and ego increased linearly with size, so I left it alone. When we come to consensus on the stats, I'll help write up the HTML for Susano.

 

 

Blue being one step bigger then Green would be:

 

+5 STR

+3 CON

+1 BODY

-2 meters more Knockback

+1 PRE

+4 meters more Running

+2 PD

+1 ED

+1 REC

+6 END

+6 STUN

Stretching additional +1 meter

 

Brown being 1.5 times bigger than Green:

+10 STR

+5 CON

+2 BODY

-4 meters more Knockback

+3 PRE

+8 meters more Running

+2 PD

+2 ED

+3 REC

+10 END

+10 STUN

Stretching additional +2 meters

 

Bronze being twice as big as Green

+15 STR

+7 CON

+3 BODY

-6 meters more Knockback

+5 PRE

+12 meters more Running

+3 PD

+3 ED

+4 REC

+15 END

+15 STUN

Stretching additional +4 meters

Physical Limitation: Huge (Frequently, Greatly Impairing)

 

Gold being one level of growth bigger than Bronze

+20 STR

+10 CON

+4 BODY

-8 meters more Knockback

+8 PRE

+14 meters more Running

+4 PD

+4 ED

+6 REC

+20 END

+20 STUN

Stretching additional +5 meters

Physical Limitation: Huge (Frequently, Greatly Impairing)

[paladin.oa]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

Here's what I got so far. More when I'm not at work and can refer to the books.

 

Green Dragon

 

 

VAL CHA Cost Roll Notes

40 STR 30 17- HTH Damage 8d6 END [8]

18 DEX 16 13-

20 CON 10 13-

8 INT -2 11- PER Roll 11-

10 EGO 0 11-

20 PRE 10 13- PRE Attack: 4d6

3 OCV 0

3 DCV 0

3 OMCV 0

3 DMCV 0

2 SPD 0 Phases: 6, 12

8 PD 6 8 PD (0 rPD)

8 ED 6 8 ED (0 rED)

4 REC 0

20 END 0

16 BODY 6

32 STUN 6

 

Movement Cost Meters Notes

RUNNING 0 36m/72m END [3]

SWIMMING 0 4m/8m END [1]

LEAPING 0 4m 4m forward, 2m upward

 

 

TELEPORTATION 12m/24m

 

 

Characteristics Total: 88

 

Cost Powers

12 Heavy: Knockback Resistance -12m - END=0

2 Reach: Stretching 3m, Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (4 Active Points); Cannot Do Damage (-1/2), no Noncombat Stretching (-1/4), No Velocity Damage (-1/4), Limited Body Parts (wings and tail only; -1/4) - END=0

24 Long Legs: Running +24m (36m total) - END=2

12 Rider Impression: Mind Link , Human class of minds, One Specific Mind, Psychic Bond, Unlimited range in this dimension (15 Active Points); Unified Power (Psionic Powers; -1/4) - END=0

11 Go Between: Teleportation 12m, MegaScale (1m = 10,000 km; +2) (36 Active Points); Side Effects (without a clear destination image in mind, both dragon and rider will never emerge from Between; -1), Extra Time (Extra Phase, -3/4), Concentration (1/2 DCV; -1/4), Unified Power (Psionic Powers; -1/4) - END=4

7 Go Between: Extra-Dimensional Movement (Single Dimension, Any Time) (25 Active Points); Side Effects (without a clear destination image in mind, both dragon and rider will never emerge from Between; -1), Extra Time (Extra Phase, could be much higher depending on amount of Time Travel; -3/4), Increased Endurance Cost (x2 END; -1/2), Concentration (1/2 DCV; -1/4), Unified Power (Psionic Powers; -1/4) - END=4

 

Powers Total: 68

 

 

 

 

Cost Talents

20 Universal Translator 11-

 

Talents Total: 20

 

Value Complications

15 Physical Complication: Enormous (up to 8m tall) (Frequently; Slightly Impairing)

 

Complications Points: 15

 

Base Points: 200

Experience: 0

Experience Unspent: 0

Total Character Cost: 176

 

First, I love that series, now with that out of the way, the criticism.

 

Only problem that I have with this is the INT value of 8. I thought that 10 was adult human average, and that is what a Dragon of Pern's INT should be, remember, Dragons are as smart as humans.

[sobran]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure that 8 is actual human average. Hero System heroes, are by default, ah... heroic.

 

EDIT: Oops. I guess that human average is defined as anywhere between 5 and 10. Either way, I think 8 works though.

[Susano]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

8 has been traditionally human average. 10 is for heroes (i.e. PCs).

[sobran]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

8 has been traditionally human average. 10 is for heroes (i.e. PCs).

So I wasn't imagining it? I couldn't find that in 6e, but could have sworn I read something to that effect in 5er.

[薔薇語]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

You aren't wrong, Sobran. 8 is the stat for the average human. Page 48 of 6e1 pegs normal range at 6-10, which was the same in 5th. There is a write up on page 438 of 6e1 that pegs the "average person" as having all 8s. Susano's comment is that typically, a PC will never have stats below 10 because they are by their nature are "noteworthy" (page 438 as well).

 

La Rose.

[Susano]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

You aren't wrong, Sobran. 8 is the stat for the average human. Page 48 of 6e1 pegs normal range at 6-10, which was the same in 5th. There is a write up on page 438 of 6e1 that pegs the "average person" as having all 8s. Susano's comment is that typically, a PC will never have stats below 10 because they are by their nature are "noteworthy" (page 438 as well).

 

La Rose.

 

Except in the Valdorian Age, where everyone starts with 8s.

[Blue Jogger]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

Okay, here's the stats for the dragons. Noteworthy dragons, of course, have better stats than this.

 

    Green  Blue Brown Bronze Gold
STR    40    45    50    55    60
DEX    18    18    18    18    18
CON    20    23    25    27    30
INT     8     8     8     8     8
EGO    10    10    10    10    10
PRE    20    21    23    25    28
OCV     3     3     3     3     3
DCV     3     3     3     3     3
OMCV    3     3     3     3     3
DMCV    3     3     3     3     3
SPD     2     2     2     2     2
PD      8     9    10    11    12
ED      8     9    10    11    12
REC     4     5     7     8    10
END    20    26    30    35    40
BODY   16    17    18    19    20
STUN   32    40    42    47    52
Run    36    40    44    48    50
Flight 36    40    44    48    50
Swim    4     5     5     6     6
Leap    4     5     5     6     6
KB     12    14    16    18    20
Reach   3     4     5     7     8
Size Enom  Enom  Enom  Huge  Huge

[RexMundi]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

They're to slow. Average Speed things get killed in Thread Fall.

 

~Rex

[Blue Jogger]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

Hmm, I guess we can assume they are at least as fast as a typical Speed 3 Horse.

 

General: SPD 3

 

Then as they are trained, they get faster and more agile:

Battle-hardened Veteran (option)

DEX 23

SPD 4

+2 with Combat

 

If you're roleplaying the dragons (with superheroic rules), I'd give them a SPD 5 or 6. But, since they have heroic riders that aren't passengers, you don't want to go beyond 4.

 

I assume they have an area-effect breath weapon to hit thread, then the only question is what is their DCV before adjustment for size. Horses have a 5 or 6 before adjustment for size, so we should probably go with that. Enormous has -4 DCV penalty and Huge has a -6 DCV penalty. Therefore, I'm not afraid of making the dragons too nimble.

 

Don't forget, we don't armor the dragons, so they must have tough natural hide

Natural Armor (8 PD/8ED), Activation Roll 14-

 

How's that?

[RexMundi]

Re: Dragon-riders of Pern

 

That's about what I was thinking. Especially since training is pretty important for the critters. Also, the various colors, have various tricks. The Greens and Blues (and Ruth), could turn on a wing tip. The Browns and Bronzes, Could Hose bigger areas when they blew flame. So a Green or a Blue Dragon has to be pretty nimble. One could almost give them a skill. Speed 4 seems about right at the top end (with the exception of Ruth). There's a lot of interesting info in the prequels for structuring their abilities. Originally, they weren't supposed to get much bigger, then a big Horse. Their flight (and the amount they can lift) is also telekinetic in most of it's nature (though they will fall out of the sky if they get a thread scored wing membrane), and what they can lift, well, they say in the books, a Dragon can lift anything it thinks it can lift (which can be hard to represent but eventually, a bunch of them grab the main drives of a star ship, poof over to the red star, and blow up the drives, said drives being big enough to affect the orbit of a PLANET (albeit a small one) and said Drives being Humongous to the extreme).

 

Shaping up nicely though over all.

 

~Rex