Warning silly question, serious players beware

[fredrik_nilsson]

I'm trying to figure a really silly power, the save and load functions from Sierras old games. The way I've reasoned this far is that it should function like this:

 

• It's an all or nothing effect. It will effect the entire group (and all NPCs), not just a group.

• It will bring everybody back to a certain point (called 'Saved Game') in campaign. Everything (both good and bad) between that point and the point where the 'Saved Game' where 'Loaded' will be lost forever.

• The player can set the so called 'Saved Game' points, by simple indicating that he 'Saves' the game.

• The group can only have a certain number of 'Saved Games' at a specific time.

• When the pool of 'Saved Games' is full, the player has to sacrifce a previously 'Saved Game'.

 

I thought about using the Extra-Dimensional Travel power, and then add suitable advantages and limitations. Naturally this could be changed if anyone have a better idea.

[Hawksmoor]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

EDM with the addition of Fixed and Floating Teleportation Locations.

 

You are right a silly but extremely powerful ability. On second thought not so siilly.

 

Doesn't Trance from Andromeda have this power? With a horticultural focus?

 

Hawksmoor

[austenandrews]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

Maybe group Precognition with Invisible Power Effects? A "Save" means activating a totally convincing precognitive vision. As the game plays out, the characters are actually seeing the future precisely as it will happen. Not until the Save is "lost" do they commit to that future - that is, the Precog vision ends and you run game-time forward to the next Save point. You might add the side effect of amnesia when the vision ends, since presumably the PCs won't know anything past the reloaded Save point (unless you want to infer that it comes automatically with IPE). And you'll have to make sure that the vision is instantaneous.

 

-AA

[Dust Raven]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

This is a silly question

 

And I have a silly answer: make it part of the physics of the campaign world. In most games, you can only "save and load" at specific locations, or under specific conditions. Simply name those conditions and allow the character to do it.

 

However, if only one character has this ability, it might be best represented with a mechanic. Say... Perk: Primary Hero (10 points....saving the game has got to be as powerful as ruling your own country).

 

Other than that, I like austenandrews' Precog idea. It sounds really cool, but might be difficult to role-play if only one character would "remember" the future.

[ghost-angel]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

Not so silly as you think..

 

In one game our Temporal Manipulators most powerful power (effects wise, not points wise) is Rewind. She "rewinds" the group back five minutes and then we go forward again... though only she remembers what happened and has gotten really good about describing things quickly right after a rewind.

 

Which is a lot like a Save game. And is a very very powerful ability.

 

but cool.

 

I think Dust Raven is right though .. make it part of the game world under GM control. It does require a bit of extra note taking though as you have to document everything you have learned and attained after the last "save" and then ditch it all when you reload that point.

[mr_azrad]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

I like Dust Raven's idea the best so far (as usual). I am curious about this: Who or what can "trigger" the "loading" of a "saved game". Can a single character do it, or do all the characters have to agree or is it majority decision? Do the characters have to be alive to make the decision?

 

You might want to settle some of these points before getting too far into the game.

[BoneDaddy]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

Major Transform (all three axes), Megascale (LOTS of it), Area of Effect (One hex), Trigger(?). For a thousand points or so, the past is yours!

[Hawksmoor]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

I just watched a recorded episode of Andromeda.

 

Trance Gemini *does* have this power. She calls it living out all possible outcomes of a decision. She then chooses the one timeline she *likes* the best based upon her choices.

 

I would build her power as

 

Clairsentience [Precog]

10d6 Luck

EDM [For when the universe gets really bad]

10 fixed locations for the EDM

10 floating locations for the EDM

 

This is just the power for an upcoming Galactic Champions game.

 

Hawksmoor

[Pegasus]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

Whichever writeup you use, the power should be called "The GM's Migraine."

[Hawksmoor]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

Whichever writeup you use' date=' the power should be called "The GM's Migraine."[/quote']

 

Agreed. PRE and POST Cognitive powers never ever get approved in any of my games. I am too free form for that to work.

 

Hawksmoor

-I don't know what I am doing now, and you want me to tell you what happens next week?

[fredrik_nilsson]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

EDM with the addition of Fixed and Floating Teleportation Locations.

 

You are right a silly but extremely powerful ability. On second thought not so siilly.

 

Doesn't Trance from Andromeda have this power? With a horticultural focus?

 

Hawksmoor

 

Why the Teleportation?

Isn't it enough to just say that you use EDM to enter a reality that reminds of the original?

 

The reason that I ask is that I've seen that suggestion before, and obviously I was just as stupid last time, but that time I forgot to ask.

[fredrik_nilsson]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

I like Dust Raven's idea the best so far (as usual). I am curious about this: Who or what can "trigger" the "loading" of a "saved game". Can a single character do it, or do all the characters have to agree or is it majority decision? Do the characters have to be alive to make the decision?

 

You might want to settle some of these points before getting too far into the game.

 

Any player can active the trigger, but since every player has to live with the effect of the trigger I guess sooner or later the trigger will become a "group thing". You can only play through a certain number of deja vu experiences before it becomes boring.

[fredrik_nilsson]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

Maybe group Precognition with Invisible Power Effects? A "Save" means activating a totally convincing precognitive vision. As the game plays out, the characters are actually seeing the future precisely as it will happen. Not until the Save is "lost" do they commit to that future - that is, the Precog vision ends and you run game-time forward to the next Save point. You might add the side effect of amnesia when the vision ends, since presumably the PCs won't know anything past the reloaded Save point (unless you want to infer that it comes automatically with IPE). And you'll have to make sure that the vision is instantaneous.

 

-AA

 

Interesting, I shall give this a thought

[fredrik_nilsson]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

This is a silly question

 

And I have a silly answer: make it part of the physics of the campaign world. In most games, you can only "save and load" at specific locations, or under specific conditions. Simply name those conditions and allow the character to do it.

 

However, if only one character has this ability, it might be best represented with a mechanic. Say... Perk: Primary Hero (10 points....saving the game has got to be as powerful as ruling your own country).

 

Other than that, I like austenandrews' Precog idea. It sounds really cool, but might be difficult to role-play if only one character would "remember" the future.

 

The specific condition thing might be needed to avoid consistent "saves and loads".

[fredrik_nilsson]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

Whichever writeup you use' date=' the power should be called "The GM's Migraine."[/quote']

 

Already at this stage my brain hurts

[fredrik_nilsson]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

Before we continue...

 

I like all ideas, but some of them aren't really what I initially searched for. In a normal campaign, I wouldn't even consider introducing a power like this one so the idea about making it part of the games natural laws would have been my normal approach. This time I want to make it hard for what ever GM, like myself, foolish enough to even consider using this power in a campaign.

 

Originally Posted by BoneDaddy

Major Transform (all three axes), Megascale (LOTS of it), Area of Effect (One hex), Trigger(?). For a thousand points or so, the past is yours!

[/Quote]

 

Had this been SAS I would have done a similar thing. I would just have picked Dynamic Powers (File Management), sort of like using a VPP. Being in a grumpy mood due to head ache from "silly rules creation", I've decided that using a VPP is cheating a ban that method from this power creation attempt.

[JmOz]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

Off the cuff, this sounds like a version of Time Travel to me (Go back to before XYZ has happened)

[Hawksmoor]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

Why the Teleportation?

Isn't it enough to just say that you use EDM to enter a reality that reminds of the original?

 

The reason that I ask is that I've seen that suggestion before, and obviously I was just as stupid last time, but that time I forgot to ask.

 

For me it is because this power would not be EDM *exactly* It would be based on EDM mechanics however.

 

The Locations would be events you can set to return to. In our games (perhaps a little to inspired by Sliders) Dimension Hopping was always a tricky thing, sometimes you just didn't quite get where you were intending to go. WE required a EDM roll to target a location. Floating and Fixed Locations gets you *exactly* where you wanted.

 

Does that answer your question?

And given the SAVE game nature of your proposed power it works!

 

Hawksmoor

[ghost-angel]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

I'd say it is EDM.

 

Load Game-

EDM, Through Time: Last Save Point. 8x Normal Mass (can reload an eight person party, limit is an 8 person party). 65 Active Points/Real Points. [if you need up a 16 person part then it's 70 pts.]

 

Save Game-

Naked Modifier: Trigger (+1/4) - Save Point; 4 Charges (-1); 16 Active Points/8 Real Points. [setting the trigger "saves" the game, the charges represent 4 Saves before you either reload or "write over" an old save. We've always assumed the creator can deactivate and reset a trigger at will, I will continue to assume that w. this creation.]

 

how's that sound?

[Magmarock]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

Time travel! I love time travel scenarios!

Very cool idea.

 

My take on it is, if this power is only used once in a while, it can be a plot-device, balanced out with a 0 point disad for all involved.

 

But I really like the idea of buying it as a power for a character. I don't think that any of the GMs in my group would allow it, but it is still cool.

 

Mags

[fredrik_nilsson]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

I thought about adding the visible SFX limitation, just so that the file management menu becomes clearly visible for the group when the power activates.

 

How much would that be worth (I currently haven't got FRed)?

[fredrik_nilsson]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

Time travel! I love time travel scenarios!

Very cool idea.

 

My take on it is, if this power is only used once in a while, it can be a plot-device, balanced out with a 0 point disad for all involved.

 

But I really like the idea of buying it as a power for a character. I don't think that any of the GMs in my group would allow it, but it is still cool.

 

Mags

 

In general I wouldn't allow that either, but now that we've gone this far it would be fun to field test the power.

 

I guess this is the bad part of the HERO System. You can do any power and I do mean any power (provided that your bored enough).

 

Some example are:

 

Absorbption linked to Comeliness, so that a little violence makes you look better (or more sexy). Perfect for Pulp Hero, Dark Champions or Sword n' Sorcery.

 

In the movie Pulp Fiction, imagine the surprise if a triggered EDM (Middle Ages) had changed the meaning of the expression "go medieval on your ass". I know wouldn't have seen that coming. Come to think of it, if he'd only sent the ass to the dark ages, I would probably have created that power with the help of a killing attack.

[fredrik_nilsson]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

For me it is because this power would not be EDM *exactly* It would be based on EDM mechanics however.

 

The Locations would be events you can set to return to. In our games (perhaps a little to inspired by Sliders) Dimension Hopping was always a tricky thing, sometimes you just didn't quite get where you were intending to go. WE required a EDM roll to target a location. Floating and Fixed Locations gets you *exactly* where you wanted.

 

Does that answer your question?

And given the SAVE game nature of your proposed power it works!

 

Hawksmoor

 

Hmmm, that made sense. I guess your right.

[fredrik_nilsson]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

I'd say it is EDM.

 

Load Game-

EDM, Through Time: Last Save Point. 8x Normal Mass (can reload an eight person party, limit is an 8 person party). 65 Active Points/Real Points. [if you need up a 16 person part then it's 70 pts.]

 

Save Game-

Naked Modifier: Trigger (+1/4) - Save Point; 4 Charges (-1); 16 Active Points/8 Real Points. [setting the trigger "saves" the game, the charges represent 4 Saves before you either reload or "write over" an old save. We've always assumed the creator can deactivate and reset a trigger at will, I will continue to assume that w. this creation.]

 

how's that sound?

 

It sounds good. Maybe a bit too points-heavy for a Heroic campaign, but it is a powerful power.

 

Maybe you could buy it as a computer that uses Precognition to sense players in need, and then uses the power?

[Dust Raven]

Re: Warning silly question, serious players beware

 

Using EDM is a bit tricky for this kind of "time travel." The difference between a single point in time and any point in time is only 5 points. That makes creating a mechanic for "save points" a bit more difficult.

 

I'd suggest buying EDM (any date or place in time) for 60 points, and then add the Limitation "Only To Saved Games" (-1), plus any other Limitations such as Extra Time or Only At A Temple or whatever.

 

To save a game, just say they need to spend a specific amount of time (1 Turn, like for Teleport Floating Locations) or meet a specific circumstance (such as being at the temple).