Musings on Random Musings

[zornwil]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

So on a whim I turned my keyboard over and shook it. Holy crap!

 

Yes, quite an experience, eh? I tend to eat over my keyboard at home, so my wife gets a bit irate if I have been careless or such, for what are now abundantly obvious reasons to you. I shake my keyboard out at home out probably once a week or so.

[lemming]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

I like the new style of avatar Doug, but how are you doing? Besides not liking keyboard cruft sandwiches that is.

[Guest Skaramine]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

I like the new style of avatar Doug' date=' but how are you doing? Besides not liking keyboard cruft sandwiches that is.[/quote']

A little better. I talked with my girlfriend to help her get out of her funk which inspired the shift in profiles and avatars.

[Guest Worldmaker]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

BTW' date=' I read a study as quoted in a newspaper article many, many years ago (late-80s) and it indicated that Southerners (as in the southeast) use a larger vocabulary than the rest of the nation, but have poorer grammar. That makes sense to me, having lived in the northeast, southeast, and northwest.[/quote']

 

 

Wouldn't surprise me. The net result is that since we speak differently from those in other parts of the nation, we are collectively seen as stupid, rather than as just speaking differently. And as I said, the stereotyping doesn't help.

[Trencher]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

Again, Kim Du-Toit.

Three dead goblins in return for three wounded citizens.

 

It's about time the humans started taking back their own country.

 

More power to them.

Well now you are being just unfair!

What inspired such a gross misrepresentation of a group huh?

Using such characterizations is uncalled for and very unfair.

What did the goblins ever do to you?

[zornwil]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

Wouldn't surprise me. The net result is that since we speak differently from those in other parts of the nation' date=' we are collectively seen as stupid, rather than as just speaking differently. And as I said, the stereotyping doesn't help.[/quote']

I totally, totally agree. Living down there and visiting back up to Boston as well as traveling for work to New Jersey I saw more visibly/demonstrably a very powerful anti-southern prejudice - by so-called liberal open-minded people. I knew it existed, of course, before that, but was not so aware of it until I travelled between both places. I see a good degree of it out here as well.

 

EDIT - as it turns out, this was my 30,000th post. Just for the record.

[AliceTheOwl]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

I totally' date=' totally agree. Living down there and visiting back up to Boston as well as traveling for work to New Jersey I saw more visibly/demonstrably a very powerful anti-southern prejudice - by so-called liberal open-minded people. I knew it existed, of course, before that, but was not so aware of it until I travelled between both places. I see a good degree of it out here as well.[/quote']

Having grown up in New England, I'm now living in Western North Carolina.

 

If anything, the stereotype about 'Mountain folk' is even worse than the 'redneck' stereotype. Granted, being in the mountains can close you off from parts of society and technology, but Asheville is WAY more open-minded and interesting than my hometown. And the school system is better than Maine's.

 

I think a lot of the stereotype comes from this odd idea we have that smiling = dumb, scowling = smart. Because most southerners tend to be friendlier and more upbeat than most of the New Englanders I know (I blame the weather), they're assumed to have less on their minds.

 

To that I say

[zornwil]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

Having grown up in New England, I'm now living in Western North Carolina.

 

If anything, the stereotype about 'Mountain folk' is even worse than the 'redneck' stereotype. Granted, being in the mountains can close you off from parts of society and technology, but Asheville is WAY more open-minded and interesting than my hometown. And the school system is better than Maine's.

 

I think a lot of the stereotype comes from this odd idea we have that smiling = dumb, scowling = smart. Because most southerners tend to be friendlier and more upbeat than most of the New Englanders I know (I blame the weather), they're assumed to have less on their minds.

 

To that I say

I think that's part of it. I think also a big part of it is that the Northeast was the part of the country that pioneered formal and universal education in America, due to the maritime and then industrial skills required there, and because American academia stems from there (and this is generally true throughout Western civilization in terms of each part of the West and where education developed inside a country) the snobbery comes along. Of course the Civil War also didn't help.

[Hermit]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

I think that's part of it. I think also a big part of it is that the Northeast was the part of the country that pioneered formal and universal education in America' date=' due to the maritime and then industrial skills required there, and because American academia stems from there (and this is generally true throughout Western civilization in terms of each part of the West and where education developed inside a country) the snobbery comes along. Of course the Civil War also didn't help.[/quote']

 

 

Not sure about that, Zornwil, it seemed to me that yes, industry was chiefly in the north east, but blue blood educational insitutions? Thanks to Virginia especially, that was a bit more spread out. I could be wrong mind you.

I'm reminded of a line from the movie 1776 where John Adams and Thomas Jefferson have a dispute over whether the word is 'unalienable' or 'inalienable'. Jefferson says he's right, and refuses to change it.

Adams- "Mister Jefferson, I attended Harvard...."

Jefferson, smirking- "I attended William and Mary."

 

For a time, mind you, some time later... IIRC, Nashville was called the "Athens of the South" due to all the colleges etc.

 

I still think the chief reason for the perspective has more to do with most media and pop culture being produced in the North East and West Coast. The rest of the nation is rarely accurately portrayed because of that.

[zornwil]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

Not sure about that, Zornwil, it seemed to me that yes, industry was chiefly in the north east, but blue blood educational insitutions? Thanks to Virginia especially, that was a bit more spread out. I could be wrong mind you.

I'm reminded of a line from the movie 1776 where John Adams and Thomas Jefferson have a dispute over whether the word is 'unalienable' or 'inalienable'. Jefferson says he's right, and refuses to change it.

Adams- "Mister Jefferson, I attended Harvard...."

Jefferson, smirking- "I attended William and Mary."

 

For a time, mind you, some time later... IIRC, Nashville was called the "Athens of the South" due to all the colleges etc.

 

I still think the chief reason for the perspective has more to do with most media and pop culture being produced in the North East and West Coast. The rest of the nation is rarely accurately portrayed because of that.

That is a really good point, Hermit, but I will say that I think this is more in terms of "popular academia" - the common man in the NE was required to have formal education earlier than the south, and Mass. was the first place in the country to introduce universal education, again for industrial reasons. So I think that my comments apply due to that, but I should really rescind the "academia" comment because you're right. I do think though that the general sentiment is at least somewhat fueled by the universality and attitude towards education.

 

I will say this - the attitude towards education in the southeast and even northwest is much poorer than in the northeast speaking VERY broadly. I've seen a lot of people in the SE when I lived there dismiss education outright, and not just in the context I often do which is whether it's necessary for certain careers, but, rather just as a learning process, dismissing "book learnin'". You really don't see that as much in the NE.

[Lamrok]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

Not sure about that, Zornwil, it seemed to me that yes, industry was chiefly in the north east, but blue blood educational insitutions? Thanks to Virginia especially, that was a bit more spread out. I could be wrong mind you.

I'm reminded of a line from the movie 1776 where John Adams and Thomas Jefferson have a dispute over whether the word is 'unalienable' or 'inalienable'. Jefferson says he's right, and refuses to change it.

Adams- "Mister Jefferson, I attended Harvard...."

Jefferson, smirking- "I attended William and Mary."

 

In other words - "You might of went to Harvard, but you ain't no smarter than me." This is a fairly typical stance in the southern states, where a good liberal arts education and an open mind are valued above all else, giving all southerners the natural right to point out this inherent superiority.

[AliceTheOwl]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

 

While I can't speak for all areas of the South, that is the prevalent attitude where I'm living now.

[James Gillen]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

It's amazing to me that the US doesn't generally give time off at Easter while Europe gives 2 days' date=' while the US is almost always considered to be more overtly religious (not meaning in a spiritual but an organizational and political sense) than most of Europe (Ireland is a notable exception, and I know sections of countries, like Bavaria in Germany, seem to be more religious than the norm in America (though less than the Bible Belt)).[/quote']

 

Because

a. Easter is on a Sunday already,

b. Easter is percieved as the "bunny" holiday and the little sister of Christmas, even though theologically it's the other way around.

 

JG

[lemming]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

I like the song "Tomorrow' date=' Wendy" (Concrete Blonde), but I can't stand listening to it with my co-worker named Wendy just across the hall. I guess I'm too superstitious for that.[/quote']

Depends if you liked your co-worker or not.

[lemming]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

I still think the chief reason for the perspective has more to do with most media and pop culture being produced in the North East and West Coast. The rest of the nation is rarely accurately portrayed because of that.

Well, I would say that none of the nation is rarely accurately portrayed.

[Hermit]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

Well' date=' I would say that none of the nation is rarely accurately portrayed.[/quote']

 

Please, next you'll be telling me California isn't full of longhaired beach bums and surfers going "Dude" and tofu eatting whackos!

 

Good point, btw. Though I still think it is more common for the South to be portrayed in the least favorable light of all the U.S. Regions.

[Hermit]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

That is a really good point, Hermit, but I will say that I think this is more in terms of "popular academia" - the common man in the NE was required to have formal education earlier than the south, and Mass. was the first place in the country to introduce universal education, again for industrial reasons. So I think that my comments apply due to that, but I should really rescind the "academia" comment because you're right. I do think though that the general sentiment is at least somewhat fueled by the universality and attitude towards education.

Ah, I see a bit more of what you meant. Thanks for clarifying.

 

I will say this - the attitude towards education in the southeast and even northwest is much poorer than in the northeast speaking VERY broadly. I've seen a lot of people in the SE when I lived there dismiss education outright, and not just in the context I often do which is whether it's necessary for certain careers, but, rather just as a learning process, dismissing "book learnin'". You really don't see that as much in the NE.

 

In the broadest sense, I've seen this as well, especially in the smaller towns. One friend of mine graduated college, and her mother didn't understand why she even wanted to go. After all, she'd worked in a factory at their town, as had her parents... so it should be good enough for her daughter. Sad really.

 

Though I've also seen the reverse where someone with little education busted their humps to make sure their son or daughter got better chances than they ever did.

[Hermit]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

In other words - "You might of went to Harvard, but you ain't no smarter than me." This is a fairly typical stance in the southern states, where a good liberal arts education and an open mind are valued above all else, giving all southerners the natural right to point out this inherent superiority.

 

Actually, IIRC, at the time, William and Mary was pretty prestigious as well. Perhaps I'm wrong on that. I could be confusing it with another college.

[Lamrok]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

Good point' date=' btw. Though I still think it is more common for the South to be portrayed in the least favorable light of all the U.S. Regions.[/quote']

 

That depends on whether Florida is part of the South.

[Guest Worldmaker]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

That depends on whether Florida is part of the South.

 

 

It is in the minds of the people who are from here originally. As opposed to transplants from up north.

[Lamrok]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

Actually' date=' IIRC, at the time, William and Mary was pretty prestigious as well. Perhaps I'm wrong on that. I could be confusing it with another college.[/quote']

 

William and Mary at one time did have a decent amount of prestige, especially among Southerners (though the more well-to-do Southerners went to Princeton.)

 

Lamrok

(who applied and was accepted to William and Mary)

[AliceTheOwl]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

It is in the minds of the people who are from here originally. As opposed to transplants from up north.

Actually, there are some people in the SE who would claim that Florida is too urban to be part of 'the South.'

 

Though I suppose it depends on what part of Florida. My friend who ran into this was originally from Bradenton. She claimed Cape Cod reminded her WAAAAAYYY too much of Bradenton.

[Hermit]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

William and Mary at one time did have a decent amount of prestige, especially among Southerners (though the more well-to-do Southerners went to Princeton.)

 

Lamrok

(who applied and was accepted to William and Mary)

 

Got it, thanks

[AliceTheOwl]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

Depends if you liked your co-worker or not.

Yes, I do get along with Wendy. She's delightfully quirky - like all of the NGD, all rolled into one person.

 

Which summons a very interesting mental image.

[Hermit]

Re: Musings on Random Musings

 

Actually, there are some people in the SE who would claim that Florida is too urban to be part of 'the South.'

 

Mm, I know what you mean, though the folks I talk to wouldn't say it's too urban, so much as it's been too saturated culture wise. Between the strong cuban influence, and the invasion of retired yankees, many I know think the poor state hasn't been Southern for some time, though I understand that there are areas IN the state that are still very Southern at least so some friends have told me.

 

Floridians might just claim they have the best of it all in a mix.

 

Barring those freaking hurricanes... poor guys