My First Character Build -- Comments Appreciated

[DrFaust]

So I've had HERO for a while now and have been coming back to it now and again. As part of the learning process, I've been making a character. He's sort of a PC-ified version of Jack Knight, DC's Starman. He's PC-ified in that he's meant to be someone's character in a game, rather than an accurate representation of Jack as written in the comics.

 

So if anyone has comments or critiques about the mechanics/build of the character, I'd appreciate them. Things like "He doesn't have enough END or STUN for a Champions game," and so on. (And whether the Cosmic Rod multipower should be a 60 reserve as default; right now it's 75 so he can have a 12d6 EB.) I'm moderately sure all the math is right, as I wrote up the powers myself, then doublechecked them in the HD demo.

 

Of the 320 points, there are by my reckoning 40 left unspent. So I've got a little play room to cover missed bases or incorporate suggestions.

 

JACK KNIGHT, STARMAN

  CHARACTERISTICS
Val  Char  Cost
15   STR   5
22   DEX   36
18   CON   16
14   BOD   8
13   INT   3
14   EGO   8
15   PRE   5
16   COM   3

10   PD    7
10   ED    6
5    SPD   18
10   REC   6
40   END   2
35   STUN  4

Total: 127

  SKILLS
2  Artist
4  Combat Skill Levels: +2 OCV Cosmic Rod Attacks
3  Conversation
4  Knowledge: Pop Culture +2
3  Lockpicking
3  Persuasion
5  Profession: Collectibles Dealer +3
6  Range Skill Levels +3
3  Seduction
3  Stealth
3  Streetwise
2  Survival: Urban Environment
5  Trading +1

  Jujutsu Training
4  Block +2, +2, Block, Abort
4  Disarm -1, +1 Disarm, +10 STR
3  Slam +0, +1, STR + v/5, Target Falls
4  Strike +0, +2, STR +2d6 Strike

Total: 61

  TALENTS
6  Combat Luck (3 rPD, 3 rED)

Total: 6

  PERKS
4  Contact: Ted Knight (useful skills, significant 
  Contacts of his own, good relationship with PC) 8-
2  Reputation: Opal City's Champion 14-

Total: 6

  POWERS / EQUIPMENT
37 Cosmic Rod Multipower, 75 point reserve; all slots OAF (-1).
4u #1) Cosmic Blast I EB 12d6, 1/2 END (+1/4); OAF (-1). 3
3u #2) Cosmic Blast II EB 8d6, 1/2 END (+1/2), Autofire (+1/4) (70 
      AP); OAF (-1). 2
3u #3) Cosmic Blast III EB 8d6, Armor Piercing (+1/2), 1/2 END 
      (+1/4); OAF (-1). 3
4u #4) Cosmic Blast IV RKA 4d6, 1/2 END (+1/4); OAF (-1). 3
3u #5) Monomolecular Edged Hook HKA 2d6, 1/2 END (+1/4), 
      Penetrating (+1/2) (52 AP); OAF (-1). 2
1u #6) Staff Blow HA +4d6 (20 AP); OAF (-1). 2
2u #7) Star Burst (Flash vs Sight) 5d6, Area of Effect 3" (+1), 
      1/2 END (+1/4) (56 AP); OAF (-1), No Range (-1/2). 2

15 Flight 10", 0 END (+1/2) (30 AP); OAF (-1). 0

8  Vintage Anti-Flare Goggles: Nightvision (5 AP); OAF (-1) 
  (total: 2), plus Infrared Perception (Sight) (5 AP); OAF (-1) 
  (total: 2), plus Flash Defense (8 AP); OAF (-1) (total: 4)

Total: 80

  DISADVANTAGES
5  Distinctive Feature: Tattoos and Piercings (Easily Concealed, 
  Noticed and Recognizable)
15 Hunted: The Mist 8- (As Pow, Public ID)
15 Psych Lim: Code versus Killing (Common, Strong)
15 Psych Lim: Honorable (Common, Strong)
20 Psych Lim: Loves Sadie Falk (Common, Total)
20 Psych Lim: Protective of Opal City (Common, Total)
10 Psych Lim: The Collector's Collector (Uncommon, Strong)
10 Social Lim: Public ID as Starman (Freq, Minor)
10 Unluck 2d6

Total Disadvantages: 120

Base Points: 200
Points from Disadvantages: 120
Total Spent: 320

[MitchellS]

Re: My First Character Build -- Comments Appreciated

 

The character looks pretty good. The only things I'd be concerned about in a standard Champions game are Con and PD/ED. The 10 defense [13 with combat luck] means he will take 29 points of damage, on average, each time he is hit by a 12d6 attack. That means he will be stunned and basically taken out with 2 hits [the second being uncontested due to being stunned]. The recommended average is 20 defense.

 

Also you combat levels should cost 3 points each because they apply to a group of attacks.

[BNakagawa]

Re: My First Character Build -- Comments Appreciated

 

Not much in the staying power department.

 

As has been pointed out, this PC can dish it out, but can't take it.

 

Also, with so much of his powers focussed through an OAF device (including flight, I think) the first person who nails him with a disarm or takeaway maneuver is going to wreck his day. (his STR of 15 is not going to stop anyone, really)

 

A few points of STR with the limitation (only to hang onto foci) might help.

 

You also might want to take a weapons element with your martial arts if you plan on hitting people with your stick (and getting the +2 DCV whilst doing so)

[Fedifensor]

Re: My First Character Build -- Comments Appreciated

 

Defenses seem a little low. Maybe a 0 END Force Field from the Rod? I seem to recall Starman wasn't that easily taken out unless he was disarmed.

 

Given what I've read of JSA, I think the Cosmic Rod should have an Endurance Reserve. Remove the 1/2 END on the powers, then add a END reserve (with a high REC) to power it.

 

And, as others have said, you're hosed if you lose the focus. At least Stargirl has the Cosmic Converter Belt (an OIF) as a backup in case she loses the rod.

 

Last thing - you have multiple skills bought up, as well as some combat skill levels. Maybe chop down the improved skills a bit to free up 10 points, then take an Overall Skill Level (which you can apply to everything).

[DrFaust]

Re: My First Character Build -- Comments Appreciated

 

Just a thought on the way out the door: I'm thinking about changing the OAF limitation on everything to an OIF. Losing the rod in combat just doesn't come up a whole lot.

 

And what would "only to keep hold of his Cosmic Rod" be worth as a limitation?

[levi]

Re: My First Character Build -- Comments Appreciated

 

If it isn't something you can lose, take a look at the Only in Hero ID Lim.

[Zed-F]

Re: My First Character Build -- Comments Appreciated

 

My thoughts:

 

I'd personally either boost his DEX to 23, or lower it to 20, and maybe buy a couple levels of lightning reflexes instead if you really want a 22 for initiative rank. A typical blaster DEX is 23.

 

I would drop less points into REC, END, and STUN, and more into defenses, CON, and/or STR. Especially with low defenses, you'll find the CON useful.

 

He's a bit vulnerable to PRE attacks, which may or may not be a problem for you.

 

The OCV CSLs won't work as advertised, you would have to pick a particular MP slot, or else upgrade them to 3-point levels. 2-point levels can only be used with one specific attack. You might also want to check your range skill levels, I think if they are only for the Cosmic Rod MP they're ok, but not if you wanted them for all ranged attacks.

 

I'm not sure the MA package is really worth it for a character that's primarily a blaster. Do you see him staying in HTH combat with a guy that gets in melee range, or more typically flying out of reach and blasting? If you want to keep the MA package I'd probably swap block for dodge, as the latter can be used against ranged attacks, and I'd probably ditch the one of your 3 attack maneuvers since you won't likely have much occasion to use them. You should probably buy a weapon element so you can use the Cosmic Rod with your MA.

 

You're over most campaign limits for Psych lims (max 50 points.) I'd swap the 'Loves Sadie Falk' for an equivalent DNPC lim, and even then you'll still be over. He has 3 different 'I am a hero' lims, which is probably excessive anyway. Public ID is normally a Frequently, Major lim for 15 points, especially since he has enemies already.

 

Hope that helps!

[DrFaust]

Re: My First Character Build -- Comments Appreciated

 

All right, so now I'm all confused. Is there some underlying design philosphy I'm not entirely aware of?

 

It seems like there's a minimum buy-in, so a significant chunk of your points are already spent just making sure the character won't fall down.

 

Maybe I'm trying to do too much, powers-wise? Just pare it down to a 12d6 attack, a little movement and spend the rest on keeping the character upright most of the time?

[Profit]

Re: My First Character Build -- Comments Appreciated

 

Seems that way, I'm working on a character right now as well. As far as the underlying design philosphy, I'm thinking it comes from years of playing Hero System. Kind of like I know how to build a mech in Armored Core to do what I need it to. But, I've been playing Armored Core since 1994, so I know what I can do with which parts. Same type of scenario, just little nuances that we as new players aren't going to get until we have been playing for a while.

[Zed-F]

Re: My First Character Build -- Comments Appreciated

 

All right' date=' so now I'm all confused. Is there some underlying design philosphy I'm not entirely aware of?[/quote']

Well, generally you want to look at what you expect a campaign average attack will be, and not get stunned (or worse, one-shotted) from a single average attack. Unless you're playing a DCV god/dess or something, who tries to avoid getting hit at all costs. Usually this means having a decent CON and enough defenses to prevent such an occurrance. In your case, if the campaign average attack is 12d6 (reasonable for a starting heroes game) then the average stun of the attack is 42. So, you probably want to have a total DEF+CON in that ballpark.

 

It seems like there's a minimum buy-in, so a significant chunk of your points are already spent just making sure the character won't fall down.

To some extent, though depending on how you go about it, this doesn't have to eat up all that many points. Stuff like armoured costumes, combat luck, and so forth come with limitations to keep the cost of the defenses down.

 

Maybe I'm trying to do too much, powers-wise? Just pare it down to a 12d6 attack, a little movement and spend the rest on keeping the character upright most of the time?

Nah, I would say you should have enough points to do the concept you have now. You do have some points left over and that should be enough or close to enough, though you might need a few tweaks. Things like spending fewer on figureds like REC/END/STUN and more on CON will help with this as well, since extra CON will give you better REC/END/STUN naturally, save you a bit on ED, and get you closer to that CON+DEF >= 42 benchmark.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: My First Character Build -- Comments Appreciated

 

Lots of good comments from others above. Putting some of these into practice:

 

Boosting your CON to 20 would cost 4 points, and save you 2 points on END and one on STUN - net cost 1 point. Raising it to 23 would cost 10, save 1 on ED, 2 on REC, 3 on STUN and 2 on END, plus boost your END a further 6. Net cost 2 CP.

 

Spend the two points and raise DEX to 23. That's +1 to OCV, DCV and DEX rolls.

 

NOTE: The above are gaming the point breaks. So what?

 

Others have noted he's a bit vulnerable to PRE attacks. You could consider some PRE (only to defend against PRE attacks) or maybe some bonus PRE linked to the Rod (ie he's more confident and impressive if he has the Rod). You have a number of PRE-based skills, so buying PRE up straight out wouldn't hurt either. 18 would raise your skill rolls by +1. These are good uses for xp, as he builds in confidence (and/or you notice this is a bit too problematic for the character).

 

On the one hand, I agree with the comments that your martial arts may be less than useful. On the other, it provides some options if tyhe Rod is taken away. I'd go with the OIF on the Rod first, however. The Weapon Element also makes sense. If you go this route, maybe add a small Hand Attack to the Multipower - right now, you can disembowel a target with the Hook, but you can't just club him over the head.

 

Multipower slots are also a good choice to cut now and add with xp later, if necessary, as he learns to use the Rod for other uses.

 

The END reserve is an idea worth considering - use of the Rod never seems to tire Jack out much.

 

Add a small Force Field provided by the Rod and your defense problem is taken care of. A 10/10 Field, with your current defenses and a 23 CON, should eliminate the "defensive" issue. That would put your defenses to 23/23. A 5/5 point Force Field and another level of Combat Luck would set them at 21/21, still able to take an average 12d6 hit without being Stunned at 23 CON. You might also consider the Defenses issue in light of your Range levels. He can be quite a distance away at a minimal penalty to OCV, so he may survive more by keeping pout of combat range and being hit less often than by having enough DEF and CON to soak up attacks.

 

Others have suggested scrapping the Loves Sadie Falk for a DNPC, which makes sense. You could also adopt one of those Opal City Police family members as a second DNPC (or Contact, or both).

 

Maybe some added Hunteds? He had a thing going with Solomon Grundy for a while, and the Shade seems to keep an eye on him (though a Watched at most).

 

If you go the END battery route, you could consider a Susceptibility to darkness which would drain the END reserve's END and/or REC.

[Zed-F]

Re: My First Character Build -- Comments Appreciated

 

On the one hand' date=' I agree with the comments that your martial arts may be less than useful. On the other, it provides some options if tyhe Rod is taken away. I'd go with the OIF on the Rod first, however. The Weapon Element also makes sense. If you go this route, maybe add a small Hand Attack to the Multipower - right now, you can disembowel a target with the Hook, but you can't just club him over the head.[/quote']

Agreed with the OIF on the Rod, but I'll note that he does in fact have an HA in his MP.

 

I'll also note that if you do want to add the END reserve, you will want to lower the MP reserve to 60 or 62 points, and remove the Reduced END advantages from those powers that have them. This will give you the points you need for the reserve. Also, rather than taking a susceptibility to darkness, I would do something like:

7  END Reserve: 100 END, 1 REC, OIF Rod (-1/2)
2  END Reserve: +5 REC, OIF Rod (-1/2), Only In Direct Sun/Starlight (-1/2)

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: My First Character Build -- Comments Appreciated

 

Agreed with the OIF on the Rod' date=' but I'll note that he does in fact have an HA in his MP.[/quote']

 

So he does - oops!

 

I'll also note that if you do want to add the END reserve, you will want to lower the MP reserve to 60 or 62 points, and remove the Reduced END advantages from those powers that have them. This will give you the points you need for the reserve. Also, rather than taking a susceptibility to darkness, I would do something like:

7  END Reserve: 100 END, 1 REC, OIF Rod (-1/2)
2  END Reserve: +5 REC, OIF Rod (-1/2), Only In Direct Sun/Starlight (-1/2)

 

You could create a tiered effect with all REC "not in full darkness", some "only outdoors in daytime or clear night skies" and some "only in direct sunlight"

[Ura-Maru]

Re: My First Character Build -- Comments Appreciated

 

All right, so now I'm all confused. Is there some underlying design philosphy I'm not entirely aware of?

Sort of. Because of the way Hero works, it has almost no ‘safeguards’ for character design, so it’s easy to make a character that’s absurdly unbalanced. Say, with a 50d6 EB, but no defenses at all.

 

 

 

It’s not so much a ‘design philosophy’ as a final checklist you want to run every build through:

 

Offense: Can the character hurt other characters, given campaign average defenses? Does he do TOO much damage? Is his OCV much higher or lower than campaign average? (Quick & Dirty: Is the character within 2 DCs of ‘campaign average?)

 

Defenses: Can the character take at least an average hit without being stunned? If his defenses are low, does he have enough Speed to Block or Dodge often? Are they so high he can’t be hurt? (Quick & Dirty: ‘average’ total PD and ED defenses are usually around 2x(Average DC) for the campaign (24, in this case) or a bit less)

 

Misc.: Can the character do anything outside of combat? Can he do anything INSIDE of combat? Does he have more than one attack option? Does he have any options when faced with at least some unusual attacks? The answer to all of these should be ‘Yes.’

 

Limitations and Disads: Are the Disads or Limitations particularly crippling? (Focus is a common one) When all of them come into play, (and they should, frequently) will he still be fun to play?

 

Concept: Did I buy anything that I shouldn’t have, (often Mental Defense or Power Defense) or did I miss any major ‘uses’ of whatever his powers concepts are? Is he, when all is said and done, interesting enough to enjoy playing? (Remember, Concepts are relative . . . If you want a super-quick martial artist you’re more concerned with the campaign average Dex and Spd than what it says under the Characteristics Chart)

 

Believe me, as far as ‘first characters’ go, this is superb. You seem to understand the mechanics of the system well. A bit of experience, and you’ll be checking everything on the list without even thinking of it.

 

 

Enough philosophy, now on to the actual build.

Be warned I have no idea what the actual character is like. I’m presuming what you’re going for is: A “tough guy” style low level martial artist, (that is, clearly above thugs and agents, but well below a dedicated MA type) who’s Cosmic Rod focus gives him fairly badass energy projector powers.

 

Overall:

As mentioned, defenses are low. Assuming you can’t justify an armored costume, Force Field, or the like, adding five points each to PD, ED, and Con, and buying his Combat Luck up to 6 points, will take him out of the danger zone, without changing the feel of the character too much. They’ll still be a bit low, but defiantly playable as long as you’re careful.

 

 

Powers:

 

You might want to go with an explosion instead of AOE for the flash, but that’s mostly a style thing.

 

As a general rule, it’s ALWAYS cheaper to buy an End Reserve instead of buying everything ‘half end,’ if you can justify it.

 

Something you wear, like Goggles, is usually an OIF, not an OAF, but if it’s as easy to swipe as a pair of glasses, that’s ok. But doesn’t the Rod protect him from his own flash?

 

 

Skills and Martial Arts:

 

You need at least a 3 point skill level to apply to the rod attacks, a 2 point one is only for one specific attack. [edit: Ok, three other people saw it first. Get off my back!!]

 

I would lose the Martial Arts, and the ranged and 2 point CSL, (25 pts total) and replace them, with 2 8 pt ‘all combat’ levels and one 10 pt Overall Level. (26 pts) That’ll give you a lot more options. Those levels will help with anything combat related, including all normal attacks, and help you in Mental combat as well.

 

And since the Overall Level can be applied to Skills as well, you can save 2 points from Trading, and one point each from ‘Pop Culture’ and ‘Collectibles Dealer’

 

Now, you can use two of those levels to add +1d6 damage to your punch, (or anything else, actually) so you can probably live without the ‘martial strike,’ but if you want to make sure you don’t ‘lose anything,’ you can take:

 

10 (15) Scrapper +10 pts Str, No End (+1/2), No Figured Characteristics (-1/2), Not for Lifting (-0)

 

That’ll add to your STR both for punching and ‘disarming’ (This is done by grabbing the weapon) but also to escape from grabs and entangles, move by and move through, and everything else. Most importantly, it will help him hang on to his focus. And you’re only 7 pts down from what you already have.

 

 

 

If you want to keep the MA after all, note that you probably want ‘Use Art With Staff,’ for it.

 

And as a general rule, it’s always better to buy 3, 5, or 8 pt ‘Skill levels’ then to buy the skill level itself up.

 

---

Heh. Made it through the whole thing without making a ‘Cosmic Rod’ joke . . .

[MisterBaldy]

Re: My First Character Build -- Comments Appreciated

 

A few brief mentions...

1. Increase the DEX to 23...the advantages of that 1pt of DEX is well worth the investment. 1 higher OCV, DCV & DEX Roll
   
2. Increase the Combat Luck, or perhaps the PD & ED...or maybe even both. Defenses are probably too low for a "Standard" Champions Campaign.
   
3. Too many Psych. Limits! A "Standard" Champions Campaign allows 50 Maximum Points From Any One Category Of Disadvantage...you have 80 pts in Psych. Limits.

Other than those few changes...he looks like a very good character.

[Super Squirrel]

Re: My First Character Build -- Comments Appreciated

 

At a cursory glance, the first thing that stuck out to me is the number of Psychological Limitations. I would recommend changing one of them to something different. Many GM's don't like it when players load on tons of Psych Limits.

[DrFaust]

Re: My First Character Build -- Comments Appreciated

 

I appreciate the comments everyone. I'm taking them into account and currently reworking everything.

 

Thanks!

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: My First Character Build -- Comments Appreciated

 

At a cursory glance' date=' the first thing that stuck out to me is the number of Psychological Limitations. I would recommend changing one of them to something different. Many GM's don't like it when players load on tons of Psych Limits.[/quote']

 

In our games, this is the categpry where the maximum per category is most likely to be waived. This is generally contingent on the psych limitatons coming from sa variety of sources (ie not 60 points, all related to being heroic, but perhaps 80 points coming from three diverse facets of the character's personality would be acceptable). That said, havihng over 1/3 of your disadvantages from a single source is pretty high.

 

This is also the area I find characters are most likely to include 0 point disad's.