Dr. Anomaly Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 I had an oddball thought earlier today, and wanted to get some other opinions about it. A teleporter can have both Fixed and Floating Locations. A location doesn't have to be a static location, either -- it can be something like "10 feet behind me" or "my teammate Bob". In other words, the location can be mobile, but unless it's in the teleporter's range, they couldn't teleport to it. Fine and dandy. The player in our group who has a character with teleport refers to "tagging" a person, location, etc. when he either buys a new Fixed Location or re-memorizes a Floating Location. And that's what brought this thought to mind. Is it possible, do you think, to create a specialized Detect that can detect a person or object or location that's been "tagged" by a teleporter to be one of his Fixed or Floating Locations? Why or why not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? Detect: Location of current Teleport Tags. Sure why not. Would require a Perception Roll I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Anomaly Posted November 7, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? The reason why I asked was this: when a teleporter "tags" a location or object, he is just memorizing something about it that will let him home in on it -- he's not actually influencing or changing it in any way. So...from that perspective...is there even anything to detect? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Squirrel Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? You would need to either Megascale it or give some major PER bonuses for it to work, but yeah, I think it could work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? It may depend on the SFX of his Teleport, but if he's remembering some very specific feature of the object, a specialized detect to relocate that object wouldn't be too unreasonable I'd think. Megascale is a good suggestion there SS, hadn't thought of that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Squirrel Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? The reason why I asked was this: when a teleporter "tags" a location or object' date=' he is just memorizing something about it that will let him home in on it -- he's not [i']actually[/i] influencing or changing it in any way. So...from that perspective...is there even anything to detect? Yes. If the character gets hit with some sort of drain or amnesia style power, the detect would prove useful for detecting where those tags were. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Anomaly Posted November 7, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? What I had in mind was something more along this line: Say there's a charcter (let's call him Sensor) who has the power Detect Fixed and Floating Teleport Locations as Sense and as part of the Sight Group. He has no special extra range (no Telescopic or Megascale) on this sense -- just what comes with the Simulated Sense Group. If he's walking down the street and passes a lamp post that Globetrotter (the long-range teleporter) has "tagged" as a Fixed Location, will Sensor 'see' something about the lamp post (a glow, or whatever his chose special effect is) when he looks at it? Why or why not? Suppose that Globtrotter is in Tahiti, and the lamp post is currently outside of Globetrotter's range, long though it may be. Will that change the answer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? For that ... I would ask exactly how you define "Tagging a Location" for teleport, does Globetrotter know the GPS Coordinates of the lamp post or is he actually marking it somehow? It really would come down the SFX of the Teleport I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Anomaly Posted November 7, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? 5Er just calls it "memorizing it" and talks about "studying" a location to reset a Floating Location. That's why I was wondering if there'd be anything there to Detect. As I noted, according to the baseline description in the rules, the teleporter isn't doing anything to the location he's "tagging" -- its seems to be a purely internal process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? From a strict rules POV ... then there probably isn't anything to detect. But as we all know SFX can add/subtract minor effects in the game .. if someone "memorizes" a location by writing down it's exact coordinates then I would say no - if they do it by marking it in some manner such a Return Beacon on a Tech Based Teleport then yes there is something to detect. So a Detect of this nature is certainly possible - whether or not it works would depend on how the Location was "Memorized" and the GM's dramatic sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Waters Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? Paraphrasing ghost-angel, it is not whether you can it is whether you should. The rules allow you to detect pretty much anything you can define and 'teleport tags' are easy enough to define. Should you allow the detect though? To answer this you need to ask that oddly elusive question: does it make sense? Well that would depend on the nature of the tagging: does the teleporter change the location in some way (it now emits beta muons, which enable him to target his teleport) or is he just memorising map coordinates? If the latter you could only really detect the tag location by telepathy, if the former then you just need a beta muon detector. Mind you another teleported might tag his locations in a completely different way; magic, negative energy, alpha muons, whatever..... Personally I would not be inclined to allow it, on the basis that it makes no sense to me, but it all depends on context. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Democracy Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? I'd be inclined to allow it. To me there has to be a connection between the location and the teleporter to allow the teleport without error - some shining thread that the teleporter follows regardless of location. I think I'd only allow active locations though (those that the teleporter could actually use) but that would provide some information about the teleporter (i.e. - he was within a particular radius). I think I'd also allow shielded locations for an extra point. Doc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Waters Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? I'd be inclined to allow it. To me there has to be a connection between the location and the teleporter to allow the teleport without error - some shining thread that the teleporter follows regardless of location. I think I'd only allow active locations though (those that the teleporter could actually use) but that would provide some information about the teleporter (i.e. - he was within a particular radius). I think I'd also allow shielded locations for an extra point. Doc The problem as I see it is that 'Detect Teleport Tag' is a metagame construct - you might be able to detect a specific person's teleport tags in game, if they are of the shining silver thread sort and you can detect whatever that shining silver thread is made from, but unless every teleporter has the same sfx then you'd need a different detect for each one. Of course if they are all the same you still have problems - there are probably thousands of the things around from different teleporters and you might have difficulty telling them apart - like trying to find a specific car in the city, it is going to be a bit difficult. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Democracy Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? The problem as I see it is that 'Detect Teleport Tag' is a metagame construct - you might be able to detect a specific person's teleport tags in game' date=' if they are of the shining silver thread sort and you can detect whatever that shining silver thread is made from, but unless every teleporter has the same sfx then you'd need a different detect for each one. Of course if they are all the same you still have problems - there are probably thousands of the things around from different teleporters and you might have difficulty telling them apart - like trying to find a specific car in the city, it is going to be a bit difficult.[/quote'] No-one said it was going to be easy! If you want to take the lazy GM road then that's up to you... I take your point though. Personally I would rule that there is a generic teleport shining thread thingy that can be detected and that you might have a mind scan type roll to determine whether it is a particular teleporter's trail that you are following - perhaps a specialist tracking skill or something? No-one said it should be easy for the players either! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Waters Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? No-one said it was going to be easy! If you want to take the lazy GM road then that's up to you... I take your point though. Personally I would rule that there is a generic teleport shining thread thingy that can be detected and that you might have a mind scan type roll to determine whether it is a particular teleporter's trail that you are following - perhaps a specialist tracking skill or something? No-one said it should be easy for the players either! Funnily enough we have been talking about the tracking adder on another thread: http://herogames.com/forums/showpost.php?p=878358&postcount=42 Never had an awful lot of use for it, and now two come along at once! Oh, and I AM a lazy GM. I'm a lazy EVERYTHING Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelcyron Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? Since the teleport tags are defined as the teleporter memorizing locations, I'd say that it's detectable but the teleporter would need to be in range of the teleporter, not the locations. In essence, the detect would be a form of mind reading, accessing the teleporter's memory for where his locations are. Kelcyron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Limmer Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? It also depends on the special effects of the detector. If he has some sort of "object reading" or "retrocognition," I'd think the act of the teleporter memorizing the spot would be significant enough to be detected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McCoy Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? Humm, if you can "tag" your teammate Bob as a location, and teleport directly to him, seems that there has to be some unconcious "know where Bob is at all times" sense. Likewise, if you can teleport back to the team's danger room without error even though you are totally lost, there has to be some way of knowing the bearing and range of the danger room. Doc Democracy's shining thread makes (comic book) sense. Or maybe the intense concentration necessary to memorize a location leaves a "psi print" on the location, and the detect is an extremely limited form of mental awareness or retrocognition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? Humm, if you can "tag" your teammate Bob as a location, and teleport directly to him, seems that there has to be some unconcious "know where Bob is at all times" sense. Likewise, if you can teleport back to the team's danger room without error even though you are totally lost, there has to be some way of knowing the bearing and range of the danger room. Doc Democracy's shining thread makes (comic book) sense. Or maybe the intense concentration necessary to memorize a location leaves a "psi print" on the location, and the detect is an extremely limited form of mental awareness or retrocognition. I like the "psi print" concept ... cool genre reasoning for this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McCoy Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? I like the "psi print" concept ... cool genre reasoning for this. Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Democracy Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? I like the "psi print" concept ... cool genre reasoning for this. I prefer the limited retro-cognition. So there One way or another McCoy deserves some credit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? I prefer the limited retro-cognition. So there One way or another McCoy deserves some credit! I repped him so yourself Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McCoy Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? I prefer the limited retro-cognition. So there One way or another McCoy deserves some credit! Thank you, and thank you both for the Rep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Anomaly Posted November 7, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? Thank you all for the comments. I could easily see making the argument either way (yes you can detect it / no you can't because there's nothing there to detect) and it was interesting to see the comments back and forth. My inclination would be to allow it, based on genre style, if you will, but there have been a lot of threads lately about certain powers (or uses of powers) granting more benefit than they "should" due to SFX and such, so I wanted to see some reasoning against as well as for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schir1964 Posted November 7, 2005 Report Share Posted November 7, 2005 Re: Can this Detect even work? Isn't this idea exactly how the SFX for Star Trek's transporters work? Especially since their communication devices can be used to "tag" the target. Just An Observation - Christopher Mullins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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