Streeeeeetch

[Sean Waters]

OK.

 

Stretching.

 

A power that expresses itself in 'inches'.

 

That has a velocity add to damage.

 

That has a non-combat multiple.

 

Erm....it's a movement power, isn't it?

 

I mean, you can't actually use it for moving, but every movement power has its little problems: running is limtied to more or less horizontal surfaces, flight gives you more KB and a turn mode, teleport doesn't do velocity damage...so what is wrong with a movement power that does not actually allow you to move? I mewan, if it WAS built as a movement power then you could make it 'Useable as second mvoement mode (usually swinging but it could be runniong or flight or even teleport depending on sfx)' and it would be about perfect wouldn't it? In fact I'd probably require that advantage unless there was a specific reason that it couldn't be used to get you from A to B.

 

So, why not make it a movement power: 2 points per 1" (5 points is way too expensive for most purposes), and treat the movement as any other movement power: instead of the rather contrived velocity damage adders, let it do move through or move by moves (with all the normal penalties).

 

Boy would that make life easier. Anyone see a problem with that?

[ghost-angel]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

Because.. stretching allows you to be in two hexes at once effectively?

 

you're going to hurt yourself with all this overthinking.

[Lord Mhoram]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

.

 

So, why not make it a movement power: 2 points per 1" (5 points is way too expensive for most purposes), and treat the movement as any other movement power: instead of the rather contrived velocity damage adders, let it do move through or move by moves (with all the normal penalties).

 

Boy would that make life easier. Anyone see a problem with that?

 

As I am playing a stretching based character* now, I feel I have the wherewithal to comment from experience.

 

As commented Stretching lets you be in two hexes at once. No movement power lets you attack and move away from the attacker by default (you can to that with move bys and such), but stretching allows you to attack and retract all at once. It also give you effectively no range mod on a short range attack.

 

So I think strecthing is priced just right for all the benefits you get from it.

 

 

Getting rid of those benefits to make it just another movement power, which you then have to buy a bunch of those other things for for special effect that are almost inherent in the way stretching works, would to me, just complicate builds.

 

 

* Go Meeb go.

[Sean Waters]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

I think you are wrong: movement powers allow you to attack and move after the attack to a different hex. I see that as practicaly identical. At least making the stretching a movement power would mean that you took penalties , as for any other movement power, when using velocity to increase damage. Now I imagine that most stretching builds, when looked at by the GM will take into accountt he damage that can be doen including stretch velocity to see if the character is appropriate for the campaign, just as speedsters have their movement taken into consideration. Given the way that Hero works, many attacks that don't use velocity damage are going to have limited impact.

 

Fighting a stretcher, like fighting a speedster, requires different tactics, but they are just as vulnerable as anyone else if you are smart and hold actions.

 

Yes, stretching as a movement power has advantages over some other types of movement power, but also significant weaknesses: that's why we have different powers: they do different stuff.

[schir1964]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

Stretching...

Sean, why aren't you asking all these questions over at GIR? (8^D)

 

Anyway, you seem to be going over a lot of things I've covered in the past.

 

Personally, I think restricting Stretching from being able to move makes no sense. Whether classifying it as a movement power would be correct? I don't think so. The converse of this would be like classifying different movement powers as attack powers since you can use them for attack.

 

Hmmmm...

 

- Christopher Mullins

[Greywind]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

movement powers allow you to attack and move after the attack to a different hex.

You can attack and then move? Where is this?

[BobGreenwade]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

I think that, in many ways, treating Stretching like a Movement Power can help with certain aspects, like you say. It's sort of like Telekinesis has certain aspects of Indirect, though it isn't actually Indirect (at least, that's what the rulebook says).

[schir1964]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

You can attack and then move? Where is this?

Movethrough/Moveby attacks. They are the only way to "attack and move" per se. More restricted as a normal move and attack method.

 

- Christopher Mullins

[ghost-angel]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

I think you are wrong: movement powers allow you to attack and move after the attack to a different hex. I see that as practicaly identical. At least making the stretching a movement power would mean that you took penalties , as for any other movement power, when using velocity to increase damage. Now I imagine that most stretching builds, when looked at by the GM will take into accountt he damage that can be doen including stretch velocity to see if the character is appropriate for the campaign, just as speedsters have their movement taken into consideration. Given the way that Hero works, many attacks that don't use velocity damage are going to have limited impact.

 

Fighting a stretcher, like fighting a speedster, requires different tactics, but they are just as vulnerable as anyone else if you are smart and hold actions.

 

Yes, stretching as a movement power has advantages over some other types of movement power, but also significant weaknesses: that's why we have different powers: they do different stuff.

Sure. but you're still only in 1 hex at a time with a Movement Power.

 

With stretching you can be in 2+ Hexes at once: Body in Hex 1; Left hand stretched to Hex 2 9" away and Right hand stretched to Hex 3 7" in the other direction.

 

do that with a movement power. Oh ... and you can do it while Flying (an actual movement power).

[Greywind]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

Movethrough/Moveby attacks. They are the only way to "attack and move" per se. More restricted as a normal move and attack method.

 

- Christopher Mullins

That is what I thought. Thanks.

[schir1964]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

Sure. but you're still only in 1 hex at a time with a Movement Power.

 

With stretching you can be in 2+ Hexes at once: Body in Hex 1; Left hand stretched to Hex 2 9" away and Right hand stretched to Hex 3 7" in the other direction.

 

do that with a movement power. Oh ... and you can do it while Flying (an actual movement power).

Correct, and technically, per the rules, you also occupy all the hexes you stretch through, and can be attacked in any of these hexes.

 

Although there is a conflict between the mechanics and the SFX concerning attacks using Stretching.

 

SFXwise, a character can be attacked in any of the hexes in which he has streched through, and even the rules support this notion.

 

However, how attacks are resolved don't explain how someone might attack a stretching character since all actions are broken up into discrete things. Presuming someone had a held action I guess they could choose to attack in that "Half-Phase" section of the attack. But the rules on this are also bit vague in general, since usually you have to give a specific trigger when holding an attack action. If you don't know that the character is going to stretch within attack range, you probably won't designate, "I'm holding my attack until he stretches into range."

 

Although most GM's are more lenient with holding actions, the rules require a specific triggering event.

 

Just some things to think about.

 

- Christopher Mullins

[ghost-angel]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

On the attack thing ... yeah it's a bit wonky.

 

I was simply pointing out that because Stretching had some elements in common with Movement Powers does not make it a movement power considering all the things you can do...

 

Including using an actual movement power while stretching - something you can't do with two movement powers is use them simultaneously.

 

Stretching has too many non-movement related elements to make it an actual Movement Power.

[Gary]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

Stretching is another power priced at a point where it may be mildly overpriced at its base cost, but becomes somewhat of a bargain in a EC or Multipower.

[ghost-angel]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

Stretching is another power priced at a point where it may be mildly overpriced at its base cost' date=' but becomes somewhat of a bargain in a EC or Multipower.[/quote']

possibly. It's also one of those powers whose full utility doesn't become apparent until someone start to get really creative with in game implementation.

[Gary]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

possibly. It's also one of those powers whose full utility doesn't become apparent until someone start to get really creative with in game implementation.

 

 

I know. I love Stretching.

[Dust Raven]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

OK.

 

Stretching.

 

Sean, hasn't your brain exploded yet?

 

Or perhaps it's your master plan to explode the rest of our brains...

 

[Lord Mhoram]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

possibly. It's also one of those powers whose full utility doesn't become apparent until someone start to get really creative with in game implementation.

 

As I have found out playing Meeb. Very utilitarian powers.

[Sean Waters]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

Sure. but you're still only in 1 hex at a time with a Movement Power.

 

With stretching you can be in 2+ Hexes at once: Body in Hex 1; Left hand stretched to Hex 2 9" away and Right hand stretched to Hex 3 7" in the other direction.

 

do that with a movement power. Oh ... and you can do it while Flying (an actual movement power).

 

 

That just makes more hexes in which you can be hit. You think that is some sort of advantage? Hmmm.....

[Sean Waters]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

Sean, hasn't your brain exploded yet?

 

Or perhaps it's your master plan to explode the rest of our brains...

 

 

 

Brain? I'm supposed to have a BRAIN?

 

Weird.

[Sean Waters]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

On the attack thing ... yeah it's a bit wonky.

 

I was simply pointing out that because Stretching had some elements in common with Movement Powers does not make it a movement power considering all the things you can do...

 

Including using an actual movement power while stretching - something you can't do with two movement powers is use them simultaneously.

 

Stretching has too many non-movement related elements to make it an actual Movement Power.

 

Yeah. So making it a movement power would cut down on the potential abuse: you can't normally use two movement powers together. As it stands at the oment you could do a running move through and get stretching velocity damage added t that: make it a movement power and that abuse goes away.

 

What non-movement elements does stretching have?

 

Indirect? Go on, say indirect.

[ghost-angel]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

You worry to much about "potential" abuse. Focus more on trying new things with the system and having fun.

 

Witch Hunting for "potential abuse" issues is productive.

[ghost-angel]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

Yeah. So making it a movement power would cut down on the potential abuse: you can't normally use two movement powers together. As it stands at the oment you could do a running move through and get stretching velocity damage added t that: make it a movement power and that abuse goes away.

 

What non-movement elements does stretching have?

 

Indirect? Go on, say indirect.

Rules already cover that 5ERp222.

 

If we made it a Movement Power you'd just complain that you can run while your neck is extended or fly with your legs and arms all stretched or some other random nonsense you feel like complaining about.

[Sean Waters]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

Rules already cover that 5ERp222.

 

If we made it a Movement Power you'd just complain that you can run while your neck is extended or fly with your legs and arms all stretched or some other random nonsense you feel like complaining about.

 

 

It may be nonsense but it is not random nonsense.

 

Go on, say indirect makes stretching different from movement powers. Or, if you don't think it does (and it DOESN'T) give me an example of how it is different.

[ghost-angel]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

Stretching doesn't Move you anywhere. It may relocate or spread parts of you across multiple hexes - but for game purposes your still inside your Stating Hex.

[Sean Waters]

Re: Streeeeeetch

 

Why is that a problem?

 

I've suggested movement could be done with 'another mode of movement' if it was a movement power (and stretching seems almost perfect to me for most instances).

 

Bits of you are moving when you stretch. I don't see why a movement power has to move ALL of you.