Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

[BobGreenwade]

Getting into the Equipment chapter in Space Wizards, I'm wondering what people would prefer when it comes to bows and firearms.

 

With the loss of much technology (on some worlds more than others), some parts of society have returned to these modes of weapons. Also, a few traveling adventurers (potentially including PCs) prefer them for one reason or another.

 

I'm wondering what approach people would advise and prefer for the Equipment chapter on this topic. Right now I have some general discussions, and referrals to appropriate books (FH, DC, and HSEG). I'm kind of leaning toward including a few samples for people who don't happen to have those books, possibly also including some extraterrestrial models (such as the sort of bow a Catavalan would use), but I'm a little unsure.

 

Would it be enough to just give references to other books, or should I include some basic sample weapons in these categories?

[Super Squirrel]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

Can you either elaborate on what Space Wizards is or provide a link that will? I can't answer the question without more information.

[BobGreenwade]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

Space Wizards is the setting I'm working on (for hopefully eventual publication) that takes place in the mid-fourth millennium of the Hero Universe. It uses skill-based magic and other elements of high fantasy and puts it into a space opera setting, with a few NH, PH, and DC elements thrown in for good measure.

 

If someone doesn't beat me to it I'll post links to the previous threads on the topic.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

Given that a fair number of firearms and muscle-powered weapons are written up in both 5ER and Sidekick, and lots more appropriate stuff can be found in the Equipment Guide and Spacers Toolkit, I would think that referring to those books for details would be sufficient for the most part. You might want to do full writeups for any unique items in your campaign, additional "primitive" alien weapons (like your fine ST Online submissions) , or items that fill in the gaps in existing lists, like early firearms (arquebuses, flintlocks and so on).

 

OTOH all of the books mentioned also have tables summarizing the most useful game stats for weapons. I would recommend including one of those for the weapons you expect to be most common in your setting, as well as any original ones you create.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

Space Wizards is the setting I'm working on (for hopefully eventual publication) that takes place in the mid-fourth millennium of the Hero Universe. It uses skill-based magic and other elements of high fantasy and puts it into a space opera setting, with a few NH, PH, and DC elements thrown in for good measure.

 

If someone doesn't beat me to it I'll post links to the previous threads on the topic.

 

 

http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42037

 

http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42347

 

http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42545

[OddHat]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

Given that a fair number of firearms and muscle-powered weapons are written up in both 5ER and Sidekick' date=' and lots more appropriate stuff can be found in the [i']Equipment Guide[/i] and Spacers Toolkit, I would think that referring to those books for details would be sufficient for the most part. You might want to do full writeups for any unique items in your campaign, additional "primitive" alien weapons (like your fine ST Online submissions) , or items that fill in the gaps in existing lists, like early firearms (arquebuses, flintlocks and so on).

 

OTOH all of the books mentioned also have tables summarizing the most useful game stats for weapons. I would recommend including one of those for the weapons you expect to be most common in your setting, as well as any original ones you create.

 

Agreed on all of this. I'd just emphasize that sample characters with full weapon write ups might be one way to work a few campaign appropriate weapons smoothly into the text.

[Teflon Billy]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

If you are asking whether you'd prefer bows to firearms, then I would say bows.

 

Why?

 

Because you are trying to have a Space Opera Fantasy world and I'm not a big fan of firearms in fantasy. It gives me cognitive dissonance.

 

Why can't you have firearms? I don't know what you magic system is like, but I usually just chalk it up to the Universe not allowing it.

 

Maybe having magical weapons that act like firearms would be fine, just not mundane non-muscle powered ranged weapons.

 

TB

[Super Squirrel]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

I would mind seeing teched up bows.

[Teflon Billy]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

I would mind seeing teched up bows.

Laser sights and other stuff? Or something altogether different?

 

TB

[Super Squirrel]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

Examples I thought of that might or might not be appropriate for the genre:

 

A bow that uses the tension of drawing back the string to charge a plasma cannon so that when released, fires a shot of plasma.

 

A tension memory string that eases drawing for the regular user. The bow essentually lowers the STR Min to use as well as is an Individual Focus, not a Universal Focus.

[BlackSword]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

Given that a fair number of firearms and muscle-powered weapons are written up in both 5ER and Sidekick' date=' and lots more appropriate stuff can be found in the [i']Equipment Guide[/i] and Spacers Toolkit, I would think that referring to those books for details would be sufficient for the most part. You might want to do full writeups for any unique items in your campaign, additional "primitive" alien weapons (like your fine ST Online submissions) , or items that fill in the gaps in existing lists, like early firearms (arquebuses, flintlocks and so on).

 

OTOH all of the books mentioned also have tables summarizing the most useful game stats for weapons. I would recommend including one of those for the weapons you expect to be most common in your setting, as well as any original ones you create.

I think LL has hit the nail on the head. Provide detailed write-ups for weapons and equipment that are unique to the setting, and provide a table that summarizes the most common weapons in the setting (which may come from other referenced sources). Refer to the Hero System Equipment Guide for more detailed references and a larger selection. This is nice because it should provide everything someone needs to play the setting in the setting book, but also references other books for more detailed or larger lists of potential equipment.

 

As for what is available, I would run the gamut from slings and fire hardened spears on primitive worlds (or people from primative cultures that somehow got aboard a ship) to the latest blasters from either the few tech savvy cultures in the setting, or left over from the previous era. Wookie bowcasters (with the serial numbers filed off) are a must.

[BobGreenwade]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

I think LL has hit the nail on the head. Provide detailed write-ups for weapons and equipment that are unique to the setting' date=' and provide a table that summarizes the most common weapons in the setting (which may come from other referenced sources). Refer to the Hero System Equipment Guide for more detailed references and a larger selection. This is nice because it should provide everything someone needs to play the setting in the setting book, but also references other books for more detailed or larger lists of potential equipment.[/quote']Since this seems to be the overwhelming consensus, this is the way I'll go. For bows I'll just use the list in 5ER, and I'll follow a similar approach with firearms, giving only the setting-specific items (especially enchanted versions).

 

It'd be interesting to see how some artist would draw a Catavalan longbow (which requires both left hands to brace).

[shadowcat1313]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

Memory Steel crossbows

laser rangefinders and or gyro stabilizers for bows

motorized cocking mechanisms for crossbows

reliable clip fed crossbows

 

as far as special arrows or bolts go

in my traveller games you can get tear gas and explosive rounds, the affects are that of a 10mm snub pistol round. but with bow range modifiers, the HE rounds arent the most reliable due to the lower velocity, and so detonate on a 14-

 

in my campaign: at higher tech levels bows and crossbows are most often used for hunting or target shooting, or occasionally as a sniper weapon

[Old Man]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

Piezoelectric-boosted crossbow prods.

Bolts with laser or gps guidance.

 

It's easy to think of ways to tech-up bows and crossbows; it's much harder to think of reasons to do so at tech levels that enable slugthrowers or beam weapons.

[Erkenfresh]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

I'd suggest sticking with Fantasy style weapons in space. Dune (the book, not the stupid movie) did an excellent job of making this work. For the readers of this post who haven't read the book, every warrior had a force field belt. The belt deflects all high velocity projectiles. You're bullet-proof. But, it doesn't deflect slower moving objects such as swords. The end result is everyone's running around using swords and shield belts. (Disregard the stupid movie where Duncan Idaho gets shot in the head through his force field.) The book also mentions "lasguns" which cause nuclear explosions upon contact with the force field belts. Yipes! Fortunately, nobody was suicidal enough to use lasguns in full force.

 

So, simply put, people use ancient weapons because the latest defenses protect completely against the latest weapons. This has the nice side effect of forcing ship to ship combat to be through boarding parties instead of slinging plasma from hundreds of miles away.

 

Your best bet is simply to use the HSEG since you've got it. It's pretty well balanced with enough variety to suit just about anyone.

[BobGreenwade]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

I'd suggest sticking with Fantasy style weapons in space. Dune (the book, not the stupid movie) did an excellent job of making this work. For the readers of this post who haven't read the book, every warrior had a force field belt. The belt deflects all high velocity projectiles. You're bullet-proof. But, it doesn't deflect slower moving objects such as swords. The end result is everyone's running around using swords and shield belts. (Disregard the stupid movie where Duncan Idaho gets shot in the head through his force field.) The book also mentions "lasguns" which cause nuclear explosions upon contact with the force field belts. Yipes! Fortunately, nobody was suicidal enough to use lasguns in full force.

 

So, simply put, people use ancient weapons because the latest defenses protect completely against the latest weapons. This has the nice side effect of forcing ship to ship combat to be through boarding parties instead of slinging plasma from hundreds of miles away.

While not exactly illegitimate, I'm going for a true blend of high fantasy and space opera (with a few other elements thrown in as mentioned above). The weapon of choice will generally be whatever the local technology level allows, so in some areas of the galaxy bows and spears will be the norm, in others you'll find mostly firearms, and in others people carry lasers.

 

Besides which, bullets are still the most reliable way to deal with vampires and werewolves.

 

Plus, I get a kind of perverse pleasure from the idea of a sharship being boarded by a horde of laser-toting chiang-shih.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

Plus' date=' I get a kind of perverse pleasure from the idea of a starship being boarded by a horde of laser-toting chiang-shih. [/quote']

 

Oooh... Now there's a good image for the cover!

 

Pardon the digression, but if you're going to include organizations patterned after any of the "super agencies" from the Champions Universe such as VIPER, IMO it would be appropriate to integrate supernatural monsters such as these into the resources that they command, considering how ubiquitous magical practices seem to be in this era.

[BobGreenwade]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

Oooh... Now there's a good image for the cover!

 

Pardon the digression, but if you're going to include organizations patterned after any of the "super agencies" from the Champions Universe such as VIPER, IMO it would be appropriate to integrate supernatural monsters such as these into the resources that they command, considering how ubiquitous magical practices seem to be in this era.

 

Oh yes, of course. Vampires and cyborgs fighting side by side, and all that.

 

The Elder Worm now have not only the Thane working for them, but Xenovores, chiang-shih, and enslaved Qularr. You do the math.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

Oh yes, of course. Vampires and cyborgs fighting side by side, and all that.

 

The Elder Worm now have not only the Thane working for them, but Xenovores, chiang-shih, and enslaved Qularr. You do the math.

 

First of all,

 

Now that that's out of my system: "Qularr?" The guys who specialize in giant monsters? I'd be concerned that those would be a little high-powered for this setting as you describe it.

[BobGreenwade]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

First of all,

 

Now that that's out of my system: "Qularr?" The guys who specialize in giant monsters? I'd be concerned that those would be a little high-powered for this setting as you describe it.

 

The giant monsters will be rare, and mostly geared toward starship encounters. There will also be allowances for particularly high-powered SW games -- Mechanon is still around, and he's an army.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

Okay, I got it now. I'm assuming you'll be including notes on how to modify the material in Space Wizards up to full superheroic level, as well as down to more gritty heroic level games.

[BobGreenwade]

Re: Space Wizards: Bows & Firearms

 

Okay' date=' I got it now. I'm assuming you'll be including notes on how to modify the material in [i']Space Wizards[/i] up to full superheroic level, as well as down to more gritty heroic level games.

No worries there. I already have some brief notes, and I'll be expanding on them after I've finished more of the book. What I've mentioned here is just the high-level stuff; there will be plenty of lower-level foes and simple monsters in there as well.

 

(Still, even for superheroic-level characters, the appearance of a Qularr monster is generally a cue to beat a hasty retreat.)