What is the best way to build this?

[Gideon]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

Umm... wow I leave my computer for a few hours and the thread grows by 2 pages. Wow...

 

Alright, let me start here. I want to make sure I understand this properly.

 

The rules (using the stuff from Dark Champions) say:

 

• You can pay 5 points to double the number of weapons you have. Each of these weapons must be identical and seperate. Each of these weapons must have the Focus limitation.
  
• At the GM's Descression, If you have 2 different weapons (meaning two seperate Focus based attacks) you can fire each one as part of the Rapid Fire manuever. This means if you have 2 guns, you could fire each gun at 2 people in a single phase.
  

 

So using the doubleing rules I could have 6 identical guns. Each of these guns is a seperate multipower. Each multipower is completely identical. In order to do this I buy the multipower once and then pay an extra 15 points for the duplicates.

 

Using Rapid Fire I can shoot all of the guns I have in 1 phase. So if I have 6 guns and each has 6 charges I can fire up to 36 shots in a single given phase. Granted realisticly this is an impossible feat considering -2 cumulitive OCV penalty.

 

I dont think I made any mistakes here so lets go on...

 

What Hyper-man is suggesting is:

• Make 6 guns.
   
  
• Make 5 of the guns invisible
   
  
• Take extra limbs
   
  
• Make the extra limbs invisible
   
  
• State that for SFX all 6 guns count as 1 gun:
  
  • If 1 gun is disarmed or blown up all 6 are.
    
  • If I use a "Normal Bullet" charge from 1 gun I use a charge from all 6 guns
    
  • ETC...
    

  [*]Call the whole thing: "1-gun-that-can-be-fired-6-times-a-phase"

 

Here's my issues with this.

1. As far as I understand the rules doubled weapons must be IDENTICAL, and as someone already pointed out the "Doubles" cannot have advantages or limitations that the original lacks.
   
2. The doubleing rules also state that the "doubles" need to be different items, and thus the SFX of: 6 Guns in 1 defies the intention of the rules.
   

 

I also have a couple of other issues with the build:

• I don't understand the concept of an Invisible Obvious Accessible Focus.
  
• The extra limbs are bought linked to the Armor Piercing Bullets, So unless I have made a grave error:
  • I cannot use the extra limbs unless I am ALSO using the AP bullets.
    
  • Since the AP bullets are not consistant powers, the extra limbs turns off immediately after I fire an AP bullet.
    
  • Becaus the Extra Limbs go away as a in response to my first shot, My second shot cannot be from one of the guns I need the extra limbs to carry.
  • This effectivly means that the power always tuns off just prior to me having the ability to use it.
    

  [*]The "Limited Power All slots can be Missle Deflected" limitation should be on the slots not the entire framework.

  [*]The rules in the 5ER do not support "mixed Clips"

[Gideon]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

Hugh Neilson: KarinsDad is correct, I (the OP) want to have the ability to fire 3 bullets (of any kind) at 3 targets in the same phase.

 

I don't care at all how many shots I can pump into a single target. At least not where this thread is concerned.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

A few things.

 

First, 5er p396 notes that

With the GM's permission, a character can use Rapid Fire to fire two different Ranged weapons, one in each hand, the same way he can perform a Sweep with multiple Combat Maneuvers.

 

Extrapolating this to a character who has paid for six ranged weapons and six arms, as proposed by HM, the character should be able to fire his six weapons (each with a separate bulllet - "two ranged weapons" could be a flash grenade and a handgun) in a Rapid Attack maneuver, rather than an MPA.

 

Second, 5er p 396 also advises

The GM may wish to restrict characters using Rapid Fire to a maximum of 2-3 shorts per phase, which gives a reasonable increase in firepower while still rendering the attacker vulnerable to counterattack.

 

So what you are asking for, while explicitly permitted (with GM permission using multiple weapons to fire multiple attacks using Rapid Attack) is also explicitly warned against (allowing a character to fire more than 2-3 shots in a phase).

 

Given this, I would suggest any other build that permits 6 shots to be rapid fired (same attack or different) in a phase is warned against in the rules, and may be something your GM does not wish to allow regardless of how book-legal the build is. If that is the case, you are wasting your time looking for book-legal huilds before you determine whether your GM is going to be willing to consider this approach.

 

New realization: MPA is not viable. An MPA must target the same target with all atacks. Your Explosive bullet would target a hex, and could not be used with other bullets that target a character.

 

The "invisible OAF" would normally strike me as mutually exclusive. However, in this case, it is only the multiple extra foci which are invisible, and they are all disarmed or destroyed if the "base gun" is disarmed or destroyed. As such, the Invisibility of the 5 "phantom guns" does not offset the Obviousness or Accessibility of the underlying focus. That said, the OAF limitation does not apply to the points paid to double the foci anyway.

 

The Extra limbs should not, IMO, be Linked to anything. Rather, they should be Limited "only to allow extra guns to be fired", which is a pretty steep limitation, as it removes all but one possible action with these limbs - I'd call it -2.

 

I suggest all the guns ARE identical. The "Invisible" applies only to the doubling itself, not to the doubled guns. That said, the "doubled equipment" rules are being put to an unusual application here, so GM permission again becomes an issue.

 

The bottom line, to me, is that the desired power effect is one not readily supported by the rules. The suggested approach achieves the desired result in a manner suportable by the rules, if not contemplated as an example to them.

 

If I were prepared to allow the desired result, I would likely accept this build (after working out the Linked, Cannot MPA, and similar issues to set the cost of the build). If I were not prepared to allow the desired result, no build would be acceptable. If, as a GM, I were prepared to allow the result, and I didn't like the specific build, I would sit down with the player and work out a way to build it.

 

No matter what approach is taken, this is an unusual effect, possibly one that will be overpowered in play. GM approval is going to be required. Discussing this desired ability with your GM is the logical next step. Before you work out the complex mechanics by which it will be implemented, you should make sure you aren't wasting your time designing a "book legal" construct that your GM isn't going to allow anyway.

[KarinsDad]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

Extrapolating this to a character who has paid for six ranged weapons and six arms, as proposed by HM, the character should be able to fire his six weapons (each with a separate bulllet - "two ranged weapons" could be a flash grenade and a handgun) in a Rapid Attack maneuver, rather than an MPA.

 

That must be the difference between myself and others.

 

I read the rules as written to mean the rules as written, not as some vague extrapolation that some GMs might allow and others might not.

 

The rule you just quoted is for two different weapons in two different hands. Not for a single weapon. That is not just a game mechanic, it is also SFX.

 

Saying that the mechanic is two different weapons in order to allow that (GM dependent) rule you quoted and then turn around and say that the SFX is actually one weapon is a stretch. IMO.

 

It is more than a stretch (i.e. just plain ignoring the doubling rules completely) to say "Well the doubling rule creates duplicate identical weapons, but I'm not using it for that. I'm using it to create duplicate powers and then I am throwing a bunch of powers, advantages and limitations at those powers so that they will in reality be a single weapon.".

 

So, it becomes a single weapon for one rule, but multiple different weapons for a different rule. The ultimate have your cake and eat it too.

 

To me, the doubling rule creates physical duplicate identical weapons, not just duplicate identical powers. Modifying the rule to create duplicate powers without duplicate weapons is creating a house rule. IMO. YMMV.

[Silbeg]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

Except that activating an attack power is the end of your phase (after determining if you hit and any damage, page 370). You cannot activate more than a single attack power in a phase, nor can you use more than a single attack power in a Blazing Away or Rapid Fire maneuver.

 

Not trying to give you a hard time here, I just know of no way within the rules to accomplish what you want to do.

 

Not exactly true, KarinsDad... you could do an MPA where you activate more than a single attack power. Of course the difference there would be that you would be using multiple attack powers with a single attack (roll)... so that may not be applicable

[AmadanNaBriona]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

I've been thinking about this WAY too much....

 

for sake of discussion, let us ponder

 

Fire and Ice is a supervillain. Ticked off at being written out of continuity he goes on a rampage downtown and decides to take on the local precinct waiting for the capes to show up. Thanks to a good PRE attack and a lot more speed than the 2 spd Donut munchers, he goes hog wild.

(assume for the moment that he bought both attacks outside of frameworks)

1st phase he Rapid fires the Freeze Blast from his Left hand (the Ice side) and drops 3 cops.

2nd phase he rapid fires his Heat Blast from his right hand and drops 3 more.

3rd phase he points both hands and does a MPA against the SWAT van and makes it go boom.

4th phase, he finishes his concerto of destruction by trying to Rapid fire an ice blast at one of the 2 remaining cops, while hitting the other with a fire blast. *fizzle*

 

Leggomyass the prettyboi elf archer, is attempting to save Hamhock the hobbit, who is menaced on one side by an Armored Ugly-hai and on the other by a Dire Wombat. He Rapid Fires an Armor Peircing Arrow and a Broadhead at them respectively. Its a FH game, so it goes off without a ruffle. Hamhock is relieved.

 

Muave Archer (because all the good colors were already taken) carries 24 arrows in a quiver with feild points and a special threading, and has about a grazillion specialty warheads all over his costume designed to be attached to the shafts. Even tho he has to pay for everything, he can't EVER duplicate Leggomyasses trickshot. OK.... With Power Skill, he can do it... but not on a consistant basis, and if he tries it too often, his GM can make him buy the ability with XP, something that makes him sad, because it's illegal according to the rules. He wishes breifly that he lived in a Heroic Dimension instead of a Superheroic one.

Deiter, a Dog of War, is gonna go attack a Rodesian millitary camp, 'cause its what he does. He brings along a 40mm, 3 shot Autofire, Drum Fed Grenade launcher filled with a party mix of HE, Incendiary, HEDP, and tear gas round to create a nice diversion. He's a Dark Chamapions character. No problems.

 

Punishment, the Obsessed Avenger, trys to do the same thing, with the same weapon, to a crack house. The GM is also using Dark Champions and equipment allowances. No problemo.

He then goes on to have a Team up with a dude in a red suit with cute lil horns that make him look like a cos-player doing Hot Stuff The Little Devil. He brings the same weapon. It don't work. Darn Comix code. Punishment gripes about how out of touch with reality Hornhead is.

 

Fritz is a pround survivor of the apocalypse, an elite member of the Moreau Project, 20th century soliders and scientists cryogenically frozen to survive a global holocaust and awake afterwords in order to try and finally find some real catgirls. He's on patrol in his v-150 when a herd of Giant Bison stampede his way. He spins the turret around and deters them with a couple of long bursts from his rh-202 20mm cannon. He's not really interested in killing more than a couple, so he uses the ammo from hopper 1, normal FMJ slugs. No worries. Later that same day, his patrol is ambushed by The S&M Slaver Gang, in their harnesses and loinpouches and hoods, driving a wide assortment of cobbled together post apoc gasburners with metal plates, spiky bits, barbed wire, cow skulls and Leather Pride flags all over them. He changes to ammo hopper #2, specially loaded by the techs back at base for these kind of opponents. the sequence of rounds in the belt are linked as such... AP, HE I, AP, HE I, Tracer. Repeat ad nausem.

In a heroic game it shoots.

The bad guys fall back and decide to go home and bust out a precious tub of crisco.

In a superheroic one, it don't.

They shot Fritz! You Faery bastards shot Fritz!

 

This topic is bugging me.

Steves answers aren't helping much.

In DC, his solution is "Just do it." Buy the gun with normal ammo and then don't worry about the cost (points wise) for special rounds. Works great for Heroic games, but leaves Champions characters high and dry.

[Silbeg]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

Yep' date=' thems the rules. I'm sure we've found another rule we can both agree sucks rocks. [/quote']

 

And at least some of us throw this rule right out, as it makes little sense...

 

Rephrase this... it makes little sense for a Multipower, or most VPPs, but I can see that it makes perfect sense for an Elemental Control (as one way to define an EC is one power with exhibits many Powers. (note the capitalization, it is important for that statement).

 

I think the rule comes from the rule that you cannot Link one slot of a Framework to another slot of the same Framework. I buy that, but this is different.

 

In my game, I use common sense, and allow them to be used. If it came up, I would probably limit the total Active Points for powers used from a VPP to be limited to the total reserve.

 

Example:

Starbolt has a 75 point Multipower (Star bolts).

He chooses to use a 10d6 EB and 5d6 Flash vs. Sight to use his pool. This is fine, since it doesn't exceed the 75 point reserve.

 

A while later (and quite a few XP), he converts his MP into a VPP. Being clever, and trying to tweak out just a little more oomph from his Framework, he adds X2 END and Extra Time (Full Phase) to get a -1 Limitation to the two powers, so that he can throw a 15d6 EB and 15d6 Flash. However, since the VPP Reserve is 75 points, the total Active Points for the two powers far exceeds the reserve. Thus, I would dissallow.

[AmadanNaBriona]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

And at least some of us throw this rule right out, as it makes little sense...

 

Rephrase this... it makes little sense for a Multipower, or most VPPs, but I can see that it makes perfect sense for an Elemental Control (as one way to define an EC is one power with exhibits many Powers. (note the capitalization, it is important for that statement).

 

I think the rule comes from the rule that you cannot Link one slot of a Framework to another slot of the same Framework. I buy that, but this is different.

 

In my game, I use common sense, and allow them to be used. If it came up, I would probably limit the total Active Points for powers used from a VPP to be limited to the total reserve.

 

Example:

Starbolt has a 75 point Multipower (Star bolts).

He chooses to use a 10d6 EB and 5d6 Flash vs. Sight to use his pool. This is fine, since it doesn't exceed the 75 point reserve.

 

A while later (and quite a few XP), he converts his MP into a VPP. Being clever, and trying to tweak out just a little more oomph from his Framework, he adds X2 END and Extra Time (Full Phase) to get a -1 Limitation to the two powers, so that he can throw a 15d6 EB and 15d6 Flash. However, since the VPP Reserve is 75 points, the total Active Points for the two powers far exceeds the reserve. Thus, I would dissallow.

 

That's been how I've handled it, and will continue to do so, the "official" rules bedamned. Heck, I even advocate allowing MPA's with multiple attack powers in EC's, as its the ONLY thing that would encourage having more than one attack in an EC (right now, virtually every EC character I've seen written up has given up on Attack powers in the EC in favor of an Attack Multipower... which means, to me, that the utility of EC doesn't match its cost)

[Hyper-Man]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

I've been thinking about this WAY too much....

 

 

You and me both!

 

Excellent breakdown btw.

[AmadanNaBriona]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

You and me both!

 

Excellent breakdown btw.

 

Thanx.

This is beginning to stick in my craw.

 

I suppose it was inevitable. It happens whenever "new" mechanisims get integrated into the system, and tho the rules for Ambidexterity and Off hand penalties have been around since the days of Espionage!, there were no core rules to allow for multiple attacks until the coming of the BBB, where we say the introduction of the Sweep maneuver, which opened the floodgates. FREd cracked Humpty Dumpty wide open, and 5ER tried to glue him back together with lots of "you can't do this" rules interpretations.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

Trigger may well end up being the only 'book legal' method of accomplishing this rather mundane real world effect (firing multiple types of rounds in one phase from one gun). However, the cost of that approach seems disproportionate to the utility. The multiple item approach (if legal according to SL) loads the brunt of the cost on the front end so that adding a different round type to the mix is not going to be more than 1-3 real points which makes far more sense. If the gun in my last example were stolen it would eventually just end up being a 'normal revolver' of whatever caliber chosen by the player. The various bullets are the 'real' power behind the build. They are either extremely expensive (silver), illegal (armor piercing) or difficult to aquire (holy). That seems to be what is really being paid for which kind of makes sense in a way.

[Gideon]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

Hyper-man: If my GM will allow the 6-in-1 gun conceptually, then that is EXACTLY how I will build it. It just needs a couple of minor fixes (linked on the extra limbs, and the can be missle deflected on the framework).

 

If he won't allow it, then I am going to see if the build AmadanNaBriona came up with will fly.

 

I am not gonna deal with the backwards crap build I suggested except as either a last ditch effort (which I honestly don't see the GM accepting) or a way of saying well Hyper-man and AmadanNaBriona's builds are both better than this.

 

So again thank you guys for all the effort you have put in to helping me.

[AmadanNaBriona]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

I'll see if I can post a cleaned up & finalized version of my earlier build then. I've gotta get some laundry done first tho.

[Gideon]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

Hugh Neilson: My GM does not restrict the rapid shot manuever. The reason is most characters in the game have an OCV of 8-10, and I don't think a single character in the game (including NPCs) can generate an OCV higher than 14.

 

With the cumulitive -2, if I am fireing at a hoard of agents who all have an 8 DCV and I have a 11 OCV:

 

First shot: 11 OCV vs 8 DCV: 14-

Second shot: 9 OCV vs 8 DCV: 12-

Third shot: 7 OCV vs 8 DCV: 10-

Fourth shot: 5 OCV vs 8 DCV: 8-

Fifth shot: 3 OCV vs 8 DCV: 6-

Sixth shot: 1 OCV vs 8 DCV: 4-

 

Thats the base, chances are after the third shot I miss, and the rapid shot is over, and thats not taking into account that the targets may abort to dodge.

[AmadanNaBriona]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

Question?

 

How dedicated are you to the idea of the gun-in-question being a Colt Peacemaker (aka Single Action Army revolver)?

 

Because, just as a side note, the Peacemaker dosen't have a swing out cylinder, and thus can't use speedloaders, which means in a realistic write up it gets reloaded one shell at a time.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

Hugh Neilson: My GM does not restrict the rapid shot manuever. The reason is most characters in the game have an OCV of 8-10, and I don't think a single character in the game (including NPCs) can generate an OCV higher than 14.

 

With the cumulitive -2, if I am fireing at a hoard of agents who all have an 8 DCV and I have a 11 OCV:

 

First shot: 11 OCV vs 8 DCV: 14-

Second shot: 9 OCV vs 8 DCV: 12-

Third shot: 7 OCV vs 8 DCV: 10-

Fourth shot: 5 OCV vs 8 DCV: 8-

Fifth shot: 3 OCV vs 8 DCV: 6-

Sixth shot: 1 OCV vs 8 DCV: 4-

 

Thats the base, chances are after the third shot I miss, and the rapid shot is over, and thats not taking into account that the targets may abort to dodge.

 

FYI, the mechanics for Rapid Fire are nearly identical to those of Sweep. The character chooses how many shots to fire first and then the OCV penalty gets applied to ALL of those shots (NOT like Autofire or Block vs multiple attacks as your example suggests).

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

That must be the difference between myself and others.

 

I read the rules as written to mean the rules as written, not as some vague extrapolation that some GMs might allow and others might not.

 

I see. Do all Energy Blasts in your game work against Energy Defense, then? Can a Killling Attack never knock a target out? Would you pedantically state that a character who actually has six hands and six guns can't fire them all at once because the rules refer only to a character with two hands and two ranged weapons? All rules require some extrapolation to be applied beyond the examples contained in the rule book.

 

A package deal in a Hero book provides "feet as usable as hands" purchased using extra limbs. Would this be denied in your game since the character doesn't actually have any extra limbs? The rules are supposed to be tools to design characters and play the game, not straightjackets to constrain the type of characters it is possible to create and frustrate the ability to play the game a certain way.

 

The rule you just quoted is for two different weapons in two different hands. Not for a single weapon. That is not just a game mechanic' date=' it is also SFX.[/quote']

 

By purchasing the extra limbs and extra guns, the character purchases the MECHANIC of six guns in six hands, with the SFX of one gun in one hand. mechanics and SFX are segregated within Hero.

 

Saying that the mechanic is two different weapons in order to allow that (GM dependent) rule you quoted and then turn around and say that the SFX is actually one weapon is a stretch. IMO.

 

There are, should you choose to look, literally hundreds of examples where mechanic and SFX vary. As very basic examples, "Teleport - Must Pass Through Intervening Space" and "Ranged Killing Attack - No Range" come readily to mind.

 

It is more than a stretch (i.e. just plain ignoring the doubling rules completely) to say "Well the doubling rule creates duplicate identical weapons' date=' but I'm not using it for that. I'm using it to create duplicate powers and then I am throwing a bunch of powers, advantages and limitations at those powers so that they will in reality be a single weapon.".[/quote']

 

The result is identical. Why should the mechanic or cost differ? [Actually, the result is somewhat inferior - disarming me of one gun when I really have six would leave me with five.]

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

Hugh Neilson: My GM does not restrict the rapid shot manuever. The reason is most characters in the game have an OCV of 8-10, and I don't think a single character in the game (including NPCs) can generate an OCV higher than 14.

 

With the cumulitive -2, if I am fireing at a hoard of agents who all have an 8 DCV and I have a 11 OCV:

 

First shot: 11 OCV vs 8 DCV: 14-

Second shot: 9 OCV vs 8 DCV: 12-

Third shot: 7 OCV vs 8 DCV: 10-

Fourth shot: 5 OCV vs 8 DCV: 8-

Fifth shot: 3 OCV vs 8 DCV: 6-

Sixth shot: 1 OCV vs 8 DCV: 4-

 

As HM pointed out, you would have a 1 OCV, needing a 4-, for every shot. Mind you, I don't encounter a lot of DCV 8 agents either!

[Gideon]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

FYI' date=' the mechanics for Rapid Fire are nearly identical to those of Sweep. The character chooses how many shots to fire first and then the OCV penalty gets applied to ALL of those shots (NOT like Autofire or Block vs multiple attacks as your example suggests).[/quote']

 

You have no idea how stupid I feel right now. I know these rules, at least I thought I knew these rules.

 

I am going to chalk my stupidity up to lack of sleep and back medication, but that shouldn't be an excuse.

 

The point is my GM will allow someone to make as many rapid fire or sweep attempts as he wishes, because after 2 or 3 targets the numbers you need start getting so rediculosly low that your simply waisting time (and possibly ammo).

[Gideon]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

Question?

 

How dedicated are you to the idea of the gun-in-question being a Colt Peacemaker (aka Single Action Army revolver)?

 

Because, just as a side note, the Peacemaker dosen't have a swing out cylinder, and thus can't use speedloaders, which means in a realistic write up it gets reloaded one shell at a time.

 

Um... I am not an expert on firearms, but the character has a 6-shooter. The gun itself dates back to the late 1800s, and its an important part of his background.

 

There may be a better gun to use that dates back to the proper time period, but I don't know of one.

 

This just sounds like another reason to not buy the gun with clips.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

The point is my GM will allow someone to make as many rapid fire or sweep attempts as he wishes' date=' because after 2 or 3 targets the numbers you need start getting so rediculosly low that your simply waisting time (and possibly ammo).[/quote']

 

Your odds are still likely better than Blazing Away!

 

Steve's latest Q & A seems to indicate the duplicate Multipowers are the way to go. I'm not a big fan of the "5 points doubles your gear" rule, but in this case, I would probably allow it, as I don't perceive the ability you're proposing as abusive or problematic.

[Dust Raven]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

And at least some of us throw this rule right out, as it makes little sense...

 

Rephrase this... it makes little sense for a Multipower, or most VPPs, but I can see that it makes perfect sense for an Elemental Control (as one way to define an EC is one power with exhibits many Powers. (note the capitalization, it is important for that statement).

 

Speaking of Elemental Control...

 

Well, if I by an EC with 3 powers, EB, Flight and FF, I'm not only allowed, but expected to use them all at the same time. If I buy an EC with EB, Flash and a Ranged Drain, not only am I for unexplained reasons not allowed to use them at the same time, I'm taken out behind the shed and whipped because I didn't buy this group as a Multipower. I see something wrong with this logic.

 

It's the same with Multipower. I can have variable slots of EB, Flash, Flight and FF, and I can put half my points in each EB and Flight, or EB and FF, or FF and Flight, and can use them at the same time, but I can't put half my points in each EB and Flash and use them both. Again no explanation. Again no logic.

 

P.S.: I couldn't agree more than an EC is a single power that just happens to have enough facets/functions/uses/etc that it requires it be built using several Powers.

[Balabanto]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

You know, he could simply buy Rapid Attack: Ranged and pump out charges, because it is better than blazing away, and buy a trigger to switch the multipower outright. You just need stupid amounts of Charges and the Fast Draw skill. (You guys do remember what the skill does, yes?) Then you don't need to worry about most of this stuff, because the Rapid Attack Ranged takes care of the penalties and he's not Blazing Away.

 

Alternatively, just buy yourself a VPP of Gun and Bullets, OAF. It doesn't even have to be very large, the CONTROL COST has the charges, and any advantages that you want to place on it, because the cost of the reserve doesn't change.

 

Observe.

 

Variable Power Pool, of Gun and specialized ammunition

 

50 Active points

33 Control Cost, 0 Phase To Change (+1), 250 Charges (+1). OAF (-1), Requires a Fast Draw Roll to be 0 Phase to Change (-1/4)

 

Yes. It hurts. But yes, it works.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

You know, he could simply buy Rapid Attack: Ranged and pump out charges, because it is better than blazing away, and buy a trigger to switch the multipower outright. You just need stupid amounts of Charges and the Fast Draw skill. (You guys do remember what the skill does, yes?) Then you don't need to worry about most of this stuff, because the Rapid Attack Ranged takes care of the penalties and he's not Blazing Away.

 

Alternatively, just buy yourself a VPP of Gun and Bullets, OAF. It doesn't even have to be very large, the CONTROL COST has the charges, and any advantages that you want to place on it, because the cost of the reserve doesn't change.

 

Observe.

 

Variable Power Pool, of Gun and specialized ammunition

 

50 Active points

33 Control Cost, 0 Phase To Change (+1), 250 Charges (+1). OAF (-1), Requires a Fast Draw Roll to be 0 Phase to Change (-1/4)

 

Yes. It hurts. But yes, it works.

 

Whether it's a VPP or Multipower makes no difference regarding the issue that only 1 specific build of an attack can be used from either in 1 phase (rapid attack or not). The only solutions found so far are use of multiple Triggers or multiple items via the equipment doubling rules.

[Balabanto]

Re: What is the best way to build this?

 

But you don't need them, Hyper-man, because any fanning of the trigger or multiple shots can be taken care of with advantages in the pool like autofire and variable special effect. Once you have the power pool, all of the restrictions of the advantages vis a vis the active point cost vanish, you just have to make a fast draw roll to change the pool.