eternal_sage Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 so i have a character who was trained as a blacksmith before his adventuring career. what types of injuries might he have sustained for accidents during that time? are their any dangers in using iron of the wrong level of purity for a specific item (say trying to forge a sword out of iron more suited for a hoe) or any accidents from inproperly quenching an item? thanks in advance, oh great masters of historical stuff! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmadanNaBriona Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? Sorta depends on how maimed you want him to be The main injuries I've seen (and/or received) from smithing are burns. The next most common are crushed fingers from poorly placed hammer strokes or other general screwups. Poor metal usually is more of a risk to the end user than the smith, tho a nasty injury could result from a materials failure at the wrong time, from metal being thrown from the project due to a flaw or fracture. I suppose it's possible to suffer a catastrophic material failure & injury during quenching, but it'd be a stretch.... quenching doesn't usually cool metal fast enough to cause it to asplode unless there's a hidden bubble or something similar, and even then the quench barrel should absorb the vast majority of the force. Smelting the raw ore, OTOH, could be fraught with hazard Can't really think of much else off the top of my head, but feel free to bounce any questions off me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comic Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? If you're talking pure fantasy smithing, then some exotic items people used to add to metal to strengthen the alloy could be pretty seriously toxic, and smiths inhaled deeply the air of the forge. Silversmiths have been known to suffer a condition that causes their skin to become extremely pale, scaly and dry, and their hair to turn white and eventually fall out. If you're talking high magic, curses, possession, or transformation could come about from really exotic attempts to work with magical forces or items. If you're exceptionally careless, a drunk, a lunatic, or subject to attack, then just about anything you could imagine very hot fires and very heavy chunks of metal doing to flesh could come about by accident, though this is extremely rare. Blindness - generally partial, in an age before goggles, could happen. And in the distant past, masters could beat their apprentices, and masters were men who exercised their muscles eight to ten hours a day beating iron, while apprentices began as small children, so the injuries could be pretty horrific. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemming Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? Silversmiths have been known to suffer a condition that causes their skin to become extremely pale, scaly and dry, and their hair to turn white and eventually fall out. I think that was arsenic used in the silver process, IIRC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmadanNaBriona Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? If you're talking pure fantasy smithing, then some exotic items people used to add to metal to strengthen the alloy could be pretty seriously toxic, and smiths inhaled deeply the air of the forge. Silversmiths have been known to suffer a condition that causes their skin to become extremely pale, scaly and dry, and their hair to turn white and eventually fall out. good call on additives and fumes. I've often wondered if some of the 'cursed' or 'magic' swords from myth might have in fact been alloyed with radioactive isotope bearing ore. almost any type of smithing other than blacksmithing gets you involved with a lot of potentially nasty chemicals for doing different finishes, patinas and the like. Mercury, lead and metallic arsenic are all likely contaminants a smith could find himself subjected to in dangerous amounts. If you're exceptionally careless, a drunk, a lunatic, or subject to attack, then just about anything you could imagine very hot fires and very heavy chunks of metal doing to flesh could come about by accident, though this is extremely rare. Blindness - generally partial, in an age before goggles, could happen. And in the distant past, masters could beat their apprentices, and masters were men who exercised their muscles eight to ten hours a day beating iron, while apprentices began as small children, so the injuries could be pretty horrific. Also a good call on the threat to the eyes... I've gotten metal shards in just the corner of my eyes working at the forge and it was a pretty serious emergency. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemming Posted January 13, 2008 Report Share Posted January 13, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? Also a good call on the threat to the eyes... I've gotten metal shards in just the corner of my eyes working at the forge and it was a pretty serious emergency. Yea, I remember a question from my MRI about welding and metal work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eternal_sage Posted January 13, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? basically, i want him maimed enough to teach a good lesson (pay attention to what your doing, blacksmithing is an art not a game, that kind of thing) but not enough to lower his stats (). basically he was doing something his dad specifically told himi not to (trying to make a sword, when he was trained to make horseshoes and shovels) and something went wrong and he was injured. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ocelot Posted January 13, 2008 Report Share Posted January 13, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? Fractures sustained while getting into barfights. You know, because of all the drinking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theron Posted January 13, 2008 Report Share Posted January 13, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? A friend of mine who's a blacksmith has broken several bones in his feet dropping heavy things on them by accident (hammers, pieces of metal, anvils). He's rather clumsy, though. Burns and smoke inhalation can be problematic, especially as some metals give off noxious gases when heated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Weapon Posted January 13, 2008 Report Share Posted January 13, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? basically, i want him maimed enough to teach a good lesson (pay attention to what your doing, blacksmithing is an art not a game, that kind of thing) but not enough to lower his stats (). basically he was doing something his dad specifically told himi not to (trying to make a sword, when he was trained to make horseshoes and shovels) and something went wrong and he was injured. At first I thought that making a sword wouldn't be particularly hazardous, apart from the heavy piece of metal being sharp what's the difference? But then I realised, it's a lot of work. You have to beat the metal, then twist it to get the crystals in the iron right (although the smith wouldn't know that's why he's doing it) and whole lotta other stuff. It's all physically hard work and he would have gotten very tired the first time he tried it. That's when concentration slips. Maybe there is some sort of exotic (by campaign technology standards) additive that his master adds to sword blades (any sort of alloying metal could make the vital difference in strength) and he didn't know how to add it properly. This is exactly the sort of thing a smith would keep secret at least from his apprentice at least until late in his service. Remember there were no patents in this era so people were very serous about trade secrets. If this caused his injury it might remind him not to assume he knows everything. Only a bad master would beat his apprentice badly enough to cause permanent injury. Remember he needs them FIT to help at the forge. I mean a schoolar could use a crippled apprentice but a smith needs someone who can really pound that iron. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eternal_sage Posted January 13, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? i'm looking more for an elaboration on this though: Poor metal usually is more of a risk to the end user than the smith, tho a nasty injury could result from a materials failure at the wrong time, from metal being thrown from the project due to a flaw or fracture. as that is really what i was thinking to begin with, but was unsure of the feasiblity of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comic Posted January 13, 2008 Report Share Posted January 13, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? Well, if he's trying some extreme sorts of steel-making, like trying to extrapolate (a bit of coal dust makes it strong, a lot must make it stronger) or sand-forging, he could create a blade as brittle as glass that fragments into long needle-shards, all of which would be razor-like in sharpness on the first serious hard blow. In itself, a few splinters flying about that (if they don't hit the eyes) would be at worse scarring. But if the first use was on something you needed a sword to fight.. well.. being gored by a boar or savaged by a wolf because you thought your sword could handle it is no fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eternal_sage Posted January 13, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? thats actually just about perfect. i looking for something that does about 1-2 Body damage. bad enough to hurt, but not bad enough to be rushed to the cleric...er....emergency room. Dad: No, son, you can't get the priest to heal it. Son: But, why not? It really hurts, and i'm bleeding quite a bit. Dad: Because son, those scars will always remind you that if you are going to do something, your going to do it right. The forge is not a toy, son. Son: But Dad, I don't want to make horseshoes and shovels, I want to make swords! Dad: Which is why I'm sending your foolish, hard headed self to live with your uncle. He's a weaponsmith, in Karnath. Son: I know dad, "a fine crafted shovel is worship of the forge god in itself..." Wait. What did you say? Dad: Yes son, you've proven that your either going to make weapons or die trying, so I suppose I'll keep you alive. thats pretty much the exchange that occurs after the accident. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John-Walton Posted January 13, 2008 Report Share Posted January 13, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? strangely scarred by virtue of being sprayed with droplets from a splash of molten alloy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pawsplay Posted January 24, 2008 Report Share Posted January 24, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? I know a couple of real life metal sculptors who have gotten metal splinters in the eye, one hot, one not. Fortunately, they did not have to depend on medieval medicine or rare sorcery for treatment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markdoc Posted January 25, 2008 Report Share Posted January 25, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? strangely scarred by virtue of being sprayed with droplets from a splash of molten alloy I actually have a fair sized scar on my leg from a stream of molten lead released by a faulty mould. Sadly, it happened after character creation, so I got no points for it cheers, Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmadanNaBriona Posted January 25, 2008 Report Share Posted January 25, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? I know a couple of real life metal sculptors who have gotten metal splinters in the eye' date=' one hot, one not. Fortunately, they did not have to depend on medieval medicine or rare sorcery for treatment.[/quote'] a magnet/loadstone could probably do the trick, in a pinch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Man Posted January 25, 2008 Report Share Posted January 25, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? That'd have to be a pretty strong lodestone. Actually, what you really don't want to get in your eye is concrete. Apparently it gets lodged in there and slowly dissolves the surrounding tissue. I'd expect an experienced medieval blacksmith to be covered with many little (and some larger) burns and scars. Losing an eye to splinters, or losing hearing over time, would not be uncommon either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmadanNaBriona Posted January 25, 2008 Report Share Posted January 25, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? That'd have to be a pretty strong lodestone. Actually, what you really don't want to get in your eye is concrete. Apparently it gets lodged in there and slowly dissolves the surrounding tissue. I'd expect an experienced medieval blacksmith to be covered with many little (and some larger) burns and scars. Losing an eye to splinters, or losing hearing over time, would not be uncommon either. Dry concrete mix is nasty, corrosive stuff. I once had a bag bust partially open on my shoulder unloading a trucks worth. I avoided getting any in my eyes, thanks to my glasses, but got some of the mix in a scrape on my forehead and I eventually wound up in the ER for it. Took several years for the scar to fade. A mild vinegar solution would probably help cut the effect, if it was available (which in my case it wasn't.... stoopid temp job in Folsom) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Man Posted January 25, 2008 Report Share Posted January 25, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? Johnny Cash knows what it's like in Folsom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eternal_sage Posted January 26, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? cause he shot a man in Reno, just to watch him die, if i remember the story right... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmadanNaBriona Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 Re: what types of injuries could result from forge accidents? Johnny Cash knows what it's like in Folsom. I sang a lot of Johnny Cash working that job, especially when digging through old riverbed rock with a pick-axe and digging bar. I awoke one morning, said to myself "If I wanted to be spending my days cooking in the Folsom sun, making big rocks into little rocks with hand tools, I should at least get to kill someone first!" Then I called my temp agency and told them "I quit" and to find me a new job Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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