Theron Posted April 10, 2009 Report Share Posted April 10, 2009 I've got a PC in my game with a number of "machine intelligence" powers and I find it tends to be nearly impossible to adjudicate them in any reliable mechanical sense. By and large, most machinery lacks the requisite defenses to put up any resistance, which seems to make high levels of it just an exercise in spending points for a special effect. The alternative, to assign such defenses to what amount to unintelligent objects tends to snap my reality suspenders a bit too hard. Is there a third path I'm missing here? Because we've got a big fight with a bunch of robots coming up and I don't want to give him an easy path to victory, but by the same token, I don't want to completely nerf him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desert Posted April 10, 2009 Report Share Posted April 10, 2009 Re: How Do You Handle Machine-Class Mental Powers? Well, you could use the machines intelligence score, which the main book says their supposed to have to be able to perform programs. Or you could have it be that they have to overcome some of the programs, like firewalls or anti-hacking programs. He basically is mentally hacking it in a way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theron Posted April 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 10, 2009 Re: How Do You Handle Machine-Class Mental Powers? Well' date=' you could use the machines intelligence score, which the main book says their supposed to have to be able to perform programs. Or you could have it be that they have to overcome some of the programs, like firewalls or anti-hacking programs. He basically is mentally hacking it in a way.[/quote'] Yeah. It's just that in a machine-filled world, that still either means a lot of improvisational statting of mundane objects, or a lot of hand-waving. Or a lot of saying, "The security system isn't smart enough for your powers to work on, so they don't." For the coming adventure, I noticed the robots I'm using (from the HSB) have a Disad that gives them an effective Ego score vs. Cyberpathy, so I'll use that for this time around. With a few evil added complications. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrosshairCollie Posted April 10, 2009 Report Share Posted April 10, 2009 Re: How Do You Handle Machine-Class Mental Powers? Machine Class of minds, to me, means 'computers'. Just by itself, machine-class mind control doesn't let you drive a car (mess it up by manipulating the parts that a computer *does* control, yes, but computers don't control the gas pedal and steering wheel). I apply Machine Mental powers to the target's INT (if a non-sentient computer) or EGO (if sentient); if the target has neither of those stats, you can't use the power on it. It's like using a regular mental power against a rock. No brain, no gain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desert Posted April 10, 2009 Report Share Posted April 10, 2009 Re: How Do You Handle Machine-Class Mental Powers? Actually CrosshairCollie is right. The machine has to have something that can be used as a mind, in order for the character to use his powers on it. If it doesn't have something that can be considered a mind, then he can't affect it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkham Posted April 10, 2009 Report Share Posted April 10, 2009 Re: How Do You Handle Machine-Class Mental Powers? Machine Class of minds, to me, means 'computers'. Just by itself, machine-class mind control doesn't let you drive a car (mess it up by manipulating the parts that a computer *does* control, yes, but computers don't control the gas pedal and steering wheel). Well, the steering wheel. Any car with cruise control has a computer that can take over control of the acceleration and brakes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peregrine Posted April 10, 2009 Report Share Posted April 10, 2009 Re: How Do You Handle Machine-Class Mental Powers? For a full cyberkinetic, add Telekinesis with Fine Manipulation, only vs. machines that cannot be affected by machine-class Telepathy. It shouldn't take more than 5 STR on the TK (maybe 10), which makes it a relatively minor power, cost-wise. Add BOECV to make it match the Telepathy, and there you go; makes the whole question moot. Or, if the intent is for the character to control all machines, roll it into the Telepathy as part of the SFX, since the Active and Real costs are going to be so low relative to the cost of the Telepathy (presuming 12d6 Telepathy or so vs. 5 STR TK BOECV, only vs. machines the Telepathy can't affect). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
concord Posted April 10, 2009 Report Share Posted April 10, 2009 Re: How Do You Handle Machine-Class Mental Powers? Something to consider is that high-tech fighter jets and some of the newer commercial airliners use fly by wire technology... the controls are hooked to a computer that reads the input of them being moved and then activates the hydraulic systems to move the control surfaces... Additionally, newer vehicles use a similar system for accelerator pedals... press the pedal and a computer reads the input then it sends a signal for gas flow to be increased or decreased... my wife's Saturn Vue has this... I was somewhat taken aback when our mechanic told me about it... Something you may want to consider is putting together a chart that gives computers that are not stat'ed out a complexity rating equal to an 'INT' stat range. Simple 5 Medium 8-10 Complex 11-15 Highly Complex 16-20 Supercomputer 21+ Then do a few example systems... Cell Phone - Simple Car Engine Computer - Medium Airliner Flight Controls - Complex Fighter Jet Weapons Computer - Highly Complex Weather Pattern Simulation Computer - Supercomputer Then you can slot new computers on the fly... . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndianaJoe3 Posted April 10, 2009 Report Share Posted April 10, 2009 Re: How Do You Handle Machine-Class Mental Powers? By and large' date=' most machinery lacks the requisite defenses to put up any resistance, which seems to make high levels of it just an exercise in spending points for a special effect. The alternative, to assign such defenses to what amount to unintelligent objects tends to snap my reality suspenders a bit too hard.[/quote'] I'll assume that the character has already bought the, "Telepathic Commands" Advantage to be able to communicate with equipment that doesn't have anything approaching a user interface. You could declare, "Embedded Systems" to be a separate class of mind from Computers (similar to Animals being separate from Humans). Or, you could give embedded systems large amounts of Mental Defense, with the special effect that they simply ignore extraneous inputs. Maybe classify any action that requires the system to ignore its inputs as something the system is violently opposed to doing. The bottom line is, make the character's benefits directly proportional to the amount of points he has spent on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egyptoid Posted April 10, 2009 Report Share Posted April 10, 2009 Re: How Do You Handle Machine-Class Mental Powers? mucho handwaving. I encourage this kind of powers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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