Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

[Susano]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

True' date=' but in a Pulp game who to say what exactly it could do?[/quote']

 

Looking like that? It's a space ship.

[shadowcat1313]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

what can it do?, I posted stats for it ages ago on surbrooks site actually

http://surbrook.devermore.net/adaptationsvehicles/militaryair/postwar/russia/caspian_sea_monster.HTML

[Escafarc]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

what can it do?, I posted stats for it ages ago on surbrooks site actually

http://surbrook.devermore.net/adaptationsvehicles/militaryair/postwar/russia/caspian_sea_monster.HTML

Nice:D but you need add as an option the missle(?) tubes that are on top of the one pictured above.

[shadowcat1313]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

I didnt put the missle option in because it never went beyond the drawing board stage, but she would have carried 4 or possibly 8 SSN-12, the one shown never had the missles actually fitted, if you want to add the missile

option, look at the data for the Slava class cruiser on the site, and just change the # of missiles

[shadowcat1313]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

57 1) SSN-12 Sandbox Missile: RKA 8d6+1, 4 Charges (-1), Semi-Armor Piercing (+¼), Autofire (2 shots; +¼),

MegaScale (1" = 100 km; 300km max range; +¾), Can Be Scaled Down 1" = 1km (+¼); Extra Time (1 Turn

(Post-Segment 12), -1 ¼), OIF Bulky (-1), Custom Modifier (must have active radar or sonar lock to

fire; -½), Custom Modifier (Minimum range of 20km; -½), Custom Modifier (Liquid fuel rocket has

proven unreliable; -½), Limited Arc Of Fire (60 degrees; Mounted Forward; -½), Real Weapon (-¼),

[shadowcat1313]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

Discovery Channel did at least part of a show on this beast, and theres some video footage of one in flight

[Escafarc]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

Discovery Channel did at least part of a show on this beast' date=' and theres some video footage of one in flight[/quote']

 

Thanks I found this on YuoTube:

[shadowcat1313]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

I'm not sure the Ekranoplan in the video and the one pictured above are the same aircraft, the one pictured has the dorsal launch containers, but you cant see them in the video

[Escafarc]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

I haven't been able to find one with the tubes yet but I'm going to keep looking.

[Ian Mackinder]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

except thats not an quite an aircraft. I dont speak russian, but the jet engines on stub wings at the nose are a dead givewaway to what that actually is, thats an Ekranoplan, what NATO called "The Caspian Sea Monster" a hybrid aircraft and hovercraft

 

yeah its probably sad I could ID the photo without the URL or captioning

 

one of the neatest ideas ever

 

Heck yeah.

 

If asked what kind of vehicle they wanted, I can imagine a LOT of groups saying "One of THOSE." Even if it is only about how incredibly cool-looking they are.

[shadowcat1313]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

550 mph at wavetop level, anybody want to figure the turn mode on this monster? let alone stopping it

[megaplayboy]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

Google Beriev Be-2500 to see a truly gigantic ekranoplan concept.

[Ian Mackinder]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

Google Beriev Be-2500 to see a truly gigantic ekranoplan concept.

 

Whoa.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beriev_Be-2500

 

http://www.beriev.com/eng/Be-2500_e/Be-2500_e.html

 

I always liked flying boats. Maybe there could be a comeback.

[Escafarc]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

Sweet !I wonder if any US Airlines will consider using anything like that?

[Susano]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

US airlines might look into the Boeing BWB project.

[shadowcat1313]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

heres another video on the Ekranoplans actually showing a missile launch

[Escafarc]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

Sweet. I could see one of those running trips between Sth FL and the Bahamas.

[gewing]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

that BE 2500 is a monster. I have always thought the Boeing Pelican design would be far more practical if it was amphibious.

 

for practicality, I prefer the BE 200.

 

The Ekranoplan never quite made sense to me. AFAIK, the effects of WIGE are usually proportional to the wingspan. So the extremely short stubby wings of the Ekranoplan seem self limiting. Perhaps they allow a higher speed or something, but larger wings, creating more lift, should allow smaller engines. More importantly, longer wingspan would allow the aircraft to fly higher above the surface, still in ground effect. hmm, article I found relates elevation to wing chord

http://www.vereporting.com/reports/gov/mil/navy/wingships/presentation/WIG%20Presentatation%20slide%20show.ppt page 33. rest is rather interesting too

 

old popular science article...

http://books.google.com/books?id=_VEEAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA72&lpg=PA72&dq=nuclear+powered+wing+in+ground+effect&source=bl&ots=I1avOaZ3-U&sig=6SNnE-soOhuTTpC5AXae3mW8G2M&hl=en&ei=KHKkS6G8JJGCsgO02vXTAw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=9&ved=0CDMQ6AEwCA#v=onepage&q=&f=false

 

another possibly interesting book, if I had $250 to spare...

http://www.amazon.com/Aerodynamics-Lifting-System-Extreme-Ground/dp/3540662774

 

 

edit: forgot to mention

In the 80s I saw a proposal in "proceedings of the Naval Institute" for iirc a "flying Frigate" that would be a (nuclear powered ?) WIGE seaplane, with some funky stuff for stability in high sea states, with literally the firepower of a frigate. Phalanx systems popup from wingtips...

I may be confusing features of it with another one, iirc a Nuclear powered WIGE CARRIER!

[Kristopher]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

except thats not an quite an aircraft. I dont speak russian, but the jet engines on stub wings at the nose are a dead givewaway to what that actually is, thats an Ekranoplan, what NATO called "The Caspian Sea Monster" a hybrid aircraft and hovercraft

 

yeah its probably sad I could ID the photo without the URL or captioning

 

one of the neatest ideas ever

 

Not that sad, I also knew it was an Ekranoplan at first sight -- the hull and the lower stub wings are also dead giveaways.

[RJB]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

Its funny. I planned to do a write up of the Amerika bomber- the one that goes down a rail- until I tried to figure out the velocities involved. This is total bullcrap. This plane was supposed to achieve 12,000mph on what, a 2 mile runway? The acceleration required would not only pancake the crew, it would probably rip the wings off. If the history channel says the germans were seriously working on this, then one of them, either the germans or the history channel, had their heads located in an unfortunate place.

[Ian Mackinder]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

The term 'Amerika Bomber' was actually used in reference to a number of different projects - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S%C3%A4nger_Amerika_Bomber

 

What you are specifically referring to is presumably this - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silbervogel

 

... And it was 1200 mph they were allegedly trying for on the track, going to over 12000 mph once airborne. Still rather steep, I have to agree.

[RJB]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

Ok, am I reading this wrong? Because it sounds to me like the boosters were meant to get the vehicle up to 12,000mph and then the ship flew on its own

 

The Amerika Bomber

 

 

The sled would have been powered with up to 15 of the V2 engines developed by another German engineer, Wernher von Braun. So the sled would have had to contain tankage for large amounts of fuel, to power the plane that was attached to it at speeds of up to 12,000 miles per hour.

As the bomber reached a point near the end of the track, the vehicle would pull away from the jet-powered sled. It would remain unpowered for just a few moments before an on-board engine would kick in.

[Yansuf]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

To achieve 12000 mph from rest in one continuous boost at 9g would require just over 130 km. So either it had a VERY long track or it was designed to go airborne and then accelerate up to max speed. I have always assumed the latter.

[RJB]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

On second thot, Ian was right about the acceleration:

 

The Amerika Bomber

 

 

"It would have burned an on-board load of fuel weighing about 90 tons," notes historian Geoff Steele, "and pitched up to about a 60-degree climb angle and remained under powered flight for approximately 3 to 4 minutes until the fuel was exhausted."

At that point the vehicle would pitch over, and because of its forward speed and centripetal force, would go into what is in effect a low-Earth orbit at approximately 115 to 120 mile altitude.

 

Unfortunately, to achieve 12,000mph in 4 minutes would mean accelerating 50 miles/sec! German engineers would surely have known this, so I think the history channel doesnt know what its talking about. BTW, that kind of velocity is just plain (plane?) wrong. Escape velocity is 5300mph, so something going that fast would not only achieve orbit, it would go flying into outer space. This is just sloppy research on somebody's part.

[Yansuf]

Re: Nazi Germany's Secret Plan to Bomb New York

 

On second thot, Ian was right about the acceleration:

 

The Amerika Bomber

 

 

"It would have burned an on-board load of fuel weighing about 90 tons," notes historian Geoff Steele, "and pitched up to about a 60-degree climb angle and remained under powered flight for approximately 3 to 4 minutes until the fuel was exhausted."

At that point the vehicle would pitch over, and because of its forward speed and centripetal force, would go into what is in effect a low-Earth orbit at approximately 115 to 120 mile altitude.

 

Unfortunately, to achieve 12,000mph in 4 minutes would mean accelerating 50 miles/sec! German engineers would surely have known this, so I think the history channel doesnt know what its talking about. BTW, that kind of velocity is just plain (plane?) wrong. Escape velocity is 5300mph, so something going that fast would not only achieve orbit, it would go flying into outer space. This is just sloppy research on somebody's part.

 

Your math is wrong.

The acceleration would be 50 mph/sec, which 73.3 ft/sec^2, or 2.28 g.

Also, earth escape velocity is MUCH more than 5300 mph.