Cover Fire ability. Comments?

[lendrick]

Cover Fire (7 CP)

Cover fire allows you to "cover" yourself or an ally by firing shots in such a way that it is difficult for the enemy to concentrate on attacking. The recipient of this ability receives a +4 DCV bonus versus ranged attacks by enemies in your line of sight. While using it, you must attack each phase, and you have a -4 OCV penalty because you are concentrating on distracting the attackers rather than hitting them

+4 DCV, Usable By Other (+1/4), Recipient must be within Limited Range of the Grantor for power to be granted, Recipient must remain within Line of Sight of Grantor (25 Active Points); Limited Power Power loses almost all of its effectiveness (DCV bonus only applies against ranged attacks by enemies within line of sight, and user must attack each phase. Only works with a ranged weapon user is familiar with.; -2), Side Effects, Side Effect occurs automatically whenever Power is used (-4 OCV while using Cover Fire; -1/2)

Comments? Suggestions? I'm trying to come up with some cool manouvers for a gun expert character. Is there some way other than Limited Power to make an ability require an attack?

[Legendsmiths]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

I think at best "Only works with a ranged weapon user is familiar with.; -2)," would be -1/2 as OIF: Guns of Opportunity. I think the Side Effect is fine.

 

This has to be balanced with the good roleplaying of NPCs, that don't want to get hit anyway. Fundamentally, that's what Suppression Fire is for.

[lendrick]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

Perhaps, but the other limitations still would add up:

* It only provides cover against ranged attacks, which I think safely diminishes half of its usefulness right there.

* The fact that it only works against attacks from enemies who are within line of sight might knock that down to a 2/3 limitation.

 

Does that make sense? Also, I'm not sure how to express that the user has to attack in order to activate this power, so I lumped it in with the limitations.

 

Also, I'm not familiar with Guns of Opportunity, but I thought guns were an OAF?

[IndianaJoe3]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

Also' date=' I'm not familiar with Guns of Opportunity, but I thought guns were an OAF?[/quote']

 

If the character only has one gun, it could be an OAF. If he has several (and can use this power with all of them), it would be OIF because it would take longer to disarm him.

[Legendsmiths]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

Only vs. Ranged Attacks would be fine at -1, don't disagree there.

Must be aware of attack is an established limitation at -1/2.

 

"Must attack each phase" - basically is saying that it uses your action, which is more or less equivalent to "Extra Time: Full Phase" at -1/2, so maybe something like:

Only When Combined with an Attack against the affected targets -1/2

 

OIF: X of Opportunity -1/2 is an established convention as well. The idea is that while the gun is technically "A" for accessible, I can draw my backup pistol and still have the power. Thematically/dramatically you can't take the power away from me unless you can deny me access to all X in the area. While sometimes you may be able to control that situation, in general you won't be able to. Therefore, the focus is, in game effect terms, "I" for inaccessible. I might agree to -3/4 since you are restricting it to guns only, but it certainly wouldn't be more than that.

 

So, to be clear, it's not that guns aren't OAF it's that the power isn't limited to a single focus - any gun will do. A "Gun of Opportunity" if you will.

 

Thematically I would also expect some kind of limitation that not only forces an attack, but forces 2 charges or more per attack, or maybe:

DCV bonus is limited by number of shots fired at the target; OCV penalty is the same -1/4

 

So, if I fire 1 shot at the target as covering fire, it's at -1 OCV and Recipient only gets +1 DCV. Fire 2 at -2 OCV, get +2 DCV etc. IMO, 1 bullet does not covering fire make.

 

You might also consider associating the power with the Suppression Fire maneuver instead of an attack. As presented I could perform this power with that maneuver, but if you restricted it to that maneuver that would be an additional limitation.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

The problem I see with such a build is that it is setting specific.

It assumes that all opponents will be concerned about getting hit by bullets.

The sfx boils down to a presence attack of sorts.

Why should it work against superhero bricks or automatons?

Why not just use the Presence Attack rules in combination with the existing autofire skills?

[prestidigitator]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

Hmm. Good point, though you could allow some kind of option for the opponent. Say, allow them to hit the covered target at normal DCV, but only so long as they Brace, effectively setting themself to not be affected by the distracting fire (but halving their DCV, leaving them pretty open to being hit).

[jtelson]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

I'd probably go with Change Environment applying a combat penalty rather than a DCV bonus to everyone crossing the area.

[phookz]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

I like the Change Environment approach. I was thinking maybe a Drain-based Suppress, but using Power Defense doesn't really make sense. Hyper-Man brings up a good point that a brick or automaton might shrug off the bullets - in that case would this really work against them? I think a PRE attack might be the best approach. The GM could provide modifiers for the perceived lethality of the attack against the defender.

[Fireg0lem]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

I agree with Change Environment.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

What if a character had a Disad/Complication about disregarding personal safety?

Why should this ability work against them?

 

I understand the desire to make predictable abilities and the Presence rules are anything but predictable.

But that's how intimidation or 'shock and awe' is in real life too. Sometimes you can deliver 1 good hit

and the enemy won't want to get hit again. Sometimes they won't care.

[Fireg0lem]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

Okay, I decided to write it up. Taking into account Hyper-Man's point, you can choose to just ignore Suppression Fire if you don't care about getting shot, and it just won't work on anyone who can't be hurt by the weapon you're using. I wrote it up to be sure it would work with any gun, but most people can just buy it with Linked to (some Autofire attack). Also, the area of effect is really large in case you want to use it with a machine gun or something, but you probably don't need that much for most characters.

 

Also, apparently Change Environment can't affect CV anymore, so it is a Drain instead to make sure it is legal.

 

Suppression Fire: Drain OCV 6 1/2d6, Standard Effect Rule ((-4 OCV); +0), Attack Versus Alternate Defense (Being Immune to The Gunfire Used; All Or Nothing; +0), Constant (+1/2), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), Area Of Effect (64 2m Areas; +1 1/2) (227 Active Points); One Use At A Time (-1), Must Be Combine Attacked With an Autofire Attack, And Can Only Include Hexes Into Which the Autofire Attack is Fired (-1), Targets May Take Half DCV Against Autofire Attack to Ignore Suppression Fire's Effect (-1/4)

[dmjalund]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

Only logical that Suppression fire uses Suppress

[Matt Holck]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

Suppress OCV 6d6 area of effect

Characters may ignore OCV loss if they are willing to exposes themselves 1/2 DCV to the attack linked to the suppression fire

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

Suppress OCV 6d6 area of effect

Characters may ignore OCV loss if they are willing to exposes themselves 1/2 DCV to the attack linked to the suppression fire

 

Why should a high PRE character suffer the 1/2 DCV?

 

If you're going to try shoe-horning an intimidation based sfx into a different mechanic than Presence then at least acknowledge PRE as a proper defense.

[Matt Holck]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

because the threat of getting hit in a spray of fire is real

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

because the threat of getting hit in a spray of fire is real

 

So you are imposing an effect that is equivalent to being cowered by a Presense attack and giving no reason why having a high PRE would not negate the effect. That makes no sense whatever. And this is gaming, not reality.

[Matt Holck]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

I don't understand the nature of your objection

[Bodkins Odds]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

I think he's saying that if you walk into a wall of hot lead your probably going to get hit by it, regardless of your PRE or whether it would actually hurt you. Hence the 1/2 DCV, which only applies to the autofire attack of the person using suppression fire.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

I think he's saying that if you walk into a wall of hot lead your probably going to get hit by it' date=' regardless of your PRE or whether it would actually hurt you. Hence the 1/2 DCV, which only applies to the autofire attack of the person using suppression fire.[/quote']

 

If you want to build an ability that increases an attacks chance to hit then use the mechanics that actually do increase the chance to hit (CSL's, AOE etc...).

 

Nothing about the described sfx should force a 'fearless' target's DCV to suddenly be halved.

 

Say a player makes a character with the following published Talent:

 

14 Fearless

Notes:

FH (5th) page 106 - Power Defense 20 + Ego Defense 20 (plus EGO/5) Only To Resist Fear (-2).

If the GM then uses a mechanic that reduces that character's combat value based on the sfx of fear and/or intimidation without taking that Talent into consideration the player would be justified in being pissed off.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

For a mechanic to create a wall of hot lead with a firearm see:

Suppression Fire (5er, page 397 & 6e2, page 89)

 

The 6e version expands the description a little and even adds a bit about 'pinning targets down'.

[jtelson]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

For a mechanic to create a wall of hot lead with a firearm see:

Suppression Fire (5er, page 397 & 6e2, page 89)

 

The 6e version expands the description a little and even adds a bit about 'pinning targets down'.

 

I had assumed he was looking for an effect to enhance the suppresion fire maneuver - so a triggered CE or a drain/suppress 'linked' to a suppresion maneuver kind of thing - It should be limited so as not to affect those who would not be put off by either the risk of being shot or the distraction of being hit repeatedly with even ineffective bullets (Cause even if you're immune that's gotta be irksome).

[prestidigitator]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

Suppression Fire requires an Autofire attack (and potentially a very large number of Charges/End to be expended)....

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

Suppression Fire requires an Autofire attack (and potentially a very large number of Charges/End to be expended)....

 

Sure, and characters can buy the ability to use Autofire with non-autofire weapons.

It's the best mechanic to start from.

[phookz]

Re: Cover Fire ability. Comments?

 

Suppression Fire: Drain OCV 6 1/2d6' date=' Standard Effect Rule ((-4 OCV); +0), Attack Versus Alternate Defense (Being Immune to The Gunfire Used; All Or Nothing; +0), Constant (+1/2), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), Area Of Effect (64 2m Areas; +1 1/2) (227 Active Points); One Use At A Time (-1), Must Be Combine Attacked With an Autofire Attack, And Can Only Include Hexes Into Which the Autofire Attack is Fired (-1), Targets May Take Half DCV Against Autofire Attack to Ignore Suppression Fire's Effect (-1/4)[/quote']

 

I'm with Hyper-Man on the issue of creating a fear based attack like this. But I'm more concerned that this boils down to either a -4 OCV or 1/2 DCV against the target. Draining someone's DCV to 1/2 could be VERY expensive for high DCV characters, and this, if allowed, wouldn't even take Power Defense into account.

 

I wouldn't allow a build like this - that 1/2 DCV limitation looks more like an advantage to me.

 

You could go for an AOE Cone Change Environment to increase the range penalty, say 32m on a side (+1/2). Require Suppressive Fire (-1/2), OIF Gun of Opportunity (-1/2). Link it to PRE attack at target's PRE (-1/4). The GM can then adjudicate the PRE attack based on the target. For the Fearless character, you're going to have a very tough time scaring them. For characters with extremely high defenses relative to the attack, the GM can apply modifiers as he/she sees fit; Superman is not going to be impressed by a .22 cal Suppression Fire:

5 Cover Fire: Change Environment (+4 to Range Penalty), Area Of Effect Nonselective (32m Cone; +1/2) (18 Active Points); Limited Power Power loses about half of its effectiveness (Requires Suppression Fire Maneuver; -1), OIF (Gun of Opportunity; -1/2), Limited Power Power loses about a third of its effectiveness (Requires Successful PRE attack at Target's PRE level; -1/2), Side Effects, Side Effect occurs automatically whenever Power is used (-2 OCV; -1/2)

 

Note: The current build of Hero Designer (build 20100617) has the cost for Range Modifier incorrect - it has it at 5 pts per level instead of 3. A bug has already been posted and it should be fixed on the next release. The example above uses the 3 pt per level from 6E1 p175.