Powerhouse

Re: [RPG.Net Article] The Birth Of The Superhero Game Rep to Ghost Angel for the great find!

Re: CHAR: Doctor Atomic The problem is, with only 40/40 defense, its not that hard to ping him to death. For example, all it takes is four 20d6 hits to KO him, sans recoveries. . . or more importantly, about ten hits with 15DC attacks. So unless you want Dr Atomic hosed if he faces a bunch of vehicles at once hosing him with 30mm cannons or the equivalent in ray guns. . . Some good points have been made to be sure, In part, it depends on how powerful he should be treated as and how powerful are his enemies. If his own attackers are 20DC (and I have since increased to about 25 DC but just looking at the original at this moment), should 4 be enough to KO him, i.e. someone at his power level? Or is that out of character for such this concept? ( especially since his DCV is only 9 ) Assuming that he doesn't use his speed to dodge but yeah, Silver Age Superman doesn't dodge- he stands there and takes it... probably yawning while he's at it because he's THAT DARN TOUGH! And I think that is what you are getting at- how tough should this man of uranium be? I think it's also what is in your mind when you think "Silver Age Superman" and for me in part is that's Doctor Atomic is clearly the most powerful hero in the world and he does those wierd things that break the laws of physics. He doesn't juggle planets but he does lift mountains and takes the hits that makes even fellow heroes wonder "how can he still be standing...." So, do you think that adding the 50% damage reduction is enough? It would certainly extend his stamina and with his other defenses, and high con, he'd be almost impossible to con stun. I just won't want him to be SO powerful that no one can face him, period. Otherwise, his enemies are so powerful that (at least some, others simply use their brains) that no other hero can even come close. In the end, definitely some great points and some considerations are there. I wonder if it might not be a bad idea to add the damage reduction but drop the con to 50 (so that he isn't impossible to con stun if the attack is REALLY powerful) but also boost the STUN and Endurance to match what he has now or even a little higher. Again, not trying to be critical at all since you made some great points. Thanks again.

Re: CHAR: Doctor Atomic Is 40PD/ED really that fragile? That said, it IS a character who is a Silver Age Superman (although even that can be a bit of a moving target). This said, and nothing that his defenses do not do much against special attacks, I added in his latest build 50% physical and energy DMG reduction (resistant). I also boosted his strength to 120 or 125 and active powers to 125 I think. Heck, that might not even be enough! I guess it depends also on the power levelsd of everyone else. At this point in time, the other characters I think will be about 750 pts so I don't want Doctor Atomic to COMPLETELY overwhelm them... or would that be appropriate? Hmm... Right now, the way it works, for my silver age team, is: 1. beginning of silver age: everyone at 350 pts 2. end of silver age: Doctor Atomic at around 1600 pts (everyone else would be around 650 I guess but no one else I statted for this period) 3. Bronze age: Doctor Atomic around 800-900 pts, everyone else at 750 pts. And as always, thank you everyone for responding and I look foward to more. Edit: regarding power levels, for me at least, the strongest person is the modern era of my world clocks in at around 80-85 str (like Tyr or Doctor Atomic if he shows up) although a few monster types (or the Hulk analog) are at 90-95. 100 str is kinda my bench mark for unattainable strength unless you're a cosmic deity. I got it from the Champion stats where Grond maxes out at 90 (although the new Ripper can hit 100 briefly) and anyone at 70 str or above just seems in the elite levels.

Re: You against Them: Battle of the Superheroes! I'd need some time to figure out how they would all go. I will go ahead with a list and it just makes me kinda sad that I'm so unoriginal that close matches are so easy to come by: 1. Lady Silver vs Doctor Strange or Clea 2. Nova vs Starfire 3. Starknight vs Green Lantern (Guy Gardner if only for the conversation between the two of them) 4. Tyr, Norse god of justice and ware vs Thor, Norse god of storms 5. Sentinel vs Captain America 6. Titan vs Iron Man 7. Speed Demon vs Flash or Quicksilver

Re: Maxim's Hottest Comic Females Not a bad list (I loved the comments on Black Cat) but I'm surprised that they didn't have more mainstream choices like Catwoman, Batgirl, Rogue, and Supergirl. No Starfire... THAT'S just a CRIME!

Well, it's been a tough couple of years but with new organization, increased resources, and the decision to be more pro-active, the heroes of the Champion Universe have performed a MASSIVE clean-up. Doctor Destroyer: passed away from a heart attack (dude was plenty old) and the body was confirmed down to the DNA and dental records. VIPER: the Supreme Serpent was captured after UNTIL and PRIMUS found the main nest. Other nests are still out there but they are fractured, disorganized, and fighting among themselves for resources, and the right to be considered the true VIPER. DEMON: according to Lady Silver (my character) and her Wards, the problem has been taken care of- i.e. the head guy was slain. Warlord: slain in combat by US forces when he tried to set up his own little kingdom in Iraq. Eurostar: most of the members, including Fiacho, were captured after a bloody battle between them, UNTIL's team, and Euroguard. and on and on. There are villians still out there of course: no knows where Menton or Telios are, the Ultimates are still causing problems, etc... but alot of the heavyweights and uber dangerous criminals are either dead or incarcerated. Speaking of being imprisoned, most supervillians are now imprisoned in Stronghold 2.0 and it (so far) seems very secure (and for the amount of money put into it, it had BETTER be!). From a mystical note, Skarn, Tyrannon, and the empress of a billion dimensions have settled into a cold war and are too busy to deal with Earth right now. Also, Skarn has a treaty of sorts with Earth (it's a long story) where he's hands off. So, with things so quiet that your heroes are being called in less and less to deal with the big supervillian threats, WWYCD?

Re: CHAR: Doctor Atomic Nice idea Arkham, thanks. I played with the character little more and right now it goes like: Early Silver Age: 350 pts Late Silver Age: 1650 pts! Bronze Age (after getting depowered and the writers decided to make him a little more "down to earth"- 900 pts and hoping to drop a little more. It's definitely an interesting exercise since I am trying to make him look at least a little bit grown organically as many experienced characters are. As many know, often a 350pt + 300 exp character can look much different from a character built with 650 initial points. The GREAT thing is that I think I've finally nailed the backstories and personalites of Doctor Atomic, Crimson Archer (my Batman/Green Arrow/Hawkeye homage) and Athena (Wonder Woman/Captain Marvel/Thor). It's a GREAT deal of fun and I hope to get it all together finally for a thread presenting the team not only in their early incarnations but also their high powered (700-800 pt) Bronze Age varieties. Thanks everyone for reading so far and please make comments and suggestions. Thank you!

Re: CHAR: Doctor Atomic Regarding the above: 1. Power level- I'm thinking about bumping him up to 120 pt str and MP. It seems REALLY high (especially if everyone else is around 750 pts) but Pre-Crisis Superman was pretty obscenely overpowered. 2. The Atomic Tricks VPP is pretty much a plot device power. Superman used to (and still does) some pretty far out things like dispersing tornadoes by flying around them in a counter direction, create diamonds with his bare hands, tunnel down through the earth, etc. This VPP is intended to replicate those tricks as the writer uses Doctor Atomic's existing powers in new ways. So he COULD disperse a tornado with his flight but the maximum active point would be based on the inches of flight that he could use. His transform from coal to a diamond (even assuming that he doesn't use his other transform powers) would go as high as his strength, etc. 3. The atomic fission power is great for protecting his secret ID (no Doctor Atomic robots, sorry) and also is used to later depower him (basically his fissioned half becomes the Anti-Doctor Atomic and is destroyed. But it leaves him with half his powers. That, along with some judicious pruning, gets him down in points as the writers make the character easier to challenge just as the Superman writers did in the late 70's. I don't like how it's written up though. The endurance per phase is just too high. Someone had suggested this: Wouldn't this be Costs Endurance (-1/2; Costs End during entire time); 1 CC (5 minutes = -3/4; or 20 minues = -1/2)? [same total limitation, just using the rules that are already there] It sounds great but my heromaker software won't reproduce that. Any ideas? Thank you everyone for you time and input.

Re: CHAR: Doctor Atomic Player: Val Char Cost 100 STR 90 26 DEX 48 60 CON 100 40 BODY 60 23 INT 13 25 EGO 30 30 PRE 20 14 COM 2 40 PD 20 40 ED 28 8 SPD 24 32 REC 0 120 END 0 120 STUN 0 6" RUN 0 2" SWIM 0 20" LEAP 0 Characteristics Cost: 435 Cost Power 100 Atomic Powers: Multipower, 100-point reserve 10u 1) Atomic Blast: Energy Blast 20d6 (100 Active Points) 10u 2) Atomic Blast II: Energy Blast 16d6, Reduced Endurance (1/2 END; +1/4) (100 Active Points) 10u 3) Atomic Blast III: Energy Blast 10d6, Area Of Effect (5" Radius; +1) (100 Active Points) 10u 4) Atomic Drain: Drain CON 6 1/2d6, Ranged (+1/2) (97 Active Points) 10u 5) Atomic Field: Drain CON 5d6, Area Of Effect (5" Radius; +1) (100 Active Points) 10u 6) Atomic Shield: Drain CON 3d6+1, Damage Shield (+1/2), Area Of Effect (One Hex; +1/2), Continuous (+1) (99 Active Points) 5u 7) Atomic Powered Punch: Energy Blast 11d6+1, Hole In The Middle (+1/4), Explosion (Cone; -1 DC/2"; +1/2) (100 Active Points); No Range (-1/2), Limited Power Power loses about a fourth of its effectiveness (Only affects grounded targets; -1/4), Gestures (Must punch ground; -1/4) 7u 8) Induce Radioactivity: Major Transform 5d6+1, Improved Target Group (Any radioactive material; +1/4) (100 Active Points); Requires A Science Skill: Nuclear Physics Roll (-1/2) 7u 9) Transmutation: Major Transform 3d6+1, Improved Target Group (One element into another; +1) (100 Active Points); Requires A Power Skill Roll: Atomic Tricks (-1/2) 4u 10) Atomic Powering: Succor END 20d6 (100 Active Points); Limited Power Power loses about two-thirds of its effectiveness (Only to nuclear powered devices; -1 1/2) 100 Atomic Flight: Multipower, 100-point reserve 10u 1) Atomic Flight: Flight 50" (100 Active Points) 9u 2) Atomic Flight Crusing Speed: Flight 30", Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (90 Active Points) 2u 3) Atomic Flight Overdrive: Flight 10", MegaScale (1" = 1 km; +1/4) (25 Active Points) 5u 4) Atomic Powered FTL: Faster-Than-Light Travel (2 Light Years/minute) (50 Active Points) 50 Atomic Phasing: Desolidification (affected by Magic, argonite, lead), Costs END Only To Activate (+1/4) (50 Active Points) 13 Atomic Powered Speed: +2 SPD (20 Active Points); Costs Endurance (-1/2) 98 Atomic Fission: Duplication (creates 1349-point form) (270 Active Points); Side Effects, Side Effect occurs automatically whenever Power is used (loses 25 active points from strength, Atomic Powers MP, AND Atomic Tricks VPP; -1), Costs Endurance (-1/2), Extra Time (Full Phase, Only to Activate, -1/4) 150 Atomic Tricks: Variable Power Pool, 100 base + 50 control cost, Powers Can Be Changed As A Zero-Phase Action (+1) (200 Active Points); Limited Power (Can not be used to augment existing powers; -1/2), Limited Effect (must has a puesdo-scientific explanation based on Doctor Atomic's powers; -1/4), Limited Power (Maximum active points based on power Doctor Atomic uses to create effect; -1/4) 40 Atomic Hardened Skin: Damage Resistance (40 PD/40 ED) 20 Atomic Hardened Skin: PD and ED Hardened (20 Active Points) 10 Atomic Hardened Skin: Lack Of Weakness (-10) for Normal Defense 30 Radiation Resistance: Energy Damage Reduction, Resistant, 75%, Limited Power Not against Argonite (+0) (60 Active Points); Limited Power Only against Radiation (-1) 22 Atomic Powered Physiology: Life Support (Eating: Character does not eat; Safe in High Pressure; Safe in High Radiation; Safe in Intense Cold; Safe in Intense Heat; Safe in Low Pressure/Vacuum; Self-Contained Breathing) 15 Radiation Resistance: Power Defense (30 points) (30 Active Points); Limited Power Only against radiation attacks (-1) 18 Radiation Sense: Detect A Single Thing 14- (no Sense Group), Discriminatory, Analyze, Range Powers Cost: 775 Cost Skill 3 Computer Programming 14- 3 Conversation 15- 3 Criminology 14- 3 Electronics 14- 3 KS: Superhuman World 14- 2 Navigation (Space) 14- 3 Oratory 15- 3 Paramedics 14- 3 Persuasion 15- 3 Tactics 14- 21 Power 20- 3 Teamwork 14- 3 Scientist 3 1) SS: Nuclear Physics 15- (4 Active Points) 2 2) SS: Physics 14- (3 Active Points) 2 3) SS: SubATomic Physics 14- (3 Active Points) 9 +3 punch, grab, or haymaker 12 +4 with Atomic Powers Skills Cost: 84 Cost Perk 12 Reputation: Popular Superhero (A large group) 14-, +4/+4d6 3 Well-Connected 25 5 Fringe Benefit: International Police Powers 5 Fringe Benefit: Membership: Sentinels of Justice 80 Vehicles & Bases Perks Cost: 130 Cost Talent 3 Lightning Calculator 20 Universal Translator 14- Talents Cost: 23 Total Character Cost: 1447 Pts. Disadvantage 25 Susceptibility: Argonite, 3d6 damage per Phase (Uncommon) 20 Psychological Limitation: Code vs Killing (Common, Total) 20 Psychological Limitation: Code of the Hero (Very Common, Strong) 10 Psychological Limitation: Tries to outthink normal opponents rather than hurt them (Common, Moderate) 15 Hunted: The Mad Doctor Murdock 8- (As Pow, NCI, Harshly Punish) 10 Hunted: Nuclear Nightmare 8- (As Pow, Harshly Punish) 10 Hunted: Rogue's Gallery 8- (As Pow, Harshly Punish) 10 Dependent NPC: Scientist Girlfriend 11- (Normal; Useful Noncombat Position or Skills) 15 Social Limitation: Secret ID (Frequently, Major) 15 Reputation: Heroic Superhero who will help anyone, 14- Disadvantage Points: 150 Base Points: 200 Experience Required: 1097 Total Experience Available: 1097 Experience Unspent: 0

Hello everyone. As you may or may not remember, I've always wanted to finish up my homage to Silver Age teams. I decided to get started back up and get it done already Most of the characters will have two forms: the 350 pt beginning Silver Age and the end of the Bronze Age 750 pt form. My Superman homage, Doctor Atomic, though will have another form, the late Silver Age 1450 pt to represent a take on a Pre-Crisis Superman. I'm posting a very rough draft of the character sheet followed by some comments. Please feel free to peruse and make suggestions. Thank you.

Re: Top 10 Action Hero One-Liners Great one liners so far. How about: "Stick around" - Predator (Arnie after he pins a terrorist to a pole with a thrown knife. "You ain't scared of no man!" "Sometimes out there, and it ain't no man." *walks away casually* "We're all going to die." - also from Predator "I'm not left-handed" followed later one by: "I'm not left-handed either." Princess Bride "I swear to God-" "SWEAR TO ME!" Batman Begins

Re: When did [Title X] Jumping the Shark Then Bob Harras took over and things got worse. Everyone started wearing flak jackets with too many pockets (not that I'm blaming Harras, I know it was editorial) and we end up with the "Crossing". It was during this time that we get the young Tony Stark and Force Works too. Some very unreadable comics. I'll be honest in that I really liked that Avengers run. While I tend to be of the old school that you need Captain America, Iron Man, and Thor (along with stalwarts like the Vision, Scarlet Witch, and Hawkeye), that team really worked IMHO. I think it was because the team became more character oriented and you could take more chances with that cast as opposed to the more iconic characters. The team at the time was: 1. Black Widow (leader) 2. Hercules (partway through he lost some of his divine power so that he was at half strength) 3. Vision 4. Crystal 5. Black Knight (deputy leader) 6. Sersi (IMHO, one of the best new Avengers in years) 7. Deathcry (a Shi'ar warrior very much in the style of Image/Xmen but later revealed to have much greater depth). 8. Quicksilver (part time) 9. Captain America (more of a reserve) Not all top guns admittedly but the team managed to do very well and tell a rather emotional and compelling story that would have been more difficult with the icons since the icons are somewhat untouchable in team books. There were many little touches like the love triangle between Crystal, Black Knight, and Sersi (with Quicksilver in a supporting role), the Vision regaining his humanity, Hercules dealing with his mortality and starting to fall in love with Deathcry. It wasn't typical Avengers (in fact, it felt a little bit like an X-title) but it was a nice change of pace with a touching ending where Sersi became incredibly powerful but was losing her sanity and Black Knight (despite falling in love with Crystal), left this world with Sersi because he lover her as well and needed him more. The "Crossing" stuff that came a bit later (like the insect Wasp and young Tony Stark) did stink though and made me stop reading.

Re: Your Character's Room at the Base Great thread. Unfortunately, I need to spread some rep... *sigh* Most of the Knights have dual residences- the apartment at the base and another home somewhere else. Only Nova I think didn't have a place and it was big storyline when she DID get her own place. I'll do some thinking for how the various apartments would look - it's so hard to keep so many character in my head.

Re: When did [Title X] Jumping the Shark You have GOT to be kidding me... You DID read everything starting with Identity Crisis up through Infinite Crisis, didn't you? The only reason that extended storyline doesn't rank as the all-time greatest crapfest in the history of comics is that Civil War is the category-killer. With respect, I disagree. While I did not like some things of Identity Crisis (Sue's rape and death really turned my stomach), in the end the heroes realized that they had gone too far, lost touch with their heroism, and resolved to be better heroes. It looked to undo some of the grim and gritty excesses. By contrast, CW completely disregarded past characterization, set hero against hero, ignored any type of logic, and had Iron Man, a once great hero, sell his soul many times over with one henious act after another. And in the end, we get a darker world where most of the "heroes" are goose-steppers.

Re: The Magnum Mage Caliburn's great destiny is NOT to get the next Archmage, That's MY character, Lady Silver! "Who am I who would stand against you? I am heir to Thanoro Azoic's office, wielder of Luathon's Lights, and defender of this realm. I am Earth's Archmage and *you*, foul creature, are not welcomed here!" Lady Silver responding to Tyrannon

Re: When did [Title X] Jumping the Shark Interesting that most of the titles so far have been Marvel ones. There you have guys like Millar and Bendis tearing down heroes while over at DC, you have Geoff Jones, Mark Waid, and Kurt Busiek who are hardcore comic geeks (and that's a GOOD thing) who love their heroes.

Re: When did [Title X] Jumping the Shark Marvel in general jumped the shark when it launched Civil War. Avengers jumped the shark when "Avengers Disassembled" occured. New Xmen jumped the shark when it became a snuff film in the House of M nonsense. Xmen in general jumped the shark after House of M but it's been in trouble for years with too many titles and constant/abrupt changes.

Re: WWYCD: We hope you're feeling better now Great scenario, I need to rep. (edit: darn, I need to spread more rep around. Sorry!) Based on this: (Oddly, your knowledge gained remains accurate. If your character knew of Arcadia, he still does. He/she may know the secret IDs of other crime fighters (Though they will wonder who you are and how you found out) and so on) It looks like the whole world has changed... assuming that my characters really WERE supers at one point! Lady Silver: would be very convinced that it was some type of trick. When she couldn't use her magic though, something that comes almost as second nature as breathing, she would be in real shock. There probably isn't too much that could stop her from casting that she wouldn't be aware of or be able to detect. Yet *something* is stopping her because she does have her powers... right? This could definitely be fun as family (either dead or in another dimension) come to visit her as normal. "Amanda, we love you so much and we just want you to be better." "But somethings not right! They took my powers!" "*sigh* I knew that occult phase would have terrible consequences." Heck, it would be positively heartwrenching as if her first fiancee showed up alive- she would WANT to believe in it. She'd be caught up between believing her memories and lure of her family. She'd tried meditating as much as possible to see if she could figure out what was blocking her spellcasting but try to hide it so that the staff didn't see it. Eventually, I think that she would decided that either the world has been changed by some powerful magic and she needs to figure out what it is and how to confront it (and gain her powers back to do so) or she really is crazy. With those two scenarios, it's better to assume the former rather than ignore the threat to the world. If she's really IS crazy, well then the only person who gets hurt is herself. Better that than the whole world and the people she loves. Question: would she be able to leave the hospital at all? If so, it would be interesting to see what happens if she tries to visit various mystics who should know her yet don't. Or is this more localized to the hospital and visitors? Starknight: no way, no sir, no ****ing how! She's a superhero, case closed. This is a trick and once she figures it out, she's going to bust some heads! Definitely interesting since the onset of her powers was a real emotional liberation that helped her shed her repressed nature and instead started living life! She'll crawl, bite, and scratch her way to where she's spposed to be. Possible scenario: try to seduce some guard to undo her straightjacket in return for some "favors" only to knock him out and escape. Works better of course if she remembers and is able to execute her combat training. Then it's escape to the outside world and start figuring out what happened. Nova: another interesting case since she's an alien. I suppose in this case, she would appear human and her family (originally killed when her planet was obliterated) are alive and human. Her alien memories become nothing more than childhood fantasies that she developed after reading too much sci-fi. The kicker is that Doctor Ann Kincaid looks just like Lady Silver (Nova's best friend and someone who Nova is in love with). All of these together I think would lead her to accept this new life and actually be relieved that it was her tragic past was just a delusion.

Re: Signature Request *CW #7 SPOILERS* The problem isn't Captain America #25. The problem is everything surrounding it. Good point. Captain America #25 itself was well written and Bru has always treated Cap well. It's the crap that was Civil War and the mandate (I assume it wasn't Bru's desire) to whack Cap from the editors that is creating all of this nonsense.

Re: Cap is dead!!!! Hi everyone. Like most posters, I was shocked, dismayed, and angered by the assassination of Captain America. In hindisight though, I shouldn't be surprised given how he was treated in Civil War. Just renewing my request for everyone who posts here to place in this sig: CAPTAIN AMERICA LIVES! If at least in our hearts where we hold his ideals of freedom, courage, and fighting for what you believe in, Steve Rogers aka the REAL Captain America lives on. Wow, looking at my sig, I had no idea how prophetic it would be.

Re: Signature Request *CW #7 SPOILERS* Bumping this thread after the TRAVESTY that is Captain America 25. I can't even say anything else right now...

Re: CHAR: Black Panther Better give him Seduction - he nailed Storm!

Re: CHAR: Thundra Great post. Just a quibble or two that depends on where you place your other characters' strength. If Thor is a 100-120, her strength is fine. I'd put her at 5-10 pts below the Thing (I understand that she's only 25 tons less compared to Ben and that in Hero STR scales geometrically but I think that sets her at about the right power level). What she lacks in strength she more than makes up for in martial arts, skill, and speed. With a 40 con, 30PD/ED *and* 50% DMG reduction she might be a little too tough to hurt/stun. You might want to drop the PD/ED to 20 or the DMG reduction to 25%. She's pretty savvy in combat so an int boost to at least 13 and more tactics would be a great idea. Finally, while she is mostly a HTH fighter, you might want to reduce her HTH to +4 levels and add +2 combat levels to represent general combat training and expand her already considerable abilities in combat. To be honest, mostly quibble and again a great job.

Re: List of Forum Members - Super Teams & Members Cool topic! I meant to post this myself. Silver Knights: greatest team of the modern era (Formerly Washington DC, now New York) Listed in order of joining: Founder 1: Lady Silver: white mage Founder 2: Nova: alien energy blaster with a bad temper Founder 3: Titan: African prince, genius inventor, and creator of the TITAN armored battle suit Founder 4: Star Knight: alien empowered knight errant Founder 5: Tyr: Norse god of truth, justice, and war Member 6: Sentinel: special forces operative assigned by the US government Member 7: Speed Demon: superhumanly fast actor Member 8: Templar: yet ANOTHER alient empowered knight errant Member 9: Lodestone: master of magnetism Member 10: Dolphin: undersea biologist who capable of studying her subjects in their own native environment *Event: Extinction Agenda* First Major team reorganization Member 11: Iron Maiden: reformed mutant terrorist transformed into steel Member 12: El Aquilla: Hispanic martial artist from the street determined to make the world one worth saving one block at a time Member 13: Psi Blade: fugitive from PSI, able to conjure weapons of pure psychic energy which he uses with deadly efficiency yet is sworn to never kill again. Member 14: Not currently named - angel-like character *Holocaust Affair* Second Major team reorganization Member 15: Nightshade: deadly elven assassin from another world

Re: Signature Request *CW #7 SPOILERS* Just posting to thank everyone for their responses so far, especially the ones who made the sig change. I would ask that we be careful in how close we veer towards NGD even as I admit that it can be tough to do so given the blatant and ham-handed allegory of CW. I just can't stand how the characters were written in ways that defied logic, thier known personalities, and histories to pull off this, as one poster noted, a rail roaded plot. Everyone keep the faith, keep 'em flying, and Stars and Stripes Forever!