Killer Shrike

Please provide me with a link: I'm very interested in finding out more about this. My (oft-quoted) personal stance on d20 after running a year long campaign from 1st to 16th level and playing in a campaing from 1st to 15th level has been that it really starts to fall apart at 12th level and gets worse from there on. I'd love to get some corroboration that this isnt just my perception, but is perhaps based on something more concrete (such as no play testing beyond 11th level was performed)........

Wow. How old are you anyway?

From the FAQ: Damage Resistance Q: If a character makes his Damage Resistance Hardened, but does not Harden the PD or ED the Damage Resistance applies to, what effect does that have? A: None whatsoever. The Advantages on the base PD/ED and the Damage Resistance have to match. Furthermore, as noted elsewhere in the Rules FAQ, partially Hardened defenses have no effect. Damage Resistance is not a separate defense from natural PD/ED, generally speaking, and so Hardening it without Hardening the underlying PD/ED accomplishes nothing.

From the FAQ: Hardened Q: If a character buys Hardened for his normal PD and ED, does he calculate the cost based on just the points he paid for the Characteristic, or the value of the PD/ED Characteristic? A: You calculate it on the value of the Characteristic. For example, if you wanted to buy Hardened (+1/4) on 20 PD (which cost you, say, 16 Character Points), you pay 4 Character Points (16 x (1 + 1/4) - 16). Q: What do I do if I have a character with some Hardened defenses, and some non-Hardened defenses, and someone hits him with a Penetrating attack? For example, Pulsar has PD 10 and a Force Field (10 PD/10 ED), Hardened. What happens when he’s hit with a Penetrating attack? A: The first thing to consider are the special effects of the defenses. If the Hardened defenses are worn “over†the non-Hardened defenses — as is probably the case with most force fields and powered armor suits — then it would seem reasonable to apply the Hardened defenses normally to counteract the Penetrating. (Of course, don’t forget the rule regarding Ablative — Ablative defenses are always “on top.†That may affect the situation.) If you think this could become potentially abusive (because it would cause characters to buy small amounts of Hardened defenses “over†their non-Hardened defenses just to obtain this benefit), establish a more restrictive guideline. For example: if the DCs of the Penetrating attack exceed the number of points of a layered Hardened defense, the Hardened won’t counteract the Penetrating. In the above example, an 11d6 (or greater) Penetrating attack would ignore the Hardened, allowing Penetrating to have its usual effect. If that particular standard doesn’t work for you, it shouldn’t be too hard to come up with one that does. Q: What happens if a character has a partially-Hardened defense (say, a Force Field [12 PD/12 ED], 6 points of which are Hardened) and is hit with a Penetrating attack — does the defense counteract the Penetrating effect altogether? A: The rules default is that a character cannot have partially Hardened defenses. A given defense must be all Hardened, or it’s not Hardened at all. (There may also be issues with the “layering†of defenses, as discussed in the question above.) Q: Does the Hardened Advantage stop the Increased STUN Multiplier Advantage? A: No. Hardened has no effect on Increased STUN Multiplier.

Re: Multiform vs OIHID Could you post the link please, Ive been looking for something on the subject myself lately. Also I could have sworn I read a paragraph or two discussing it in one of the new products, but now I cant find it and am beginning to wonder if Im going crazy.....anyone know of anything 'official' on the subject and where I can find it?

Just dont buy the skill at all. Take KS: Gardening (or whatever) instead to show that you KNOW all about it, but dont actually have the applicable practical application skill to DO it. Like most sports commentators for example. If you want to be acutally SUCKTACULAR (as opposed to just not good) at it if you do try to perform the act, then just play it off as character flavor or at most take a PsyLim to reflect your characters hangup about it. Actually, if your character were supposed to be renowned for thier skill at it but in reality werent any good at it, then perhaps you could take a Social Lim similar to (but less than) Secret ID. If the word got out that he was a hack instead of an adept, his reputation would be ruined, and he would become a laughingstock....

Nice try, do-gooder. You can maintain your elaborate charade if you wish, but we are well aware that it was all a plot to insinuate your leader Defender into our midst by the expedient of having us capture him. It was all too pat, you see, and the fact that all the help-staff had been sent away for the day tipped your hand. Defender, sadly for you, of course broke under our focused questioning and admitted to the nefarious ruse. He cried most piteously as we cast his pathetic armor into the Marrianas trench, but even more so when we amputated his hands and feet. A lesson for you then "hero", we may be EVIL, but that doesnt mean we are STUPID. Mwah-ha-ha-ha! Disrespectully, Giles

Curses, Mattingly is one step ahead of me again! Uh...yes, yes of course I thought of that, but, um...decided not to do that because.....um....hey, look at the time; gotta go.... Ahem. Well, we just finished the 1st session, and though John Wrath did not get to use all of his skills and abilities, the Hovercar sure came in handy Will eyeball the character again to assess the feasability of this brilliant suggestion..... All that aside however, what do you guys think of John Wrath as printed above?

The HOVERCar PRIMUS Hovercar Player: Val Char Cost 20 STR -5 20 DEX 30 13 BODY 0 4 SPD 10 25" RUN380" SWIM-20" LEAP0Characteristics Cost: 104 Cost Power END 54 Anti-Gravitic Generator and Hover-JETS: Flight 15" (Improved Noncombat Movement (x16)), 2 Continuing Fuel Charges lasting 1 Hour each (+1/4), Fuel is Difficult to obtain (-1/4), Sideways Manueverability (+1/2) (67 Active Points); Only In Heroic Identity (-1/4) [Notes: To use this power, the car goes through some physical alterations, the tires flip down, stabilizer wings and flaps extend, and the jets pop out from concealed hatches in flanks of the car.] Comm Suite, all slots: OIF (-1/2), Restrainable by Jamming; Interference (Only by means other than Grabs and Entangles -1/4) 5 1) Radio Perception/Transmission (10 Active Points); Sense Affected As More Than One Sense (Hearing and Radio) (-1/4) 11 2) Radar (Increased Arc of Perception: 360-Degree) (20 Active Points) 5 Spotlight: Sight Group Images, x2" Radius (+1/4), Conforming (+1/2) (17 Active Points); Only To Create Light (-1), IIF Bulky Fragile (-1), Limited Arc of Fire (60 Degrees; -1/2) [Notes: The headlights of the car have a 'spotlight' setting. The lamps are on pivots allowing a small amount of lateral and horizontal movement, similar to a rearview mirror.] 2 6 Tractor Beam: Suppress Running 4d6 (20 Active Points); IIF Bulky (-3/4), 3 Continuing Charges lasting 1 Turn each (-3/4), Limited Arc of Fire (60 Degrees; -1/2), Only In Heroic Identity (-1/4) [Notes: This device is contained under the car, and can thus only be used while the car is flying and off the ground.] Powers Cost: 81 Cost Skill 6 +2 Combat Driving, Combat Piloting Skills Cost: 6 Cost Talent 3 Absolute Range Sense 3 Absolute Time Sense 3 Bump Of Direction Talents Cost: 9 Total Character Cost: 200 Val Disadvantages 10 PRIMUS Hover Car, Concealable, Noticed and Recognizable, Detectable By Commonly-Used Senses 6 Vulnerability: Telekinesis, Uncommon, Only when flying, Vulnerability Multiplier (2x Effect) 13 Susceptibility: Gravitic Fields, Uncommon, 1d6 damage, per Segment, Only when flying 15 Reputation: Vehicle used by top PRIMUS Agents (criminals will hide or attack), Almost Always (14-) 5 Accidental Change: From Fly Mode to Drive Mode: Encounter abnormal gravitic field or electical interference, Uncommon, Infrequently (8-) 5 Dependence: Requires regular tune-ups, Difficult To Obtain, -30 Active Points from Affected Power, 1 Week 5 Physical Limitation: Requires special technicians to repair, Infrequently, Slightly Impairing Disadvantage Points: 59 Base Points: 140 Experience Required: 1 Total Experience Available: 1 Experience Unspent: 0

Heres a pic

Jon Wrath, Agent of PRIMUS OK, I got ruthless and cut John Wrath down to 375, which is much closer to the ballpark. I had to chop a lot of flavor as well as hamper his cyberline powers. Here he is in his diminshed state: John Wrath, Agent of PRIMUS Player: Jon Bristow Val Char Cost 15/30 STR 5 15/25 DEX 15 15/20 CON 10 15/20 BODY 10 18 INT 8 15 EGO 10 15 PRE 5 10 COM 0 5/20 PD 2 5/18 ED 2 3/4 SPD 5 6/10 REC 0 30/40 END 0 34/50 STUN 3 6"/12" RUN02" SWIM01"/4" LEAP-2Characteristics Cost: 73 Cost Power END 1 Life Support (Longevity: 200 Years) 5 Regeneration: Healing 1 BODY, Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), Persistent (+1/2) (20 Active Points); Extra Time (Regeneration-Only) (1 Hour; -2 1/4), Self Only (-1/2) [Notes: No Healing Max (see FREd p. 120).] Cyberline Powers, all slots: Drained as an EC (Power loses about a fourth of its effectiveness; -1/4), 4 Continuing Charges lasting 1 Minute each (-1/4) 10 1) +15 STR (15 Active Points) (added to Secondary Value) 20 2) +10 DEX (30 Active Points) (added to Secondary Value) 7 3) +5 CON (10 Active Points) (added to Secondary Value) 7 4) +5 BODY (10 Active Points) (added to Secondary Value) 7 5) Running +6" (12 Active Points); No Noncombat Movement (-1/4) (added to Secondary Value) 7 6) +1 Overall (10 Active Points) 7 7) +2 with HTH Combat (10 Active Points) 12 8) Combat Luck: 9 PD/9 ED (18 Active Points) 45 PRIMUS Special Agent Field-Test Equipment: VPP, 41 base + 4 control cost (62 Active Points); Activation Roll 14-, Jammed (-1), VPP Powers Can Be Changed Only In Given Circumstance (-1/2), VPP Can Only Be Changed Between Adventures (-1/2), Limited Class Of Powers Available (Limited; -1/2), Character Has No Choice Regarding How Powers Change (-1/2), OIF (-1/2) 0 1) Cyber Eye: (Total: 40 Active Cost, 15 Real Cost) Find Weakness 14- (Related Group of Attacks) (35 Active Points); Activation Roll 14-, Jammed (-1), OIF (-1/2), Visible (-1/4) (Real Cost: 13) plus Nightvision (5 Active Points); Activation Roll 14-, Jammed (-1), OIF (-1/2), Visible (-1/4) (Real Cost: 2) Real Cost: 15 0 2) Energy Pistol: Energy Blast 4d6 (vs. ED), Variable Advantage (+1/2 Advantages Limited Group of Advantages (AP,Autofire x5, Penetrating, Explosion); +3/4) (35 Active Points); Activation Roll 14-, Jammed (-1), OIF (-1/2), 16 Clips of 8 Charges which Recover every 1 Week (-1/2), No Knockback (-1/4), Real Weapon (-1/4), Cannot Be Used With Multiple-Power Attacks (-1/4), Beam (-1/4) Real Cost: 9 0 3) Omni-Belt: Force Field (7 PD / 7 ED / 7 Mental Defense / 7 Power Defense / 2 Flash Defense: Sight Group) (30 Active Points); Activation Roll 14-, Jammed (-1), 4 Continuing Charges lasting 1 Minute each which Recover every 1 Week (-3/4), Extra Time, Only to Activate Constant or Persistent Power (Full Phase; -1/4), Character May Take No Other Actions (-1/4), OIF (-1/2) (not added to totals) Real Cost: 8 0 4) Haze Grenade: Darkness to Sight Group 3" radius (Additional Sense: Radar, Additional Sense: Spatial Awareness) (40 Active Points); Activation Roll 11- (-1), 1 Continuing Charges lasting 1 Minute each (-1), Extra Time, Only to Activate Constant or Persistent Power (Full Phase; -1/4), Character May Take No Other Actions (-1/4), Can Be Missile Deflected (-1/4), Strength Based Range (-1/4), Cannot Be Used With Multiple-Power Attacks (-1/4) Real Cost: 9 Powers Cost: 128 Cost Martial Arts Maneuver 8 +2 HTH Damage Class(es) 4 Fast Strike: 1/2 Phase, +2 OCV, +0 DCV, STR +4d6 Strike 3 Legsweep: 1/2 Phase, +2 OCV, -1 DCV, STR +3d6 Strike, Target Falls 4 Nerve Strike: 1/2 Phase, -1 OCV, +1 DCV, 3d6 NND 3 Martial Grab: 1/2 Phase, -1 OCV, -1 DCV, Grab Two Limbs, +20 STR for holding on 4 Martial Dodge: 1/2 Phase, -- OCV, +5 DCV, Dodge, Affects All Attacks, Abort 5 Takeaway: 1/2 Phase, +0 OCV, +0 DCV, Grab Weapon, +20 STR to take weapon away 4 Reversal: var Phase, -1 OCV, -2 DCV, +25 STR to Escape; Grab Two Limbs 4 Shove: 1/2 Phase, +0 OCV, +0 DCV, +25 STR to Shove 3 Defensive Throw: 1/2 Phase, +1 OCV, +1 DCV, Block, Target Falls Martial Arts Cost: 42 Cost Skill 10 +1 Overall 3 Breakfall 12- (14-) 1 Bureaucratics 8- 3 Combat Driving 12- (14-) 3 Combat Piloting 12- (14-) 3 Concealment 13- 1 Cryptography 8- 1 Demolitions 8- 4 Language: French: Completely Fluent, w/Accent (Literacy) 5 Language: Vietnamese: Idiomatic, native accent (Literacy) 1 Lockpicking 8- 3 Interrogation 12- 3 Security Systems 13- 3 Shadowing 13- 3 Stealth 12- (14-) 3 Streetwise 12- 4 Survival (Temperate/Subtropical, Tropical) 13- 3 Tactics 13- 1 Tracking 8- 11 WF: Common Melee Weapons, Common Missile Weapons, Garrote, General Purpose/Heavy Machine Guns, Grenade Launchers, Off Hand, Small Arms, Vehicle Weapons Everyman Skills 0 1) Persuasion 8- 0 2) Climbing 8- 0 3) Conversation 8- 0 4) Deduction 8- 0 5) Paramedics 8- -1 6) TF: Custom Adder, Small Motorized Ground Vehicles [Notes: Custom Mod is Everyman Skill] Skills Cost: 68 Cost Perk 2 Reputation, Law Enforcement, Federal Government (A large group, 11-) +1/+1d6 23 Fringe Benefit (Concealed Weapon Permit (where appropriate), Federal/National Police Powers, License to Kill, Membership: PRIMUS, Passport, Security Clearance) 28 PRIMUS Hovercar (140 Base, 60 Disad) Perks Cost: 53 Cost Talent 6 Combat Luck: 3 PD/3 ED 2 Resistance: 2 points 3 Lightsleep Talents Cost: 11 Total Character Cost: 375 Val Disadvantages 20 Social Limitation: Subject to Orders, Frequently (11-), Severe 5 Social Limitation: Public Identity, Occasionally (8-), Minor 10 Psychological Limitation: Vengeful, Uncommon, Strong 10 Reputation: Hardass, Frequently (11-) 15 Physical Limitation: -1 Sight PER, All the Time, Slightly Impairing 15 Hunted: Watched by Primus, More Powerful, 8- (Occasionally), Watching, Extensive Non-Combat Influence, PC has a Public ID or is otherwise very easy to find 10 Psychological Limitation: Driven to complete the mission, Uncommon, Strong 5 Distinctive Features: Scarred over eye, Easily Concealed, Noticed and Recognizable, Detectable By Commonly-Used Senses 10 Dependence: Cyberline RNA Treatment, Difficult To Obtain, Powers Gain 0- Activation Roll, 1 Week, Looses all Cyberline Powers until he can get another treatment 10 Enraged: When it looks like his mission will be botched, Uncommon, go 11-, recover 14- 15 Hunted: Shadowdragon (CKC pg 193-194), More Powerful, 8- (Occasionally), Harshly Punish Disadvantage Points: 125 Base Points: 250 Experience Required: 0 Total Experience Available: 0 Experience Unspent: 0

Its beyond good, its Grrrrrrrrrrrreat! The mere fact that Im playing (er....running) HEROs again instead of d20 leaves me nearly orgasmic. Its a good thing that FREd is made of Questionite which resists accidental splashage....like spilled sodas and such...... Ahem.....what I meant to say is, ya, I will keep an eye on the character. I personally dont have a problem with characters being at different power levels as long as it is story-driven. I dont typically run a competitve environment (except when the genre benefits from it), and favor a more story building approach generally, so its not about whos character has the biggest avg damage or best to-hit percentage.... However, if the other players get irritated by the character, I will 'fix his little red wagon' to the extent necessary.

That would be true if I expected the campaing to have much out-of-combat time. I dont. The pulse I get from the players is that right now, at this time, they are more interested in hitting things really hard, throwing around buildings, doing 30+" of knockback, going faster than speeding bullets, etc etc etc. This is an interlude campaign between other games, and is part of an ongoing effort to get full buy in to the HERO System with a group that is mostly new to the system (only myself and 1 other have played it for a long time). This is the 2nd campaign I've run in it since FREd came out, the 1st being a dark, brutal cyberpunk campaign. Im trying to show the systems flexibility off by contrasting it, AND the players have indicated that they want some relaxing episodic summer-fun rather than a serious long-term serialized campaign. Thus, the out of combat dominance (which you are correct, he has in spades) is unlikely to be an issue in the context of the game itself. Actually, I dont intend to give him more screen time; I expect to have his obligations to PRIMUS be both and annoyance and a simplifier for injecting story hooks. If anything, it will be Jon Wrath and all the people that wish they didnt have him around as part of thier sactioning agreement. Plus, the metacampaign considerations of the players themselves wouldnt allow it. The player is not a leader among the other players. He is by nature a follower. If anything, he normally gets taken advantage of by the other players in-game because he is easy going. Not an issue in this case. Hehe. I wish he would try to walk over me. That would require a more direct personality, which would make this entire issue non-existant. Possesing that level of will, he would instinctively design a character that would allow him to exert some modicum of control in-character. His characters would probably be more serious, or at least more directed and focused. Sadly, the opposite is true. He would probably be happy to play somebodies pet beagle if he became intrigued with the deep emotional satisfaction of playing such a multi-faceted expression of Man and Servant vice Man and Companion, or something along those lines. I would let him play it if he insisted, but at some point players become dead weight if all they do is introduce farsical elements to an activity that requires some level of suspension of disbelief. I want him to take more of an active role in the group, and if I have to let him play an overpowered character so that, in his non-proactive hands, the character plays out as roughly as effective as lower pointed characters played by people that proactively squeeze the last drop of functionality out of those characters then so be it. If nothing else its a worthwhile experiment to see how he handles it, and as GM I can always fix the problem later if it becomes an issue.

Re: Re: Jon Wrath, Agent of PRIMUS Thanx; I havent checked out your web site in a number of years (been awhile since I ran supers), but will do so presently. Sorry, I dont meant to indicate that this character is currently ineffective...at 450 points in a 350 point campaign. BUT when I stripped him down to 350 points he just didnt measure up well to the other 350 focused, 'younger' character because the points allocated to 'makes sense to support the characters background' abilities, mostly skills and perks, impacted his combat capacity. PRIMUS certainly is a powerful ally, and having a ton of perks related to membership in such an organization also certainly has its up side. Which is probably why buying those abilities eat points so quickly. So, I basically floated the PRIMUS points as 'storyline enablers' to the character rather than have him come in at 350 points and be much better than everyone else OUTSIDE of combat (due to his contacts, perks, and skills) but much worse than everyone else in combat. Also, thinking in metacampaign thought, this particular players is one of those guys with a strange sense of humor who consistently makes goof-ball gimmick characters that are definitely schticky but ultimately relatively useless aside from the 1 odd-ball thing they do, and end up just being comic relief. While I laude interesting characters, I also think interesting should be combined with 'somewhat effective as compared to the other PCs'. As the GM, Im trying to encourage the player to be more actively involved in all aspects of the in-game-play rather than constantly pushed to the sidelines due to the inherent ineptness of his characters. If all the players in the campaign wanted to explore the socio-political significance of thier characters having super powers, or play characters that basically just parody some of the goofier aspects of the genre then I could base a campaign around it and have fun. But since the other players want to explore the more outrageous aspects of superhero roleplaying -- most of them have never played supers before and view the opportunity as a chance to take a break from the grimmer, more lethal fare they have had of late. They want more of the BIFF and BAM than the deeper story building elements available in supers. Personally, I like the Wildcards/Astro City/Watchmen/Anything by Ross style of supers (I mean, I collected Valiant comics rather than Image back in the day) but the bulk of my players are a tad younger and see supers as being more mindless opportunities for massively destructive but mostly non-lethal violence. In that sort of environment, I can see this guys character at 350, with half of his points buried in background items and perks, not fitting in very well, getting sidelined again, and becoming the butt of copious jokes. To him, the concept IS the character, and all of the mechanix mean nothing to him. He wants to play Jon Wrath, AGENT OF PRIMUS with all the goofy kitsch of Nick Fury at his worst. I want him to play a character he can be happy with, tell a good story, and provide a setting that all the players will have fun in as a break from more serious campaigns. Its just a strange element of Supers games that Ive noticed before, which is well grounded characters get shafted by other players who design SUPERheroes as opposed to SuperHEROS, ie, who put the emphasis on the element that makes superhero games different than other genres -- the POWERS and was curious how other GMs who make superhero RPG thier primary genre address this, if at all.

The old Champions Universe I presume? Thanx!

One of my players wants to play Jon Wrath, Agent of PRIMUS in our upcoming Champions campaign. He's got a good concept (parody Nick Fury, essentially, give or take a few differences), but the problem is after we statted hime up, even cutting corners he's at least 100 points over 350 (and thats without the de rigeur Hovercar which turned out to be just out of the question). The Perks alone totalled up at over 30 points (including of course, Liscence to Kill, more for the ability to say "I'm an internationally renowned secret agent, and I've got a liscence to kill!" in a gravelly voice than anything else). Also, he wanted the characters superhuman capacity to be based on a 'super-soldier serum'. Of course, PRIMUS's super-soldier serum is Cyberline. So, I made him a 'Silver Avenger' as thats what somebody on Cyberline who is not the Golden Avenger is classified as generally, from what I could determine in the source material, but being an (internationally famous) top-secret operative who made his name in the Jungles of 'Nam leading his unit the Growling Recondos on media-covered 'top secret' missions to daring victory after daring victory (as a mere Sgt, no less, because thats how the military works in comic-land apparantly) before leaving military service to enter the Intelligence community, he goes by his own name rather than his official rank of 'Silver Avenger'. After numerous skills including Vietnamese and French {nobody speaks English in the Bush} from his 5 Nam tours {he was in country before, during, and after of course}, Martial Arts (more than 500 logged hours of Close Combat Training, skippy), a Cyberline Enhancement set of powers (+15 STR +10 DEX +1 SPD +5 BOD +5 CON, some Combat Luck and a few CSVs {hyped up reflexes}, IIRC), and of course the PRIMUS Agent Test Equipment Inventory VPP (No control over when and how powers change {the lab just gives him new stuff and collects the old}, limited circumstance change, Act 14- Burnout or Equivalent all slots, OIF or equivalent all slots) for all those neat Operatives-only spy toys he comes out a little point heavy. The problem is, at 450 points he really isnt any more effective than the 350 point characters in the group. 100 or so of those points are buried in background flavor, miscellaneous skills, and pure schtick. All told, he labors under far more significant disadvantages than other PCs (if he pisses off PRIMUS then no more Cyberline treatments, no more Gadget Pool, no more Perks--he's left a competent normal). I've run into this problem before on other characters, but it seems like in a supers campaign, the skill guy or any character with a significant number of background and flavor oriented abilities seem to come up lacking against focused power based characters. Power Suits help to defray this because of the points return, but outside of that it can be difficult to achieve a same-pointed character that isnt the weak sister of the group once the fists start flying. I "solved" the "problem" by floating the player the extra hundred on the understanding that 1) his XP will be deficited until if/when the other PCs catch up (not likely to happen anytime soon, thats for sure), 2) I had him take an extra 50 points of Disadvantages beyond the limit to help defray the cost, 3) I will use and abuse him for plot hooks and story elements above and beyond whats nornal for a single PC, 4) there will be circumstances where his Cyberline treatments (I put them on a weekly dependence, lose access to Cyberline powers without) and/or Gadgets will be unavailable due to circumstances beyond his control, and 5) if the character proves to be too much, he'll either suffer a 'radiation accident' of some sort to repoint him, or be retired as a PC. Just as an aside, I dont have a problem with PCs being at different power levels, although I do prefer to have everyone at least at a certain effectiveness in the context of the campaign; Id rather see a player have a character thats TOO powerful and then as the GM put restraints in place or kybosh the character than to see a character that is too weak and leaves its player feeling left out of the fun because his character is too frail. Ill post stats for the guy later tonight when I am at home, but Im curious how other people would have handled it. Also, could some helpful soul point me at relevant PRIMUS info, particularly as it pertains to Cyberline? I have all of the new material and have read the PRIMUS section in Champions Universe. I also have a fair amount of old Champions material, and I looked up the Silver Avenger in ALLIES (who didnt impress me), but since I never ran the old Champions Universe, prefering home-brews and other genres, Im not familiar with the full back story of PRIMUS. Thanx

The SLEEPER Heh. Croyd has always been one of my favorite character concepts. I kept reading the Wildcards series well past the point I actually liked it anymore, in the hopes that Croyd would show up at some point. Some other Wildcard-derived favorite concepts are Golden Boy, Mackie Messer, Carnifex, Mr. Nobody, and of course the Turtle, off the top of my head. Within the confines of normal character creation rules, a VPP would work best IMO. No Choice How or When (-1) and a bigger Between Adventures (-3/4, takes weeks or months). These days, I would prolly use the random generator in Champions to at least get a running start each go around if I were the GM, in the past I would have used Dave Mattingly's random generator. Ive always thought of doing his Sleep bit as a END pool which drives all of his powers, with 2 Recoveries limited differently. The 1st Recovery would be his 'awake' Recovery; it would be small, would take Personal Recovery, and would be limited to Must Ingest Amphetamines (treat similar to the must plug into a wall socket disadvantage). The 2nd Recovery would be his 'asleep' Recovery, and of course would be limited to only work while he is comatose; further it would also be fairly small. Then, to make it all work, his Disadvantages would pick up the slack. 1st off, he would have a Susceptibility to having his END Pool at 0, which would cause him to take STUN when his END pool ran out, eventually passing out; obviously the disadvantage needs to exceed his personal Recovery to be effective. Then he would have a PhysLim: Cannot wake up until VPP is changed. So basically, the bigger the powers, the longer he'll stay asleep and the more END those powers will burn when he wakes up. The GM, of course, should limit powers bought down to 0 END in the VPP when he builds the power set, but on the other hand Croyd stayed awake for longer stretches on occasion so maybe some forms are just more efficient and dont tire him out as fast. The GM needs to be a little bit lenient and allow maybe 25 -50 points of 'morphable' Physical and Distinctive Feature disadvantages relevant to each form, which of course the GM gets to set with each form. Fortunately, Croyd certainly doesnt lack for other disadvantages, including a Dependency on amphetamines, Enraged while on amps, certainly a bad Reputation ("if its Croyd leave him alone"; Typhoid Croyd; etc), and prolly some Unluck (Croyd seems to get the short end of the stick often). I would rather treat his fear of drawing a Black Queen as a Psychological Limiation: Fear of going to sleep (VC, Strong or Common, Total depending on how you look at it) than as an actual possible outcome, as I dont see Croyd ever actually morphing into anything other than an ace or joker-ace. Outside of his 'Sleeper' power suite, I would also give him Life Support: Longevity (he's been around along time, and doesnt seem to actually age -- or at least not at the same speed as everyone else), some Power Defense and Mental Defense (he seems pretty resistant to other folks powers regardless of form), and of course some extra strength, maybe around 30 (it seems like all of his forms have some degree of enhanced STR -- any further extra strength relevant to a form would come out of the VPP for that form). Just some ideas......

But why would you want to? Chaos Nation: Does he actually get bigger/denser when he absorbs people, or does he absorb them in the comic book no effect -> mass sense? When he absorbs them, are they themselves helpless? Can the target resist getting absorbed? Once absorbed, can a target bust loose of thier own accord? Can Chaos Nation release people still living, or is he like a roach motel, only spitting them out when they are dead? In other words, would it be most appropriate to just KILL the target outright when he 'absorbs' them rather than fuss with them? Could Chaos Nation treat his damage delegation ability as an ablative Armor instead, or as an appropriate Limitation applied to a large Damage Reduction ? Will post more after above has been answered......

Heres a pic I found to use for the character. The character concept is vaguely similar to the Black Queen, Selena from the Hellfire club (inspired by the 'Hellfire' schtick of Talisman no doubt), and this pic seems to capture the hard hearted sluttiness of the character.

Hey all, I wanted a powerful mystic antagonist as a Tier 2 NPC (not world-threatening, but formidable). I ended up lifting Talisman and adapting her by tacking on a couple of hundred points of extra powers. I renamed the character and her background is different to fit my storyline. I intend to use her as a sometimes-ally sometimes enemy Loki type character. Ultimately selfserving, but possibly helpful when it suits her ends. I wanted her to have more odd-ball and story driving powers so I tacked on a few 'allows-for-plausible-story-hooks' powers more than combat ability. I also wanted her to be an independent player to be reckoned with, so I upped her INT and EGO a tad to reflect her stature as a mover and shaker. So, here she is; how does she look? Incantrix Player: Val Char Cost 10 STR 0 20 DEX 30 20 CON 20 10 BODY 0 20 INT 10 30 EGO 40 25 PRE 15 20 COM 5 5/19 PD 3 7/21 ED 3 5 SPD 20 10 REC 8 56 END 8 30 STUN 5 6" RUN02" SWIM02" LEAP0Characteristics Cost: 167 Cost Power END 60 Mastery Of Hellfire: Multipower, 60-point reserve 6u 1) Hellfire: Energy Blast 12d6 (vs. ED) (60 Active Points) (uses END Reserve) 6 6u 2) Hellfire Gate: Energy Blast 8d6 (vs. ED), Explosion (Normal (Radius) -1 DC/1"; +1/2) (60 Active Points) (uses END Reserve) 6 6u 3) Agonizing Hellfire: Energy Blast 8d6 (vs. ED), Armor Piercing (+1/2) (60 Active Points) (uses END Reserve) 6 6u 4) Writhing Hellfire: Energy Blast 4d6 (vs. ED), Penetrating (+1/2), Uncontrolled (+1/2), Continuous (+1) (60 Active Points) (uses END Reserve) 6 40 Foul Sorcery: Multipower, 40-point reserve 4u 1) Warp and Wend: Teleportation 6" (Position Shift), Safe Blind Teleport (+1/4), Megascale (1" = 100 km; +3/4), Can Be Scaled Down: 1" = 1km (+1/4) (38 Active Points) (uses END Reserve) 4 2u 2) Cull the Weak: Transfer 2d6 -1 (max. Transfered Points: 13): END to STUN & BODY, Variable Effect (Two Powers Simultaneously; +1/2) (40 Active Points); Only Restores To Starting Values (-1/2), Beam (-1/4) (uses END Reserve) 4 4u 3) Domination: Mind Control 8d6 (40 Active Points) (uses END Reserve) 4 4u 4) Befuddlement: Mental Illusions 8d6 (40 Active Points) (uses END Reserve) 4 4u 5) Spell Of Torment: Ego Attack 4d6 (40 Active Points) (uses END Reserve) 4 4u 6) Touch Of Terror: Drain 4d6: PRE (40 Active Points) (uses END Reserve) 4 20 Helpful Witcheries: Elemental Control, 40-point Powers 22 1) Shield Of Sorcery: Force Field (14 PD / 14 ED), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (42 Active Points) (added to Secondary Value) 20 2) Wings Of The Wind: Flight 20" (40 Active Points) (uses END Reserve) 4 20 3) Visions: Clairsentience (Sight Group; Additional Sense Group: Hearing Group, x4 Range) (40 Active Points) (uses END Reserve) 4 3 Magesense: Detect Magic 13- (5 Active Points); Concentration (0 DCV; -1/2) 10 Mystic Comprehension: Universal Translator (20 Active Points); Costs Endurance (Costs END Every Phase; -1/2), Concentration, Must Concentrate throughout use of Constant Power (1/2 DCV; -1/2) 13- 2 10 Mystic Wards: Power Defense (15 points) (15 Active Points); Activation Roll 14- (-1/2) 13 Mystic Will: +14 Mental Defense (20 points total), Hardened (+1/4) (19 Active Points); Activation Roll 14- (-1/2) 67 Mystic Doppelganger: Duplication (creates 5 625-point Duplicates) (Easy Recombination: 0 Phase Action (Full DCV)) (150 Active Points); Extra Time, Only to Activate Constant or Persistent Power (5 Minutes; -1), Character May Take No Other Actions (-1/4) 32 Mystic Channeling: Endurance Reserve (120 END, 30 REC) Reserve: (42 Active Points) REC: (30 Active Points); Personal REC (-1/2) Powers Cost: 363 Cost Skill 6 +2 with Master Of Hellfire Multipwer 3 High Society 14- 3 CK: Vibora Bay (INT-based) 13- 2 CK: Millennium City 11- 3 KS: Arcane & Occult Lore (INT-based) 13- 3 KS: Demonology (INT-based) 13- 3 KS: Necromancy (INT-based) 13- 3 KS: Witchcraft (INT-based) 13- 1 Language: Latin: Basic Conversation 7 Seduction 16- 3 Stealth 13- 3 Streetwise 14- Skills Cost: 40 Cost Perk 2 Contact: a member of the Circle Of The Scarlet Moon (11-) 4 Contact: a Morbanes of DEMON (11-) (Contact has: very useful Skills or resources) 4 Contact: Dark Seraph (8-) (Contact has: extremely useful Skills or resources) Perks Cost: 10 Cost Talent 44 Danger Sense (16-) (Area: General Area, Discriminatory, Function as a Sense, Sensitivity: Any Danger, Targeting Sense) (55 Active Points); IIF Unbreakable (-1/4) Talents Cost: 44 Total Character Cost: 624 Val Disadvantages 10 Distinctive Features: Mystic Aura, Not Concealable, Always Noticed and Causes Major Reaction, Detectable Only By Unusual Senses 20 Hunted: Trismegistus Council, More Powerful, 8- (Occasionally), Capture, Extensive Non-Combat Influence 15 Hunted: DEMON, As Powerful, 8- (Occasionally), Capture, Extensive Non-Combat Influence 20 Psychological Limitation: Corrupted Soul, Common, Total 15 Psychological Limitation: Utterly Self Centered; Cares Only For Herself, Common, Strong 15 Social Limitation: Secret Identity , Frequently (11-), Major Disadvantage Points: 95 Base Points: 200 Experience Required: 329 Total Experience Available: 330 Experience Unspent: 1

Hi Steve. This recently came up: a player has a character with 6" of Stretching. That player thinks that they can use this Stretching to (among other things) "Stretch" 6" straight up and then, from this elevated height, jump or move at their normal speed. I said no, it doesnt work like this because Stretching explicitly does not provide movement, and stretching 6" up duplicates some of the functionality of Leaping, Flight, or even Clinging (if used to basically step up onto the roof of a building or similar). It also duplicates some of the functionality of Growth, but thats not necessarily relevant. I said he could reach up 6" to make a HtH attack or to grab ahold of something and then try to pull himself up with a Climbing check or something along those lines as an action, but that I thought it abusive to give him effectively 24" of free Leaping (halved for going up, and halved again to make it a 1/2 Move allowing a subsequent 1/2 Phase attack). However, I just wanted to be sure that this is correct. So, Question: can Stretching be used to gain elevation, and can a character elevated in such a manner then use other forms of movement such as Leap and Run from this elevated position? Thanx!

I always prefered the little blue book over the BBB in 4th Edition, and I could find ANYTHING in that book in 2 seconds flat. 5th Edition is overall a superior product (I mean, its made out of QUESTIONITE for crying out loud; what other game company can make that claim?) but I cant find the inside covers of the book without a flashlight and a spare pair of hands. Its a damn big book PLUS some of the bits are oddly scattered. Still and all though, you can have my FREd when you pry it from my cold dead fingers. The main rulebooks notwithstanding, I unilaterally agree that all of the other supplements DOJ has put out are superior to all but the creme de la creme of all previous versions of Champions/HEROs put together.

LS: Intense Heat I once had a player in 4th Ed who thought his LS vs Intense Heat completely protected him from a fireball attack. Went something like Me: '[Wizard NPC] launches a flaming burst of magical force at you; it hits; you take [lots of damage].' Player: 'No worries dude; Ive got Life Support vs that $#!%. I dont take any damage.' The player totally could not understand how game balance could never allow an ability that cost a few points to counter any attack of a broad special effect bought in 5 to 15 point increments per d6; or if he were correct why EVERYONE wouldnt buy that power, or why subsequently no one would buy any such attack. Logic was not his strong suit.....

This is (1 reason) why I dont collect comix anymore Great stuff, and sadly, though humorous, also captures the spirit of every single superhero(s) encounter new superhero(s) battle ever. Cant damage that valuable money making intellectual property, afterall.

Cowboys and Indians I shot you! No your didnt, you missed! My intergallactic ray-gun never misses! Oh yeah, well my pan-cosmic forcefield deflects all blows!!!! Etc etc etc We are talking about fictional comic book characters. All comic book characters have a secret un-referenced attribute which is more important than all others. This attribute is "cool factor". Cool factor is a direct indicator of how well appreciated the character is by fans willing to shell out dollars to read completely contrived mini-stories about them. Thus, in any real no-holds barred non-partisan 'fight' which would have to result in a clear winner and a clear loser (no Secret Wars bs here), the winners could be directly traced to which ever intellectual properties were expected to gross more in coming years, regardless of background, capabilities, or relative power levels. Superman and Batman continue to be big grossers via liscencing to other media, so they'll survive; anything with Wolvie sells, so be sure he's gonna make it. Thor & Iron Man carry thier own books so they will survive. Professor X, Magneto by whatever name, and any other X-Man that is a) in the first movie and expected to be popular in the second movie will make it thru, etc. The lesser knowns are all Red-Shirts and will fall to better known/more profitable characters. Welcome to Intellectual Property land, where the bigger earners get all the bennys.