Power Build Question

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

The concept is a character that is glowing so brightly that someone looking right at him will be blinded.

 

Obviously this is some sort of flash … but what I’m looking for is something that will affect opponents who simply *target* him whether or not they actually hit or miss and something that will not eat up one of the character’s actions.

 

My thought is that Damage Shield meets most of these requirements but I have two very sticky issues with it. First DS only works on attacks that hit. Secondly DS does not affect ranged attacks.

 

My inclination to solve the first issue would be to create a custom increase to the cost of DS to have it affect attacks that miss as well as ones that hit. My gut says that +3/4 would be about right but I’m looking for feedback here. Thoughts?

 

For the ranged aspect, one solution would be to buy lots of area on the DS Flash, but I’m not really sure that this does what I want. I’m not looking to flash everyone in a 6†or so radius, just the folks who target the character. So is it legal to buy the Ranged advantage on a DS? The DS description states that it turns ranged powers into no-range powers, so for +1/2 could one buy ranged back?

 

The final power would then look like:

 

Flash (3d6) 0 End (+1/2), Persistent (+1/2), Continuous (+1), Damage Shield (+3/4), Ranged (+1/2), Only in Hero ID (-1/4)

 

64 Active Points & 51 Real Points.

[SirViss]

If you collect Digital Hero, in DH #11 Steve covers the Trigger advantage, and how you could use it to replace the Damage Shield advantage. It comes to the same cost in the end though.

 

Anyway, you might be able to come up with something with Trigger advantage, as long as your GM allows it to automatically reset (which is covered in DH #11)

[Rick]

How about a Flash, AE: Radius (W/lots of Hexs, maybe mega scale), personal immunity, always on, 0 range, only effects people who look at character, blah blah blah.

 

From here GM's fiat will dictate that the character doesn't need to make attack rolls.

 

You can also link a create light power (images in FRed) to it, since the character is illuminating.

[Bengal]

would invisibility work? I mean, how long are people blinded? Longer than it takes to look away? My first gut instinct is, although you'll get those annoying ghosting after-images on your retina, your long-term vision won't be affected- you just won't be able to get a bead on your character- much like you can't really study the sun my looking directly into it.

 

You could build it as invisibility, invisible power effects, bright fringe.

[Outsider]

It seems to me that the effect you are trying to simulate is something like loking directly into the sun on a clear day, or directly at a magnesium flare at close range. Assuming the character is always horribly bright, I would simulate this by taking a flash linked to a darkness :

 

Flash : 3D6

Advantages : (+3 3/4 total)

(+1) Continuous

(+1/2) Uncontrolled

(+1 1/4) Explosion, with 3 levels reduced DC loss (1dc/4")

(+1/2) Reduced Endurance Cost, 0 END

(+1/2) Persistent

Disadvantages : (-3/4 total)

(-1/2) No Range (always centered on the character)

(-1/4) Hero ID Only

 

Darkness : 1" radius

Advantages : (+1 3/4 total)

(+1/2) Uncontrolled

(+1/2) Reduced Endurance Cost, 0 END

(+1/2) Persistent

(+1/4) Personal Immunity

Disadvantages (-2 1/4 total)

(-1) The Character himself is the only allowed target

(-1/4) Hero ID Only

(-1/2) Linked to Flash

(-1/2) Others automatically make their perception rolls against this darkness (maximum effect is -1 DCV & 1/2 OCV in melee, and 1/2 OCV at range)

 

 

 

I also think your point accounting is off. Your version lists +3 1/4 in advantages, but only gets to 64 points on a 3d6 flash. Or did they make flash 5 points per D6 in 5th Ed?

 

If so, my version will be 71 active points and 41 real points for the Flash portion, and the 27 active points and 8 real points for the Darkness portion. Your overall real point expenditure remains about the same.

 

I think this write up simulates a very bright thing pretty well. Since explosions originate from a center in Champions, those who are not actually looking at or, better yet, facing towards your character remain uneffected. Since the intensity of light decreases in an inverse square relationship with the distance of an observer from its source, Explosion is also good. If someone is far enough away, they should be reasonably safe from being blinded. However.. very bright objects, even very far away, ARE difficult to clearly define, and thus would be more difficult to target with a ranged attack. This is where the Darkness comes in.

 

People within 4" get 3d6 of flash. Within 8", 2d6, and within 12 " 1d6. If this is too little, buy some more +1/4 slow dropoffs. They're less than a real point each, all told (if flash is 5 pips per die, anyway)

 

A real stickler of a GM might make you buy a Change Environment (From whatever to "achingly brightly lit") but I'm not gonna worry about that.

[Hugh Neilson]

Originally posted by Outsider

Flash : 3D6

Advantages : (+3 3/4 total)

(+1) Continuous

(+1/2) Uncontrolled

(+1 1/4) Explosion, with 3 levels reduced DC loss (1dc/4")

(+1/2) Reduced Endurance Cost, 0 END

(+1/2) Persistent

Disadvantages : (-3/4 total)

(-1/2) No Range (always centered on the character)

(-1/4) Hero ID Only

 

Yes, Flash is only 5 points per die in 5e, but it blinds for segments, rather than phases, so 3d6 will have a very short impact.

 

Whether you need Persistent is debateable - does it stay on when he's unconscious? If it does, you might sub out OIHID for Always On. There should also be some limitation for only affecting people looking directly at him. I'm inclined to set that at -1/2. -1 is arguable since the opposition can control whether they look at him, but since your choice is look at him or don't target him, a lower total seems appropriate.

 

I'd scrap Darkness, however, Just buy some bonus DCV levels, Linked to the Flash, and limited to -1 in HTH and 1/2 opponent's OCV at range.

[Outsider]

He had Persistent in his original conception, so I included it.

 

Were I his GM, though, I wouldnt give him any limitation for his flash only working if people who look directly at him/try to target him, unless I was also going to make the ruling that people could target him without a OCV penalty without looking directly at him. Otherwise it is like giving someone a limitation on their (Normal sight) invisibility "Doesnt work if viewer's eyes are shut" Basically, giving your opponents a choise between bad and bad isnt horribly limiting.

 

I went with the darkness instead of simple DCV because the darkness, unlike the DCV, will also prevent people from seeing or targetting effectively things that the character is standing next to or along the viewer's LOS to. I should have clarified that this was one intention. Also.. the "automatically makes per roll" limit should apply only to people trying to perceive the character himself... not things past him that he is directly in their LOS to.

[Hugh Neilson]

Originally posted by Outsider

Were I his GM, though, I wouldnt give him any limitation for his flash only working if people who look directly at him/try to target him, unless I was also going to make the ruling that people could target him without a OCV penalty without looking directly at him. Otherwise it is like giving someone a limitation on their (Normal sight) invisibility "Doesnt work if viewer's eyes are shut" Basically, giving your opponents a choise between bad and bad isnt horribly limiting.

 

Consider three possible constructs for an area effect or explosive Flash:

 

(a) As constructed, no advantages or limitations on who is affected. Everyone within 3 hexes takes some level of Flash on every one of the character's phases. Absent Flash Def, this is pretty painful.

 

( Add in "Selective Area" - now the character chooses who will or won't be blinded (this is well ouitside the concept as presented)

 

© It only affects those looking at/targeting him. Now far fewer people are affected. Anyone not attacking him is fine. Anyone attacking him would (as I would rule it) get the shot off and be blinded at the same time, so no OCXV penalty to that shot. As well, anyone with an area effect power can simply fire towards the light without looking directly at the character specifically, and avoid the flash.

 

I think © is sufficiently differentiated from (a) that some form of limitation is reasonable. YMMV.

 

The Darkness ultimately becomes a matter of taste (and of cost). Although I like the construct, I don't see it as essential.

[Outsider]

OIHID was also in his original write up, So I am assuming it isnt "always on" otherwise maintaining a second identity might be difficult. If the character has more than just seperate identities, but also has seperate forms, and the light is always on -when he is in hero form- then I would reduce the disadvantage for Always on from -1/2 to -1/4 anyway.

 

And, thinking about it some more, he also HAS to target the flash portion on himself, so he should get some limitation for that, just like he does with the darkness. He cant leave flash explosion zones laying around (that he set up within melee range of himself (no range) then moved away from) whish is limiting on the flash power, which, when made continuous would normally be maintainable at a distance, even if it couldnt be used at range due to another limitation.

 

One also has to wonder, though, if the character can be blinded by his own brightness if he happens to look at himself either directly, or when someone holds up a mirror unexpectedly... Personal Immunity might be appropriate on the flash also.

 

Flash : 3D6

Advantages : (+4 total)

(+1) Continuous

(+1/2) Uncontrolled

(+1 1/4) Explosion, with 3 levels reduced DC loss (1dc/4")

(+1/2) Reduced Endurance Cost, 0 END

(+1/2) Persistent

(+1/4) Personal Immunity

Disadvantages : (-1 1/4 total)

(-1) The character himself is the only allowed target

(-1/4) Hero ID Only OR Always On in Hero ID only

 

Darkness : 1" radius

Advantages : (+1 3/4 total)

(+1/2) Uncontrolled

(+1/2) Reduced Endurance Cost, 0 END

(+1/2) Persistent

(+1/4) Personal Immunity

Disadvantages (-2 1/4 total)

(-1) The Character himself is the only allowed target

(-1/4) Hero ID Only OR Always On in Hero ID only

(-1/2) Linked to Flash

(-1/2) Others automatically make their perception rolls against this darkness (maximum effect is -1 DCV & 1/2 OCV in melee, and 1/2 OCV at range)

 

Totals are

33 (75) Flash

8 (27) Darkness

41 real points total.

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

Hmm. Not having DH #11 I can’t really comment on Trigger. Without the auto-reset though it would be problematic vs. multiple attackers.

 

Invisibility is an interesting suggestion I’ll have to think about that more, but my gut tells me that *I* have afterimages in my eyes after looking directly at the sun that sometimes makes it hard to see in general.

 

I’m pretty resistant to the explosion affect idea. I really don’t like the extra bookkeeping explosion generates & I want the effect to be the same for someone trying to hit him in hand to hand range and trying to snipe at him from the top of a building.

 

I am also in agreement that if you use an Area Effect instead of Range that the power should also be No Range. However as I have seen write-ups of Area Affect Damage Shields & Triggers in the past they affect *everyone* within the Area and that doesn’t seem to fit at all. If thug A is targeting the character and thug B is within the AoE but targeting the character’s teammate why should thug B be affected? AoE can also lead to a huge Active Point inflation though by the time you apply all the limitations the real cost might be close to the same.

 

As for the Darkness and DCV penalties I just assumed that the penalties for being flashed would be enough though it would be easy to build in something else on top of that too.

 

Any thoughts as to whether or not Ranged (+1/2) can be combined with Damage Shield in general?

 

Thanks for all the feedback so far!

[Outsider]

Thinking even more about it, I see your point. My initial thoughts were that he was using a normally offensive power to build a defensive one. But, so long as the darkness construct is kept, people's difficulty in looking at the character (and thus targeting him) is, game mechanics-wise, handled by it, and the flash portion of the total construct IS purely offensive.

 

The thing is, your example c) has advantages too. Friendly people will be targetting him far less often than unfriendly ones, and will likely actually be in the area of effect more often. Normally selective target is a +1/4 advantage, and this simulates it in some ways. I suppose I could live with an additional -1/2 lim. 33 points is pretty expensive for a bit of lingering effect on his "darkness" anyway.

[Outsider]

If it works on anyone who even looks at the character, regardless of range, it SHOULD be prohibitively expensive.

 

It would, effectively, be a selective AOE with a truly immense radius. Unlike a normal "selective" attack AoE, though, in which the character has to decide which potential targets within the area of effect he wants to hit AND has to roll to hit them (with range mods!) individually, this one would allow the character to attack people he isnt even aware of who might be hundreds of hexes away, and ALWAYS hit them. That's the part I hang up on, mechanicswise.

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

True.

 

Don't forget the downside though. Friendly ranged aid, bam! Blind. Friendly heal, bam! Blind. Makes it kind of hard to do media interviews as well.

[badger3k]

Haven't thought much about it, but what about a change environment effect (multiple combat, sight Per, OCV), only to those looking at the character - it wouldn't give the blindness effect, but you can link it with flash (or vice versa). Might be too costly though.

[Outsider]

Another way to write it up that doesnt bend any rules, though it too would end up being a tad pricey, and wouldnt effect people really far away unless your GM didnt mind a truly immense active cost...:

 

A large radius darkness with a limitation on it that it doesnt effect anyone who hasnt looked directly at the character in the last 3 seconds, or anyone who has more than 3 pips of sight Flash Defence.

[TaxiMan]

I'm with Badger3k.

 

Megascale Change Environment, -4 to PER, no range, only works on those that target the PC (-0), effects fade after (x) seconds (TBD). GM handwave the rest.

 

The -4 to PER is the same as a completely dark night, so I'd say (as GM) that ranged perceptions are impossible with the effected sense. Fits the SFX.

 

You would have to work out with your GM how to work around this. What's the penalty for targeting your PC "out of the corner of my eye"? It's got to be better than being blind (-4). Another item, what is the effect of just being in the area? Is there "glare" that affects everyone? How much?

[Hugh Neilson]

Originally posted by Vanderbilt_Grad

Don't forget the downside though. Friendly ranged aid, bam! Blind. Friendly heal, bam! Blind. Makes it kind of hard to do media interviews as well.

 

A lot of that can be avoided if the power can be shut off, or when such effects are undertaken out of combat. "Come here, and I'll heal you." Stretch out hand and look the other way Unless the power is LOS, I don't HAVE to look at you to use it, but it becomes much tougher if you're avoiding me rather than helping me target you.

 

It is an immensely powerful effect. The self-resetting trigger would, IMO, be the best approach. Get Digital Hero #11 or see if you can work something out with your GM. [Maybe if Steve's feeling especially generous he'll pop in and tell you what that would cost...]

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

I really like the change environment idea and it fits well.

 

To give a little more detail most of the character’s powers are bought OIHID. In Hero ID his body is composed of crystal that absorbs light. He is built with an End Reserve OIHID that recovers only in light. He also has images only to create light that glows brighter the more full his End reserve is. This part is good & bad since it gives some positive PER bonuses to overcome darkness but can alert foes as to how much power he currently has.

 

Among other powers Cascade also is built with a big honking Aid that affects pretty much all his physical characteristics & I was thinking of having him glow super brightly while the Aid is active. Again this would be a visible clue that he is ‘pumped up’ alerting foes who have fought him before but it would have some beneficial effects as well.

[Farkling]

Thinking out loud...

 

Darkness, SFX: Blinding Flare

1" MegaScalex2 (cheese alert! cheese alert!), Only affects perceptions directed at the character. Cannot affect characters with >5 pips FD. Affects Sighr Group.

 

hmmmmm....

 

Invisibility, Explosion, Fringe, possibly UAA

 

hmmmmm....

 

Change Environment, Explosion, -4 PER rolls (complete night/darkness modifier), -3 OCV (unfamiliar weapon modifier), only affects characters looking directly at the target.

 

Ah...this is a good one:

 

Images: Limited to Blinding Light, -x to PER rolls, Explosion.

Linked with +6 DCV, persistent, effective levels limited to half of attackers OCV.

 

I like the Images construct...but have no time to build it out tonight.

[Snarf]

I once used images to make an alien species with a glowing body. I just bought sight group Images with the Only Light and No Range limitations and the 0 END advantage. In the FAQs I found this gets you bright illumination in the Image power's radius, and a bit of dim illumination outside the power's effect. The exact amount of light that bleeds outside the radius was up to the GM.