Do all Gm's use the Skill roll for magic?

[JLXC]

I was starting a new campign here and I think I am going to leave this one off. Aren't there enough disadvantages to magic? In my game for example you will have at a minimum Extra Time: Delayed Phase, Gestures, Incantations, an OAF of some kind, must have charges, charges cost End to activate, etc. Then to make the player roll and hope they cast this super limited spell right seems sorta unfair really. Why not just use an activation on spells then? Like 14 or less. Most GMs seem to limit the MAgic Skill so that essentially all spells have the activation limitation anyways.

 

I dunno, I was just wondering how many of you don't use the magic skill and how it is working for ya. For the gms that do use it, why? If I am wrong and the magic skill is the better way to go I'd like to at least know why.

 

 

"OK you spend the 6 hours casting the spell, you got the diamond and the dragons blood, make a roll.... awwww... sorry now you got to get more Diamonds and Dragon blood. Silly man trying to cast such a good spell. For shame."

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Do all Gm's use the Skill roll for magic?

 

Of all the various Magic Systems that I have in play only one uses RSRs to be cast, and it's a Skill-based Magic System (Magecraft). Many of the other Magic Systems I created have Magic Skills, but they are to LEARN Spells with, not to cast them. The primary Magic Systems of my own creation currently in play (Spontaneous via MP and both the Spell Gestalt and Preparred methods via VPP) expressly forbid RSR to CAST Spells, but do allow them for Spells that require a Skill Roll to affect an individual target at the Spell designer's option.

 

 

Magic Skills are just one of many tools with which to build a Magic System, and certainly arent mandatory or even preferrable. They work to help define the desired flavor of some Magic Systems, and run at cross purposes for the desired flavor of other Magic Systems.

[John Desmarais]

Re: Do all Gm's use the Skill roll for magic?

 

I dunno, I was just wondering how many of you don't use the magic skill and how it is working for ya. For the gms that do use it, why? If I am wrong and the magic skill is the better way to go I'd like to at least know why.

 

My current FH campaign uses the spells from the Fantasy Hero Grimoire - the master version of the spells only (the ones that don't have RSR). So far things are working well.

 

John D

[Chris Goodwin]

Re: Do all Gm's use the Skill roll for magic?

 

To me it gives the feel of something that you can learn how to do, but like KS said it's by no means mandatory.

[Markdoc]

Re: Do all Gm's use the Skill roll for magic?

 

I do use RSR in my current games, but that's because I WANT magoc to be a bit flakey and to limit it's use in combat.

 

To me, mages with totally reliable magic are more like Superheroes: they fly around, cast energy bolts from behind forcefields, etc.

 

Of course it depends what you want - I also allow in some cases magical powers that don't have RSR - but then they are abilities, not spells.

 

So it's a question of deciding how you want to magic to feel and how/when you want it to act. Only then should you design your magic system

 

cheers, Mark

[Galadorn]

Re: Do all Gm's use the Skill roll for magic?

 

My experience is that I have never played in a campaign where the magic skill was not used, except a short-lived campaign of mine. The magic skill roll, while generally not used in the best of the fantasy genre, helps create tension in fantasy roleplaying. I can't remember a spell-casting attempt that didn't work in Tolkein or Le Guin, except early on in Le Guin.

 

As I've said before, I don't think a person can exactly translate fantasy fiction conventions into roleplaying. I believe the magic skill roll is one of things that, while a quality and well-conceived disadvantage in roleplaying, just doesn't work high quality in fantasy fiction.

[JLXC]

Re: Do all Gm's use the Skill roll for magic?

 

Well after some thinking and reading here, I have decided to drop the RSR totally. With the Delayed Phase, and a house rule if you take damage while spellcasting you must make an Ego roll with a -1 for every 2 body damage divided by two rounded down to keep casting the spell, there is ample chance to "stop" spellcasters and make magic less reliable. I guess I have played too many fantasy based RPG's where if you got all the materials, waggle your toes, talk in tongues, and generally look like a goon for a while, the spell goes off. Adding "well after all that you waggled your toe right instead of left so no spell for you!" seems seriously unfair to players in the long run. Thanks for all the talk and ideas! This board is great!

[Ndreare]

Re: Do all Gm's use the Skill roll for magic?

 

I do have two magic systems that use the RSR however I have found that all it does is slow down gameplay.

 

In exchange for that I created a rule that if after all modifiers your effective skill is still 16 or higher then no roll is necisary.

 

This encurages players to create very skilled casters. (However they are also subject to Skill vs. Skill rollswhich means that even a very "Powerful" (skilled) caster can be biten while working the Great Path.)

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Do all Gm's use the Skill roll for magic?

 

In the Magic System documents Im in the process of rewriting I go into various Control Factors for Magic Systems.

 

 

Im still in the process of restructuring the old Magic sytem pages to remove all vestiges of an assumed "default Magic System"; I still havent finished with the overall organization of the various parts of content and havent linked everything together yet, but there is a section that covers various Spell Disruptions and general Magic Restrictions cobbled together out of the material thats getting phased out. There might be some references here and there to a "Default Magic System", but just ignore them -- they will be deleted as I move thru each document editing in turn:

 

 

[Derek Hiemforth]

Re: Do all Gm's use the Skill roll for magic?

 

For the gms that do use it' date=' why?[/quote']To me, the Skill Roll reflects the "level" aspect of those other games you mentioned. It's what keeps a relatively inexperienced mage from casting extremely powerful spells (especially if it's combined with Side Effects). With all the Limitations available for and frequently applied to spells, it's possible to get pretty darn powerful spells down to an affordable cost if you put your mind to it. But requiring a Skill Roll makes casting a spell that's "beyond you" more dicey.

 

In D&D, if you can only use up to 3rd level spells, then that's all you can use. But with RSR in FH, you might come across the equivalent of a "5th level spell," realize that it's more advanced than what you're comfortable with, but still try to cast it anyway.