Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

[Aroooo]

I'm trying to build a drain body power, and have this so far:

 

Drain BODY 7 1/2d6 (standard effect: 22 points), Cumulative (+1/2), Ranged (+1/2) (150 Active Points); OAF (-1), STR Minimum 10 (STR Min. Cannot Add/Subtract Damage; -1), Real Weapon (-1/4), Beam (-1/4), 32 Recoverable Continuing Charges lasting 1 Extra Phase each (+1)

 

Are the continuing charges and cumulative redundant?

How does Standard Effect work with the Cumulative advantage?

 

Its supposed to work like this; you get shot, take the Drain for the current phase and the following phase, up to a max of 22 BODY lost. So, did I do it right?

 

Aroooo

[devlin1]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

What about getting it with Gradual instead?

[Snarf]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

If I'm remembering correctly, I think you don't need Cumulative for the effect you want, because drain is already cumulative. But you will have to apply Continuous (+1) to go with the continuing charges if you want the extra phase of draining to work automatically.

 

Could you describe this weapon? I'm curious because at first I pictured as some sort of sci-fi zapper, but then I noticed it had recoverable charges. Is it some sort of cursed arrows?

 

Edit: Oops, drain doesn't have max effect. *snip* *snip*

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

If you want to hit them once and have the effect applied over more than 1 Phase go with Gradual Effect or Continuous and Uncontrolled (hint, GE you need to buy more dice of effect and hope you roll well, but there is no way to stop the effect once it starts. Contin Uncontrolled can be done w/ lower dice of effect, but must have a common termination clause).

 

If you want to activate the Power once on a Continuing Charge and then be able to target one or more opponents over your next several Phases go with Lingering.

[Aroooo]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

Lingering? not familiar with that one? Is if from FH?

 

What am I trying to build? The short version is a 'one-shot-disintegrates-goons' type of effect.

 

The longer version is my group is trying to work up some Stargate Hero guidelines. One guy is working up package deals, and I'm doing weapon conversions. This is part of the Zat write-up. (For the uninitiated, the Zat is an energy weapon-sfx looks like electricity-that stuns, kills, or disintegrates its target based on the number of times you get shot with it.) The first two stages are easy enough to build, but this third stage is tough.

 

So, with that in mind, how would you build it, because I'm still a but confused between Continuous, cumulative, gradual effect, etc.? The reason I did the 1 extra phase was to give it some added 'umph' without making the initial attack a huge number of dice. Also, that seemed to be its SFX when you get shot with it.

 

Aroooo

[ghost-angel]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

You don't need cumulative on a drain ... Drain is inherently cumulative, AND has no maximum effect (you keep draining and draining until the target runs out of the power/stat you're draining).

 

FREd p100, first paragraph after the "Example" outlines this.

 

If you want the Drain to go more than one phase then Continuous will work.

 

Of course keep in mind that at it's current level you're draining 11 BODY from the target per phase (assuming they have no power defense). You kill a normal in one attack if the Drain is Continuous for 1-Extra Phase. I hope this is a lethal campaign or Power Defense is very common.

 

edit: spelling.

[JmOz]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

IIRC: Drains do not have a max effect...

[JmOz]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

ZAT GUN: Build it as a Multi power, here are the base powers

 

EB: Stun Only

RKA

Major Transform (Nothingness)

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

ZAT GUN: Build it as a Multi power, here are the base powers

 

EB: Stun Only

RKA

Major Transform (Nothingness)

 

Actually, I'd use an NND - Does BOD, limited with the restruction that it aplies BOD only if the target is hit twice within some timeframe. Assume, for example, a 15d6 NND Does BOD, Standard Effect. 1st hit does 45 STUN on average (most people will be at -10 or lower, though some may struggle up to -9, and still be aware - O'Neill seems to get this a lot). Second hit does 45 STUN, 15 BOD AND means the 15 BOD from the first hit is also effective. Anyone with 15 BOD or less is dead. Add, say, 5d6 w/ no STUN and anyone within NCM is dead on the second hit.

[Aroooo]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

ZAT GUN: Build it as a Multi power, here are the base powers

 

EB: Stun Only

RKA

Major Transform (Nothingness)

 

That's how I started, only Drain instead of transform.

 

Aroooo

[Aroooo]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

You don't need cumulative on a drain ... Drain is inherently cumulative, AND has no maximum effect (you keep draining and draining until the target runs out of the power/stat you're draining).

 

FREd p100, first paragraph after the "Example" outlines this.

 

If you want the Drain to go more than one phase then Continuous will work.

 

Of course keep in mind that at it's current level you're draining 11 BODY from the target per phase (assuming they have no power defense). You kill a normal in one attack if the Drain is Continuous for 1-Extra Phase. I hope this is a lethal campaign or Power Defense is very common.

 

edit: spelling.

 

Yup, thats about the effect I was looking for. The disintegrate is supposed to wipe out 'normals' and 'goons' and boxes...

 

Aroooo

[Aroooo]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

Actually' date=' I'd use an NND - Does BOD, limited with the restruction that it aplies BOD only if the target is hit twice within some timeframe. Assume, for example, a 15d6 NND Does BOD, Standard Effect. 1st hit does 45 STUN on average (most people will be at -10 or lower, though some may struggle up to -9, and still be aware - O'Neill seems to get this a lot). Second hit does 45 STUN, 15 BOD AND means the 15 BOD from the first hit is also effective. Anyone with 15 BOD or less is dead. Add, say, 5d6 w/ no STUN and anyone within NCM is dead on the second hit.[/quote']

 

I don't see how the BODY from the first hit can get applied to the second hit, since its considered a second attack.

 

Aroooo

[Dust Raven]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

I think he meant it as a Limitation "BODY damage only applies if hit a second time within 12 segments" that applies retroactively.

 

So if hit once, it only does the STUN. The second hit satisfies the Limitation on both the first and second hit, so both are applied on the second hit.

 

An interesting, though very expensive, construct.

[Dust Raven]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

If you went with the above, I wouldn't worry about the disentegration effect. If the target died or almost died on the second hit, then the third hit doesn't mean much in game terms. Just say it disentegrates the target.

[Aroooo]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

I think he meant it as a Limitation "BODY damage only applies if hit a second time within 12 segments" that applies retroactively.

 

So if hit once, it only does the STUN. The second hit satisfies the Limitation on both the first and second hit, so both are applied on the second hit.

 

An interesting, though very expensive, construct.

 

That was my interpretation as well. But is it legal - delaying the BODY part of the damage like that? I'll have to re-read Delayed Effect...

 

Aroooo

[Snarf]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

For the uninitiated, the Zat is an energy weapon-sfx looks like electricity-that stuns, kills, or disintegrates its target based on the number of times you get shot with it.

Are the three shots fired in a single burst (in other words, 1 attack in Hero) or are they pretty seperate?

 

By the way, it's unusual to build a gun with recoverable charges. Recoverable charges are more meant for the kind of weapon you release in some way and can pick up off the ground after the fight. The ability to refill/recharge a gun with ammo is generally a (+0) modifier.

 

Here's a slow acting drain body disintegration, based on Drain Body:

 

Drain BODY 3d6 (standard effect: 9 points), Continuous (+1), Uncontrolled (+1/2), Ranged (+1/2), 32 Charges (+1/4), (146 Active Points); OAF (-1), STR Minimum 10 (STR Min. Cannot Add/Subtract Damage; -1), Real Weapon (-1/4), Beam (-1/4), (42 Real Points).

 

With uncontrolled, it can continue for as many turns as you have charges and you don't have to concentrate to maintain it, like you normally would have to do with a Continuous power.

 

Here's the instant death NND disintegration:

 

RKA 8d6, NND (defense is being an important character, +1), Does Body (+1), 32 Charges (+1/4), (390 Active Points); OAF (-1), STR Minimum 10 (STR Min. Cannot Add/Subtract Damage; -1), Real Weapon (-1/4), Beam (-1/4), (156 Real Points).

 

You can stick Continuous and Uncontrolled on that if you think it might take a couple extra turn to do the job sometimes.

[MadWand]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

I would build a ZAT gun as a 4d6 RKA, OAF, Beam, 0 END, Does not do BODY unless a second shot follows before first shot has been recovered from (+1/4)

 

I would not use charges - the weapons never seem to run out of ammo.

I would not use "Real weapon" - the weapons are "so advanced as to seem magic"

STR min is fine, but the min would be so low as to hardly merit a limitation.

If you want to the weapon to be more deadly you can raise the damage.

Why +1/4 on delaying the BODY effect? Well, it's really handy being able to choose whether or not you want to take prisoners or not. You could make this a -0 limitation instead. Upon taking a second shot, the target takes the BODY damage from both the first and second shot.

Why RKA, and not a drain or NND? Well, most goons don't have enough defenses to prevent getting killed -- but, we have observed appropriate defenses protecting various characters on the show from being affected by the weapon. If you are tough enough, or have enough shelding or armor, the gun is only partially effective.

The disintegration is a special effect - if you shoot at a dead body, that dead body has only the BODY and DEF of a body-sized bag of meat. If you do enough BODY, the special effect is that it is disintegrated, rather than being splattered over the landscape.

[Aroooo]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

Are the three shots fired in a single burst (in other words' date=' 1 attack in Hero) or are they pretty seperate?[/quote']

 

While I ponder all the great input, some details. The Zat is an alien weapon. Its an energy weapon - and its not that there are different modes of fire, its the same output from the weapon, but the effect builds in the target. The more appropriate way to word it would be first hit stuns, second hit kills, third hit destroys target.

 

As for the recoverable charges, I was thinking along the lines of rapid recharging capacitors, but you're all right, its not worth charges. In the 6 seasons I've watched SG, I've never seen the things run out of power.

 

Aroooo

[Guest Kolava]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

RKA 8d6, NND (defense is being an important character, +1), Does Body (+1), 32 Charges (+1/4), (390 Active Points); OAF (-1), STR Minimum 10 (STR Min. Cannot Add/Subtract Damage; -1), Real Weapon (-1/4), Beam (-1/4), (156 Real Points).

 

So the BBEG takes no damage?

[Dust Raven]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

I've been thinking about the -0 Limitation for EBs, STUN Only. Specifically, about having a weapon that fired bean bag rounds that really only knock out the target and don't cause any real damage, but can still cause Knockback and break small objects. This lead me to think about having an EB that's only partly STUN Only.

 

What does this have to do with Zat guns? Well, what about an attack Power that is STUN Only on the first shot, but not on the second shot? Is that an Advantage, a Limitation, or not worth enough of either to warrent a +/- value? If the GM allows it, you can build a Zat gun as a simple RKA (though I'd probably go with an EB NND Does BODY to get more standard results). First shot will only do STUN, while the second will do STUN and BODY (but not retroactively add in the BODY from the first shot), and the third shot will do the same as the second, but most likely will do enough BODY to vaporize the target when added to the first. This assumes you must make three seperate attack rolls, using either Rapid Fire or attacking the same target three phases in a row.

 

Another way to look at it, is to say that you can pull the trigger very quickly, that you can effectively shot the same target three times using a single attack action. In this case, you'll need a Multipower, with a seperate slot for how many times you'll fire.

 

In either case, it'll be a chore to gauge the damage to actually knock out/kill/vaporize all possible targets. It would kinda suck of your SG team each shot a bunch of Jaffa and for some reason two of them didn't fall down or die because you didn't roll enough damage.

[Hawksmoor]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

One Question.

 

How can a drain "Kill" anyone?

 

The minimum you can drain someone to is zero. Body overflow from damage is different.

 

Leave them comatose yes. Kill no.

 

Hawksmoor

[Aroooo]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

One Question.

 

How can a drain "Kill" anyone?

 

The minimum you can drain someone to is zero. Body overflow from damage is different.

 

Leave them comatose yes. Kill no.

 

Hawksmoor

 

Actually it can. I read up on that last night. Page 100, it states that a Drain BODY will kill someone if drained to "negative starting body or less," that drained Body does not recover. Physical objects will crumple to dust when drained to 0 Body.

 

That's why I wanted to use Drain as the 'third hit' because it fits the effect so well, but admit it could just be a SFX of an RKA or Does Body NND.

 

Aroooo

[Hawksmoor]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

Omigod....

 

:falls on the floor:

 

:gets back up:

 

This is so so uncool. All that power and does body and has rare defenses and its cheap?

 

:goes to build body drain man:

 

Bricks beware a 90 lb weakling is coming for you!!

[Aroooo]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

Omigod....

 

:falls on the floor:

 

:gets back up:

 

This is so so uncool. All that power and does body and has rare defenses and its cheap?

 

:goes to build body drain man:

 

Bricks beware a 90 lb weakling is coming for you!!

 

Yeah, amazing how many of those little gems exist in the Hero system.

 

Aroooo

[Dust Raven]

Re: Power Construct & Redundant Mods?

 

Omigod....

 

:falls on the floor:

 

:gets back up:

 

This is so so uncool. All that power and does body and has rare defenses and its cheap?

 

:goes to build body drain man:

 

Bricks beware a 90 lb weakling is coming for you!!

Of course, it has an even cheeper defense. And the Power isn't all the common either.