Good bye

[Chuckg]

Re: Good bye

 

> Actually, Chuck, if you hadn't stepped in and continued the argument with

> him, this thread would have probably died a fairly swift death.

 

*snorts*

 

Again, so much for "not taking sides". For somebody who claims to be such an impartial observer, you spend all of your time talking to chuck and none of it talking to nexus.

 

Kara, you're saying one thing and doing another. This makes me want to listen to you *how*?

 

> You, too, seem to "desperately" need the "Let It Go!" lecture. You're

> coming across as someone who always has to be right. If you're so sure

> you're right, why are you so worried about continuing the argument?

 

Ah, so in your world, the people who are right should shut up and yield the floor to the people who are wrong? Or, alternatively, trying to win an argument is somehow a sign of massive insecurity? If the only people who keep trying to win arguments are those who think they're wrong, what does that say about *you*, and *your* repeated attempts?

 

Of course, for some reason, your own logic *won't* apply to you. Only to Chuckg.

 

... nothing but a continual series of excuses as to why Chuckg should shut up and let Nexus have the floor -- regardless of who's right or wrong. This isn't impartial anything, Kara, and your attempt to pretend it was was cheap.

 

[snip]

> Your posting to this thread, content-wise, has provoked the responses

> that have kept it alive.

 

Because, of course, absolutely *nobody* was posting to this thread and encouraging nexus before I got here. And, of course, nexus wasn't writing post after post before I said anything.

 

Kara, the man had already made four posts bashing some other people hard (out of maybe 10 posts in the thread total) before I opened my mouth in this thread *once*, and was showing no signs of stopping. So I don't believe you.

[Chuckg]

Re: Good bye

 

> Nexus didn't say anything at first except he was pissed and he was leaving

> because he felt insulted.

 

And then he went on to say it three more times, wailing about how nasty and mean some people were.

 

> You jumped and starting "defending yourself". You're name wasn't even

> mentioned from what I saw until you volununteered it.

 

*ROTFLMBO*

 

Do you seriously want to try and pretend he was talking about anyone else? No one else has.

 

And if he wasn't talking about me, then who /was/ he talking about? Meta? Pendaran? Jeff? All of the above are good friends of mine -- to rag on them is to rag on me.

 

> He created the thread to tell people he was leaving. [snip]

 

That would've taken one post, and required a simple 'Folks, I'm leaving."

 

He made four posts.

 

All of which went out of their way to talk about how horrible some other people were.

 

Q.E.D.

 

> You've almost posted more in this thread than he has.

 

By now, yes. Of course, by now, it's not just nexus that I'm talking to...

[Chuckg]

Re: Good bye

 

> Not in character and not logical are two seperate things.

 

Not really.

 

As I said, Logic is "A implies B and B implies C means A implies C."

 

That's it. Logic is an orderly succession of events. *What* order depends on your basic starting postulates. That's elementary.

 

Logic applies equally as well to worlds with comic book physics as they do to worlds with utter realism. It's merely that in the world with comic book physics, you have a different set of starting assumptions.

 

Logic != Realism. Logic = remaining internally consistent to the original premises set up by the situation, whatever those were. The premises do *not* have to be realistic... that is to say, to be strictly consistent with real-world physics. They just have to be *internally* consistent, with *themselves*.

 

And one of the original premises of a situation is that if the bad guy is out to conquer the world, somebody had better be capable of stopping him, or he *will* conquer the world.

 

Which leads us back to the original question -- 'Since there's nobody in default CU canon capable of stopping the megavillains on the rampage, why haven't they conquered the world yet?'

 

> Expressing the real world with realistic concrete and blue skies like our

> world in terms of hero's and villians is absolutely illogical.

 

Really? Then why do 99+% of the comic book worlds out there have ordinary concrete and blue skies on Earth?

 

A directly observed fact needs no explanation to exist, it simply is. First principle of epistemology.

 

> Thats why you cant really justify any super hero comic based universe as

> logical.

 

Logic is when you take a set of postulates, apply a set of rules, and reach an outcome. Which postulates and which rules are changeable from world to world. The key point is, you don't change the rules after you've started, and neither do you go against your initial posits.

 

> RPG's are systemized which implies it has internal logic and structure. That

> however doesnt mean that the rules are logical in accordance to real world

> phenomenon.

 

The problem is, the default CU as published isn't logical even in accordance to *game* phenomenon -- which is the whole problem.

 

> Logic is the enemy of Drama.

 

Logic is the avoidance of plot holes -- and plot holes are the enemy of Drama.

[Chuckg]

Re: Good bye

 

> That more people are sympathetic to Nexus tells you that I have a problem?

 

Yup.

 

To be consistent with the set of principles and motivations you want me to believe you have, the proper time and place for this lecture of yours would have been to nexus, in the last thread, yesterday. Or to nexus, after his first four posts in this thread, before I showed up, yesterday.

 

You didn't even bother trying. As far as you were concerned, an entire thread bitching about the horrible behavior of people -- even repeat statements that the entire board was turning to crap -- was just fine so long as Nexus was doing it.

 

But God forbid anybody bitch about *his* behavior.

 

> All righty. Clearly reason has left the building.

 

You know, for people who claim that I call everybody names just because they don't agree, you sure are doing a lot of that yourself today.

 

I have disagreed with Katherine, therefore I must be nuts. That's what you just did.

[Chuckg]

Re: Good bye

 

I'm sorry ladies' date=' but you have it all wrong. ChuckG is only continuing this to pad his post count. [/quote']

 

I don't give a crap about post count. I have /never/ given a crap about post count. And even if I did, there are far easier ways to inflate post count, that make you a lot more popular.

 

Right now I'm running on pure annoyance -- with nexus, and now with his crop of loyal-defenders-who-pretend-to-be-purely-impartial-and-are-anything-but.

 

As far as I can see, there are only two people in this thread who are being even halfway honest about how they really feel and why they really posted here -- and that's me and nexus. And, natch, my significant annoyance with nexus' behavior is what prompted me to come into this thread in the first place.

 

Oh, and for those who want to hit 'report to mod' -- go ahead. Really. That's what mods are there for. They warn me off, I get warned off. They don't, I won't.

 

If you want me to follow your 'advice', it had better come with the official weight of authority behind it. Peer pressure, by itself, really isn't something that bugs me very much. I take advice only from friends. You people ain't friends, and somehow, for some reason, I really doubt you want to be.

[Kara Zor-El]

Re: Good bye

 

> Actually, Chuck, if you hadn't stepped in and continued the argument with

> him, this thread would have probably died a fairly swift death.

 

*snorts*

 

Again, so much for "not taking sides". For somebody who claims to be such an impartial observer, you spend all of your time talking to chuck and none of it talking to nexus.

 

Kara, you're saying one thing and doing another. This makes me want to listen to you *how*?

 

> You, too, seem to "desperately" need the "Let It Go!" lecture. You're

> coming across as someone who always has to be right. If you're so sure

> you're right, why are you so worried about continuing the argument?

 

Ah, so in your world, the people who are right should shut up and yield the floor to the people who are wrong? Or, alternatively, trying to win an argument is somehow a sign of massive insecurity? If the only people who keep trying to win arguments are those who think they're wrong, what does that say about *you*, and *your* repeated attempts?

 

Of course, for some reason, your own logic *won't* apply to you. Only to Chuckg.

 

... nothing but a continual series of excuses as to why Chuckg should shut up and let Nexus have the floor -- regardless of who's right or wrong. This isn't impartial anything, Kara, and your attempt to pretend it was was cheap.

 

[snip]

> Your posting to this thread, content-wise, has provoked the responses

> that have kept it alive.

 

Because, of course, absolutely *nobody* was posting to this thread and encouraging nexus before I got here. And, of course, nexus wasn't writing post after post before I said anything.

 

Kara, the man had already made four posts bashing some other people hard (out of maybe 10 posts in the thread total) before I opened my mouth in this thread *once*, and was showing no signs of stopping. So I don't believe you.

 

I'm not saying NOBODY. You don't listen. I'm saying that you've perpetuated this thing way beyond the life span these threads normally have.

 

And you don't believe anyone that doesn't agree with you, Chuckg. I'm sorry if holding you responsible for your behavior is "wrong" or taking sides. And you're not trying to win an argument. You're trying to browbeat someone into agreeing with you by being smug, condescending and superior about a difference of opinion. Arguments based on opinion are never right or wrong.

 

Sorry for hoping you could be an adult about it for a change. You're not always right. No one is. I also apologize for appealing to your better side. I was hoping that you had one.

 

Have a nice life, Chuck. Go ahead and flame away, sonny. I know you'll have to have the last word. I hope it makes you feel better.

[Chuckg]

Re: Good bye

 

> I'm not saying NOBODY. You don't listen. I'm saying that you've perpetuated

> this thing way beyond the life span these threads normally have.

 

"Normally" have? 'Scuse me, but I find that to be a *very* interesting choice of words? "Normally"?

 

Does nexus do this kind of thing often? Are 'internet suicide notes' and 'bashing threads' accepted practice here?

 

If so, then why are you bent out of shape about *me*?

 

> And you don't believe anyone that doesn't agree with you, Chuckg.

 

Really? I seem to recall posting several posts saying 'I stand corrected.', without comment, whenever shown to be wrong on a point of fact.

 

The most recent being to Katherine, yesterday.

 

Of course, that was on a thread where Katherine was simply talking about facts and reason -- and got responded to in kind. In this thread, she's been anything but... and got a much less warm response.

 

You'd think that people would learn after a while what works and what doesn't work, but apparently not.

 

Here's a clue. What you're trying now does not work. It will *never* work. Try something different. *Substantially* different.

 

> Sorry for hoping you could be an adult about it for a change.

 

Again, so much for your pose of impartiality.

 

And again, for people who gripe so much about my inability to tolerate the existence of opposing POVs, you sure do a lot of name-calling. Now, the act of disagreeing with you isn't just foolish, it's also childish.

 

At the rate I'm going, I can probably get the impartial defenders of civility here to be accusing me of insanity by this afternoon, and devil worship by tomorrow morning. All the while they're congratulating themselves on what adult people they are, too. (sarcasm warning!)

 

[snip[

> I also apologize for appealing to your better side. I was hoping that you

> had one.

 

Perhaps I should have taken the sarcasm warning off that 'devil worship' joke, then. I think I just got accused of having no soul. Or, at least, of having no conscience.

 

*shrugs*

 

Whatever.

[Thrakazog]

Re: Good bye

 

FILTH FLARG FILTH FOUL FILTH FLARG FLARG FOUL FILTH...

 

 

 

Oh, poop. I'm late again. Oh well.

 

 

Ahem.

 

 

Cum bay yah, my Lord....cum bay yah.....

[Agent X]

Re: Good bye

 

Telling somebody that he's wrong is automatically 'condescendingly personal'?

 

Lord Liaden *definitely* hit it on the head with you lot, then.

 

Here's a clue -- if we hold diametrically opposite opinions on a matter that is not capable of encompassing both simultaneously, then one of us *is* wrong, and all that remains is the process of discovery to determine which one.

 

Unless, of course, the very idea that you *might* be wrong is an intolerable personal affront, at which points, nuts to you.

I seriously doubt that Lord Liaden would want his comments to be interpreted the way you have.

[Metaphysician]

Re: Good bye

 

Just out of curiousity, how *is* someone supposed to go about arguing with a person's statements??

[Chuckg]

Re: Good bye

 

Just out of curiousity' date=' how *is* someone supposed to go about arguing with a person's statements??[/quote']

 

Apparently, in some mysterious 'adult' way that doesn't involve actually disagreeing...?

[Agent X]

Re: Good bye

 

Nexus,

 

Take a few days out and come back. Getting upset with what someone says is perfectly reasonable as it has happened to a whole load of us on the site.

There is a lot of good information, ideas etc, to which you have contributed.

You won't please all the people all the time and people will disagree with what you do.

 

As regards ChuckG. He managed to get Raven'sPath thread on Games Gone Awry shut down. And is free and liberal in his use of swear words forgetting that this is a family board. It looks like becoming a necessity to report various of his posts to the administrators. If we cannot persuade him to behave then we can ask them to have a word with him.

If it was just one thread and just one person complaining then it would be excessive. It isn't. Worldmaker's summation is entirely accurate. Chuck is being condescending and personal. And if he continues attacking people, I for one will report him regardless of who the target is.

Sounds like a plan to me.

[Vondy]

Re: Good bye

 

Happy Trails

[Chuckg]

Re: Good bye

 

Here's an even better one -- report me now.

 

Seriously. Don't threaten, don't posture -- just drop the time *right now*.

 

If you can. If you actually have any just cause too. If you're not just trying to win a pissing contest on a bluff.

 

Well, bluff called.

 

Edit -- where the bloody hell is the 'Report to Mod' button? *shrugs* Ah well, so much for dropping the dime on myself. One of you will have to do it.

[Agent X]

Re: Good bye

 

Kara' date=' the man had already made four posts bashing some other people hard (out of maybe 10 posts in the thread total) before I opened my mouth in this thread *once*, and was showing no signs of stopping. So I don't believe you.[/quote'] I noticed three posts before he responded to your posts. In those three posts he mentioned one name, Tesuji.

 

Now, your statement is inaccurate and I have witnessed you lambaste others for these sorts of inaccuracies. I just thought you'd like to know.

[Chuckg]

Re: Good bye

 

*looks again*

 

I stand corrected re: three posts as opposed to four posts. I miscounted.

 

As for 'mentioning no names' -- that, however, I do not accept. Does anyone seriously want to pretend that he was *not* talking about me (or my some of friends, such as meta)? So far, even nexus hasn't tried that.

 

I also stand pat on 'showed no signs of stopping'. He still didn't.

[Agent X]

Re: Good bye

 

If you want me to follow your 'advice'' date=' it had better come with the official weight of authority behind it. Peer pressure, by itself, really isn't something that bugs me very much. I take advice only from friends. You people ain't friends, and somehow, for some reason, I really doubt you want to be.[/quote']Considering your commentary on this and many other threads, I think you are right. At this moment, I sincerely doubt many posters want to befriend you.

[Chuckg]

Re: Good bye

 

Considering your commentary on this and many other threads' date=' I think you are right. At this moment, I sincerely doubt many posters [b']want [/b] to befriend you.

 

I sincerely doubt that as well.

 

Then again, I don't really care. The way I live my life, I have few friends -- but those few friends I *do* have are very, very *good* friends.

 

(And no, that does /not/ mean 'they always agree with Chuckg'.)

 

All I need, really.

[Agent X]

Re: Good bye

 

Just out of curiousity' date=' how *is* someone supposed to go about arguing with a person's statements??[/quote']They probably would want their statement to be interpreted in context.

[Chuckg]

Re: Good bye

 

They probably would want their statement to be interpreted in context.

 

Contest was hardly the problem here.

[Simon]

Re: Good bye

 

Here's an even better one -- report me now.

 

Seriously. Don't threaten, don't posture -- just drop the time *right now*.

 

If you can. If you actually have any just cause too. If you're not just trying to win a pissing contest on a bluff.

 

Well, bluff called.

 

Edit -- where the bloody hell is the 'Report to Mod' button? *shrugs* Ah well, so much for dropping the dime on myself. One of you will have to do it.

Don't bother.

 

Frankly, chuckles, you're being an argumentative ass. And we really don't have need of any more of those around here (of late).

 

So....I'm going to officially overstep my bounds and put you in a "time out" -- also known as a temporary ban.

 

Ben can (of course) override this when he gets in for the day (making it a very short temporary ban). Or he can make it permanent -- that's his call.

[Agent X]

Re: Good bye

 

I sincerely doubt that as well.

 

Then again, I don't really care. The way I live my life, I have few friends -- but those few friends I *do* have are very, very *good* friends.

 

(And no, that does /not/ mean 'they always agree with Chuckg'.)

 

All I need, really.

I don't remember asking how many friends you had or how good they were.

 

Look, it's getting tiresome. Nobody enjoys being treated the way you treat people when there is a debate. You don't simply debate. You make snide, condescending statements and when someone calls you on it you ramp up the character assassination attempts.

 

Death Tribble is tired of it. Worldmaker is tired of it. Kara is tired of it. Katherine appears tired of it. I'm tired of it. If you really want to get reported, just do what you do and we'll see what happens. Be careful what you wish for though. If you continue to alienate people and get reported often enough, Ben will get tired of it too.

 

The sad thing, for me, is that I have a lot of the same tastes in character design, etc. Unfortunately, the way you make your point either reflects a very mean-spirited person or someone totally devoid of social skills.

 

So yeah, I think you need to consider why so many are more sympathetic to Nexus than to you and your running buddy, Metaphysician. I'd like to have you stay on the boards for the many positive contributions you make but I have a feeling you will be paving the road for your own departure if you don't stop chewing people up when they disagree with you.

[Metaphysician]

Re: Good bye

 

And how, exactly, is it "chewing out" to say that a person's statement is wrong, for X reason??

 

If a person makes a factual statement ( "the Champions Universe does not need powerful superhumans to explain why the villains haven't taken over" ), how *are* you supposed to say "You are wrong, and here is why??"

[Agent X]

Re: Good bye

 

And how, exactly, is it "chewing out" to say that a person's statement is wrong, for X reason??

 

If a person makes a factual statement ( "the Champions Universe does not need powerful superhumans to explain why the villains haven't taken over" ), how *are* you supposed to say "You are wrong, and here is why??"

I'm not going to argue with you. There shouldn't be any need to. Maybe, you're too close to it or something but I would drop this if I were you. Better threads and better days. [waves]

[Simon]

Re: Good bye

 

And how, exactly, is it "chewing out" to say that a person's statement is wrong, for X reason??

 

If a person makes a factual statement ( "the Champions Universe does not need powerful superhumans to explain why the villains haven't taken over" ), how *are* you supposed to say "You are wrong, and here is why??"

There is a way to state your opinion without deriding others and starting a flamewar.

 

The fact that I'm the one having to tell you this should say something about just how far over the line Chuckg has gone.