Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

[Oruncrest]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

All my point was' date=' is that the origin is included earlly enough in the series that I suspect it was always part of Dan Jurgens' vision of the character.[/quote']

Oh, I'm fully aware that Dan Jurgens meant for that to be Booster's origin from the start, but from the moment he decided on that origin, he felt the need to remind us that Booster really is a nice guy, that he actually cares about people, that he's not a mercenary (Booster Gold #17) or a hero for hire (DC Heroes RPG Background/Roster Book pg. 30). That irritated me. I know Booster's a Good Guy Mr. Jurgens, you don't have to tell me that every freaking story (also, the next time you write a comic book, please remember to show us things that you want us to know, not tell us).

 

Any disappointment can only come from the read making false assumptions about the character as opposed to a change being made by the creators-- which is how I interpreted the original comment.

 

I don't think Clonus was talking about Booster's origin, though. I think he was talking about how Booster was presented to us in Booster Gold #1 - as a High Flyin' Wheelin' Dealin', Movie Starrin', Spandex Wearin' Celebrity. After BG#6, he became an Opportunistic, Money-Grubbin' Swindler who fled to the 20th Century because no one would fall for his lies in the 25th. Obviously, Dan Jurgens felt that many of his readers would have that reaction, otherwise he wouldn't have spent so much time reminding us that 'Booster's a really nice guy - really!' Given that Booster Gold was canceled after another 19 issues should tell you that most of the fans didn't buy it.

 

Keith Giffen didn't buy it either. And Booster's still trying to recover from the damage that Keith did to him in Justice League International/ America, Formerly Known As the Justice League, and I Can't Believe It's Not the Justice League. Booster's Justice League Unlimited story, 'The Greatest Story Never Told' didn't do him any favors either, what with Booster asking J'Onn J'Onzz how much money he made after taxes and telling the scientist that he came to this century to get rich.

 

So yeah, I can understand Clonus' opinion about how that damaged Booster Gold for him, and how he preferred the Booster Gold of Booster Gold #1-5 over the Booster Gold from BG#6 on.

[clsage]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

 

 

There's no fixed rule for how completing claims should be adjudicated, especially with all the odd cases that can come up in a superhero world. But I'd say demonstrating that your ownership of the items was in line with the intentions of the creators and historical owners by actually transforming into something in line with their intentions and then acting in accordance with their values would be pressing your claim in the strongest way short of proving that you personally were the items' creator and owner.

 

It would be very reasonable for the museum to want to negotiate a compromise solution. The elf hero could spend regular time in the museum and allow visitors. Even if it was only a fifteen minute showing a week, the attendance would be huge - enough eventually to make up for even a huge dollar loss on the item. The elf hero might be filmed and scientifically examined, and sign over the rights to that data to compensate the museum for its scientific loss. The elven hero might say that his code was against both those things, but he could undertake a quest to compensate the museum with other items that could be legitimately examined and shown to the public.

 

If the elf hero didn't do anything like that, when reasonable compromises were on offer, then yes that would be unheroic.

 

But if the museum just took the attitude that they owned everything and what the elves wanted with their own sacred items was of no importance, then they'd be acting like a typical nuisance hunted, and morally they could be treated as such.

 

 

Interesting and well stated...Thanks.

 

As for the heroes origin...I'm not quite sure yet if she is inhabited by the

spirit of the original warrior thru the artifacts (the least likely option) or if she

is simply a member (albeit unkowningly) of the "Elvish bloodline" and her

contact with the artifacts helps her realize that hidden potential....

 

Based on a suggestion derived from a prior post, I am considering having the

individual responsible for the artifacts discovery (or at least someone from

the team in question) knowledgeable about such things and, thru exposure to

the character in question and some form of mystic 'conference' with the artifacts

they determined that the items should be 'made available' to the character,

so that they could 'connect and fullfill the destiny in question'. So the powers

that be at the museum might just turn a sort of blind eye at the items being

used...Tho' the insurance company might have a different opinion. Hmmm.

 

I definately like the "Semi-Public ID" part of having the character spend some

'public service time' at the museum on a regular basis, since it allows for some

plot hooks.

 

On a related note: I am still stumbling around with finding a solid character

name. Both for the curator ID and for the hero ID. Anyone with more knowledge

of things Celtic, farie and/or Elvish have any suggestions ? Thanks.

 

-Carl-

[Cygnia]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

Well, if you're going for legends, there's always the Morrigan (Celtic warrior goddess).

 

http://www.maryjones.us/jce/morrigan.html

[clsage]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

Well, if you're going for legends, there's always the Morrigan (Celtic warrior goddess).

 

http://www.maryjones.us/jce/morrigan.html

 

 

Thanks....Hmmmm. Well, IF I use that name, then it does give me a 'hook'

for a possible nemesis, since according to the site listed Morrigan had

some siblings. So what if, in this telling of the tale, there was some form

of sibling rivalry between the sisters. And across the centuries, bearers of

the bloodline have been seperated and have forgotten each other. Till the

discovery of these artifacts causes the potential within them to be unleashed ?

 

 

-Carl-

[Querysphinx]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

If you wanted a more historical name you could go with Boudica the warrior queen.

[Clonus]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

Huh? That was part of his original origin as presented in his first book.

 

And from the issue in which it was revealed, I liked him a lot less just as many people like a jock less when they find out that he owes his success to a rigorous program of exercise and steroids. I don't care that it was what they always intended. It was a big mistake if they expected him to carry his own book.

[clsage]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

 

Thanks....Hmmmm. Well, IF I use that name, then it does give me a 'hook'

for a possible nemesis, since according to the site listed Morrigan had

some siblings. So what if, in this telling of the tale, there was some form

of sibling rivalry between the sisters. And across the centuries, bearers of

the bloodline have been seperated and have forgotten each other. Till the

discovery of these artifacts causes the potential within them to be unleashed ?

 

 

 

An additional tangental thought and question(s): anyone know off hand

if the Celts had a specific name for goblin-like creatures ? Or if they even had

such things in their mythos ? I've started some web scanning about it but

figured I'd pick the brains of those here too....I'm looking for some possible

plot hooks and was a bit inspired by the attached image. If it was a Norse

character I'd just call them trolls but.....

 

EDIT: I think I found my answer: Boggarts. Basically Brownies gone bad. Which

would allow for there to be a mix of good and bad within the race for the character

to interact with....Hmmm.

 

My sources:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brownie_%28mythology%29

 

and

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boggart

 

-Carl-

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

Oh' date=' I'm fully aware that Dan Jurgens meant for that to be Booster's origin from the start, but from the moment he decided on that origin, he felt the need to remind us that Booster really is a nice guy, that he actually cares about people, that he's not a mercenary ([i']Booster Gold #17[/i]) or a hero for hire (DC Heroes RPG Background/Roster Book pg. 30). That irritated me. I know Booster's a Good Guy Mr. Jurgens, you don't have to tell me that every freaking story (also, the next time you write a comic book, please remember to show us things that you want us to know, not tell us).

 

I think the theory was that Booster was NOT initially a nice guy. He was basically a crook, but one who was at least trying to do the right thing and edging along that road to be a hero.

 

I don't think Clonus was talking about Booster's origin' date=' though. I think he was talking about how Booster was [b']presented[/b] to us in Booster Gold #1 - as a High Flyin' Wheelin' Dealin', Movie Starrin', Spandex Wearin' Celebrity.

 

To me, Booster was not "presented to us". We saw him through the same eyes the puiblic saw him. Much like, in Thunderbolts #1, we saw a band of brand-new true-blue Super Heros...until the last page gave us a look at something beyond what they wanted the public to see.

 

My recollection of the original intro of BG was that he was not a Super because he was a Good Guy, but because he could make money from endorsements. He was modelled less as a classic SuperHero Boy Scout and more as a modern-day celebrity.

 

After BG#6' date=' he became an Opportunistic, Money-Grubbin' Swindler who fled to the 20th Century because no one would fall for his lies in the 25th. [/quote']

 

I would say rather that, after BG#6, we knewhim for the Opportunistic, Money-Grubbin' Swindler who fled to the 20th Century because no one would fall for his lies in the 25th. He didn't change. We just got access to more information.

 

Obviously' date=' Dan Jurgens felt that many of his readers would have that reaction, otherwise he wouldn't have spent so much time reminding us that 'Booster's a really nice guy - really!' Given that [i']Booster Gold[/i] was canceled after another 19 issues should tell you that most of the fans didn't buy it.

 

Again, the intent was a nice guy who had flaws - greed being the major one - and had done some not-nice things as a consequence. Was he trying to do the right thing? Well, to some extent - he was a hero, not a thief, at least. But he was still a hero for money, not a hero to do the right thing.

 

He was different from the established norm, making his publication a risk. But don't we keep hearing from certain aspects of the readers that they want something different, not just the same old thing? Publishing Superman was a risk DC took in the late 1930's. No one had ever heard of a "super hero". Conventional wisdom of the time said it would never sell. DC took a risk. It paid off. They took a risk on BG. It certainly didn't have the same payout - but what realistically could? Although the book did run 25 issues, not bad for the times. The character kept appearing, unlike many who simply faded into limbo. And his new book seems to be doing OK.

 

Keith Giffen didn't buy it either. And Booster's still trying to recover from the damage that Keith did to him in Justice League International/ America' date=' [i']Formerly Known As the Justice League[/i], and I Can't Believe It's Not the Justice League. Booster's Justice League Unlimited story, 'The Greatest Story Never Told' didn't do him any favors either, what with Booster asking J'Onn J'Onzz how much money he made after taxes and telling the scientist that he came to this century to get rich.

 

So yeah, I can understand Clonus' opinion about how that damaged Booster Gold for him, and how he preferred the Booster Gold of Booster Gold #1-5 over the Booster Gold from BG#6 on.

 

Keith Giffen did a lot of damage to a lot of characters by turning the Justice League into a humor mag. The damage to Blue Beetle is on a similar scale. Maybe DC can shunt all that Giffen Bwaa Ha Ha to a separate world in the 52 (and then blow it up...).

 

And from the issue in which it was revealed' date=' I liked him a lot less just as many people like a jock less when they find out that he owes his success to a rigorous program of exercise and steroids. I don't care that it was what they always intended. It was a big mistake if they expected him to carry his own book.[/quote']

 

I disagree. I think that Booster was intended to be a very tarnished hero from the start. DC chose to take a risk on a character that you really weren't INTENDED to like all that much, especially at his low point as a money grubbing opportunist. The risk didn't pan out. Many don't. But they took a chance on something different. If no one ever did, as noted above, we wouldn't have had Superman, or any of the Supers that follow.

 

It's very tough to guess how the readership will react. In early Marvel, the Hulk got his own book, but he didn't really catch on, so it only lasted six issues. I guess the public didn't like heroes who acted out of rage and anger instead of a motivation to do the right thing. At or about the same time, they published a one shot in the last issue of a cancelled book, since they didn't see any likelihood that this Spider-Man would be well received by the readers. We all know how that worked out.

 

Stan Lee took another big risk with that character in the early '70s. He published a couple of issues with a significant drug subplot. He had been asked to do so by the US Gov't. The Comics Code wouildn't put the seal on. Stan decided to publish anyway, a serious risk in those days, since it wasn't all that long since the Code had saved comics from disappearing forever, and books without the stamp were commonly boycotted. That risk also paid off.

 

If no one ever took a risk, not much would move forward. If there wasn't a real chance of a negative result, it wouldn't be called a "risk".

[Querysphinx]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

An additional tangental thought and question(s): anyone know off hand

if the Celts had a specific name for goblin-like creatures ? Or if they even had

such things in their mythos ? I've started some web scanning about it but

figured I'd pick the brains of those here too....I'm looking for some possible

plot hooks and was a bit inspired by the attached image. If it was a Norse

character I'd just call them trolls but.....

 

EDIT: I think I found my answer: Boggarts. Basically Brownies gone bad. Which

would allow for there to be a mix of good and bad within the race for the character

to interact with....Hmmm.

 

My sources:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brownie_%28mythology%29

 

and

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boggart

 

-Carl-

 

There's also the Redcap

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redcap

[Cygnia]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

Heck, there's the whole concept of the Wild Hunt and the Unseelie Court as well.

 

Another possible villain could be Arawn, Celtic god of the Underworld (used in the Prydain Chronicles by Lloyd Alexander).

 

The following are all mentioned in Brian Froud & Alan Lee's "Faeries" book in having some sort of malicious bent.

 

Hags (British Isles)

Jack-in-Irons (Yorkshire)

Leanan-Sidhe (Isle of Man, Ireland blood-sucking vampire who is also the muse of poets. "Those inspired by her live brilliant, though short, lives.")

Aughisky (Ireland water-horse related to the Kelpie of Scotland. "If the Aughisky is ridden inland, the rider is quite safe, but the slightest smell or sight of sea water will spell death to the rider...")

Nuckelavee (Scotland, water-faerie)

Jenny Greenteeth & Peg Powler (water hags)

[clsage]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

Another possible villain could be Arawn, Celtic god of the Underworld (used in the Prydain Chronicles by Lloyd Alexander).

 

Thanks for the great leads....And in my looking up Arawn, I found that in the

Prydain novels he has a female consort named Achren, descibed thusly on

Wikipedia:

 

"Achren is a powerful enchantress, and was apparently the one who taught

Arawn to use his own powers before he became more powerful than she."

 

And since I'm really wanting Siobhán's major adversary to be a female (the

whole balance of light and dark thing) Achren might be a reasonable choice.

Even if it's not purely accurate historically or mythologically, as I'm blending

a novels version with actual myth (if there can be said to be such a thing).

But it is a superhero game after all and so most anything can happen, yes ?

 

And yeah, I think I've decided that, for the curator ID at least, the characters

name will be Siobhán. Don't have a last name or hero name yet tho.....

 

EDIT: As for a last name, I have become intrigued by the idea of linking the

Elvish bloodline to some famous female warriors, including Joan De Arc. So I'm

toying with giving Siobhán the family name of Joans' mother, which according to

my research was either Vouthon or Romée, depending on the particular source.

And I think that Siobhán Vouthon does have an alliterative ring to it. Even if

it might seem more French than Celtic.....

 

-Carl-

[Jaxom]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

With respect to the "less a hero" question, I think that the answer is to ask "what kind of campaign is this?" In a golden age, 4-color campaign I would say this should be avoided. In a gritty iron age comic I would find it par for the course.

 

The key to this is going to be defining the change in character. If this person thought that stealing items from the museum was acceptible, probably hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of museum property, then has anything changed? Is that still acceptible behavior? If not, why not? And does that mean that you should give the items back? The hardest part of this is going to be justifying why you are comfortable using these stolen items to punish other people who steal things.

 

 

For example, one of my more interesting characters was a defense attorney who found an artifact which saved his life at a cost. Think of it as a come-to-Jesus moment. He's been *forced* to adopt a different life outlook and so he still maintains his lawfirm and is trying to keep that going without offending his clients while donning his mask evenings. Makes for an interesting cross between "The Firm" and a Dark Knight Batman concept. I dread the day the GMs start crossing threads from my background (a bunch of DNPCs, some Hunteds (Watching) and a Secret ID)...

 

 

In general, I love the idea for the character but the hard part is going to be finding a good definition of the psyche the condones his/her own stealing and still is justified being a hero/vigilante.

[assault]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

With respect to the "less a hero" question' date=' I think that the answer is to ask "what kind of campaign is this?" In a golden age, 4-color campaign I would say this should be avoided. In a gritty iron age comic I would find it par for the course.[/quote']

 

I wouldn't have any problem with it for a golden age campaign. The issue simply wouldn't arise.

 

Silver age might be a bit rockier (Comics Code!), but again it probably wouldn't come up unless your players are into over-thinking.

 

Booster Gold, of course, was Bronze Age.

 

The whole problem would simply go away if the character just "found" the gear, or stole it from someone who doesn't count. There is, in fact, a difference between finding Thor's hammer in a cave and stealing it from a museum.

[Blue]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

I have several character origins that begin with ill-gotten goods.

 

As a "stormbringer" homage, I had a hero who commandeered an evil sword from a sinister knight. The intelligent sword was always at odds with him and he spent a lot of time trying to will it to do things (A pretty good limitation on many special abilities).

 

I had a hero who was an actual thief, robbing graves, until he took a cursed item off of the wrong one and had to fight for justice as a means of clearing the curse. Reluctant hero is interesting to play. At first it starts out as "belly-aching guy", but slowly he evolved into a guy who gained satisfaction from doing these things.

 

Dr.MadHatten was the hacker name for a mental patient who created a virtual partner, an AI hamed "QH" (As in Queen of Hearts). As part of his delusion, he had a fixation on women named "Alice". Ultimately, one such target fought back by stealing the device which allowed her to "shrink down" (Send herself into the internet). I abandoned this idea later without ever using it when I decided I had plenty of hackers in my champions game already and would never run the storyline. So now I'm thinking I may rework it without the internet, and Alice as "Malice"--a woman with shrinking powers.

[Clonus]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

I wouldn't have any problem with it for a golden age campaign. The issue simply wouldn't arise.

 

Silver age might be a bit rockier (Comics Code!), but again it probably wouldn't come up unless your players are into over-thinking.

 

Booster Gold, of course, was Bronze Age.

.

 

Iron. Iron isn't just about megaviolence. It's about deconstruction and cynicism, abandonment of traditional heroic ethics as being "unrealistic". Booster Gold came out the same year Watchmen did, the year Punisher got his first miniseries, just a year before Marshall Law comes out. It's the start of the Iron Age and Booster, the athlete who got expelled from sports for betting on games and then stole his powers so he could play hero and get back the fame and money is right there along with with the other heros who don't play by the old rules.

[David Blue]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

Iron. Iron isn't just about megaviolence. It's about deconstruction and cynicism' date=' abandonment of traditional heroic ethics as being "unrealistic". Booster Gold came out the same year Watchmen did, the year Punisher got his first miniseries, just a year before Marshall Law comes out. It's the start of the Iron Age and Booster, the athlete who got expelled from sports for betting on games and then stole his powers so he could play hero and get back the fame and money is right there along with with the other heros who don't play by the old rules.[/quote']

I think so.

 

My point about the elven hero is that he doesn't need to be like that at all. He could be a post-iron, heroism restored sort of character. The museum authorities could be irrelevant and forgotten, a real option in the golden age, or they could be hunters like J. Jonah Jameson in a Silver Age game, or the origin could be part of a bronze age story about the racist white establishment needing to learn respect for the rights of all other races (you could have native Americans, elves, aliens and other races reclaiming their rights from honkie scholars), or in an iron age story reclaiming the items might save them from being replaced by fakes and destroyed, along with the rest of the irreplaceable items in the museum for, sick kicks at some evil billionaire's parties, or in a fairly hopeful post-iron game with a lot of character building, the museum might provide the elf hero with some nice normals to interact with, a bunch of good looking scenery to pose in front of and save from thieves and vandals, and a place to meet and be met by other heroes.

[Adventus]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

I have a character named Force Knight. He got his powers while stealing a laptop computer from a science lab at the local university. He did it while the scientist was running some tests on an experimental force field projector and the power source is a trans-dimensional power tap. While he was stealing the laptop, VIPER broke thru the outside wall in their usual subtle style. This completely disrupted the experiment and a stray shot hit the power source. Which I was hiding behind. The Trans-dimensional power tap went into me, giving me force field powers. I ran out of there and hid for a while.

 

My character joined the group after he stopped a robbery at a big shindig for 'important' people. He was actually there to steal the jewel. The press labeled him a hero. it was only later , away from the cameras, that the truth came out. He was given 2 choices. 1. Prison for 10-15 years 2 join the local super-group and wear an ankle monitoring device. He took option 2. Force powers really help when stealing things. Need a lockpick, create one on the spot.

[The Weapon]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

Well, it might depend on who was responsible for "donating" the artifacts in the first place. It may be a case of the donor "sensing the destiny" of the hero to be and set it up for them to be...acquired.

 

Is her secret ID a suspect in the artifacts' theft at all (if not the thief itself, then someone who passed on "insider information") ?

 

Whether or not the donor wanted her to steal them is irrevelent, she didn't know that and neither did the museum. If they did they probably wouldn't have spent all that money on the display. She's a theif. Of course given how many of the heros break the law we'll probably let it pass. Plus she may not have been responsible for her actions what with the artifacts messing with her head.

[The Weapon]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

Is it really stealing if she's the rightful owner?

 

If something compelled her to use the artifacts, then can that something be considered the will of the original owner in any way, whether it's a spell or another agency putting the items in the character's way?

 

It may be that whoever dug 'em up is the thief, not your hero. =P

 

Come to think of it who does own something that's been buried in the ground for hundreds of years? I mean most of the time it's the person who digs it up but if it was buried for safekeeping and the owners still "alive" in some sense...

[David Blue]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

Come to think of it who does own something that's been buried in the ground for hundreds of years? I mean most of the time it's the person who digs it up but if it was buried for safekeeping and the owners still "alive" in some sense...

Exactly.

 

If someone breaks into the museum, steals something, and tries to fence it, that's one thing.

 

If, when they examine the item and take it, they transform into one of the people that made and owned that item, and start doing things in line with their values, that's strong evidence that the claims of the original owners are still live - live enough to work magic! - even though that had not been immediately apparent.

 

Even if you say that to the extent of the incompatibility between the property rights of the original owners and the property rights of the museum, the property rights of the original owners are suppressed, that still leaves open what those rights are, what the extent of the conflict really is, and what might be achieved in negotiations between friendly and reasonable people.

 

Outside Iron Age conventions of story-telling, most people don't get into museum work to be plundering and destructive enemies of the ancient peoples whose creations they catalog and display. The Greek antiquities guys are likely to the think highly of the Greeks, the Roman antiquities people to think well of the Romans, and so on. In a world where there are more exotic options, it's a fair bet that the exotic antiquities people are going to be symathetic to virtuous ancient cultures, or even mildly xenophiliac.

 

By and large, they're not likely to ignore the interests of the museum in making a deal that's good for everyone. They're not likely to take whatever view of the museum's property rights is most vexatious to the real life elf that they're actually getting to meet, and stick to that regardless of reason, Presence, Persuasion and so on.

 

Mind you, if the elven hero starts off by energy blasting staff, to that people's awe turns to fear and hatred, that's different. In a situation like this, first impressions count for a lot.

[DusterBoy]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

Looks like the Tuatha de Danann have struck again.

 

There's a breed of evil Celtic giant called the Fomori who were the TdD's hereditary enemies.

 

About a hero "stealing" his artifact/s, look at "The Hobbit". Bilbo "acquired" the Ring from Gollum so technically he's a thief. But the Ring was trying to leave Gollum - to get back to Sauron. Bilbo chanced upon in the dark and put it in his pocket. He didn't realise at that point that it "belonged" to anyone.

 

And consider that Gollum/Smeagol murdered Deagol to get the Ring - after Isildur had "stolen" it from Sauron in battle, claiming it as "weregild" or some such. So who's the real thief? And the point is, the Ring allowed Bilbo to resolve the conflict between the Dwarves, Men and Elves - an undoubtedly heroic action. On his deathbed, Thorin forgave Bilbo for stealing the Arkenstone - again, without which the coalition would have been impossible. And Bilbo never saw himself as a hero, or a thief.

 

As Gandalf points out to Frodo in "LotR:Fellowship of the Ring": "I can put it no plainer than by saying Bilbo was meant to find the Ring, and not by its maker. In which case you were meant to have it. And that may be a comforting thought."

 

The point here (yes I have one - I'm not just rambling or quoting Tolkein for the hell of it) is that is taking something you were meant to have - no matter by whom - stealing? Even though the museum could legitimately press charges against Character X for theft, and the local PD would also regard her actions unfavourably.

 

I think it's how she uses these artifacts as well as their provenance. If she is (literally) fighting for "good" with them against inimical forces, then she can be properly seen as heroic.

 

I think if I was working with her, I would regard her as heroic - plus I'm a sucker for Elves.

[assault]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

First: Bilbo is irrelevant. He's a fantasy character, not a superhero.

 

Second: Personally, I would be reluctant to allow a player to play an "Elf" in a superheroic game. A mermaid, or an Ancient Greek nymph, yes, but not an Elf or a Dwarf. Unless, of course, it was a mythological Elf or Dwarf.

 

Finally: Hawkman and Hawkgirl used to "borrow" much of their equipment from the museum they worked in. I suspect at least some of it never ended up being returned. Even if it was, they didn't ask anybody's permission. (Silver Age and probably Golden Age versions of the characters, of course.)

[Cygnia]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

Well, it sounds like the OP wants to tie in Celtic legends into her background, so mythology is covered here.

 

That being said, what's the difference in playing an alien in a superheroic game then?

[assault]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

That being said' date=' what's the difference in playing an alien in a superheroic game then?[/quote']

 

Because there are very few aliens in DnD.

 

Slightly more seriously, aliens have a lot of history in superhero comics. Some "fantasy types" do too: wizards, ghodz, knights on flying horses, werewolves, vampires, ghosts and so on.

 

I'm sure you could find the odd Thor story with Elves and Dwarves. Trolls were certainly present.

 

Fantasy types have their place - but.

 

My objection is mostly to characters that are basically converted DnD types. I don't mind mythological Elves - Tolkien, or worse, DnD elves, have no business being in my games.

 

Drow Ninjas with Light Sabres are right out.

[Adventus]

Re: Opinions: A 'Hero' Stealing Their Gear.....????

 

How about: Drow Ninja pirate lesbian catgirls with light sabers?

 

 

 

I kid I kid I kid:p