Ask a question, get an answer.

[hammersickle59]

I want to build a divination spell in which you ask a question and you get an answer. I may limit the amount of time of casting or limit it to yes or no questions, or put an activation roll on it; but for now, I need a base power to start with.

 

Let me give an example.

 

Player casts the spell and asks the GM "What did that necromancer have for lunch?"....GM answers.

 

Any suggestions?

 

None of the powers I looked at can really help.

 

Dean

[jtelson]

Re: Ask a question, get an answer.

 

Clairsentience with pre and retro cognition w/ appropriate limitations and a chunk of hand waving, maybe?

Add a massive Transdimentional N-Ray Detect: Location of Answer, w/ enough telescopic and rapid to cover the planet quickly so you can justify targeting the right location...

[Derek Hiemforth]

Re: Ask a question, get an answer.

 

I'd suggest Variable Power Pool. Because no single Power is going to work to get an answer to any question.

[BNakagawa]

Re: Ask a question, get an answer.

 

In this case, no game system ever written can solve the problem.

 

If the question is: Will be happy if married to , the answer requires seeing into the future and reading the minds of 2 people, neither of which is currently possible. Granted, there might be instances where the answer is obvious, but it is more likely that the answer is unknowable.

[CrosshairCollie]

Re: Ask a question, get an answer.

 

Oddly, the first thing that jumped into my mind was to use Detect. Detect Correct Answer To My Question is probably too cheesy for words, though.

[jtelson]

Re: Ask a question, get an answer.

 

Oddly' date=' the first thing that jumped into my mind was to use Detect. Detect Correct Answer To My Question is probably too cheesy for words, though.[/quote']

 

That was the first thing that popped into my head as well, it lead to the idea that the answer to pretty much every question can exist somewhere/when thus the Transdimentional, Rapid, N-Ray Detect Location of Answer coupled with Clairsentience. Slap on limits that remove knowledge of the process so the questioner can't really backtrack how he got the answer and Viola (sic). Crazy expensive but does the job.

[Kenn]

Re: Ask a question, get an answer.

 

Oddly' date=' the first thing that jumped into my mind was to use Detect. Detect Correct Answer To My Question is probably too cheesy for words, though.[/quote']

 

Especially when you add the modifyer: OAF - Magic Eight-Ball.

[Lucius]

Re: Ask a question, get an answer.

 

Oddly' date=' the first thing that jumped into my mind was to use Detect. Detect Correct Answer To My Question is probably too cheesy for words, though.[/quote']

 

And yet that's exactly how Lightning Calculator was built, and they didn't add any of those expensive modifiers like Transdimensional either.

 

I'd see Lightning Calculator as a more limited form of exactly what the original poster is trying to do.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

Detect Palindromedary

[jtelson]

Re: Ask a question, get an answer.

 

And yet that's exactly how Lightning Calculator was built, and they didn't add any of those expensive modifiers like Transdimensional either.

 

I'd see Lightning Calculator as a more limited form of exactly what the original poster is trying to do.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

Detect Palindromedary

 

Except that the "Correct Answer to a Mathematical Process" is something that could be worked out on the spot whereas "What did Bob have for Lunch" isn't.

[ghost-angel]

Re: Ask a question, get an answer.

 

jtelson's solution is viable - if we wanted to know where the answer was. Not What The answer is.

 

I'm not sure why you feel it's needed to go to the location of the answer to find it. It's a form of clairvoyance as a special effect - there's no reason that distance is involved in any way.

 

Detect: The Answer To My Question.

 

You're asking the sky gods what the answer is, not trying to view it yourself in person. No need for any of those modifiers at all. It just over complicates the issue - and once more falls back on the theme of "trying to model real life" for a completely non-real life situation; or getting way way too literal with the rules.

 

sheesh.

[jtelson]

Re: Ask a question, get an answer.

 

jtelson's solution is viable - if we wanted to know where the answer was. Not What The answer is.

 

I'm not sure why you feel it's needed to go to the location of the answer to find it. It's a form of clairvoyance as a special effect - there's no reason that distance is involved in any way.

 

Detect: The Answer To My Question.

 

You're asking the sky gods what the answer is, not trying to view it yourself in person. No need for any of those modifiers at all. It just over complicates the issue - and once more falls back on the theme of "trying to model real life" for a completely non-real life situation; or getting way way too literal with the rules.

 

sheesh.

 

sheesh?

 

There's no systemic difference between asking the sky gods, deducing the correct answer, viewing it yourself or any other special effect.

 

My understanding is that Clairsentience is the power for gathering information remotely, particularly when that information is in the past or future. We can give that to Detect through Analyse but only if we're willing to reduce Clairsentience's value.

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Ask a question, get an answer.

 

Sublime Knowledge

 

Bardic Knowledge (Retrocognition)

 

 

Tangentially,

the Knowledge Domain

3e Bard Conversion

Karestal {click the picture for character sheet} (misc facts "skill")

Qaand Oneloriig (bardic knowledge Multipower)

Wizardry Divination Spells

Commune spell

Contact Other Plane spell

Augury spell

Divination spell

 

 

...etc...

[Lucius]

Re: Ask a question, get an answer.

 

Except that the "Correct Answer to a Mathematical Process" is something that could be worked out on the spot whereas "What did Bob have for Lunch" isn't.

 

It couldn't?

 

As my priestess used to say, "The answer is in the question." The principle of the answer being implicit in the question is not confined to mathematics.

 

And remember, Detect is a sense, and therefore as fallible as senses often are. That fallibility is hand-waved for Talents like Lightning Calculator and Universal Translator and Time Sense, for the sake of simplicity and because it is not generally held to be unbalancing. But it is entirely possible to apply penalties to the roll depending on how obscure and difficult the question is, such as you take a penalty to hear one sound out of an overwhelming din or catch the smell of bitter almonds in a spicy dish. It is possible to get a vague or partial answer, as you may be able to only catch part of a radio transmission due to static or see only the outline of a person when they're coming into a dark room with the sun at their back. It may take more time or effort to answer some questions than others, as is pointed out in Lightning Calculator. And some questions may well be unanswerable; I don't think a Lightning Calculator can casually resolve some problem that's stumped generations of mathematicians, nor can the keenest eye or ear determine the color of Justice or the sound of a single atom splitting, nor would a Divination power necessarily give a definitive answer to questions like "what is my destiny?" Or for that matter, any unbalancing, game destroying, or plot spoiling questions a player may ask.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

Detect Palindromedary

[hammersickle59]

Re: Ask a question, get an answer.

 

Wow. Lots of great advice. Thank you ghost angel, killer shrike, Lucious and Jtelson for all of your arguments and examples on how to build this.

 

Those were some great example spells killer shrike

 

Detect and Clairvoyance both seem like viable ways of building a few versions of this spell.

 

Dean

[jtelson]

Re: Ask a question, get an answer.

 

It couldn't?

 

As my priestess used to say, "The answer is in the question." The principle of the answer being implicit in the question is not confined to mathematics.

 

The answer to "What did Bob, Lord of Evil have for lunch yesterday?" is not in the question unless the game world is one where it is assumed that all people carry all knowledge they just fail to access it or that all things are not only connected but perceptibly connected if one somehow (casting a spell, meditates, etc) places oneself in the correct frame of mind or the only questions you expect are of the "What was the appearance of my face before my ancestors were born?" ilk. If those or something like them are the case then sure it could.

 

If you are using a different model for your game world then quite often the answer is 3000 miles away and 600 years in the past or 300 feet away and 5 minutes in the future and once you know that you can target it with a way to learn what the answer is.

 

It's expensive but it probably should be because eventually someone's gonna ask "What will the positions of the three assassins in the next room, relative to the room's primary unhidden door, be 5 minutes from now?" and perhaps "What will each of them do if we execute plan X?"

[Lucius]

Re: Ask a question, get an answer.

 

The answer to "What did Bob, Lord of Evil have for lunch yesterday?" is not in the question unless the game world is one where it is assumed that all people carry all knowledge they just fail to access it or that all things are not only connected but perceptibly connected if one somehow (casting a spell, meditates, etc) places oneself in the correct frame of mind or the only questions you expect are of the "What was the appearance of my face before my ancestors were born?" ilk. If those or something like them are the case then sure it could.

 

If you are using a different model for your game world then quite often the answer is 3000 miles away and 600 years in the past or 300 feet away and 5 minutes in the future and once you know that you can target it with a way to learn what the answer is.

 

It's expensive but it probably should be because eventually someone's gonna ask "What will the positions of the three assassins in the next room, relative to the room's primary unhidden door, be 5 minutes from now?" and perhaps "What will each of them do if we execute plan X?"

 

At which point they get answers like "Did you buy Discriminatory and Analyze on that Detect?" or "Okay, finding that's a -20 on your Perception roll" or maybe, depending on the special effects of the Divination, "Two wolves in the glen, and one on the hill" (i.e. one of the assassins isn't even in the room but is covering it through the window from a neighboring roof - IF the players can figure that out) or even (say they're consulting the I Ching) "Sky and water go their seperate ways: image of CONFLICT. Thus in all his transactions the superior man carefully considers the beginning" Even if we take the original poster literally and assume every question gets an answer, that doesn't mean every answer is comprehensible, applicable, or even true. Perception rolls can be failed.

 

The way Universal Translator is currently written is as Detect Meaning, so the game obviously assumes that the meaning of any meaningful communication is inherent to the communication itself; that is, the meaning of an ancient partchment covered with ideograms is actually an emergent property of that arrangement of symbols. Do you think it shoud have been written instead as a massive Telepathy plus Mind Scan with either Clairvoyance or Transdimensional to locate the mind of the long dead sage who wrote the scroll and read the meaning out of that mind at the time it was being written?

 

(Although I admit there are a number of long dead authors whose minds I'd like access to...heck, sometimes I wish I could read Steve Long's mind because there are some things I just have to wonder "What were you thinking?!" but that's a digression....)

 

But I think you're making the mistake of getting both too metaphysical and too literal. I would say Universal Translator is meant to be used even if the person running the game, for purposes of that game world, does not believe that the meaning of any communication is inherent to the communication but rather that meanings are only inherent in comprehending or intending minds (in such a game the Talent may have mandatory limitations reflecting that it can only do what's theoretically possible, like "only for languages the character could conceivably have been exposed to" - but the mechanical basis for the Talent wouldn't be deconstructed and reconstructed.) Accepting "Detect Answer to Question" as the basis for Divination does not commit you to running a game where an omniscient and omnipresent "Akashic Record" of all things actually exists, regardless of what the characters, or even the players, may think regarding the existence of anything of the sort.

 

How an ability works in the game is a matter of mechanics; how it works in the game world is a matter of special effects.

 

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The palindromedary is applying for a library card at the Akashic Public Library

[jtelson]

Re: Ask a question, get an answer.

 

How an ability works in the game is a matter of mechanics; how it works in the game world is a matter of special effects.

 

This was my point from the start. The mechanic for gathering information remotely, including from the past or future, in Hero is Clairsentience. Getting the answer to any question (Any meaning any question that can be asked) ultimately requires the remote gathering of information since most information is not local. Lightning Calculator and Unversal Translator involve local information gathering and interpretation.