Xavier Onassiss Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? It's the generic nature of the system. The vehicle rules have to cover everything from shuttles the size of a panel van that can travel hundreds of light years in a few hours, to generation ships the size of Manhattan (not to mention giant robots, Roman chariots, the USS Constitution, and the Batmobile). Any rules for mass or volume will be setting-specific. (Of course, having said this, someone will come up with truly generic rules to cover this, but that's OK.) I've seen a few of these (GURPS Vehicles, BTRC's VDS come to mind) in other game systems. They were a number-cruncher's delight; an "interesting challenge" for everyone else. There was a time when I enjoyed that sort of thing, but my tastes have changed. I get the feeling I'm not alone, because those big, highly detailed vehicle design systems don't seem to be as popular as they once were. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Escafarc Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? I've seen a few of these (GURPS Vehicles' date=' BTRC's [i']VDS[/i] come to mind) in other game systems. They were a number-cruncher's delight; an "interesting challenge" for everyone else. There was a time when I enjoyed that sort of thing, but my tastes have changed. I get the feeling I'm not alone, because those big, highly detailed vehicle design systems don't seem to be as popular as they once were. Another thing is many of those systems are very campaign specific and some don't translate well to other concepts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xavier Onassiss Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? Another thing is many of those systems are very campaign specific and some don't translate well to other concepts. Yeah. One thing I liked about GURPS Vehicles was that it produced lots of 'real world' stats for a vehicle first, then evaluated the design in terms of GURPS rules second. Given that, I could create a complete vehicle design (without finishing its GURPS stats -- didn't give a **** about GURPS) and convert it to whatever system I liked. Nothing 'campaign specific' there. But every single design was rather a lot of work, and I got fed up with SJG's bizarre aversion to the metric system.* *Technically, their power plants were metric because they used kW. A real anti-metric purist would've stuck with horsepower, but even SJG had to admit a 100 mega-horsepower fusion power plant sounds silly as all-get-out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowcat1313 Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? GURPS Traveller had the right idea with the modular design system, and it was used in the WW2 set also, I prefer large amounts of detail myself... and a lot of the basics are the same from system to system.. Traveller Displacement ton is defined as 13.5 cubic meters... call it 2 hero hexes GURPS Space uses Cubic feet and spaces/vsps, VSP ends up being half a displacement ton in Traveller or 1 Hero hex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowcat1313 Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? Champions 2 HAD rules for mass/volume which got tossed... among other things... which I have never agreed with... they should have been left in or at least updated and kept as optional rules Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daeglan Posted March 13, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? The GURPS Discussion is interesting and all but off topic Champions 2? Is that in Fifth Ed or are you referring to 2nd Ed? I am still trying to wrap my head around the propper way to do staterooms. Do I just calculate the number of state rooms and multiply the cost? What other things do I need to do to complete the design? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowcat1313 Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? there really isnt a proper way to do staterooms in Hero I guess, a standard 2 person stateroom will take up 8 hexes of space, if you want to just ignore them and just figure it has the capacity for its crew... that works too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daeglan Posted March 13, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? what other things aside from the staterooms need to be done to complete the ship? We can work out the Staterooms later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowcat1313 Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? its going to depend on how much detail you want in your design... heres a rough order of how I build mine 1. choose hull size 2. add basic hull plating... 8 resistant PD and ED minimum 3. Add Power Plant, Secondary Power Plant, Emergency Batteries, I use the formula of 50% for secondary, 10% for emergency based on total END of Main powerplant 4. add Life Support and Internal Gravity 5. Add Weapons Systems 6. Add Defensive Systems 7. Add Sensors and Commo 8. Add Computer and Other Electronics 9. Add Bridge and Other Command Functions 10. Add Staterooms and Other Crew Facilities 11. Add Assorted Other Functions 11a. Add Cargo Space 12. Add Carried Craft I have left out some other stuff I use that are campaign specific 1a. Determine Hull Configuration, Streamlined or Unstreamlined Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowcat1313 Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? for some good examples of Starship Building, you want to look at Spacers Tool Kit, The Ultimate Vehicle, and if you can find a copy of Traveller Hero Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowcat1313 Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? you can also look at some of the stuff I maintain on this site http://fafrhd.pocketempires.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowcat1313 Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? ok, heres the basic template I use for Hero System Starships... with the following caveats 1. I use a lot of things in my designs that arent standard to the hero system, staterooms, cargo capacity, among other things... do as you will Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlHazred Posted March 23, 2011 Report Share Posted March 23, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? A couple of points: It's not clear from the description, but if the ships being carried by Space Fold have to be "docked" (essentially the vehicular equivalent of "Grabbed") and they fit under the weight limit of the vehicle's STR, then I believe there's no need for the Usable Simultaneously Advantage. I mean, you don't need it for the Lifeboats, you don't need it for any similar ship contained "within" the mothership. Basic Hero System Vehicle construction is more or less "cinematic" in flavor. You have enough room for exactly as many staterooms or other chambers as you need for narrative logic (compare the ship interiors of the U.S.S. Enterprise with the Serenity). As a highly customizable system, you can change the Vehicle construction system to pretty much match whatever you want. Shadowcat's system is intricate, and is perfect for people who like that sort of thing. I used to be one of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowcat1313 Posted March 23, 2011 Report Share Posted March 23, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? I tend to way overbuild everything... its not even remotely perfect etc... thats why I try and setup HD templates to make things easier for people to mix and match etc whatever they want or dont want I just tend to go on building binges.... and I am always happy to accept criticism or corrections... I just rarely get any feedback in all seriousness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daeglan Posted March 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 23, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? Nope they just have to be inside the sphere of space that is occupied by the space fold bubble. This bubble is fairly large and a bad guy can hop into it to follow you if you are not careful. Also if you are inside a gravity well it makes it nearly impossible to calculate your jump and you could end up anywhere. In the beginning of the Macross episodes of Robotech the SDF1 tried to jump to the farside of the moon while being less than 100 feet above earth. They took Macross island with them and ended up near Pluto. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daeglan Posted March 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 23, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? Personally I like detailed. it leaves less rooms for arguments later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tasha Posted March 23, 2011 Report Share Posted March 23, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? The GURPS Discussion is interesting and all but off topic Champions 2? Is that in Fifth Ed or are you referring to 2nd Ed? I am still trying to wrap my head around the propper way to do staterooms. Do I just calculate the number of state rooms and multiply the cost? What other things do I need to do to complete the design? Champions 2 was a Champions 1st/2nd edition supplement. It added a ton of skills and the first iteration of the Vehicle construction system. Which has been majorally changed many times (pretty much with each edition). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawnmower Boy Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? I tend to way overbuild everything... its not even remotely perfect etc... thats why I try and setup HD templates to make things easier for people to mix and match etc whatever they want or dont want I just tend to go on building binges.... and I am always happy to accept criticism or corrections... I just rarely get any feedback in all seriousness That's because you're really good at what you do, and very generous in sharing it. So we look at and we say to ourselves, "Hey, that's how you do it," as opposed to, say, "I think that's too much BODY for a star cruiser." It also shows that we spend more time looking at builds than actually playing them. But that's a thing with RPGing in general. For some reason, I just don't have the time I had in college. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowcat1313 Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? I actually have often wondered if the body ratings for the ships in TE and STK are low, but then you look at the shield ratings etc... it looks like they are designed around the low armor/high shielding school of thought. I have accumulated a large collection of Spacecraft design systems for various RPGs. Traveller GURPS Traveller Space Opera Rolemaster Star Wars[West End] Silent Death Victory By Any Means Starmada Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowcat1313 Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? theres a new design system out from Fantasy Flight Games which ties into the Dark Heresy/Rogue Trader etc line associated with their Warhammer 40K RPG system Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowcat1313 Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? my 2 favorite SF Universes to work in are Traveller and Warhammer 40K. as far as development in backstory etc go, I think Battletech and 40K hold the crowns, Traveller while having a vast storehouse of information hasnt been nearly as developed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Man Posted March 25, 2011 Report Share Posted March 25, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? theres a new design system out from Fantasy Flight Games which ties into the Dark Heresy/Rogue Trader etc line associated with their Warhammer 40K RPG system Oo, I'm going to have to check that out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowcat1313 Posted March 25, 2011 Report Share Posted March 25, 2011 Re: How do I get started in making a cruiser sized ship? Rogue Trader.. Battlefleet Kronus is the title Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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