How to build a duel wield attack

[Teeka]

I have a player that is wants to use 2 weapons in a flurry of attacks, how ever I have not found ( Yet ) how to give him the feel of duel weapons without jacking up his speed or just making my own. Does anyone know of a way rule set to make this ability? ( he wants to be able to attack with both weapons and/or chose to attack with one or the other ) Gaining an extra attack is powerful how ever I have felt with a 2nd attack ( Rolls. with minus ocv and damage classs ) would give a chance to really do some damage without killing everything in one hit. Any thoughts on this?

[phydaux]

Re: How to build a duel wield attack

 

Isn't that just a Talent? Two-Weapon Fighting?

[phydaux]

Re: How to build a duel wield attack

 

Also, weapons have STR requiorments, He won't be swinging great swords, one in each hand.

 

So he'll be swinging smaller swords, each doing less damage. And, assuming both attacks hit, the opponent will be able to apply their PD to each attack. While the player will have to spend END for both attacks every swing.

[Greywind]

Re: How to build a duel wield attack

 

Well, you can wield a single weapon, or two weapons in a duel.

[Beast]

Re: How to build a duel wield attack

 

Auto fire 2

Area hexes 0 range(multiple targets

reduced penetration for a double stab(buy the attack twice as powerful as wanted ,so a 2d6 ka is bought as a 4d6ka with reduced penetration so each 2d6 has to go against the targets Def)

Rapid attack

[Lucius]

Re: How to build a duel wield attack

 

There's lots of ways to do this, starting with the way that requires no point expenditure.

 

If you're using 6th edition, the relevant rules start on page 73 of volume 2.

 

The character can make two (or more) attacks by taking a full phase action, at half DCV, and taking a -2 OCV per extra attack. So attacking three times would be -4 on each attack. Once one attack fails, all the rest fail; so if you miss the first, you miss all.

 

Some Skills and Talents can help. Rapid Attack makes it a half phase action, and I think there's a Skill to reduce the OCV penalty.

 

You might also consider Skill Levels or extra DCV that only apply if fighting with two weapons, but remember that the halving applies AFTER these additions. So if you are DCV 5 and want to stay at 5, you'll need to buy +4 to your DCV (to bring it up to 9 before halving it back down to 5.) If you buy them so they apply when you have two weapons, not necessarily just when making two attacks, you would then have a choice between being DCV 9 (wow) or DCV5 and making two - or more - attacks.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The palindromedary says I should be doing taxes, not helping people play Hero

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: How to build a duel wield attack

 

As mentioned, there is a Two-Weapon Fighting Skill/Talent in the game already. It is an expansion to the Multiple Attack/Sweep rules. It is basically 2 skill levels to offset Multiple Attack penalty and Skill Levels to offset the off-hand penalty (of -3 OCV) which is why it is rather expensive. This can also be simulated by simply purchasing Ambidexterity (to remove the off-hand penalty) and calling it good to go.

 

You could also easily create Talents/Powers that simulate utilizng two weapons at once such as those listed above like Area of Effect HKA, Autofire HKA, Large HKA with Reduced Penetrating, HKA on a Trigger etc.

[Teeka]

Re: How to build a duel wield attack

 

Thanks for all the suggestions, I am very sorry I forget to mention we are using base 4th ed rules and some of these things mentioned are not there, Though I will now go pick it up and read up on these new rules and additions. In your opinion, is 6th ed much better, I was not really happy with 5th on many things they changed. But this does give me some great things to solve this problem, thanks again.

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: How to build a duel wield attack

 

Thanks for all the suggestions' date=' I am very sorry I forget to mention we are using base 4th ed rules and some of these things mentioned are not there, Though I will now go pick it up and read up on these new rules and additions. In your opinion, is 6th ed much better, I was not really happy with 5th on many things they changed. But this does give me some great things to solve this problem, thanks again.[/quote']

 

Ah i see. What werent you happy about with 5th edition? 5th edition wasnt very different from 4th edition with the exception of a buttload of expansion added like the aforementioned Two Weapon Fighting. However be warned: if you though 5th edition changed some stuff, 6th edition is going to give you a coronary. Compared to the incrimental changes from 3rd to 4th to 5th, the 6th edition is a pretty radical departure. Now the core game is still the same, but there are more changes in the 6th edition than in all the other editions combined.

[Beast]

Re: How to build a duel wield attack

 

I would just skip 5th ed and get Champions Complete(CC)

CC is the new core book for 6th ed

it is built more like the 4th ed Hero System Book in size (not 2 books and over 800 pages)

cost is 40$ and includes the PDF also

 

Thanks for all the suggestions' date=' I am very sorry I forget to mention we are using base 4th ed rules and some of these things mentioned are not there, Though I will now go pick it up and read up on these new rules and additions. In your opinion, is 6th ed much better, I was not really happy with 5th on many things they changed. But this does give me some great things to solve this problem, thanks again.[/quote']

[Teeka]

Re: How to build a duel wield attack

 

Ah i see. What werent you happy about with 5th edition? 5th edition wasnt very different from 4th edition with the exception of a buttload of expansion added like the aforementioned Two Weapon Fighting. However be warned: if you though 5th edition changed some stuff' date=' 6th edition is going to give you a coronary. Compared to the incrimental changes from 3rd to 4th to 5th, the 6th edition is a pretty radical departure. Now the core game is still the same, but there are more changes in the 6th edition than in all the other editions combined.[/quote']

 

Mainly package deals and a few other things, Nothing real major that we would stop playing by no means. But we have been playing for many years so its hard to just up and change stuff. But we are now looking for some change, after so many years its getting where we just don't enjoy it as much as we did. Hope with a lot of the changes you spoke of that might entice us to get into it head on.

[Tasha]

Re: How to build a duel wield attack

 

Thanks for all the suggestions' date=' I am very sorry I forget to mention we are using base 4th ed rules and some of these things mentioned are not there, Though I will now go pick it up and read up on these new rules and additions. In your opinion, is 6th ed much better, I was not really happy with 5th on many things they changed. But this does give me some great things to solve this problem, thanks again.[/quote']

 

When 4th came out there were things that I didn't like about it either. The good changes outweighed the bad ones. So I quickly grew to like it. I found the same thing about 5e, some changes were annoying (ie Regen), the great many things that became possible with 5e made it worth the money. Also the depth of the explanations for the powers were also very nice. Now, 6e has some great stuff in it. Growth does everything it should. Regeneration is back as it's own power. Decoupling figured characteristics is a jarring change, but one that allows for a LOT of flexibility in Character gen. I really like 6e a bunch.

 

Champions Complete is a great way to get into 6e. If your group plays a bunch and totally adopts the new rules, I would also suggest picking up the original 6e 2 volume set(The PDF's are inexpensive'ish). They make a great reference set and a great resource for finding rulings on nearly any rule in the game.

[CrosshairCollie]

Re: How to build a duel wield attack

 

I found the same thing about 5e' date=' some changes were annoying (ie Regen), [/quote']

 

That's what House Rules are for. I still use 4e Regeneration and Always On Growth/DI/Shrinking in my 5e games ... along with the 6e half-d6 Stun Multiplier.

[JamesG]

Re: How to build a duel wield attack

 

I have a player that is wants to use 2 weapons in a flurry of attacks ... ( he wants to be able to attack with both weapons and/or chose to attack with one or the other )

 

If all he wants to do is attack with the two weapons, then the various methods outlined by others on the thread accomplish that well. Which one to choose depends on what you and he feel best matches the flavor of his two weapon style.

 

But if he wants to do different things, like attack with one and block with the other, or attack with one and hold the other to attack/block in a future segment, then I think limited SPD is the way to go. The simplest way is probably to have him buy additional, Limited, SPD equal to his base SPD. A limitation of "only to take additional attack/defense actions with a second weapon" is probably worth about -1. He can't move with this SPD, he can't use it do double attacks with a single weapon, etc.

 

So if his character is SPD 3, he buys +3 SPD with that Limitation for 15 points.

 

To keep things simple at the table, I'd say he only acts on the Speed Chart at his base SPD, but whenever he acts he gets both actions. I'd probably also say if he does not use both actions at the same time, he has to use the held action in a future segment. For instance, when his phase comes up in segment 12, he could attack with both weapons right then. But if he chooses to only attack with one weapon and hold the other, the second weapon can not act until segment 1 of the next turn.

[Markdoc]

One option that we've used extensively is just to build a signature attack. For example:

 

+1/2d6 HKA, AF (15 active points), requires weapons of opportunity (-1/2), requires two hands (-1/4). 9 real points. Since I didn't add in STR, min, real weapon, etc, this gives him a 1+1d6 HKA that he can use to attack with between 1-5 times, at full OCV, as a half move, as long as he has two weapons. He can also attack multiple foes at once, albeit at a penalty

 

This power is suitable for a knife fighter, or duelist using light weapons, The character could really mess up lightly-armoured foes, but will struggle against anything with tough defences. For 4 more real points, he can lift the base attack to 1d6 HKA (22 real/13 active) which means at 15 STR, he's getting a 2d6 AF HKA. Now're you're talking damage equivalent to a barbarian with a couple of big axes - but special effects are up to you: it could as easily be just a really, really skilled guy with knives.

 

This is a pretty expensive talent, for a fantasy character, especially since I didn't add reduced END. On the flip side, the high END cost means it's not a game-breaker, even at 2d6, because the character will run out of END pretty swiftly. That makes it a special move the PC can bust out from time to time,

 

cheers, Mark

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: How to build a duel wield attack

I found the same thing about 5e' date=' some changes were annoying (ie Regen), [/quote'] That's what House Rules are for. I still use 4e Regeneration and Always On Growth/DI/Shrinking in my 5e games ... along with the 6e half-d6 Stun Multiplier.

 

You and me both. I have no problem going back to the way a previous edition does something such as Regen, Growth etc. The core mechanics of HERO haven't changed at all. The details only add flavor to taste.