Range Penalties in Change Environment

[bigdamnhero]

I think this is more of a "how do YOU do it" than a rules question, so I'm posting it here rather than the Ask Steve section.

 

One of the options with Change Environment is to "increase the penalty imposed by the Range Modifier or other Combat Modifiers." I don't think I've ever actually used this in a game. How do you normally handle it? Say someone buys a Change Environment AOE: -2 to RMods.

• Does every character in the AOE suffer that -2 up front, even at point-blank range? Effectively, that's a cheap-ass way to Drain 2 points of OCV from everyone with a ranged attack.
• Or do you add it to existing RMods if any, but point blank attacks are still at -0? That makes it effective at long range, but useless at short range.
• Or do you subtract it from the number of meters for purposes of determining RMods? I.e -0 at 0-6m, -2 at 7-14m, etc. That seems like...math is required.

PS - I do love the fact that I've been playing Hero for 25+ years, and I can still stumble over something that's never come up before!

[L. Marcus]

Well, the Range Modifier is -2 per increment, so Option #2 seems to be the one that's according to RAW ...

[Sean Waters]

Within reach is a -0.  That is not 'at range' to my thinking, so would not take a range penalty. 2-8m is also -0, but that is at range and so would take the penalty, becoming -2, in your example.  Each range category then takes the -2 in addition to the normal penalty.

 

Not only is it a cheap-ass way to drain OCV for ranged attacks, there are no defences.  

[Armitage]

6E2 38 states that any bonuses or penalties to the Range Modifier don't apply within 8 meters, since there's no Range Modifier to increase or decrease at that point.

[Sean Waters]

6E2 38 states that any bonuses or penalties to the Range Modifier don't apply within 8 meters, since there's no Range Modifier to increase or decrease at that point.

 

It is a constant learning curve.  Good catch.

[bigbywolfe]

Would the range penalty only apply to those on the CE or would it effect anyone trying to fire through the area (kind of like Darkness)?

[bigdamnhero]

Armitage: thanks! I knew that for bonuses like PSLs since there's no RMod to decrease, but it makes sense that would also apply to penalties.

Would the range penalty only apply to those on the CE or would it effect anyone trying to fire through the area (kind of like Darkness)?

Depends on the sfx. If it's a distortion field that makes everything blurry, I'd think that would work if the attacker, the target, or the LOS pass through the field. If it's some kind of psionic attack that disrupts people's ability to focus their eyeballs, then it would only work if the attacker is in the AOE.

[Christougher]

Not only is it a cheap-ass way to drain OCV for ranged attacks, there are no defences.  

 

That's my problem with a lot of the extra crap that Change Environment was given in 5E and carried over.

 

Chris.

[bigbywolfe]

Armitage: thanks! I knew that for bonuses like PSLs since there's no RMod to decrease, but it makes sense that would also apply to penalties.

Depends on the sfx. If it's a distortion field that makes everything blurry, I'd think that would work if the attacker, the target, or the LOS pass through the field. If it's some kind of psionic attack that disrupts people's ability to focus their eyeballs, then it would only work if the attacker is in the AOE.

That's a pretty significant game effect to base on SFX.

[Christopher]

Not only is it a cheap-ass way to drain OCV for ranged attacks, there are no defences.  

Incorrect on the no defenses part. Usually special senses will circumvent a CE, just like they would the natural effect.

 

 

Regarding "does it affects passing LoS":

"Area-affecting Change Environments that interfere with perception use the same rules as for Images to determine if they block Line Of Sight (see 6E1 237)."

So yes, both the "Wall of Fog" and the "Psionic defocussing" Power would affect somebody looking through. If that is unfitting the "Psionic defocussing" could take a limitation to prevent that.

[Sean Waters]

Incorrect on the no defenses part. Usually special senses will circumvent a CE, just like they would the natural effect.

 

 

Regarding "does it affects passing LoS":

"Area-affecting Change Environments that interfere with perception use the same rules as for Images to determine if they block Line Of Sight (see 6E1 237)."

So yes, both the "Wall of Fog" and the "Psionic defocussing" Power would affect somebody looking through. If that is unfitting the "Psionic defocussing" could take a limitation to prevent that.

 

It is not necessarily a perception change though: it might be swirling winds, or variable gravity or layers of variable density that act like a prism.  OK that last one is perceptionish, but even then you can not necessarily see through it, at least not straight.  It could be a charged field that simply repels (or attracts) anything passing through.  Or psionics: if your brain thinks the target is left a bit, that is where you aim.

[bigdamnhero]

So yes, both the "Wall of Fog" and the "Psionic defocussing" Power would affect somebody looking through. If that is unfitting the "Psionic defocussing" could take a limitation to prevent that.

Yeah, that makes sense.

[psyber624]

one thing to note is that it isnt draining full OCV since you can still use PSL's vs Range to counter the increased Range Penalty (which are much cheaper than OCV)