Power Creation: Wound Transfer

[NuSoardGraphite]

Indeed the main Problem is that the effect is: Damage a Foe, Heal an Ally.

 

If it was "Heal Ally, damage yourself (or suiteable, willing donor)" Side Effect would be good enough.

 

But healing and damaging are both Attack Powers.. Each of those would normally end your phase. If you put both in a Multipower, you cannot Multiple Attack with those two unless you can have both Slotted at the same time (unlikely or not going to be powerfull).

This might be one of those cases where "what works in Fiction does not nessesarily works in a RPG". It sounds all very easy and balanced in concept/original interpretation, but the RPG has to make sure things are actually balanced in gameplay.

It worked when Transfer existed within the system.  It would also work if people didn't allow Hero Designer to limit their character designs.

[Greywind]

Heaven forbid people should abide by RAW.

[bigbywolfe]

Transfer acted as an Aid, not as Healing. There are significant differences.

[NuSoardGraphite]

Transfer acted as an Aid, not as Healing. There are significant differences.

Yes, but pre-5th edition, there was no seperate healing power, AID was used for healing where points below the starting value of the power or characteristic you aided did not disappear. i never saw a need for that to change, and the removal of Transfer from the game has now made powers mimicking that effect using a combination of Aid and Drain far more complicated (and much pricier) than they need to be.

 

In fact, i think there is merit in making "Transfer" an advantage added to adjustment or healing powers. maybe a +1/2 or +1 advantage that adds the same number of CP to the character as it takes from the victim.

[NuSoardGraphite]

Heaven forbid people should abide by RAW.

I'm sure my experience with HD is horribly outdated, but with earlier versions of the software, there were a ton of things that were RAW or very close thereabouts that HD wouldnt let me do. it was geared towards super heroic gameplay and i was trying to use it for heroic level gameplay outside the supers genre, and it didn't work well for it at all. that was years ago however, and i'm sure the improvements made to the software since then (and the increase in the number of players using the game for non-supers play) have made my misgivings invalid. but they exist nevertheless...

[Greywind]

Simon has said repeatedly that it is built to support RAW. Current version is geared towards 6th, but supports 5th.

[dropblack]

I've been using HD v3, I've only GMed one Heroes game years ago (heroic level), had a blast and have been using the software to help familiarize myself with the system so that I might run a supers game some time soon. I think HD can be customized and support the creation of house rules. Turning Transfer into an Advantage sounds like a good idea. It's been interesting looking at the various ways of creating a power. 

[NuSoardGraphite]

Simon has said repeatedly that it is built to support RAW. Current version is geared towards 6th, but supports 5th.

Well, i used it in the 4th edition days. back then, i did a lot of things with the system that were possible, but werent really known or supported by the vast majority of the fanbase back then .

 

5th edition pretty much brought HERO up to my level of gameplay in the way i had been using it for years. i'm sure HD has been updated to match that since then, but my initial experience with it was so frustrating i havent touched it since.

 

And yeah, currently i havent moved on to 6th, still being satisfied with 5th, so current editions may have moved past me.

[Tasha]

Yes, but pre-5th edition, there was no seperate healing power, AID was used for healing where points below the starting value of the power or characteristic you aided did not disappear. i never saw a need for that to change, and the removal of Transfer from the game has now made powers mimicking that effect using a combination of Aid and Drain far more complicated (and much pricier) than they need to be.

 

In fact, i think there is merit in making "Transfer" an advantage added to adjustment or healing powers. maybe a +1/2 or +1 advantage that adds the same number of CP to the character as it takes from the victim.

 

Actually Healing first appeared in Fantasy Hero 1.0 which was released in the 3.0 days of Champions. In 4.0 Hero System Aid was the power you used for healing and they had a section about how to set up Aid to work like FH's Simplified Healing.

 

Re: Hero Designer. It was designed to work for RAW 5.0 first. It's very persnickety about the way certain constructs are build (ie 5e Regeneration) if you don't have certain Advantages and Limitations chosen other ones needed for the build don't show up. You are right that the program works best for Superheroes, but with all of the Prefabs that people have made for equipment it works well enough for Heroic games.  6e was added to HD by changing the different powers etc between 5e and 6e. It still does strict RAW for both game versions.

[Christopher]

It worked when Transfer existed within the system.  It would also work if people didn't allow Hero Designer to limit their character designs.

As others pointed out, it was only Aiding you.

Also the Drain Part was Touch Range and the Aid part was "Self only" - at 15 CP per die.

You could modify to be ranged and to work on others, but that quickly got expensive (+1/2 for Range. +1/2 to Transfer to Others; another +1/2 to be able to Aid others and yoruself this way). You would reach 60 AP by the time you hit 2D6 with this.

[NuSoardGraphite]

As others pointed out, it was only Aiding you.

Also the Drain Part was Touch Range and the Aid part was "Self only" - at 15 CP per die.

You could modify to be ranged and to work on others, but that quickly got expensive (+1/2 for Range. +1/2 to Transfer to Others; another +1/2 to be able to Aid others and yoruself this way). You would reach 60 AP by the time you hit 2D6 with this.

Again, pre 5th (thanks for the info about simplified healing in champions 1 and 2 tasha, i was unaware of that. i was also a fan of the simplified healing option with AID in 4th. i used it frequently) it worked as both aid and healing. any points that were below starting value didnt go away after the aid time period elapsed. that made defacto aids and transfers a very effective healing power. (However, suppress didnt work that way, so this made suppress quite different from aid in functionality)

 

And the ability to take points from others and add them to yourself or from yourself to add to others with the same power should be somewhat expensive, but it shouldnt necesarily be a complicated writeup. As you stated above, if transfer still existed, you would only need to add useable against others. to be able to do this at range (a potent ability) is just adding the ranged advantage. high active points, yes, but very simple.

 

In my games as gm, if my player came to me with the idea of a character with empathic healing powers, i would simply have him write it up as a transfer with a -1 limitation that it transfers the characters own points to others and use the simplified healing option. done and done. or we could just use the healing power with a side effect that strips the same points away from the character that he heals on his target.

 

And people wonder why Hero can't attract new players. i'd say slavish loyalty to a system of convoluted character design could be a major reason.

[dropblack]

Hey HyperMan, thanks for version 2!

 

From what I've seen of 6th edition, the system seems pretty solid. The open-ended nature of character creation is both attractive and a little daunting. I admit it has taken me more effort to learn this system than any other but I'm hoping it will be worth it. 

[NuSoardGraphite]

Hey HyperMan, thanks for version 2!

 

From what I've seen of 6th edition, the system seems pretty solid. The open-ended nature of character creation is both attractive and a little daunting. I admit it has taken me more effort to learn this system than any other but I'm hoping it will be worth it.

 

This game does have an incredibly high learning curve compared to most others, but once you've mastered it, it's far more rewarding than any other game on the market. and when you have a group of players who know hero well (or are flexible enough to trust the gm to know it) it will be some of the best gaming you'll ever have.

[Tasha]

Hey HyperMan, thanks for version 2!

 

From what I've seen of 6th edition, the system seems pretty solid. The open-ended nature of character creation is both attractive and a little daunting. I admit it has taken me more effort to learn this system than any other but I'm hoping it will be worth it. 

I would recommend not starting out with Superheroes. Learning to play with a low fantasy game or even some sort of Modern Adventures can make a huge difference in your learning curve. The actual play rules fit in 2 pages.

 

http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/product/110227/Hero-In-Two-Pages?term=hero+in+two+

which is a totally free product on DriveThru RPG. Get it, print it out and hand it to all of your players.

[NuSoardGraphite]

I would recommend not starting out with Superheroes. Learning to play with a low fantasy game or even some sort of Modern Adventures can make a huge difference in your learning curve. The actual play rules fit in 2 pages.

http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/product/110227/Hero-In-Two-Pages?term=hero+in+two+which is a totally free product on DriveThru RPG. Get it, print it out and hand it to all of your players.

Agreed. starting out at a lower level of gameplay will also give you a more realistic view of how everything in the system interacts and will help you to balance out higher powered games if you decide to graduate to them later.

[dropblack]

I can see the potential. This will be the second Hero game I've GMed. The first was heroic-level fantasy and the system was well-received. I can see how complex it will be to run a supers game, but I can handle it if prepare correctly. I've been GMing 36 years I'll take ample notes and make sure I understand everyone's powers in and out. The one thing I'm most concerned about is creating encounters for a group of super heroes with a wide variety of powers, while keeping everything interesting and challenging. 

[Christopher]

Again, pre 5th (thanks for the info about simplified healing in champions 1 and 2 tasha, i was unaware of that. i was also a fan of the simplified healing option with AID in 4th. i used it frequently)

4th edition is long in the past. Mentioning anything farther back then 5E is not going to add to much to any discussion about 6E.

 

And the ability to take points from others and add them to yourself or from yourself to add to others with the same power should be somewhat expensive, but it shouldnt necesarily be a complicated writeup.

6E1 197 has this little rebuild of 5E Transfer. It does not looks complicated.

 

STUN Transfer:

Drain Stun 3d6 (30 active points); unified power (-¼) (total cost: 24 points)

plus

aid stun 3d6, trigger (when character uses Drain, activating trigger takes no time, trigger immediately automatically resets; +1) (36 active points); linked (-½), unified power (-¼), only aid self (-1) (total cost: 13 points).

total cost: 37 points.

 

Better AP/die efficiency then Transfer ever had. The guidelines sugest a 80 AP Limit with a 12-14 DC limit, what this power will easily fullfill.

And you can just replace Drain Stun with a Attack and Aid Stun with healing.

 

Having the three ways to choose as the OP actually wanted is hard no mater what build or version you use.

[Greywind]

4th edition is long in the past. Mentioning anything farther back then 5E is not going to add to much to any discussion about 6E.

 

Don't see where edition was specifically limited. There are people that still use and borrow from earlier editions.

[NuSoardGraphite]

4th edition is long in the past. Mentioning anything farther back then 5E is not going to add to much to any discussion about 6E.

 

 

6E1 197 has this little rebuild of 5E Transfer. It does not looks complicated.

 

STUN Transfer:

Drain Stun 3d6 (30 active points); unified power (-¼) (total cost: 24 points)

plus

aid stun 3d6, trigger (when character uses Drain, activating trigger takes no time, trigger immediately automatically resets; +1) (36 active points); linked (-½), unified power (-¼), only aid self (-1) (total cost: 13 points).

total cost: 37 points.

Better AP/die efficiency then Transfer ever had. The guidelines sugest a 80 AP Limit with a 12-14 DC limit, what this power will easily fullfill.

And you can just replace Drain Stun with a Attack and Aid Stun with healing.

 

Having the three ways to choose as the OP actually wanted is hard no mater what build or version you use.

80 active cap is a lot for transfer. that's a 5d6 transfer (75 active) which is plenty. i could understand your hesitation to work with a 15/D6 power if working under 60 active point cap, but 80 is plenty. you can even work in some advantages in that case.