Bartman

And don't forget Ocelot from the Assesinos in 4th Ed Champions. I'm sure if we dug we could come up with several others.

It is currently listed under "Other Tentatively Planned Products." That almost certainly means 2005 or later, if ever. And as Steve puts it anything that far out is nothing more than an "exercise in speculation."

Markdoc, I think the problem is that we are talking about different periods. I absolutely agree with what you are saying about the 12th century and later. The changes that took place in trade, education, population etc. in the 12th century invalidate everything I've been talking about. Just look at universities. There were what, a half dozen universities in all of Europe in 1100? A century later there were dozens. The 12th century wasn't the renaisance, but it did provide the foundations for it. I'm talking about the 9th through 11th centuries. I'm talking about when thralls were still plentiful, raiders were common and there were 4-6 towns in all of Denmark. This is a period where it took months to ride from Calais to Provence. The Dark Ages, if you will excuse the expression. I will have to try to look up the newer info on Copenhagen though. I simply don't have the time to keep up with such stuff anymore. And if it's not in English or Portuguese I generally have to wait a decade or so to get a good translation, if it ever becomes availible.

This is just a built in bias of the system. All living things are given a huge body bonus over what raw mass would indicate. If people were treated like everything else in the system, they would have 5 body and would die when they reach 0 body. But then we would be playing GURPS and rewriting our characters every few adventures.

True. But other traditions have the gear of a slain knight or noble passed to his son. In other times and places the king overode tradition and just claimed goods and properties himself. And in other places the bodies of the slain were left for the local peasants to deal with. They got to keep anything of value, but were responsable for dealing with the bodies. Of course this never applied to the nobles just the common soldiers. My point was in any case there will be a tradition or law which states who gets what. All slaughterj has to do is set his society with the rules he wants his players to obey. If they don't then they will deal with the legal consequences. All without having to change his economic defaults. Of course if the PCs routinely loot bodies, they may end up flooding the local economy with these goods. This would tend to force the value of these goods down. "Another sword? I haven't managed to sell the last dozen you sold me. And all those horses are eating all my stocks. I wouldn't pay a copper for another of either."

No offense, but I do know what I'm talking about. I received a minor in history in '96. The focus was on medieval Europe. I have repeatedly said this was general and many exceptions could be found. Heck I could come up with a few hundred exceptions to what I wrote myself. But I stand by it. Gruel/porridge/pulse was the staple dish of Europeans for a thousand odd years. Much like rice was, and still is, the staple dish of Asians for the last couple thousand years. The vast majority of calories consumed by people in pre-modern agricultural societies have come from grains or tubers. And in Europe this meant grains. And the most common way of preparing these was some form of porridge, with bread being a distance second. Certainly there were other elements in their diet. But meat was vanishingly rare. Just look at the standard diet of a Roman on frontiers about the 2nd century. They would have two meals a day both of which were a porridge/gruel. Only one of these would have meat and generally that was about a pound or so per contubernia. Each soldier got less than an ounce of meat per day. Nuts, fruits, vegetables, cheese, eggs and other local produce were added in season. But even that would generally provide less than 10% or so of the daily calories. And this was a great diet compared to most peasants. Coins were also fairly rare. And the further you got from a political center the rarer they became. For much of the medieval period coinage wasn't being produced in large quantities. Roman and other coins were still in circulation because of this lack of new coinage. The overwhelming majority of transactions were done in kind not coin, especially outside the towns where over 90% of the population lived. That is not to say that coinage didn't exist. It definitely did. But it was generally used for out of economy transactions. Meaning a person would generally use barter for individuals within the community and coins for individuals outside the community. A traveling merchant would use coin almost exclusively and a village baker would use kind almost exclusively. Well that can't be right. It didn't receive any fortifications until Bishop Absalon, in 1167. And it didn't receive a municipal charter until the 13th Century. In the 12th century the population was, what 1000? Certainly not much more than that. That would mean every person in Copenhagen would have to be eating 17 kilos of meat a day. Now if I remember correctly Copenhagen means 'city of the merchants' or some such. Its wealth was based on trade and more specifically the trade of agricultural products. It may very well be that 500 tons of meat passed through Copenhagen a month, but they certainly wouldn't have consumed 500 tons a month. The question is what kind of farms are these found on? I think you find that they are from the farm of a freeman, a descendant of Karl, to follow the mythology. I personally can't recall any that have been found in a village of serfs, the descendants of Thrall to follow the mythology. These freemen were the ones that 'went a viking' and had opportunity to gain coin. And upon returning they would be a kind of small business farmers. They would have an opportunity to buy and sell in coinage. Most serfs wouldn't. You are picking your examples from the edges of what I was talking about, Europe - 800-1100. Yes, there are numerous exceptions to what I wrote, especially if you pick them from the 12th century and later. I have said so repetitively. But the problem is generally people assume too much affluence rather than too little. I'm just trying to swing the pendulum the other way. Life was filthy, brutish, frequently short, and in general everyone lived in what we today would consider abject poverty. Trying to paste a modern economy onto a medieval European setting is going to result in bizarre anachronisms. Even in a high magic world, pasting a modern economy on results in Steampunk rather than a pseudo-medieval setting.

Hey. It was 1200 words as it was. To be more specific, even in the most general terms, would have required a book. There are of course wild variations from place to place and time to time. Even 100 miles or 100 years could result in a markedly different outlook. But for most of Europe, for most of the medieval period, say about 800 AD to 1100 AD, it is a reasonable picture.

First remember that 90%+ of the people in a 'realistic' pre-modern setting won't deal with currency at all. They will spend their entire lives without having so much as a single copper penny. They live in a largely barter economy. And most peasants won't barter much either. They generally will produce most or all of the the items used in their lives themselves. An ancient or medieval peasant had virtually nothing and little chance of changing that. Here are some highlights of the average person's economy. Food - This would of course be grown entirely by the peasant. 99%+ of the calories would come from grain. And most of that was in the form of some sort of gruel. Most villages had a central bakery as the firepits in the average home were too crude to bake properly. This bakery charged a fee (again generally paid in barter not coin) which most locals would only be able/willing to pay once or twice a week. So the standard was two meals of gruel a day. This would be suplimented by vegitables and occasionally whatever might be locally availible and in season (nuts and berries). Ocassionally some bread, milk and or eggs would be added and very occasionally a little meat (generally only on feast days). Clothing - The medieval European peasant changed clothing only twice a year. In some places this wouldn't even be fully removable. The clothing would be sewn into place around the individual. And six months later they would be cut out of it. This was more likely in winter than summer. If the peasant took a bath at all, the semi-annual changing of the clothing is when they would take it. This clothing would generally be made by the owner or a family member and would be made from locally availible materials. Lodging - The peasant was once again responsable for building and maintaining their own. Generally this would be a single room building as small as possible. Think 4m x 2m. They were kept small because it took a lot of work and energy to build them, and because they were vastly easier to keep warm if if the space could be limited. Very little was actually done in the building. Anything that climate and weather allowed was generally done outdoors. Furniture and other belongings - First virtually nothing would be metal. Everything from the utensils to the plow would be made of wood. The hovel itself would have a single table (maybe), at most, a couple of stools and a blanket covered straw 'nest' on the floor that would be used as a bed. The only likely metal objects, for an entire household, would be a knife or two and a cooking cauldron. Everything would be made as needed, so there would be very little in the was of goods. But there may be a small trunk which would hold the handful of family posessions. This trunk would likely be used as a stool as well. Moving on from the peasants to the townspeople results in a great deal of improvement. But only because there the barrier is set so low. They account for almost all the rest of the people in the setting. Most of their economy is driven by barter as well. But in general they will have a few coins and be able to pay and charge in monetary terms. Food - Unlike the peasant the townsman is likely to buy much of their food. But not all. Most towns had plenty of space for gardens and animals within their wall. And most families will grow their own vegitables and have chickens, goats, and or pigs. Cows would only be availible to the wealthier townspeople. The daily staple however would still be gruel and or bread. This would not be prepaired by the townsperson themselves though. The dangers of fire meant that individual fireplaces were generally regulated by law. Cooking would be done by in central bakeries and most meals were eaten cold. Clothing - Although better off than their village cousins, most townsmen still relied on what could be made by the family. Tailors were only really availible to the burghers. Journeymen had to rely on family for clothing and would only buy a change or two a year. Lodging - Most townsmen rented not owned their homes. Rent was usually very modest, the equivalent of a days pay per month or thereabouts. Inns of course were all but unheard of. If one was travelling, one was expected to have made arangements with family or friends. Most homes were situated on the second floor, generally above the shop operated by the resident. These were down right roomy in comparison to the hovels in the countryside. Think 4m x 6-8m. Furniture and other belongings - Pretty much the same thing. A single family bed in the corner. A single table. And a collection of stools and a couple of trunks. Metal is more likely to be used. But most things would still be wood. In any case the room would look completely barren to a modern eye. Above this you find the wealthy. They live in unspeakable luxury in comparison to the other two groups. Any PC almost inevitabley comes from this group, namely because nobody else can afford to adventure. They may be "second sons of second sons" with no lands or future beyond what they make for themselves. But in comparison to the above they are unimaginably wealthy and well connected. These are the people who will be paying for goods in a FH campaign because nobody else has the coins to do so. That said let me address your specific points. 1- I think pricing things according to a day's unskilled labor is a bad idea. An unskilled laborer can buy virtually nothing. He will work 25-26 days in a month and will have absolutely nothing left over after paying for a space on the floor of a hovel to sleep on and 60 meals of gruel. And in fact he is unlikely to be payed directly anyway. He probably will be payed in food and board rather than coin. 2- I don't know of any single place that lists a broad variety of how long it takes to do something. But that isn't a very good reference for determining prices anyway. Even if a shirt takes as long to make as a sword there are many other things that will make the sword much more expensive. The raw material is more expensive and the training required is much more specialized. Any goodwife of the period could make a shirt, only a very skilled smith could make you a sword. 3- If your players are killing people for their goods there are better ways to resolve the issue than changing the prices of goods. In fact a sword or horse were very rare and expensive items. Their prices should reflect that. Society will have a system in place to resolve who gets them. Even if a killing is justified by law the dead man's property will generally go to his heirs or the state (inheritance tax don't ya know), not his killers. Looting bodies was pretty much universally a hanging offense. If someone is killing people and looting their bodies. It won't take much for the 'officials' to figure out who did it. After all a very large city like London, Paris or Florence had fewer than 10,000 people. There won't be many people in town trying to hawk the dead men's horses and weapons. They do this even once and they are likely to end up outlaws and/or in a noose pretty quick.

Normals Unbound was a great book for two reasons. First - It filled a hole in a lot of the previous books. Up until that point there weren't a lot of normals in any Hero books. After it came out it seemed like most books started actually detailing some the regualr folk that populated the universe. Up until that point Hero had put out a couple hundred villians and a couple dozen normals. After that it seemed like for every villian or two there was a normal as well. Second - It was well written with lots of plot hooks. You could run a campaign for years with all the plot hooks in there. Definately a good buy. As to your second question, bluebooking is a popular way of taking care of some of the action that takes place off-screen so to speak. Basically the idea is that every character has a notepad that is regularly passed between the GM and the player. This notepad will detail the private adventures of the character. This allows the player to have some one-on-one time with the GM to cover things that are either not appropriate for the other players to hear or that they might find boring and uninteresting. For example if a character is having problems with their spouse that could be taken care of in a bluebook. The player could detail his attempts to placate and come to terms with a spouse that is frequently is at odds with the super lifestyle. It increases the depth of the characters without impinging at all on the main storylines. It is called bluebooking because traditionally it was done in the little testing booklets that can be found at most US universities. These are generally called bluebooks. Now a-days I think most bluebooking is done through e-mail.

I agree with pretty much exactly what you have said. Yes. Low base powers with lots of advantages can be unbalanced. Yes. Reasonable limits on advantanges, APs, and DCs can help a campaign work smoothly. And finally, yes. A flexable and reasonable GM is key to a good campaign. Especialy when he is capable of recognizing when it is reasonable for a player to excede one or more of the campaign limits.

That's too bad. I guess it's no suprise that Champions is king of the heap. But all the Star Hero material has been top notch. I've certainly picked up all of it. It would be a shame if no more were to come out.

Genre Convention #4a Regardless to how a Secret Identity is uncovered, it will be effectively protected by the end of the storyline.

You may also want to find Normals Unbound. It was a modern sourcebook for 4th edition. It had a large number of characters built on 25, 50 and 75 points.

I might also mention that one of the advantages of Hero is that Steve Long, the Hero Line Developer, frequents these boards. In fact he has already responded personally to one of your questions. There are very few RPGs where the author and editor of the system is so easily accessable. And IMO that is a good thing. If you have any questions when you get your books please post them here Sly. We're always happy to discuss any feature of the system.

On review I don't think I actually answered your question. Let me try this again. You seem to be a least somewhat familiar with GURPS. You will notice that they do have a number of similarities. When starting a FH campaign the GM will need to decide the power level. The GM will assign a number of starting points for the characters to be built with. In addition to these poitn the players can add more points by taking a number of 'disadvantages.' These can be anything: personality traits, phsyical ailments, social issues (like being an outlaw), enemies, rivals, etc. In general there will also be a cap in how many disads a character can take. The most common power levels for play in FH are: 25 pts + up to 25 pts of disads. Which roughly equals about 1st level in D&D. 50 pts + up to 50 pts of disads. Which roughly equals about 5th level in D&D. 75 pts + up to 75 pts of disads. Which roughly equals about 10th level in D&D. This is probably the most common starting level for FH. There are other levels and each GM can decide this for themselves. For other genres different starting values are used. For example supers generally start at 200+150. Experience is rewarded for accomplishing a task or completing a scenario/storyline. Extra experience is awarded for good roleplaying and characterization. Generally this amounts to about 2-3 pts per session. So most characters will earn an equivalent to a level every five sessions or so. Both starting points and experience can be spent on anything the player wishes. There is no restriction based on class, race, or level, unless the GM decides to impose one. The GM could for example could decide that only elves can cast healing spells. But the system doesn't force that on the GM. So within GM guidelines you could create a character that matches any of the standard fantasy archetypes (thief, fighter, ranger, barbarian, mage, etc) or create a character that combines whichever characteristics you like best of each. You could have a mage who can swing a sword with the best of them but is lousy with a staff. Or you could have a warrior who is an excellent pickpocket. Or even a barbarian who can communicate easily with animals. The only limit is the player's imagination and the number of points he has to spend. Once playing Hero tends toward the cinematic style of gameplay instead of the 'realistic.' In general the system is fairly forgiving and player death and dismemberment tends to be low. However there are an number of optional rules which allow a far less forgiving campaign, if that is what you want. Combat is measured in turns. And each character is allowed a number of actions based on the character's Speed (a basic characteristic like Strength or Dex). Combat is detailed and has multiple options. So there isn't the kind of repetiveness tht some systems have. Instead of swing longsword - swing longsword - swing longsword - swing longsword - swing longsword, you instead get somthing like sweep longsword at the two orcs on my right - block attack from ogre - full attack on ogre - dive out of the way of shaman's fireball - charge shaman. Historically the one problem with the system has been that there has been very little support material for FH. That looks like that will no longer be the case. In addition to the excellent Fantasy Hero book itself, Hero has published an excellent 300 odd page book of premade spells. And the primary setting is due to come out shortly. And in case no one has mentioned it, you will need the 5th Edition Hero ruleset. This contains the character creation and play rules. Fantasy Hero only contains genre specific information. Hope this helps.

Its hard to say without knowing your style and preferences. I would suggest you try to find a Demo or Convention game and play at least one scenario using the Hero system. The basic rules carry from genre to genre just like d20 does. So if you play any Hero game you wil pick up the basics. In all it is not too different from most systems. Task resolution is decided by rolling 3d6 under a target number. And combat is a "roll to hit then roll damage" affair. But where Hero really shines is in character and campaign creation. You can literally create any type of character you want. No classes. No levels. No "you must have this to get that." You can create the exact characters you want for your campaigns. And the system is exceptionally well balanced. 5pts of one ability really does equal 5pts of annother ability. This is unlike most systems where there is one feat, talent, or skill that everyone picks up because it is greatly more useful than the others. However the learning curve can be quite steep. It is kind of the opposite of D&D. In D&D you can learn the basic rules and start playing a just a few minutes. But everything is an exception. Every spell acts differently and the GM and players are required to keep learning the system as they go. Hero instead presents everything up front. But once the system is understood there are a lot fewer exceptions and suprises.

As with all such things prices tend to vary from time to time and place to place. Eight silver pennies for a page of paper would have been a steal in Saxon England. By mid 15th century 400 silver ducats probably could buy a small library. (A small library being a couple dozen books). Figure out your economy and its general technological level, and the rest should fall into place. Your estimate is reasonable. I would add a surcharge of 100%-1000% for a fully illuminated manuscript, rather than just a quick pen job though.

Re: Re: 22 years from now Ooops looks like I spoke too soon. Atomic Batteries. Imagine running a laptop for years without a recharge on a battery about a 1 cm^3 in size.

Well I just went and downloaded it as well. Of course I can't comment on the accuracy of your review. My character is hunted by Black Paladan. And I know my GM has picked up SoB as well. So if I were to read it I think my GM would hurt me badly.

I'd say most of them. Frankly top-heavy has never been my prefered body form.

I hate to pick a comment from an excellent post, but I have must defend Tolkien on a -14. Part of the reason ME feels rather small is it actually is pretty small. None of the action takes place south of Rome, north of Hamburg, west of London, or east of Belgrade. If you were to take a train from London to Belgrade you would probably see less variation in terrain then Tolkien actually crammed into his story. Here is a map if ME with an overlay of Europe.

Well done Houston. Logical, well thought out, and complete.

My father has heart and other problems. He takes over a dozen medications on at least a daily schedule. Most are 2 times a day. All are controled substances, although not more than most medications.

Right you are. I thought it was more strongly worded in 4th. Here is the relevant text for both: "The following are special powers that automatons may purchase. They should not be used for player characters, except with special GM permission." p180 BBB "The following are Powers which automatons may purchase. The are unique to automatons; PCs cannot purchase them." p311 FREd

I thought Steve Long was your padawan/apprentice/sidekick. When did I get promoted to this lofty position?