Derek Hiemforth

Of course, if you already have a MP (as with the original example in the thread), then you can also just buy additional MP slots, some of which have more base movement but no Adders or Advantages, some of which have some Adders but not others, some of which have various Advantages, etc. as needed. Which slot you use is just a matter of what you're trying to accomplish at the time.

I haven't seen anyone mention this (my apologies if I missed it), but the key here is not to change the Power... it's to change the character's SPD. As CC page 137 notes, "In non-combat situations, everyone is assumed to act at SPD 2 at all times, unless the circumstances require them to use their full SPDs." (You can also voluntarily lower your SPD to 2 if desired.) When simply flying long-distance, you're normally going to be acting at SPD 2, not SPD 4. So the END cost doesn't need to get down to 3 to be sustainable... it only needs to get down to 6. Just let off the gas a bit, fly with a base of 15m instead of 20m, and you're there: Flight 15m [15] Position Shift and 8x NCM (+15 CP] Combat Acc/Dec, NTM, and NGP (+1 Adv.) = 60 Active Points = 6 END You can fly at this speed indefinitely (about 45 MPH)...

I learned about it (and bought it) due to Hero Games announcing it on Facebook Wednesday, March 24.

I think this is a great point, and I agree. However, I think there's also danger in going too much the other way, where things seem likely to proceed mostly unchanged regardless of what the PCs do. That sounds like it could be an issue with some of these as well, such as Eltirian or Tor Vilos. Ultimately, I voted for Kurum-Sathiri, both because I think the idea of a city ruled by a meritocratic magocracy sounds interesting, and because I think it avoids either of those issues. There's no single "monster" to bump off and seize the crown, but there is a very cutthroat--almost Klingon--hierarchy a PC could gradually ascend. Loading up for one lucky go against the top dog wouldn't be a good strategy even if you could pull it off, because even if you got lucky, then you'd just have to defend your crown against the next challenger. So you couldn't really try to take over until you were truly powerful enough to hold it -- a potentially-interesting long-term campaign goal (or even campaign-ending goal). But in the meantime, it seems like it could easily lend itself to many interesting stories. Plus, you'd get to write a lot about the doings and maneuverings of the Sithians, which is just inherently bad-ass.

Plus, unless a character is particularly analytical, this is probably more in-character anyway. Especially for impatient, impulsive, or excitable characters. Most folks just don't sit around for hours dissecting every option before they make a decision, unless it's a major decision. And sometimes not even then...

At a glance, it seems workable (though I'm sure some rough edges to sand off might be discovered during play). The main thing I'm wondering is what problem you seek to solve. You mention speeding up combat, but this is the same number of actions overall; they're just clustered differently. And it doesn't really address the most common concern with the Speed Chart (its predictability), because this setup would be equally predictable.

In my opinion, this factor (players not being ready when their Phase comes up) is the single biggest contributor to Hero's reputation for slow combat. A standing house rule in 4-color superheroic games I run is that every character (including the bad guys, so I have to be on my toes as GM) has to immediately make a soliloquy as soon as their Phase comes around (this can be an internal "thought bubble" soliloquy if the situation would be inappropriate for the character to actually speak), and if they're not ready to talk when it's their turn, they lose their Action that Phase! The camera doesn't cut to you if you have nothing to say! How does this help speed up combat? Just by making them keep their heads in the game. They're not technically required to immediately take their Action (or declare a Hold) the way they are the soliloquy, but it doesn't usually matter. If they're ready to go with the roleplaying, they're ready to go with the Action too. I could run Challenge of the Super Friends combats with 11 heroes vs. 13 villains, and finish them in less than 2 hours...

Who said anything about an "obvious" imbalance? I'm just saying that, barring the exceptionally unlikely event of a completely flawless system, something in the system will be the "best" buy in the game, even if only slightly.

Ah, you're right. Sorry about that; it was in HSMA, and I missed it (I was just looking in CC/6E2). You're also right about STR+ and STR-. I was thinking they'd be okay together, because they're applying to different maneuver bases, but HSMA doesn't say anything about an exception to the "no STR+ and STR- together" rule for such a case. Okay, I back off my position. Extra DC is not necessarily the "best buy in the game." It's still a good buy, but not unreasonably so.

I agree, I'd stay away from lowering the costs of maneuvers (which are already very cost effective), and maybe model it more on Perfect Pitch than on Skill Enhancers. As Perfect Pitch gives a +1 to any music-related Skill Roll, Natural Martial Artist could give +1 to any martial arts-related Skill Roll (e.g., Analyze Style, KS: Style, some applications of Skills such as Acrobatics, Breakfall, Climbing... any Skill Roll that the GM agrees is "martial arts-related").

Granted. But it speaks again to the cost effectiveness of Extra DC, just in a different way. For 50 CP, you can get both the 6d6 NND, 75 STR Grab from hell, and a 16d6 Offensive Strike. Or rather, you can have them if your GM is asleep at the wheel. But strictly from a game mechanics perspective, that can certainly lead to some head-scratching when you compare the cost to other attacks. Having said all this, I wouldn't advocate for changing the cost of Extra DC. Changing the cost just raises the specter of issues already addressed in the thread. It's just something to be aware of. After all, something has to be "the best purchase in the game." If it wasn't Extra DC, it would just be something else, the way it used to be DEX and STR.

As Cantriped noted, 2-pt. levels don't add to damage. Also, I think you're missing most of the potential of Extra DC by focusing your attention on normal damage. For example, consider, say, 10 Extra DC (40 CP) when used with a "Pressure Point Lock" custom maneuver: +1 OCV: +1 CP Grab Two Limbs: +3 CP 1d6 NND Damage: +2 CP +5 STR to hold on: +1 CP No STR to damage: -2 CP Total Cost: 5 CP For 45 total CP, some of which will also be useful with other maneuvers, you get a Grab with an OCV bonus, that holds them with +55 STR. Assuming a MA with a STR of 20, that means they basically have to be a Brick to get out on their own (or have some other special means of escape). And as long as they can't escape, you're dropping 6d6 NND damage on them every Phase. Doesn't suck.

Or not used equally by all. Extra DC really reach their full "best purchase in the game" status when combined with the martial arts design rules from Hero System Martial Arts, which are optional. If the GM doesn't allow those rules, it nerfs Extra DC considerably. They're definitely still worthwhile, but not at the "Holy cow!" level they can reach if you're able to custom-build just exactly the maneuvers you want to use them with.

I would argue that the "miraculous" event or situation significantly softened their previous position related to their faith (or lack thereof) before they were ever subject to Persuasion.

It's up to you and your game and/or GM of course, but I as a GM would totally not let you use Armor-Piercing for this effect. The time that Skills take to use is not a "defense." In my game, you would need to buy Skill Levels with the Limitation Limited Power: Only to Counteract Time Modifiers (-1), plus any other Limitations appropriate to the SFX. For an example, see the "Superspeed Tasks" example power on CC pg. 211. The levels could be included in the power build, but that's the game element I'd ask you to use.

Plus, not only does Persuasion require time in order to work (and likely repeated application), but the target is also a conscious actor throughout the process. So if you were to lead off with something like g3taso's "I want you to make me your sole beneficiary," you would almost certainly not only be met with some variation of "No way!" but you'd also likely never be allowed another attempt, because the person would stay away from you. Mind Control works now.

I also think Oratory is largely about manipulating a crowd to have "herd mentality" help convince them (i.e., they agree because they get caught up in the rush of being in a crowd that agrees). It's like how a mediocre comedy seems so much funnier in a theater surrounded by people laughing than it does watching it at your house with just a few friends. Persuasion is more about actually convincing the brain or the heart than the herd mentality. Where Oratory uses peer pressure to get them all to Just Say No to drugs, Persuasion convinces them that drugs are bad and they should stay away.

Season to taste, of course, but for me, Charm would more like a personality cult leader who gets people to follow him specifically moreso than the religion. Oratory might be effective in the right circumstances, especially if the Orator was already in some kind of position of authority. But I think of missionary work as being more at the one-to-one level than Oratory is, and not as all-about-me as Charm is. The missionary is trying to Persuade the person they're dealing with that the missionary's view of the world is correct, and the listener should adopt it.

Not exactly (or at least, that wasn't my take on it). The sense I had from Amazing Engine was that you played the same character in every campaign (I think they called it a "character core") with just whatever functional tweaks were required to fit the world/genre. My snarky sense was that it was sort of meant as an RPG for people who didn't really like roleplaying, and couldn't be bothered to make up more than one name and personality.

I think I understood you. I guess I just thought it was clear that Persuasion could be used to shift someone's attitude. I mean, one of the examples is a missionary converting someone to his faith.

I'd say you can use Persuasion to shift it from violently opposed to staunchly supportive. Just not all in one go.

That's a fair point about Selective. I guess how "Selective" Persuasion naturally is will vary depending on how you're using it, who you're using it on, etc. If you actually bought it Selective, then you could be more precise with your use all the time. I generally think of the relationship between Persuasion and Mind Control as somewhat analogous to the relationship between Running and Teleportation. Running takes a while, and you have to actually cross the distance between where you start and where you want to be, but you can also go around obstacles you discover en route, etc. Teleportation is "Poof! You're there!" with no distance crossed, no time spent, etc. But it's also all-or-nothing. If it isn't completely effective, it isn't effective at all. Similarly, Persuasion takes some time, is more likely to need to happen in gradual stages if you want to accomplish big changes, etc., but you can also read your target adjust your approach accordingly as you go. Mind Control is "Poof! You'll do/believe what I say!" with no skill required, no time spent. But it's also all-or-nothing, and it's more likely to simply wear off, even without outside influence.

How is it outside RAW? Mind Control's effect is based on the target's level of opposition. So if you first use Persuasion to shift their attitude to be less opposed, then of course the Mind Control will be more effective on them.

You don't need the Usable By Other (what do you even intend that to do?), Persistent (the effects of Persuasion aren't temporary), Area of Effect (it already affects anyone close enough to the character to reasonably be said to be interacting with them), or Selective (you can already choose who you're trying to Persuade). But as the others have noted, Persuasion also isn't Mind Control.

A true multi-genre/cross-genre campaign and campaign setting supplement. This would likely mean some sort of cross-worlds overarching setting and campaign framework, with sub-settings (other planets, other dimensions, other time periods, etc.; whatever fits the overarching setting) that are more genre-specific. The intent would be that gamers could either play groups of characters from the same genre, groups made up of characters from assorted genres, or some mix of both. I think the Special Effect-driven nature of the Hero System (where very different-seeming characters can interact mechanically very easily) would really shine in this sort of setting.