First Blood -- Impressions

[jml]

After months and months reading about the HERO system, learning the rules, fiddling with characters designs and plotting two new Fantasy campaign settings, I've actually gotten around to having a small, trial session of HERO.

 

I invited most of my roleplaying group around to design some characters and run through a simple combat session. Character design took almost all night -- and they still need more work before they'll be ready for use in an actual campaign. (At one point, I made it clear to one player that I'd never GM a campaign with a PC called Stabby McKnifer.) Being too tired after designing characters, playing Settlers of Catan and Halo 2, we repaired to the next evening.

 

That night, I GMd my first ever HERO combat session. And I was surprised. The pace was much faster than I had expected and everyone had a good grasp of the rules from reading Sidekick. The players won, naturally, with one of their number leaving the battle not with his shield, but on it.

 

I very much look forward to polishing off my campaign and playing lots of HERO.

 

Assorted comments:

- One of my villians had the power to strengthen his skin with the power of the earth. I ruled that it's DEF stacked with his mundane armor. I since looked up the rules and referred to Fantasy HERO. From henceforth, Armor doesn't stack.

 

- BODY hey? It's good to have lots of it. Or armor. Or not get hit. Because getting hit with a great sword hurts a great deal.

 

- END. Basically, I need to track it, or get players to track theirs. It seems to be too important as a balance to leave out. I ignored it in this combat.

 

- "Using STR". One of my players asked me what that meant. I went "Ummm... I haven't been able to find out in the rules either. I'm pretty sure that whenever you do something that requires lower-case 's' strength, you use STR, and that you pretty much always use all of it in combat unless you tell me otherwise"

 

- Movement and END. The rulebook says that movement costs 1 END per so-many active points, and this includes your normal movement. I couldn't figure out how much END it costs a regular, base HERO to move 6".

 

- Damage. Beforehand, I figured out the common case of using weapons to do killing damage, but ignored non-weapon killing damage and weaponed normal damage. One of the characters was a martial artist trained in open-hand fighting. Players never do what you expect.

 

- So that's why Phases and Segments have different names!

 

- With OCVs and DCVs changing so much due to CSLs and penalties and so forth, we've decided to use the alternative "(11 + OCV - 3d6 >= DCV) is a hit" system.

 

- Lacking a convenient "Challenge Rating" system like the d20 system, I just built two Heroic characters on 75+75 and gave them some decent equipment. It proved to be a good challenge for the party. I'm going to need some sort of basic algorithm for estimating a challenge though. Average STUN and BODY inflicted per Turn seems like a good starting point.

 

- Awesome.

 

I really can't wait to start playing out this Fantasy HERO campaign. I've promised that I won't buy any more HERO books until I do. (MMM, Grimoire, UMA (is that available?) and Ninja HERO are all on the list).

 

cheers,

jml

[Killer Shrike]

Re: First Blood -- Impressions

 

First off, congrats, and welcome to it.

Assorted comments:

- One of my villians had the power to strengthen his skin with the power of the earth. I ruled that it's DEF stacked with his mundane armor. I since looked up the rules and referred to Fantasy HERO. From henceforth, Armor doesn't stack.

Thats a GM's option, but one I use as well in fantasy. My house rules on the subject are here:

 

 

- BODY hey? It's good to have lots of it. Or armor. Or not get hit. Because getting hit with a great sword hurts a great deal.

All good strategies. Minding your character's defensive options is a good sound plan to maintaining their continued existance.

 

Check out Block and Roll With Punch as well -- two very handy things, particularly in a Heroic game.

 

- END. Basically, I need to track it, or get players to track theirs. It seems to be too important as a balance to leave out. I ignored it in this combat.

Don't worry about it overly much while you get used to the game. There are some tricks to minimize the bookkeeping of this also. For starters, consider buying character abilities to be 0 END, and applying 0 END to STR, Running, etc. It's somewhat expensive, but can be very very effective in a drawn out engagement.

 

An out-of-character trick is to sit down and for each character puzzle out their average END expenditure per PHASE, multiply it by their SPD, subtract their PS-12 REC, and have the Players track that amount per TURN. It's not exact, and you would need to address any significant occassional END expenditures, like an Autofire and other multiple attack actions.

 

So for example, lets say Timmy has a 20 STR, 6 REC, 30 END, 3 SPD, and 6" of ground movement. In combat he usually 1/2 Moves and strikes or otherwise uses his STR; thus he typically spends 5 END per Phase (if you are using the Heroic 5 STR costs 1 END option); thus each TURN Timmy loses 15-6 = 9 END beyond his REC. So, as a simplicity if the player forgets to keep track of their END just subtract 9 END each TURN that Timmy is in combat. It's fast, and encourages resource hoarding players to track it more closely.

 

- "Using STR". One of my players asked me what that meant. I went "Ummm... I haven't been able to find out in the rules either. I'm pretty sure that whenever you do something that requires lower-case 's' strength, you use STR, and that you pretty much always use all of it in combat unless you tell me otherwise"[/qoute]

The STR rules are pretty clear cut on how to use STR, but off the top of my head, you use STR to exert force, move mass, grapple, strike things, throw things, escape from entangles, and leap. A character does STR/5 in d6 damage when striking unarmed, leaps STR/5 in inches (plus any additional Leap they have bought seperately), roll STR/5 in d6 and count the "BODY" (ie 1=0, 2-5=1, 6=2) to escape from Grabs and Entangles, and so forth. There are various charts detailing lifting capacity, throwing distances, encumbrance categories, and what not.

 

- Movement and END. The rulebook says that movement costs 1 END per so-many active points, and this includes your normal movement. I couldn't figure out how much END it costs a regular, base HERO to move 6".

Every 1" of Running costs 2 active points. Thus 6" = 12 AP = 1 END.

 

- Damage. Beforehand, I figured out the common case of using weapons to do killing damage, but ignored non-weapon killing damage and weaponed normal damage. One of the characters was a martial artist trained in open-hand fighting. Players never do what you expect.

Normal damage is easier to calculate and resolve than Killing damage so you shouldnt have any probems there. If it is easier to conceptualize the difference, Normal damage is mostly non-lethal but can do lethal damage vs frail opponents or in enough quantities. Like getting hit by a car; and low speeds it can hurt, at high speed (more velocity = more damage) it can kill; Killing damage on the other hand is intended to be lethal, though it may not always kill it does serious injury, particularly in a Heroic campaign.

 

- With OCVs and DCVs changing so much due to CSLs and penalties and so forth, we've decided to use the alternative "(11 + OCV - 3d6 >= DCV) is a hit" system.

Ive used this method for years and greatly prefer it.

 

- Lacking a convenient "Challenge Rating" system like the d20 system, I just built two Heroic characters on 75+75 and gave them some decent equipment. It proved to be a good challenge for the party. I'm going to need some sort of basic algorithm for estimating a challenge though. Average STUN and BODY inflicted per Turn seems like a good starting point.

There are many many variables and nuances involved, and as you branch out and make more complicated characters you'll find that it's not quite so easy to determine as that.

 

Some GM's like to use various formula and similar to determine combat capacity, called collectively "The Rule of X" -- it's kind of like Unified Field Theory for the HERO System though.

 

When I was first starting off I went by the points and when in doubt ran quick sample combats in my mind against the PCs until I got a better handle on what works and what doesnt. However, after I had a little more experience under my belt I started just going by "feel".

 

I really can't wait to start playing out this Fantasy HERO campaign. I've promised that I won't buy any more HERO books until I do. (MMM, Grimoire, UMA (is that available?) and Ninja HERO are all on the list).

 

cheers,

jml

 

Off that list the only one I would worry about getting is the UMA. I can't imagine playing the HERO System for any length of time without it, but then I like the Martial Arts system of HERO quite a bit.

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: First Blood -- Impressions

 

Congrats!

 

Sounds like you had a good first attempt at Gm'ing Hero.

 

Good luck in your future campaigns. Check in here periodically and let us know how its going (or if you have any questions, of course)

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: First Blood -- Impressions

 

To add one point;

 

I'd have to agree with Killer Shrike above. If there is one book that is essential to the Hero system as a whole (besides the main rulesbook of course) thats The Ultimate Martial Artist. Get one if you can.

 

If you like Modern or future campaigns as well, The Ultimate Vehicle is also a must have. But the UMA should definately be #1 on your list of future purchases.

[Eosin]

Re: First Blood -- Impressions

 

Add a ditto to what NSG & KS said - UMA is fairly intergral to a non-powered campaign (or at least it is in all the games I play).

[Steve Long]

Re: First Blood -- Impressions

 

I made it clear to one player that I'd never GM a campaign with a PC called Stabby McKnifer

 

Now, that's just plain unkind.

 

Re: UMA, we no longer have printed copies in stock, and have no plans to reprint at this time. However, there are still a good many copies floating around through distribution and retail; it's not as if it's completely vanished. We should soon be making it available for sale as a PDF; this week's update notes some of the work I did on it over the past few days.

[Susano]

Re: First Blood -- Impressions

 

I really can't wait to start playing out this Fantasy HERO campaign. I've promised that I won't buy any more HERO books until I do. (MMM, Grimoire, UMA (is that available?) and Ninja HERO are all on the list).

 

If you are going with PCs built on 75+75 points, I'm not sure how much immediate use you will get out of NINJA HERO (and I'm allowed to say that, seeing as I wrote it). Unless you're running a swashbuckling campaign ala 7th SEA, I think your best bet is UMA. Now, if you want to a more anime/wuxia-flavored fantasy game, with flying swordsmen, freaky ninja, and chi-powered Shaolin monks, then NINJA HERO is your book!

 

As for the other books you listed, I'd recommend the HERO SYSTEM Bestiary before MMM (if only for the basics on animal use and the listings of standard fantasy and mundane animals), but get MMM once you can (since it has all the minion monsters written up). I also highly recommend the GRIMORE (excellent resource for spells and spell ideas) as well as the GRIMORE II.

[Silbeg]

Re: First Blood -- Impressions

 

Re: UMA' date=' we no longer have printed copies in stock, and have no plans to reprint at this time. However, there are still a good many copies floating around through distribution and retail; it's not as if it's completely vanished. We should soon be making it available for sale as a PDF; this week's update notes some of the work I did on it over the past few days.[/quote'] If I may ask, is there a reason for this? Does it have to do with your change in printers? Seems a shame that books in the series would go out of print (I am sorry, but PDF replacements just aren't the same), especially one so popular. Was the first supplement I purchased!

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: First Blood -- Impressions

 

If I may ask' date=' is there a reason for this? Does it have to do with your change in printers? Seems a shame that books in the series would go out of print (I am sorry, but PDF replacements just aren't the same), especially one so popular. Was the first supplement I purchased![/quote']

 

If I recall correctly, the reason is that sales have declined (most who want the book have the book) such that a large enough print run to be cost-effective would leave Hero with an excessive number of books to store for an excessively long period while current sales slowly dribble the supply out. Plus, like in any business, it's not economical to tie up large sums of money in slow moving inventory.

 

In other words, my understanding is that it's an inventory management issue, not a change in the printers.

[aylwin13]

Re: First Blood -- Impressions

 

...However' date=' there are still a good many copies floating around through distribution and retail; it's not as if it's completely vanished...[/quote']

 

As Steve said earlier, there are copies of UMA available out there. I looked through the HERO Games On-line retailers list, and all of these sites still had UMA for sale. Prices vary.

 

http://www.taloncomics.com/herogames.html

 

http://www.gameslore.co.uk/acatalog/Product/PR_HER101.html

 

http://www.theherofactory.com/inprint.html

 

http://www.rpgshop.com/product_info.php?cPath=_1_452&products_id=30576&

 

http://www.warehouse23.com/item.cgi?DOJHER101

[Steve Long]

Re: First Blood -- Impressions

 

If I may ask, is there a reason for this?

 

Sure. The reason is UMA doesn't sell at a sufficient rate to justify the minimum print run we would have to buy. Given the rate at which the book sold in the many month prior to selling out, reprinting even the minimum number we would typically print would in effect mean we'd tie up money in UMA inventory for the rest of the life of the company. In short, it's not worth the cost.

[Rapier]

Re: First Blood -- Impressions

 

At one point' date=' I made it clear to one player that I'd never GM a campaign with a PC called Stabby McKnifer.[/quote']

You are really missing out...and you would REALLY hate my games!

 

Stabby McKnifer is right up my alley.

 

Jabby Le Spike

Stinky de Eau

Flamer McHotty

Tranz Par Ent

 

It satisfies this disturbing urge I have for puns and word games.

[John T]

Re: First Blood -- Impressions

 

You are really missing out...and you would REALLY hate my games!

 

Stabby McKnifer is right up my alley.

 

Jabby Le Spike

Stinky de Eau

Flamer McHotty

Tranz Par Ent

 

It satisfies this disturbing urge I have for puns and word games.

Then how about:

 

Justin Thyme

Justin Case

Evelyn Karnate

Monterrey Jack (a character I'd LOVE to build for a Pulp Hero campaign )

Sandy Klause

Annie (Andy) Matter

Al Bondigas

 

...don't get me started, man!

 

John T

[Rapier]

Re: First Blood -- Impressions

 

Then how about:

 

Justin Thyme

Justin Case

Evelyn Karnate

Monterrey Jack (a character I'd LOVE to build for a Pulp Hero campaign )

Sandy Klause

Annie (Andy) Matter

Al Bondigas

 

...don't get me started, man!

Heh. I've actually used Justin Thyme, Justin Case and Evelyn Carnite!

 

It started as a joke one night when I was short on time and hadn't named the villains. So I stand on the chair, with one leg up on the table, fists on hips and announce "Fear for your lives Heroes, for I am Razor McSlice!" I then went on to introduce the rest of his dubiously named compadres. Since then, it's really become a schtick.

[jml]

Re: First Blood -- Impressions

 

As for the other books you listed' date=' I'd recommend the [i']HERO SYSTEM Bestiary[/i] before MMM (if only for the basics on animal use and the listings of standard fantasy and mundane animals), but get MMM once you can (since it has all the minion monsters written up). I also highly recommend the GRIMORE (excellent resource for spells and spell ideas) as well as the GRIMORE II.

 

Well, I bought the Bestiary Hero Designer prefabs, rather than the book itself, because it was cheaper, and I wouldn't have to wait for international shipping. Although I'm sure the book is excellent (all HERO books that I've read have been), does it provide anything useful apart from beast stats?

[jml]

Re: First Blood -- Impressions

 

You are really missing out...and you would REALLY hate my games!

 

Stabby McKnifer is right up my alley.

 

Perhaps I am. However, there's enough wit and wordplay around the gaming table already.

 

Also, the campaign that I'm planning on running is to be an epic fantasy campaign. Much of the impact of that sub-genre is based on a certain level of internal seriousness.

 

...and now, poised on the brink of world domination, Sauron's dentist commits to single combat with his arch nemesis: Anna Sthetic.

[Rapier]

Re: First Blood -- Impressions

 

...and now' date=' poised on the brink of world domination, Sauron's dentist commits to single combat with his arch nemesis: Anna Sthetic.[/quote']

See, now don't you feel liberated.

 

How about my sonic EPer? Your standard halloween skeleton costume (black body suit with white glow in the dark bones)...yep, Skell-E-Tone.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: First Blood -- Impressions

 

Well' date=' I bought the Bestiary Hero Designer prefabs, rather than the book itself, because it was cheaper, and I wouldn't have to wait for international shipping. Although I'm sure the book is excellent (all HERO books that I've read have been), does it provide anything useful apart from beast stats?[/quote']

 

Well, of course that will depend on what you consider "useful."

 

Every creature comes with a description of its ecology, personality and motivation, typical abilities and combat "tactics," and suggested campaign use. There's some general advice on how to use animals and creatures in various campaigns: what role they function in modern adventures, fantasy, sci-fi etc., how to roleplay them, and how to train them to your use.

 

There's a breakdown of the appropriate range of Characteristics and what they mean applied to animals, and the same thing with Skills, as well as a list of "Everycreature Skills." How Talents and Powers interact with animals is covered, and there's quite a bit of discussion of appropriate Disads and how to use them.

 

A number of customizable templates for particular creature abilities are spelled out, enabling you to quickly modify creatures to your taste: Size templates for large or small creatures, Venomous creatures, Diseased creatures, those who live in other environments like underwater or space, Undead or Elemental versions, and so on.

 

The book examines animals in combat, what maneuvers are appropriate, and Martial Arts for trained fighting animals. There are several new optional Hit Location tables for creatures with a configuration other than humanoid. You also get info on how to run "swarms" of small creatures.

 

There's a quick reference list in the back of the book with the combat-pertinent stats for every creature, so you can whip one out on the fly during a game. I also think most of the artwork is pretty nifty - almost every creature has an illustration.