Guest taxboy4 Posted January 3, 2005 Report Share Posted January 3, 2005 Hello all On my home RPG site in Wellington New Zealand http://central.rpg.net.nz/cgi-bin/cutecast/cutecast.pl?session=1jRwFAjlsUulVSK86nEnNSWJxl&forum=3&thread=1150&page=1#3 I get a bit of stick for ranting about Fantasy Hero being much supieior to other game systems esp d20 and D&D (yuck!!). Found this link of why D&D sucks - quite funny and true... Thought this could be a good forum to post it http://kuoi.asui.uidaho.edu/~kamikaze/RPG/wrong_adnd.php Also while I'm here New Zealanders are referred to as Kiwi's - not that small green fruit but our national bird and we are def. not part of Australia. Cheers ears Baz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Martin Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe Calling in Mark Hughes as a witness against D&D is like calling Jack Chick as a witness against gaming (or Catholicism, or a host of other subjects . . . ). Matthew L. Martin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curufea Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe Nice! This is definitely going on my LJ Too many of my friends treat it like a religion. And as some of them are fairly vocally athiest, I should be more vocally antiD&D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest taxboy4 Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe Calling in Mark Hughes as a witness against D&D is like calling Jack Chick as a witness against gaming (or Catholicism, or a host of other subjects . . . ). Matthew L. Martin Could be mate, but he does make some interesting points...and now a guy who subscripes to my home forums is chastising me for trying to start a flame war...I mean I buy into the arguement that different game systems are good for different things but heck, for Fantasy Rolemaster has levels and hits but is more realsitic / felxible than D&D, even GURPS that HERO wanna be is better.... I don't buy into the argfuement its bettercos lots of people play it...lots of people use Microsoft exploer but firefox is the shizzknee,,,, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sketchpad Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe eh ... I don't have a prob with D&D or d20 ... heck I still play them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rapier Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe eh ... I don't have a prob with D&D or d20 ... heck I still play them Well sure, it's fun to go slummin every once and again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enforcer84 Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe Well sure' date=' it's fun to go slummin every once and again! [/quote'] That's why I am here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curufea Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe I play D20 because our most frequent GMs like D20. However - it is the best system to represent a D20 heroic fantasy world. I don't know of any other system that can adequately portray the D20 heroic fantasy setting. Of course, I prefer realism or even continuity and logic - but am willing to put those aside for a system that is its own setting and genre. Its also great for Farscape D20 heroic fantasy world, Modern D20 heroic fantasy world, Cthulhu D20 heroic fantasy world and any other D20 heroic fantasy world with different names. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lupus Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe *yawn* Oh, is it time for the Anti-D&D diatribe again? Wake me when the too-cool-for-school tribe go home again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest taxboy4 Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe I play D20 because our most frequent GMs like D20. However - it is the best system to represent a D20 heroic fantasy world. I don't know of any other system that can adequately portray the D20 heroic fantasy setting. Of course, I prefer realism or even continuity and logic - but am willing to put those aside for a system that is its own setting and genre. Its also great for Farscape D20 heroic fantasy world, Modern D20 heroic fantasy world, Cthulhu D20 heroic fantasy world and any other D20 heroic fantasy world with different names. that doesn't really make sense....all genres can be captured very well by the HERO system - all genre d20 do are apply the same base rules to a genre, still with the same base problems and limitations. At worst it rampant commercialism , at best its propagation of a flawed system into areas serviced by other gaming systems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CourtFool Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe I am way too cool for school, so you go nap now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest taxboy4 Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe *yawn* Oh, is it time for the Anti-D&D diatribe again? Wake me when the too-cool-for-school tribe go home again. well, thats a good contribution to the thread - at least Curufea had an arguement or contribution. Forgive us mortals who havn't run down this topic before and allow a little to and frooing... its a bit like censorship if you don't want to read about this arguement , don't and keep your posts to yourself, little one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CourtFool Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe We have to make a contribution? Why didn't I get the memo!?Um...I don't like D&D because...uh...well...it's D&D. I like the skills. Oh wait! They stole that from other systems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rapier Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe I play D20 because our most frequent GMs like D20. However - it is the best system to represent a D20 heroic fantasy world. I don't know of any other system that can adequately portray the D20 heroic fantasy setting. Of course, I prefer realism or even continuity and logic - but am willing to put those aside for a system that is its own setting and genre. Its also great for Farscape D20 heroic fantasy world, Modern D20 heroic fantasy world, Cthulhu D20 heroic fantasy world and any other D20 heroic fantasy world with different names. Well, of course, D20 is best at representing a D20 setting. That's like saying a ham sammich is best at tasting like a ham sammich. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest taxboy4 Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe We have to make a contribution? Why didn't I get the memo!?Um...I don't like D&D because...uh...well...it's D&D. I like the skills. Oh wait! They stole that from other systems. Apologies, I was a bit tectchy yesterday, my tone of my post could have been better, the message is still the same though. I think its something about the poster being an Ozzie and me banging my head locally with the D&D zealots...they are worse with logic than my fundamentalist mum.. Me: But Mum, how do you know the bible is true? Mum: Becasue it says so in the Bible. Me: AHhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest taxboy4 Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe Well' date=' of course, D20 is best at representing a D20 setting. That's like saying a ham sammich is best at tasting like a ham sammich.[/quote'] hahha, exactly what i meant to say!!! Hell even Rolemaster is better than D&D. Quite liked MERP and Rolemaster - gave me my first gentle introduction to logical skill progression and combat - where an Orc is scary. I must admit once you play a lot of Fantasy Hero, I cannot stand playing D&D, - its just that it D&D the Orc is a one dimensional cannon fodder, esp at level 5+...in FH, no matter how powerful you are a group of Orcs or Footsoldiers who outnumber you 5-1 are always a risk... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incrdbil Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe I thinkit comes down to this. If there was a good GM who said "you want to play a good game of D&D"--I'd probably say yes. If he said "Would you like to play a good fantasy role playing game system", I'd reply, "oh, so were playing something other than D&D?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest taxboy4 Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe I thinkit comes down to this. If there was a good GM who said "you want to play a good game of D&D"--I'd probably say yes. If he said "Would you like to play a good fantasy role playing game system"' date=' I'd reply, "oh, so were playing something other than D&D?"[/quote'] Good point mate, I think there is def a level of horses for courses here..I guess now after being a ardent AD&D player / DM er I have gone way off it. A bit like those annoying reformed non-smokers :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Houston GM Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe Well, of course, D20 is best at representing a D20 setting. That's like saying a ham sammich is best at tasting like a ham sammich. You're missing Curufea's point. If a person's favorite food is ham sammiches, you're not going to be able to convince them that pizzas are a better food. Similarly, other gaming systems don't feel the same as D&D/d20 systems. If you prefer the feel of those systems, you will always prefer them to systems like Hero. In d20, you start out where an equal number of orcs is a credible threat. Later in your career, your party can tackle an army of orcs. Further on, you can fight multiple dragons at the same time. Is it realistic? No. Do some people prefer it to more realistic feeling games? Yes. As a GM, I prefer to run my fantasy game by Hero rules. As a player, I'll use whatever system the GM prefers. A good GM can run a good game regardless of the system. A bad GM will run a bad game regardless of the system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bblackmoor Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe Bradd Szonye wrote a really good piece on a subject closely related to this. I liked it enough to get his permission to add it to the RPG Library FAQs. You might find it interesting. FAQ: Why bother with a class system, when it essentially is emulating a skill system? This FAQ specifically addresses an objection to d20 Modern, but it also addresses the larger question of "why bother with a class system at all?" (And personally, I like D&D quite a bit, even though I disliked AD&D and absolutely hated second edition AD&D.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintQuakko Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe that doesn't really make sense....all genres can be captured very well by the HERO system - all genre d20 do are apply the same base rules to a genre' date=' still with the same base problems and limitations. At worst it rampant commercialism , at best its propagation of a flawed system into areas serviced by other gaming systems.[/quote'] In Horror/Suspense/NormiesVs.TheDark games, the hero system seems like it would be a little... overpowered... like using a cannon to swat a fly... I rather enjoy using a pared down version of the d20 CoC rules (mixed with the SW damage rules and removing levels, because who wants to play CoC for more than a session or two?). Not that HERO couldn't handle it, it just seems like more work than I'd want to deal with (emulating a fear/insanity guage) when running a "run away!" type setting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curufea Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe I think its something about the poster being an Ozzie and me banging my head locally with the D&D zealots...they are worse with logic than my fundamentalist mum.. Ahem. I was pro your initial post, and I'm an Aussie ;-p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest taxboy4 Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe Ahem. I was pro your initial post' date=' and I'm an Aussie ;-p[/quote'] The exception that proves the rule Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curufea Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe Have you got any more links? I would really like to see something about D20. Preferrably a detailed enough discussion that it is similar to http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest taxboy4 Posted January 4, 2005 Report Share Posted January 4, 2005 Re: D & D Diatribe Have you got any more links? I would really like to see something about D20. Preferrably a detailed enough discussion that it is similar to http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/ Whoa I should send this to my mum... Sorry no, and i got so much shit at my local rpg forum I had to remove the thread... guess i should stick to the safe advice and let everyone play their own beloved systems... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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