5ER review

[Barwickian]

Here's the text of a review of 5ER I've just sent to rpg.net. It should be up sometime over the next week.

 

It's taken me longer that I thought to write it - I started just afer Christmas when, to my surprise, there were no reviews of 5ER on rpg.net. Since then, there's been one posted - by a newbie no less - which you can find at: http://www.rpg.net/reviews/archive/11/11044.phtml.

 

Anyway, FWIW, here's my take:

 

Over the past 18 months I've become increasingly impressed by, and devoted to, the Hero System. I'm a late starter - many Hero fans have been playing since its first incarnation, as the Champions RPG (1981); back in those days I was hooked on AD&D, Traveller and Runequest.

 

But since I bought Hero 5th edition, it's become one of my favourites. While I'm no expert compared to the people who've been playing for more than 20 years, I can no longer class myself as a newbie, as I did in my review of the Fantasy Hero Grimoire.

 

I'm going to attempt two things in this review: to give an overview of the differences between the fifth edition and the fifth edition, revised (henceforth known as 5ER), which will be of more interest to established players; and then to review 5ER as if it were an entirely new product, which will be of more interest to those who don't already play Hero.

 

So what does 5ER do that the unrevised 5th edition didn't?

 

Well, the most obvious difference is that it's chunkier. Far chunkier. The old version was an impressive 372-page hardback - thick enough for me to show a friend in awed disbelief - but the new one adds more than 200 extra pages, making it an intimidating 1.75 inches (4.5cm) across the spine. And the UK price (£29.99) is only £1 more than the previous oevre.

 

It isn't size that matters, though, it's what you do with it. And what DOJ/Hero Games have done seems intended to make it a lot easier for beginners to get into the system. The layout is clearer, the rules are clearer, and there are many more examples of rules in action. The FAQ file from the old edition has been incorporated into the revised version, so many of the thorny rules questions are answered in the book, and of course, the errata have been fixed.

 

Actual rules changes are very few - the only one I've spotted is that the way Extra-Dimensional Movement works (and its point costs) have been altered. That means that if you're happy with your 5th Edition, you don't have to upgrade. Let me repeat that: THE RULES HAVE HARDLY CHANGED - YOU DON'T HAVE TO UPGRADE. But for me, an extra 30 quid spent on a re-written version of rules I already own has been 30 quid well spent.

 

How I wish it had been available when I initially took the plunge. Hero System is hugely flexible, and the rules are relatively simple, but it requires something of a paradigm shift when you're used to more typical RPGs. The process gave me headaches. 5ER is much easier on the brain.

 

The first thing that makes the new version easier to use is simple navigation: each section is marked on the edge of the pages, making it easy to find the bit you're looking for. It's a minor touch, but important in a book this big.

 

The next most obvious difference is the addition of a new 50-page chapter (Hero Genre by Genre), which gives capsule overviews of how to modify Hero System for its most popular settings (superhero, fantasy, SF, modern action and 1930s pulp) and two or three paragraphs apiece on minor settings (horror, post-apocalypse, Old West). The main settings list recommended power levels, character archetypes, sample characters and popular sub-genres. For more details, look to the relevant expansion book (Fantasy Hero, Star Hero, Dark Champions and so on).

 

So what about the other 170 extra pages? Well, it isn't like you're going to find a new page here and a new page there - we're talking about a re-write of the entire book. The new text, while remaining crunchy, is largely devoted to making things clearer and providing examples for Hero newbies.

 

For example, there's a new table in the character generation section which shows what kind of stats various different kinds of people would have. Old hands may already know this, but for newcomers it's useful when designing characters to know that an Olympic-grade weightlifter would have a Strength of 14-20, and Hercules a Strength of more than 31.

 

There's a very useful new appendix giving templates for characters/creatures of different sizes, from insectile to colossal, which draws together rules scattered throughout the old edition.

 

OK, that's established (I hope) the main differences between old edition and revised edition. Let me change tack and review this as if it were a new product.

 

The physical side

5ER is, as mentioned, a huge tome. Hardback, 1.75 inches thick, and 592 pages. It is, according to Hero Games, designed to stand up to massive amounts of punishment. My copy hasn't been around long enough to judge the truth of this claim over the long term, but it has survived three months of reading and two game sessions unscathed. The pages are of an unbleached, rough textured paper which feels flimsy but is apparently designed for strength. It tends to give the book a slightly grubby appearance, though. Printing is black and white throughout, and nice and crisp. The body text is big enough for me to read without my spectacles (your eyesight may vary).

 

Artwork: Entirely B&W, and mostly line-art. Quality variies between acceptable and satisfactory - nothing awesome, but nothing awful. A nice touch is the use of B&W versions existing Hero book covers as full-page illustrations at the beginning of each chapter, such as the Dark Champions cover, showing a gunman bursting through a window, introducing Combat and Adventuring.

 

Overall: It looks as though Hero Games have had to balance presentation, durability and affordability. Presentation drew the short straw. It's a good effort - just be aware that the wow factor of this book lies in its size, not its appearance.

 

The Contents

 

Introduction (18 pages): Two pages of Hero history, followed by basic game concepts, core mechanics (3d6 skill rolls) and a brief overview of character creation and combat (do not skip this if you're a newbie), a sample filled-in character sheet, then a seven-page glossary. Since Hero, as befits its 1980s origins, is given to acronyms and abbreviations, the glossary is your friend.

 

Character creation (320 pages): Hero is a points-based design system, intended to be utterly flexible. You can create what you want, from an inch-high flower fairy to an extra-dimensional intelligent space amoeba. That's why this chapter is so big.

 

Hero breaks characters down into three basic types: normals, heroes and superheroes. Normals and heroes use the same rules; superheroes have a couple of differences - most notably, where normals and heroes can pay money, rather than character points, superheroes have to use their character points (of which they have many). The reasoning is that superheroic equipment is as much part of the character as innate powers (after all, where would Batman be without his utility belt or the Batmobile?). Normals and heroes have limits on their characteristics which are expensive (in design point terms) to exceed; superheroes don't.

 

PCs are generally either heroes or superheroes. You can play normals, but you have very few points to spend, and it's generally considered something for experienced players rather than novices.

 

With your chaarcter points, you buy characteristics (there are eight primary ones, including strength, intelligence, dexterity and body, and six derived ones - such as speed and recovery - which you can top up with extra points), skills, perks, talents and powers.

 

Powers are the key to Hero. 231 pages of character creation are devoted to them. They're what turn your bundles of characteristics into the flower fairy, the giant space amoeba, Rocket Man or whatever. And if you've never played Hero before, they're going to hurt your head.

 

The main things to understand about Powers is that they're described in terms of game mechanics. You decide what they represent. For instance, the Power Ranged Killing Attack could be a longbow, a lightning spell, a revolver, laser rifle or venom spit. It's up to you to decide, within the limits of the campaign. To turn the power into what you've decided, you then apply various modifiers to it.

 

For example, if your Ranged Killing Attack is a revolver, you'll add the modifiers Obvious Accessible Focus (people can see it, and can snatch it from you), Real Weapon (it has to be cleaned and maintained) and Limited Charges: 6 (you have six shots before you need to reload).

 

If it's a lightning bolt spell you'll probably want the modifiers Incantations, Gestures and Requires Magic Skill Roll, and you may like to add Extra Time (if you need some preparation before unleashing the spell), Requires Expendable Focus (if you need a material component) and so on.

 

There's no getting round it - to use Hero effectively, you have to understand how to use Powers and Power Modifiers. There is a learning curve: I'd say it took me about a year to get to grips with it fully by reading the 5th edition, but I never had the opportunity to play in someone else's Hero game first. That's the hard way - if you have a GM who knows the system, it'll be quicker, and 5ER will also make things quicker. But be aware of the learning curve.

 

Character creation rounds off with Disadvantages (which you can take to get more points to spend), a sample character (Randall Irons, a 1930s pulp hero) and four pages of generic NPC characters.

 

Combat and Adventuring (86 pages): The chapter covers spotting (the use of senses and perception rolls), moving (getting close enough to hit), striking (how to hit) and hurting your opponent (damage rolls). Various optional rules follow, together with sections on healing, special attacks and an example of combat (a clash between a superhero and a supervillain and his lackeys).

 

The default level of Hero combat is cinematic. PCs are expected to be able to take a fair bit of punishment and survive, and to pull a few flashy moves. Optional rules allow you to downgrade the combat towards gritty realism or upgrade it to four-colour pazzazz.

 

It assumes the use of a battleboard and miniatures though, like all such systems, you can make do without them at the expense of tactical precision.

It's often said (though I haven't found it so) that Hero combat is rather time-consuming, so there's even a panel giving several ideas on how to speed it up by taking shortcuts.

 

The Environment (18 pages): Deals with such things as falling, hazardous environments (radiation, chemicals and so on) and with breaking or repairing machinary, equipment and buildings. There are a coupleof pages on hiding and concealment, and three pages on animals (which only gives three sample beasts: the black bear, the lion and a heavy warhorse).

 

Equipment (44 pages): Equipment, like characters, is built using design points and Powers. As noted earlier, superheroes do have to pay points to have equipment, as its really just an expression of their superhero powers, but heroes just have to pay cash. The chapter covers creating automatons (which could be robots in an SF setting, or golems and zombies in a fantasy setting), computers, vehicles and bases, and weapons and armour. Rules for vehicle combat and explosives are found here.

Since heroic-level games don't really need to go through the whole design process there are a selection of prefab vehicles and weapons in table form, from archaic weapons and armours, through modern firearms, and a selection of modern vehicles.

 

Hero System Genre by Genre (52 pages): Each of Hero System's major genres is given an overview of several pages, ranging from two pages for the as-yet-unpublished Pulp Hero to 14 pages for Champions, the superhero genre in which Hero has its origins. Each gets a campaign overview and guidelines, conventions of the genre, suggested level of play (heroic or superheroic), and suggested points values for beginning characters, and each has sample characters. Five minor settings get three pages of notes between them.

 

Gamesmastering (14 pages): Has some good, if not awe-inspiring, advice on the Noble Art. Most of it boils down to common sense. It's well written, and may prove useful for a beginning GM; I couldn't say - I've been GMing for more than 20 years. Perhaps the most useful sections are on using PC disadvantages as part of the game (something that applies to any design system with disadvantages), and a handy list of GM Dos and Don'ts. THe most important bits of advice for someone who's GMed plenty but is new to Hero are the sections on participating in character design and on pacing character growth - after all, when the system can do pretty much anything you can imagine, you may want to try and ensure what the players design fits in with the overall concept of the campaign.

 

Changing the System (9 pages): Gives you an overview of the thinking behind Hero System, suggests ways you may like to adapt rules to fit particular genre, and finally tackles the biggies altering the rules in the book to fit your game. It's interesting that the example of changing the rules (in which the GM considers all the possibilities of affecting game balance and so on) ends with the GM deciding that the rules work perfectly well as written and a change would be detrimental. Hubris on the part of principal designer Steve Long? Maybe - or perhaps he's given what you have his best shot, and can't think of any ways to improve the rules he's written.

 

Concluding Notes (21 pages): The story of how Hero came to be, suggestions as to where you can take it, a four-page appendix covering the issue of differently sized characters and creatures (extremely useful), character sheet to copy, and a 13-page index. The index will be your friend - learn to love it.

 

Conclusion

 

Hero is a very flexible system with a steep learning curve. It's capable of modelling just about anything you want it to, but you have to be prepared to do the grunt work of learning how to use Powers and Power Modifiers. Whether you choose to put in the graft is up to you - I did, and I'm reaping the benefits of what I've found to be a wonderful system.

 

It's also an all-in-one book. Yes, there are genre supplements (such as Dark Champions or Fantasy Hero) and rules supplements (such as The Ultimate Martial Artist or The Ultimate Vehicle), but these are really just specific applications of the rules you find in 5ER. They make your life easier and suggest new ideas, but don't change the core rules any. That's impressive - all you need to play is your campaign notes and one (admittedly hefty) rulesbook, and you're ready to rumble.

 

Awarding the Scores

 

Style: 4 - If I were going purely on production quality, this would be a 3, as I think even Hero Games would admit they've sacrificed presentation for content. However, it's well written and clearly organised, with many examples, and that earns 5ER the bonus point as far as I'm concerned.

 

Substance: 5 - And if the reviewing rules allowed, I'd give it a 6. It's a hugely crunchy book which gives you the tools to model any genre you care to imagine. I was bowled over by the potential of Hero 5th; 5ER makes it easier to turn the potential into reality.

 

Note: edited to remove HTML tags, which no longer work on the boards

[Sean Waters]

Re: 5ER review

 

So you quite like it then?

 

Excellent job, and well worth the rep you'll be receiving when I finish typing this....

[Sean Waters]

Re: 5ER review

 

I read the other review you pointed at too, which was also pretty excellent. I was interested to note that it had been read nearly 2400 times since mid-February.

 

I do like that.

[crayadder]

Re: 5ER review

 

I only have one small issue with your review--I can't get the word 'crunchy' out of my head.

Aside from that, great review; I wanted to buy the book before, but now I NEED to buy the book!

 

Well done!

[Barwickian]

Re: 5ER review

 

I only have one small issue with your review--I can't get the word 'crunchy' out of my head.

 

Yeah, my bad. It's almost entirely down the the posts I've been reading on this forum over the last couple of days (are genre books fluffy, or are they crunchy?).

 

I began writing the review just after Christmas, extended it at the beginning of February, and completed and edited it today. Somehow the word 'crunchy' embedded itself in my brain...

 

Aside from that, great review; I wanted to buy the book before, but now I NEED to buy the book!

 

I know exactly how you feel. The truth is, you don't. You merely want it.

 

You, sir, are the victim of Steve Long's secret power: Minor Transform 4d6 (turn want into need), Based on ECV (+1), Works Against EGO, not BODY (+1/4), Area of Effect (+1/4), MegaArea: planet Earth (+1 1/4), Limited Target: Hero fans (-1/2).

 

Given that the average roll of a 4d6 is 14, only strong-willed Hero fans are likely to resist Steve's secret power. Being weak-willed, I naturally succumbed.

 

I suspect Steve has another secret power: Major Transform 3d6: create want, with similar modifiers. Despite the fact that I do not now, nor have ever, played or GMed a superhero game, I still feel the urge to pick up a copy of Champions. Only the purchase of Hudson City and Valdorian Age can expunge this burgeoning desire (which may also qualify as an NND on Steve's lesser-known secret power).

 

But thanks to both you and Sean for the nice words.

[incrdbil]

Re: 5ER review

 

Nice review, but I see its attracted some of the usual replies fomr the 'hate anything that isn't 20 sided crowd". who can't tolerate a good review of a non d20 product. What really bugs me are the people who present their (almost always incorrect) opinion as fact, or talk about the game like they have a clue about it when it's powerfully obvious they don't.

[Barwickian]

Re: 5ER review

 

The review is now up on rpg.net at:

 

http://www.rpg.net/reviews/archive/11/11174.phtml

 

Stand by to repel boarders.

[Trebuchet]

Re: 5ER review

 

Nice review, Andy. Well done, and repped.

 

And I quite agree with your tagline: Excrement occurs.

[Guest bblackmoor]

Re: 5ER review

 

Way, way, way overdue, but here's my review of H5R.

 

http://www.blackgate.net/blog/index.php/review-hero-system-fifth-edition-revised

 

I put it off for so long because I knew it was going to be less than glowing, and I dreaded doing it. Ah, well.

 

It'll be appearing in <Nth Degree> at some point, space permitting, probably along with my Fantasy Hero review, and my Valdorian Age review (which will be glowing) if I get to it in time.

[Sean Waters]

Re: 5ER review

 

Way, way, way overdue, but here's my review of H5R.

 

http://www.blackgate.net/blog/index.php/review-hero-system-fifth-edition-revised

 

I put it off for so long because I knew it was going to be less than glowing, and I dreaded doing it. Ah, well.

 

It'll be appearing in <Nth Degree> at some point, space permitting, probably along with my Fantasy Hero review, and my Valdorian Age review (which will be glowing) if I get to it in time.

 

Those who did not use Hero System in their games would encounter a rule-tweaking, mechanic-fiddling, mini-maxing, minutiae-obsessed Champions player, and draw the obvious, albeit incorrect, conclusion.....

 

Well, if you are going to get personal...

 

I don't really agree with a number of your points. I don't think the 5er or h5r or whatever is badly organised (and it contains the finest index of any game syste I've ever seen). The quality is not good but that doesn't bother me too much - it isn't a glossy piece of merchandise but it works. My biggest gripe about 5thed revised (and 5th ed, for that matter) is that it lacks excitement. I think it is a great piece of work, a valuable addition to the line. It doesn't make you salivate to start playing though.

 

I do agree it is too big. I think the physical size (and attendant cost) may put off a number of players and SideKick doesn't quite work had enough to fill the gap.

 

The trouble is (and to me it is more of a feature than a problem) 5ER has been written for Hero fans. That's great for Hero fans but means we are all going to have to do the work of dragging in new blood.

 

Still, some good points and a good piece of work.

 

Sean

[Guest bblackmoor]

Re: 5ER review

 

I don't think the 5er or h5r or whatever is badly organised (and it contains the finest index of any game syste I've ever seen).

 

I did give it props for the index. A good index can make all the difference in the world.

[prestidigitator]

Re: 5ER review

 

I did give it props for the index. A good index can make all the difference in the world.

No kidding. 5E/5ER have about the best indexes of any of the gaming books I have ever owned!

[Narratio]

Re: 5ER review

 

Well, it was a long time since I picked up 4th Edition (with a 3.5" floppy with the Hero Creator system on it... Oooooohhhhh!) So on my last R&R I picked up a copy of 5ER in Singapore. And then read solidly for next 9 hours of airport hell.

 

I like it. It does a good job of explaining 'stuff', but I must agree with Sean. It's still written for the Hero system fan. None of us care about the pages of iffy artwork, but the newbies do. We don't care about the presentation much, heck, we're going to be colouring in, adding post its and taped flags to it within a week. But it lacks the pizzazz required to grab the fresh meat.

 

I would have ditched a lot of the gratuitous art (although it does give me space to stick extra charts and comments in) and a different layout. Maybe going back to the original D&D idea of three seperate booklets in a slip case? It would have cost the same, looked flashier and made better bait.

[zornwil]

Re: 5ER review

 

After having read the whole thing, let me say my criticisms of the critique are really more picayune than anything.

 

Sigh. The paper quality is great. You may not like the AESTHETICS of it, but the QUALITY of it is quite good. My wife is a long-time callligrapher, having studied under some of the best, and has been involved in bookmaking and knows a good bit, albeit less, about papermaking. I had her review it. She said it was excellent paper, very durable, and much higher quality than as if it had been bleached, and while I'm biased, she has no interest in HERO per se and she has no bias on this, and her rep is good. That plus others who know about such things have attested to this. This debate was had, and I think there was no credible evidence presented by anyone that the paper quality was a problem. I really wish, bblackmoor, you had presented the specific issue more adequately as it had been discussed and I know you had seen it. It's also hardly "grey". That being said, I DO have some issues with the choice in that it's harder to read in places, anywhere the ink fades (often due to touch, though, again, the paper is actually more acid-resistant than most such books), and with aging eyes it's a bit harder to read. Although there is controversy on this matter, and it would have been good to have presented a more balanced review on this rather than present it as you had, as I think it presents a flat-out inaccuracy. Better to have stated that for some it's a problem on the eyes, but that the lack of high-gloss white is better for others' eyes, and it's questionable whether the look is suitable. As you do say, anywhere the print is less good is an issue; I think this seems to vary by book, from what I've seen on the boards and looking at some minor variation in my book. The major issue here is not that I'm saying you should have called the paper quality other than what you believed to be true, but you should have acknowledged that it isn't so factual as you cite and not been so oblique or dismissive with the brief rag count comment.

 

What has been criticized fairly is that the book is simply too big for solid binding. The cost factors force a publisher into so-called "perfect" binding, which is indeed far from perfect, it's in fact a poor binding and it's questionable how well the binding will hold up in the 592 page book over a few years if regularly used. For me, this was a reason to both use the PDF and to hold onto 5th edition (non-revised), so that I can use 5th edition non-revised more if I have to really check something. Ha, I just read your comments on the binding...no, the binding is NOT great. It's industry standard and "acceptable", but this pushes its limits.

 

(Side note - I was one of the lucky ones - my 4th edition stayed in great shape until the day I dropped it on the street while going to a friend's to play, and that was after 10 years; by the way, from what I heard, there was apparently a smaller good, solid run but otherwise a larger bad run (or two or three?) of 4th, but that's just what I heard, don't know how true it is; given how well my book did stand up and that I'm fairly sure it's a 2nd printing (have to check...), I have a hunch it could be true)

 

Generally, as with any critique, I hate bombastic statements such as "If it weren’t for the excellent index, Hero System, Fifth Edition, Revised would not be usable at all." I wish critics would avoid these sorts of comments. Not suggesting to not voice an opinion, but "difficult to use" would be a far more accurate choice of words in any opinion, unless you truly believe that without the index we'd all have thrown it away or refused to buy it and HERO would be out of business as clearly it isn't an impossibility.

 

Regardless, these really are nitpicks, as on the whole it otherwise seems to be accurate and whether I agree with each opinion, they seem well-informed and thought out, which is all a reader can ask of a critic.

[zornwil]

Re: 5ER review

 

I, alone, find the first two Champions books to be aesthetically pleasing and very cool.

[Guest bblackmoor]

Re: 5ER review

 

...you should have acknowledged that it isn't so factual as you cite...

 

I stated the facts and backed them up with hard data and with photos.

 

...I hate bombastic statements such as "If it weren’t for the excellent index' date=' Hero System, Fifth Edition, Revised would not be usable at all."[/quote']

 

That's an opinion, obviously. Nonetheless, it is my opinion. Without the index, finding Powers, Advantages, and Limitations scattered throughout the nearly 600 page book (rather than listed alphabetically in their eponymous sections) would have been so difficult that the book would have been useless. Fortunately, this is not the case.

 

Regardless' date=' these really are nitpicks, as on the whole it otherwise seems to be accurate and whether I agree with each opinion, they seem well-informed and thought out, which is all a reader can ask of a critic.[/quote']

 

It really doesn't matter, of course: it's just a review. It's much easier to criticize something than it is to do it. Still, I thank you for saying so.

[zornwil]

Re: 5ER review

 

I stated the facts and backed them up with hard data and with photos.

 

 

 

That's an opinion, obviously. Nonetheless, it is my opinion. Without the index, finding Powers, Advantages, and Limitations scattered throughout the nearly 600 page book (rather than listed alphabetically in their eponymous sections) would have been so difficult that the book would have been useless. Fortunately, this is not the case.

 

 

 

It really doesn't matter, of course: it's just a review. It's much easier to criticize something than it is to do it. Still, I thank you for saying so.

I've yet to hear an expert back up the opinion that the paper quality, as paper, is inferior. It's a cut above the standard RPG books. Your "hard data" is a simple reference to a few stats but not to the known effects of those on durability and sturdiness.

 

Now, it seems to be harder to read to a substantial population, but that's a separate issue.

[Guest bblackmoor]

Re: 5ER review

 

It's a cut above the standard RPG books.

 

For crying out loud, Zornwil... bah: I'm not going to play "is not/is too" with you. The facts are plain.

[schir1964]

Re: 5ER review

 

bblackmoor: You're losing credibility with this attitude.

 

You can define quality however you want, and the referenced information defined it for thier particular interest.

 

For me, however, quality would be defined as follows:

 

Durability: If the pages are falling out within a year of heavy use then that's poor quality. If it holds up for five years of heavy use, that's good quality. So far the pages have held up. Only time will tell if actually good quality or not.

 

Aesthetic: How it looks and ease of reading. No problems on my end so I guess that makes you wrong, correct? (8^D)

 

Reference: Can I find things when I need them. I'm probably an anomaly since I rarely need the index and haven't had any trouble finding information I need easily. But I've read the book and the FAQs many times due to other reasons so maybe I've aquired Eidetic Memory when comes to knowing things in the book.

 

So you've based your opinion on some facts based on a definition of quality that may or may not really match what others consider quality. Good for you. If you think that makes your particular review useful to anyone else, well, at least you have you opinion, and you are entitled to it.

 

- Christopher Mullins

[zornwil]

Re: 5ER review

 

For crying out loud' date=' Zornwil... bah: I'm not going to play "is not/is too" with you. The facts are plain.[/quote']

Yes, they are.

[teh bunneh]

Re: 5ER review

 

That's an opinion' date=' obviously. Nonetheless, it [b']is[/b] my opinion. Without the index, finding Powers, Advantages, and Limitations scattered throughout the nearly 600 page book (rather than listed alphabetically in their eponymous sections) would have been so difficult that the book would have been useless. Fortunately, this is not the case.

 

Strange. In my book, Powers, Advantages, and Limitations are listed alphabetically in their eponymous sections. Aid follows Absorption, and is followed by Armor, all the way down through the alphabet. Unless you're using a different alphabet, or you got a messed up book.

[Guest bblackmoor]

Re: 5ER review

 

Strange. In my book' date=' Powers, Advantages, and Limitations [i']are[/i] listed alphabetically in their eponymous sections.

 

If you think so, then you haven't looked closely enough.

[zornwil]

Re: 5ER review

 

Strange. In my book' date=' Powers, Advantages, and Limitations [i']are[/i] listed alphabetically in their eponymous sections. Aid follows Absorption, and is followed by Armor, all the way down through the alphabet. Unless you're using a different alphabet, or you got a messed up book.

To be more explicit to bblackmoor's point, a few powers and even power groupings have specific advantages listed only in those sections, but since they apply a bit broadly it makes them hard to find or realize in construction. It is an issue; the severity of it is of course a matter of opinion, but I wouldn't say it's without being worthy of note.

[zornwil]

Re: 5ER review

 

Here's a neat idea for a book...as 5ER has side bars which one could make notes in, but most of us don't like to mess up our books plus we change our minds, it would be neat if a rulebook had sidebars with an erasable sort of paper/material!

 

Of course I don't think I'd want to pay $300 for a rulebook, but it'd be cool..

[Guest bblackmoor]

Re: 5ER review

 

...it would be neat if a rulebook had sidebars with an erasable sort of paper/material!

 

PDF files permit that now, and have for a number of years. The problems with that being a) there's isn't a portable PDF reader that's as cheap, convenient, and durable as a book, and some publishers are ridiculously short-sighted, and cripple their PDF documents with unnecessary and obnoxious "protection", rendering them all but useless to anyone who'd actually want to buy them.

 

The former problem will be overcome by technology: the latter, sadly, can only be overcome by education or perhaps evolution, and even then I wouldn't bet on it. The serious obstacles we face are rarely technical. In a word, people are really, really freaking stupid.