What types of Skill Levels do YOU allow with Dive For Cover?

[prestidigitator]

Re: What types of Skill Levels do YOU allow with Dive For Cover?

 

Hey!

Having a High DEX does not make someone a Moron!

 

HM

Yes it does. Dex is EXPENSIVE!

[CourtFool]

COM is the new STR

 

Yes, COM is the best buy.

[prestidigitator]

Re: COM is the new STR

 

Yes' date=' COM is the best buy.[/quote']

Damn right! Why, half my characters have a Com of 400, and never need to lift a finger for having it all handed to them on silver platters. It makes adventures kind of dull, though.... Besides, you have no idea how many heteros are converted by a 400 Com, and that can get a little awkward when you're not bi....

 

Sorry. No, really. Sorry. Not sorry enough not to post it, but really....

[David Blue]

Re: What types of Skill Levels do YOU allow with Dive For Cover?

 

10 Overall

8 Dex and agility

5 Dex rolls

3 Dive for cover

 

On the other hand even the lesser "clumsiness" disadvantage (physical limitation, DEX rolls 11- and agility skills based on 11- regardless of superior DEX, 15pts) kills you regardless. No skill applies if you take those points.

 

I invite comment if I've costed the skills incorrectly - what should they be?

[Supreme Serpent]

Re: What types of Skill Levels do YOU allow with Dive For Cover?

 

I would also allow someone w/movement-based levels to use them getting out of the way (ie use Superleap/Flight levels when you leap/fly for cover). I've rarely seen a player get these, but if they did I'd allow them to be used for DFC.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: What types of Skill Levels do YOU allow with Dive For Cover?

 

I would also allow someone w/movement-based levels to use them getting out of the way (ie use Superleap/Flight levels when you leap/fly for cover). I've rarely seen a player get these' date=' but if they did I'd allow them to be used for DFC.[/quote']Good Catch! I almost forgot that Movement Skill Levels are already applicable to DFC per 5ER, page 369.

 

Here are all of their possible uses:

 

1. Lower Turn Mode by 1 (minimum of 0").
   
2. Add +1 to any roll (like a DEX roll for DFC) required to land in, or otherwise move to, a particular hex.
   
3. (at GM's option) Increase acceleration or deceleration with his modes of movement (not vehicles) by 1" per hex per Skill Level applied.
   
4. (at GM's option) Improve DCV if Dodging or using a Combat or Martial Maneuver that provides bonuses to DCV while moving.
   

Skill Levels with one mode of mevement cost 2 Character points per Level. Skill Levels that apply to any of a character's modes of movement cost 3 Character Points per Level.

 

HM

[Mike W]

Re: What types of Skill Levels do YOU allow with Dive For Cover?

 

The only skill levels I allow for Dive for Cover are 8 point overall combat levels, 10 point +1 with any roll levels, and 5 point Dexterity levels. To me, no other ones really make much sense. Although the book allows "movement levels" to count, which I could see. But hardly anyone buys them. And of course, if anyone actually bought levels with "dive for cover", but I don't think I've ever seen a character with levels bought just for "dive for cover".

[Sean Waters]

Re: What types of Skill Levels do YOU allow with Dive For Cover?

 

Tecnhically you can't use movement levels to DFC as the manouvre does not provide a bonus to DCV, but it does seem a perfectly reasonable use for the levels: far more reasonable, in fact, than allowing them to be used to increase DCV for dodge, martial dodge and flying dodge (the only manoeuvres that involve movement and a DCV bonus) for 2 points a level IMO.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: What types of Skill Levels do YOU allow with Dive For Cover?

 

Tecnhically you can't use movement levels to DFC as the manouvre does not provide a bonus to DCV' date=' but it does seem a perfectly reasonable use for the levels: far more reasonable, in fact, than allowing them to be used to increase DCV for dodge, martial dodge and flying dodge (the only manoeuvres that involve movement and a DCV bonus) for 2 points a level IMO.[/quote']

 

Please check your facts again.

 

First see 5ER, page 369 (or 5E, page 242*).

It clearly states that each Movement Skill Level can provide a +1 to ANY roll required to land in a particular hex.

 

Then see 5ER, page 393 (or 5E, page 260*).

It clearly states that to use Dive For Cover the character chooses a hex to move to, and then attempts to make a DEX Roll at -1/1" of distance moved. If the DEX roll succeeds, the character is in the designated hex when the attack goes off.

 

HM

 

*found easily with Zornwil's thread below.

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: What types of Skill Levels do YOU allow with Dive For Cover?

 

I'm with Hyper-Man on this one. Dive For Cover is a movement maneuver, and thus Movement skill levels should be able to work with it. Heck, if Movement skill levels can add to DCV while moving (or using a moving manuever like Flying Dodge) then whats the problem with it adding to Dive For Cover?

[zornwil]

Re: What types of Skill Levels do YOU allow with Dive For Cover?

 

I THINK I would play it as Steve Long ruled whether I knew his ruling or not. But our players don't seem to Dive for Cover very often, and the times it's happened I can't really recall what levels if any were brought to bear, and they may have assumed and applied levels that I wouldn't have bothered to check.

 

PS - re "Noncombat Skills", I consider DfC to be a Combat Maneuver, so you can't apply a noncombat skill level.

[OddHat]

Re: What types of Skill Levels do YOU allow with Dive For Cover?

 

I THINK I would play it as Steve Long ruled whether I knew his ruling or not. But our players don't seem to Dive for Cover very often, and the times it's happened I can't really recall what levels if any were brought to bear, and they may have assumed and applied levels that I wouldn't have bothered to check.

 

PS - re "Noncombat Skills", I consider DfC to be a Combat Maneuver, so you can't apply a noncombat skill level.

 

Except you also can't apply 8 point levels with "All Combat". Steve's "Combat skill levels only modify CV" doesn't hold water; CSLs also modify damage, and movement levels can clearly modify CV (unless that too has changed).

 

In my own games, I'd rule that DFC is a Combat Maneuver, and that "all combat" means "all combat" and leave it at that.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: What types of Skill Levels do YOU allow with Dive For Cover?

 

I just wanted to be clear that I was not attempting to make judgements about anyone's opinions or house rules on this subject. I was only pointing out specific rules with regard to the "official rules" as a baseline. Sorry if I did not come accross that way earlier.

 

HM

[OddHat]

Re: What types of Skill Levels do YOU allow with Dive For Cover?

 

I just wanted to be clear that I was not attempting to make judgements about anyone's opinions or house rules on this subject. I was only pointing out specific rules with regard to the "official rules" as a baseline. Sorry if I did not come accross that way earlier.

 

HM

 

No worries.

 

Most of us have rules we disagree with, this is just one of mine.

 

I also think that the explosives chart is frelled and most military hardware needs a re-write, but that's another flame war.

[Sean Waters]

Re: What types of Skill Levels do YOU allow with Dive For Cover?

 

Having checked my facts, I agree with Hyper-Man. I was considering adding movement SLs on the basis of them being able to add to manoeuvres that involve movement and DCV bonus (+ dodge), but as he rightly points out DFC is a move to a specific hex, and the roll is to get there, which allows the bonus to be applied under the MSL rules.

[zornwil]

Re: What types of Skill Levels do YOU allow with Dive For Cover?

 

Except you also can't apply 8 point levels with "All Combat". Steve's "Combat skill levels only modify CV" doesn't hold water; CSLs also modify damage, and movement levels can clearly modify CV (unless that too has changed).

 

In my own games, I'd rule that DFC is a Combat Maneuver, and that "all combat" means "all combat" and leave it at that.

You know, funny, I had a feeling that somehow I missed that 8-point "all combat" wasn't supposed to apply, either...well, I agree with you, that's dumb. I would allow that to function.