What's the Kryptonian speedster benchmark ?

[Wanderer]

I'd like to have a good benchmark for the basic speedster abilities (DEX, SPD, and combat Flight/Running; I deem a Variable Advantage or MP Megascale slot to be a much more proper and efficient mechanic for superhuman out-of-combat speed, so I totally neglect noncombat movement multipliers) for "quick, strong, and tough" cosmic level brick/energy projector/speedster hybrid guys like (Post-Crisis) Superman and Supergirl and their various clones and thematic homages (Hyperion, Zarda, Gladiator, Centurion, Silver Surfer, Shazam Family, Cap. Mar-vell, Sentry, Ms. Marvel, etc.), at a proper (750-1000 pts.) power level. Damage and toughness benchmarks are more easy to gauge, but the quickness area leaves me a bit more baffled.

 

Tentatively, I'd hypothesized, DEX 29-40, SPD 6-8, Movement 25"-30". Any suggestions, Herophiles ?

[Guest TheUnknown]

Re: What's the Kryptonian speedster benchmark ?

 

Well dex 29-40 I would not set it that high automatically I wouls base it on the character and his concept because Batma has showed many times that his skill and or dex are higher than Supermans when he diminstartes through martial arts str is not everything and if his these character stats were this dramatically high no non cosmic character could lay a finger on them.

 

besides that every 1" on movemnet per segement 12" per turn with 1 level of megascale is slightly over moch 3 hope that helps you movement issue.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: What's the Kryptonian speedster benchmark ?

 

Another approach might be to think about what these characters stats would be without their powers.

 

I'm sure there are numerous JLA stories that deal with removing the team's super-powers at which point Batman ends up having the best stats. But by how much? Is he really that much better than non-speedzone Flash or Aquaman?

[Wanderer]

Re: What's the Kryptonian speedster benchmark ?

 

Well dex 29-40 I would not set it that high automatically I wouls base it on the character and his concept because Batma has showed many times that his skill and or dex are higher than Supermans when he diminstartes through martial arts str is not everything and if his these character stats were this dramatically high no non cosmic character could lay a finger on them.

 

See these posts

 

http://www.herogames.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1236823&postcount=134

 

http://www.herogames.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1236943&postcount=138

 

To know my (exceedingly negative) opinion about the crappy Bat-God concept. IMO, Batman makes much sense in his own street-level comic crossing wits with clever psychotic criminal masterminds. The JLA Bat-God besting cosmic powerhouses with a few well-placed karate chops is stupid, stupid, stupid. Cosmic characters only being threatened by other cosmics (or an extremely clever plan, or their own vulnerabilities and psychological foibles) is just the point of this kind of characters, I think. Please ignore the Bat-God nonsense. No amount of mundane martial arts training can best reflexes and quickness that may outrun a bullet (as Neo shows eloquently in the Matrix movies). It is true that an highly trained mundane artist might indeed match or best a powerless cosmic (it depends on how much of the latter's combat prowess is pure superhuman innate talent and how much plain combat experience and training). Batman may, or may not, best a Kryptonian under a red sun (at least for Superman, I seem to remember that even when depowered he showed excellent martial prowess, as it might be expected from accumulated experience in myriad combats). However, such an occurrence is of peripheral interest here, since the issue would be the DEX and SPD benchmark value of such characters in usual conditions, i.e. with their full powers on.

[Vestnik]

Re: What's the Kryptonian speedster benchmark ?

 

I hate characters at this power level. Writing them up is like writing up God/

[JmOz]

Re: What's the Kryptonian speedster benchmark ?

 

Here are the stats/bio of a JLA like speedster from my campeign, it is a couple of years old and has not been updated (Will do so when I get Ultimate speed)

 

BLUR

 

 

Alternate ID: Maria Lopez

Archetype: Speedster (flight Based)

 

Background/History: Maria Lopez was a somewhat affluent Argentinean woman who ran a small charter helicopter business. Her life would forever change when she first met (RA’s Real Name). He came to hire her, to get him to and from remote archeological sights. World travel became a normalcy for her.

 

Ironically it was a Mayan temple that would have the biggest effect on her, flying back from a dig with a cargo of rare artifacts the tail of the helicopter was struck by lightning, as she came crashing down she remembers seeing Ra flying towards her, but the ground was getting very close, the next thing she knew she was hundreds of feet in the air looking as the copter crash to the ground. Somehow the lightning and the artifacts had bestowed upon her new powers.

 

Personality/Motivations: Confident is the first word many people think upon meeting Maria, others would say overconfident. She knows she is skilled, she knows she is powerful, and she knows she has even more powerful friends backing her up, she has it covered.

 

She is also a very caring woman, who spends much of her time with orphans. She was not an orphan growing up but her best friend was, so she feels a certain empathy with them.

 

Quote: This will only take a moment, be right back

 

Powers/Tactics: Blur is able to surround herself with dimensional energy, this energy permits her to move at speeds that are almost impossible to believe, it will also protect her from environmental dangers.

 

As she spends a lot of time in space she uses a Centurion Micro Rebreather to provide air.

 

Her Martial Arts Package allows for lightning fast attacks, which she favors.

 

Campaign Use: She is an A list superhero, should be used sparingly, she normally should be in the background as an explanation of who stops the threats the heroes of the game can not

 

Appearance: A Light Blue Bodysuit with white accents covering her neck down, with very little adornment, when she powers up a Bluish white aura surrounds her distorting her features (thus the name Blur)

 

 

Blur

Player: NPC

 

 

Val Char Cost

25 STR 15

25/45 DEX 45

25 CON 30

11 BODY 2

18 INT 8

14 EGO 8

15 PRE 5

20 COM 5

 

10/20 PD 2

10/20 ED 2

6/10 SPD 25

10 REC 0

50 END 0

40 STUN 3

 

6" RUN 0

35" SWIM 0

5" LEAP 0

Characteristics Cost: 150

 

 

Cost Power END

3 +3 Mental Defense (6 points total)

6 Centurian Communicator: Mind Link (Specific Group of Minds), Number of Minds (x2) (15 Active Points); Only With Others Who Have Mind Link (-1), IIF (-1/4), Effected as Hearing & Radio, Not Mental (-1/4)

7 Micro Rebreather Unit: Life Support , Self-Contained Breathing, 1 Recoverable Continuing Fuel Charges lasting 1 Hour each (+0) (10 Active Points); OIF (-1/2)

17 Avoiding a Blow: Physical Damage Reduction, Resistant, 50% (30 Active Points); Combat Luck Based (-3/4)

17 Avoiding a Blow: Energy Damage Reduction, Resistant, 50% (30 Active Points); Combat Luck Based (-3/4)

3 Showing no weakness: Lack Of Weakness (-5) for Resistant Defenses (5 Active Points); Combat Luck Based (-3/4)

Phased Body, all slots: Only In Heroic Identity (-1/4)

48 1) Enhanced Agility: +20 DEX (60 Active Points)

16 2) Enhanced Speed: +2 SPD (20 Active Points)

25 3) Phase Field: Armor (10 PD/10 ED), Hardened (+1/4) (37 Active Points); Visible (-1/4)

8 4) Phase Distortion Field: +2 with DCV (10 Active Points)

8 5) Phased Mind: +10 Mental Defense (16 points total) (10 Active Points)

8 6) Phase Field: Flash Defense (10 points) (Sight Group) (10 Active Points)

7 7) Out of Phase: Life Support , Safe in High Pressure, Safe in High Radiation, Safe in Intense Cold, Safe in Intense Heat, Safe in Low Pressure/Vacuum (9 Active Points)

 

120 Phase Field Manipulation: Multipower, 150-point reserve, all slots: (150 Active Points); Only In Heroic Identity (-1/4)

12u 1) Phased Propulsion I: Flight 50", Reduced Endurance 0 END (+1/2) (150 Active Points)

4u 2) Phased Propulsion II: Flight 20", Reduced Endurance 1/2 END (+1/4) (50 Active Points) 2

4u 3) Phased Propulsion III: Flight 10", Usable Underwater (+1/4), Variable Advantage (+1/4 Advantages +1/2), Reduced Endurance 0 END (+1/2) (45 Active Points)

4u 4) Phased Propulsion IV: Flight 10", Reduced Endurance 1/2 END (+1/4), Megascale (1" = 10,000 km; +1 1/4), Can Be Scaled Down: 1" = 1km (+1/4) (55 Active Points) 2

1u 5) Phased Propulsion V: Faster-Than-Light Travel (16 Light Years/year) (18 Active Points)

4u 6) Water Propulsion: Swimming +33" (35" total), Reduced Endurance 0 END (+1/2) (50 Active Points)

4u 7) Out of Phase: Desolidification , Costs END Only To Activate (+1/4) (50 Active Points) 4

1u 8) Shift to Phase Verse: Extra-Dimensional Movement (Single Dimension), x8 Increased Weight (35 Active Points); Concentration 0 DCV (-1/2), Extra Time Full Phase (-1/2) 3

4u 9) Phased Senses: (Total: 45 Active Cost, 36 Real Cost) Rapid x100000000 (Normal Sight) (Real Cost: 24) plus Rapid x10000000 (Normal Hearing) (Real Cost: 21)

2u 10) Super Speed Skills: +6 with all non-combat Skills (48 Active Points); Super Speed Based (-1/2), Costs Endurance Only Costs END to Activate (-1/4) 5

Powers Cost: 333

 

Cost Martial Arts Maneuver

5 Flying Dodge: 1/2 Phase, -- OCV, +4 DCV, Dodge All Attacks, Abort; FMove

5 Flying Grab: 1/2 Phase, -2 OCV, -1 DCV, Grab Two Limbs, +15 STR for holding on; FMove

5 Passing Strike: 1/2 Phase, +1 OCV, +0 DCV, STR +1d6 +v/5; FMove

5 Passing Disarm: 1/2 Phase, -1 OCV, -1 DCV, Disarm, +15 STR to Disarm roll; FMove

5 Passing Throw: 1/2 Phase, +0 OCV, +0 DCV, STR +1d6 +v/5; Target Falls; FMove

5 Sacrifice Strike: 1/2 Phase, +1 OCV, -2 DCV, STR +5d6 Strike

4 Fast Strike: 1/2 Phase, +2 OCV, +0 DCV, STR +3d6 Strike

4 Martial Block: 1/2 Phase, +2 OCV, +2 DCV, Block, Abort

4 +1 HTH Damage Class(es)

Martial Arts Cost: 42

 

Cost Skill

9 +3 Speed Fu

10 Defense Maneuver: I-IV

3 Acrobatics 14- (18-)

3 Breakfall 14- (18-)

3 Combat Piloting 14- (18-)

3 Stealth 14- (18-)

3 Teamwork 14- (18-)

3 Navigation (Air, Space) 13-

3 Paramedics 13-

3 Shadowing 13-

3 Systems Operation 13-

3 Conversation 12-

2 TF: Centurian Vehicles, Helicopters

2 SS: Archeology 11-

3 Linguist (Spanish is Native)

2 1) Language: English (completely fluent) (3 Active Points)

1 2) Language: Italian (fluent conversation) (2 Active Points)

1 3) Language: German (fluent conversation) (2 Active Points)

1 4) Language: Portugese (fluent conversation) (2 Active Points)

1 5) Language: Russian (fluent conversation) (2 Active Points)

1 6) Language: French (fluent conversation) (2 Active Points)

3 Scholar

3 1) KS: Flight Regulations (INT-based) (4 Active Points) 14-

2 2) KS: Aircraft (INT-based) (3 Active Points) 13-

2 3) KS: Super Heroes & Villains (INT-based) (3 Active Points) 13-

1 4) KS: History (2 Active Points) 11-

1 5) KS: Customs Laws (2 Active Points) 11-

1 6) KS: Cathlic Religion (2 Active Points) 11-

3 Traveler

2 1) AK: World (INT-based) (3 Active Points) 13-

1 2) CuK: South Americans (2 Active Points) 11-

2 3) AK: Argentina (INT-based) (3 Active Points) 13-

1 4) AK: New York (2 Active Points) 11-

1 5) AK: Egypt (2 Active Points) 11-

2 6) AK: South America (INT-based) (3 Active Points) 13-

1 7) AK: North America (2 Active Points) 11-

2 8) AK: Solar System (INT-based) (3 Active Points) 13-

Skills Cost: 91

 

Cost Perk

11 Fringe Benefit: International Police Powers, Member of the Luner Centurians, Pilot's Licence

4 Reputation (A large group; 11-) +2/+2d6

3 Well-Connected

1 1) Contact (Contact has: useful Skills or resources, Contact limited by identity) (2 Active Points) 11-

2 2) Contact (Contact has significant Contacts of his own) (3 Active Points) 11-

3 3) Contact (Contact has access to major institutions, Contact has significant Contacts of his own, Contact has: useful Skills or resources, Contact limited by identity) (4 Active Points) 11-

1 4) Favor (1 Active Points)

1 5) Favor (1 Active Points)

Perks Cost: 25

 

Cost Talent

6 Combat Luck (3 PD/3 ED)

3 Lightning Calculator

Talents Cost: 9 Total Character Cost: 650

 

Val Disadvantages

15 Dependent NPC: *Parents* 8- (Normal; Group DNPC: x2 DNPCs)

10 Dependent NPC: *Partner* 8- (Normal)

15 Dependent NPC: *Boyfriend* 8- (Normal; Unaware of character's adventuring career/Secret ID)

5 Distinctive Features: (Not Concealable; Noticed and Recognizable; Detectable Only By Unusual Senses)

20 Hunted: The World Hostility Implementation Party 8- (Occasionally), More Powerful, Harshly Punish, Extensive Non-Combat Influence

10 Hunted: Centurians 8- (Occasionally), More Powerful, Watching, Extensive Non-Combat Influence

10 Hunted: Rouge Gallery 8- (As Pow; Harshly Punish)

10 Hunted: The Weaver 8- (As Pow; Harshly Punish)

20 Psychological Limitation: Code vs Killing (Common; Total)

15 Psychological Limitation: Heroic (Common; Strong)

10 Psychological Limitation: Overconfident (Common; Moderate)

10 Reputation: Hero 11-

5 Rivalry: Professional (Other Pilots; Rival is As Powerful; Seek to Outdo, Embarrass, or Humiliate Rival; Rival Aware of Rivalry)

15 Social Limitation: Secret ID (Frequently; Major)

10 Vulnerability: 2 x STUN Dimensional Powers (Uncommon)

10 Vulnerability: 2 x BODY Dimensional Powers (Uncommon)

10 Vulnerability: 2 x Effect Dimensional Powers (Uncommon)

Disadvantage Points: 200 Base Points: 400 Experience Required: 50 Total Experience Available: 50 Experience Unspent: 0

[Enforcer84]

Re: What's the Kryptonian speedster benchmark ?

 

I hate characters at this power level. Writing them up is like writing up God/

Nah, he's got more perks.

[Squall]

Re: What's the Kryptonian speedster benchmark ?

 

I'd say the high 20's is fine for a DEX (though perhaps a 13-15, with the rest bought as part of his Kryptonian super powers package). You can probably get by with a 6 SPD or so, and then another 4-6 SPD that can cost END or something (Superman doesn't move that fast ALL the time).

 

*shrugs* Of course, this is assuming you're (as mentioned) working with an appropriate number of points, and facing appropriate threats. It'd be pretty boring, otherwise.

[assault]

Re: What's the Kryptonian speedster benchmark ?

 

I'd say the high 20's is fine for a DEX (though perhaps a 13-15' date=' with the rest bought as part of his Kryptonian super powers package). You can probably get by with a 6 SPD or so, and then another 4-6 SPD that can cost END or something (Superman doesn't move that fast ALL the time). [/quote']

 

This seems fair enough.

 

He should be able to hit 11 or 12 SPD, since only the Flash is as fast or faster.

 

*shrugs* Of course, this is assuming you're (as mentioned) working with an appropriate number of points, and facing appropriate threats. It'd be pretty boring, otherwise.

 

Writing scenarios for him takes a bit of thought. The main thing is to keep combat down to a minimum, and make sure he can't solve the problem by just looking at it with his X-Ray vision.

 

His most dangerous opponent is, of course, Lois Lane. After all, you can punch Batman and Lex Luthor.

[Squall]

Re: What's the Kryptonian speedster benchmark ?

 

It just seems to me that reading comics that features Supes and his "family" (Superboy, Supergirl, Power Girl, etc), and even the Superman homages in other universes (Gladiator, Sentry, etc) -- they don't always move at Speedster speeds. They're capable of it, but for the most part we think of them as "flying bricks," not "flying speedsters," y'know?

 

But every now and then they can really pour it on. Hence the average-to-above-average SPD all the time, and the capability to really haul bootie (SPD 10-12 or so) when they're willing to exert themselves appropriately.

 

*shrugs* Makes sense to me, at least.

[pinecone]

Re: What's the Kryptonian speedster benchmark ?

 

Yeah my "Cosmic champs" "homage" to supes has a big Multi with a slot of speed and some STR...so he's not as strong (around 50, vs 90 at full power) so it's a rare use and he burns End like a fiend....

[Wanderer]

Re: What's the Kryptonian speedster benchmark ?

 

Hmm, to sum it up, you would suggest to set up things this way: STR, DEX, CON, at 15, or so, for the "unpowered" condition, SPD at 3, the same chars at say STR 80-85, CON 35-40, DEX 30, SPD 7, for the "usual" superpowered stuff, and a Succor STR, DEX, CON, and SPD of 10d6 or more for when the Krypton guys and their thematic clones pull their gloves. Or alternatively, the same amount of characteristics, with Costs End.

[assault]

Re: What's the Kryptonian speedster benchmark ?

 

Hmm' date=' to sum it up, you would suggest to set up things this way: STR, DEX, CON, at 15, or so, for the "unpowered" condition, SPD at 3, the same chars at say STR 80-85, CON 35-40, DEX 30, SPD 7, for the "usual" superpowered stuff, and a Succor STR, DEX, CON, and SPD of 10d6 or more for when the Krypton guys and their thematic clones pull their gloves. Or alternatively, the same amount of characteristics, with Costs End.[/quote']

 

Pretty much. Play with the figures to get them how you want.

 

Some variations: Billy Batson and the other Marvel family members would have at least some lower characteristics in their non-powered forms.

 

Superman is a bit inconsistent (surprise!). In some of his Bottled City of Kandor type appearances he actually did a reasonable Batman impersonation, with Jimmy Olsen doing a decent Robin. You could give him a bit of a boost if you feel like it. Or not, if you don't.

 

Hmm... if I was building a homage for a game I would definitely be expecting to have to play him without his powers occasionally. That would lead me to err on the side of generosity.