How would Stronghold imprison your character?

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

My apologies. The ACA is not an obscure acronym if you work in corrections. It's the national accreditation organization for prisons. Every year we get to do an audit.

 

As for accepting pressure chambers. I can't answer that because the situation does not arise in the real world.

 

Of course, anything we discuss here is speculative by necessity.

 

Instead, I will rephrase the assertion in more general terms.

 

For the sake of argument, let us assume there are metahumans, some of whom are criminals.

Let us assume that ordinary prison facilities are incapable of containing metahumans.

Let us assume that, without resorting to outlandish technology, the government devises a feasible one-size-fits-all method of containing metahumans.

Let us assume that this one-size-fits-all method resides at the upper limit of budgetary constraints.

Let us assume that this one-size-fits-all method imposes some constraints on prisoner safety: e.g. it will be difficult or impossible to evacuate them in case of fire, flood, or medical emergency.

 

What are the government's options: I see three.

 

1) Let the criminals go. We can't contain them without violating their civil rights

 

I suspect other options might be suggested.

 

At present, the criminal justice system often has difficulty obtaining a conviction because the evidence against the individual must be obtained in a manner which does not violate their civil rights (why am I thinking of orange juice as I type this...). To many, that constitutes "letting the criminals go because we cannot convict them without violating their civil rights".

 

2) Break the budget to try (possibly without success) to research and construct individual solutions for every individual inmate.

 

I'm reaching back to high school, but it seems to me that "budgetary constraints" were raised in the landmark precedent case that held everyone was entitled to legal representation in criminal cases. The Courts did not feel, at that time, that budgetary constraints were an excuse for the violation of the civil rights of the accused.

 

3) Allow the one-size-fits-all and chalk up the extra risk to the "If you don't like it here' date=' why do you keep coming back?" effect.[/quote']

 

And that may be the final decision. Expect it to be subjected to numerous court challenges and considerable public dissent, however.

 

Just saying' date=' "The government would never allow that," to the one-size-fits-all is non-productive. The government has to do [b']something[/b] with these inmates.

 

The question comes down to what that "something" might be. "The government" does not enjoy carte blanche. Legislation is subject to challenge by those it effects, and review by the courts. Radical changes often take considerable time and expense to actually implement. It would not surprise me to see the pressure facility constructed and sitting idle as prisoners sit awaiting transfer while their appeals of the cruelty of this punishment (the risk to the prisoners has already been addressed) and its unusual nature (Why only metahumans, Your Honor? Many non-powered criminals are a greater risk to society than my client - why are they not subjected to this same process to better protect the public?)

 

The most analogous real world situation is Administrative Segregation. That's the 23/7 Lockdown part of the facility. If' date=' by some miracle[/b'], a fire got started in the Ad-seg units, the inmates might be evacuated from their cells into the day room, but removing them from the pod would likely take the better part of an hour.

 

Bolded for emphasis. What measures can and will be put in place to reduce the risk to inmates to a level tolerable to the judiciary and/or those groups advocating against this inhumane punishment?

 

Director of prisons: "Yeah' date=' right. Go ahead. Make us release every metahuman inmate in the county. We'll be sure to release them in your neighborhood."[/quote']

 

Much like we refer to the parole of violent offenders today? Imagine the Director's career options when that quote hits the media.

 

Querysphinx does make a good argument for pressure chambers as a way to hold supers using real world technology, and it or something like it probably would be implemented. All I'm saying is that there would be protesters and court challenges. Probably some sympathy from the bench for the protesters too.

 

Saying "the government would never allow that" makes the government into a monolith that it is not. The executive branch would be all over pressure chambers, as a way to make its own job easier (ie possible). The judiciary branch would be giving it a good hard look, and in some cases making demands that would be hard or impossible to meet. Incumbents would say "it's the best we've got, and we're doing our job keeping criminals behind bars", while non-incumbent candidates would say "what's the difference between Guantanamo and Stronghold? In Gitmo, if you have a heart attack, you get medical attention."

 

Ultimately, there would be strong pressure for research into an alternative, and if there's not a one-size-fits-all alternative, then many inmates would probably be moved (eventually, and in most cases due to court order) to more expensive, individualized containment cells. If no Reed Richards stepped forward to donate some technology to the corrections system, it would end up a nightmare.

 

A lot depends on the political climate. Shortly after an escaped metahuman kills a school bus full of kids, this plan is far more likely to be accepted than shortly after a metahuman member of a minority group who committed much less violent offenses dies in agony in a pressure chamber because medical attention couldn't reach him and his mother's tear-stained face has been all over the TV for a week.

[Querysphinx]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

At present, the criminal justice system often has difficulty obtaining a conviction because the evidence against the individual must be obtained in a manner which does not violate their civil rights (why am I thinking of orange juice as I type this...). To many, that constitutes "letting the criminals go because we cannot convict them without violating their civil rights".

I'm reaching back to high school, but it seems to me that "budgetary constraints" were raised in the landmark precedent case that held everyone was entitled to legal representation in criminal cases. The Courts did not feel, at that time, that budgetary constraints were an excuse for the violation of the civil rights of the accused.

 

The question isn't really one of civil rights vs. no civil rights. The question is one of priority. The Department of Corrections overriding priority is public safety by dint of keeping inmates incarcerated. If the civil rights of convicted felons are allowed to trump the safety of the general public, then you might as well not bother with prisons at all.

 

The court system convicts Mega-Evil of mass murder and orders him put behind bars.

 

The D.O.C. (that's Department of Corrections for you acronym haters) says, "Well, we have this nice new facility that can hold him."

 

Mega-Evil's lawyer says, "You can't keep him there because it's cruel and inhumane."

 

While this legal argument is being run through the courts, Mega Evil is placed in 24/7 lock down in a normal prison.

 

Mega-Evil breaks out and kills every guard in the prison, then he kills a school bus full of kids and a puppy for good measure. He is recaptured and tried on new charges. His lawyers still argue that sending him to a special prison is cruel and inhumane. While this is going through the courts, the D.O.C. tries to keep Mega-Evil drugged so he can't use his powers.

 

Mega-Evil's lawyer says, "You can't do that to him because it has negative long term health implications."

 

While this legal argument is being run through the courts, Mega Evil is placed in 24/7 lock down in a normal prison.

 

Mega-Evil breaks out and kills every guard in the prison, then he kills a whole stadium full of sports fans and a kitten for good measure. He is recaptured and tried on new charges. His lawyers still argue that sending him to a special prison is cruel and inhumane, so is keeping him drugged.

 

While this is going through the courts, Mega Evil is placed in 24/7 lock down in a normal prison.

 

Every prison guard in the system quits. Many flee to foreign countries. Five high-powered superheroes are hired to keep watch on Mega-Evil in shifts. (You need 5 otherwise you can't have weekends and holidays) The court battle drags on for years. Five superheros are tied up guarding one villain.

 

When does logic enter this picture?

 

 

The question comes down to what that "something" might be. "The government" does not enjoy carte blanche. Legislation is subject to challenge by those it effects, and review by the courts. Radical changes often take considerable time and expense to actually implement. It would not surprise me to see the pressure facility constructed and sitting idle as prisoners sit awaiting transfer while their appeals of the cruelty of this punishment (the risk to the prisoners has already been addressed) and its unusual nature (Why only metahumans, Your Honor? Many non-powered criminals are a greater risk to society than my client - why are they not subjected to this same process to better protect the public?)

 

The DOCs response to the question "Why don't you do this to everyone?" has traditionally been to do it to everyone.

 

Bolded for emphasis. What measures can and will be put in place to reduce the risk to inmates to a level tolerable to the judiciary and/or those groups advocating against this inhumane punishment?

 

Apparently the risk is tolerable because in the real world this is how it's done.

 

Much like we refer to the parole of violent offenders today?

One of the problems inherent with incarcerating violent criminals is that, unless they have life or death, they're eventually going to be let out, but that's because they reach their mandatory release date, not because some sociopathic lawyer said their incarceration is cruel and unusual and demanded their release thereby.

[Vulcan]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

Actually, it was really quite simple for Stronghold to imprison my character. Power supression kept Vigil under wraps quite handily for about a month...

[Metaphysician]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

There is the side question: Why, exactly, was Mega Evil not given a capital sentence? Also, how was he contained for trial, if he's capable of such degree of power?

 

These complicate the matter, but you can bet they *will* come up, so. . .

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

The question isn't really one of civil rights vs. no civil rights. The question is one of priority. The Department of Corrections overriding priority is public safety by dint of keeping inmates incarcerated. If the civil rights of convicted felons are allowed to trump the safety of the general public' date=' then you might as well not bother with prisons at all.[/quote']

 

Why not just kill all violent offenders? That provides far more protection of the general public than incarceration, especially if we execute everyone whose psychological profile (and we'll make those mandatory) indicates they are potentially capable of a violent offense. Now everyone will be much safer.

 

I find it hard to reconcile "overriding priority is public safety" with "better a hundred guilty men go free than a single innocent man be convicted".

 

The simple fact is that our society does strike a balance between the protection of the innocent and the rights of the convicted. I'm not convinced it is reasonable to say that society would fall right in behind the Pressure Cell.

 

The court system convicts Mega-Evil of mass murder and orders him put behind bars...

 

That's one scenario. How about another?

 

The court system convicts SuperDude, previously known as an upstanding hero, of murder and orders him put behind bars. The D.O.C. (that's Department of Corrections for you acronym haters) says, "Well, we have this nice new facility that can hold him."

 

SuperDude is incarcerated in this new prison, despite concerns raised that it's cruel and inhumane. SuperDude's cell is breached in an accident, and he dies in agony, on nationwide TV. Days later, new evidence surfaces which conclusively shows SuperDude was framed. His family and his teammates speak out in support of those protesting the Pressure Cells. They've already robbed us of one hero - how many more must die?

 

While this legal argument is being run through the courts, Mega Evil is placed is tried for mass murder. After he is acquitted, it is discovered that several jurors were uncomfortable with the prospect he would be Pressurized, like poor SuperDude, biasing them to an acquittal.

 

The newloy free Mega-Evil kills every police officer in the city, then he kills a school bus full of kids and a puppy for good measure. He is slowed down by a team of Supers, but without SuperDude they just don't have the raw power to take him down, and he defeats them, killing them as well.

 

The DOCs response to the question "Why don't you do this to everyone?" has traditionally been to do it to everyone.

 

Really? We have the death penalty for everyone? All convicted criminals are held in solitary confinement in maximum security prisons? Every felon in the United States is employed making license plates?

 

One of the problems inherent with incarcerating violent criminals is that' date=' unless they have life or death, they're eventually going to be let out, but that's because they reach their mandatory release date, not because some sociopathic lawyer said their incarceration is cruel and unusual and demanded their release thereby.[/quote']

 

How do you think we got mandatory release dates, fixed sentences and incarceration rather than execution, amputation, deportation and flagellation?

 

There is the side question: Why, exactly, was Mega Evil not given a capital sentence? Also, how was he contained for trial, if he's capable of such degree of power?

 

These complicate the matter, but you can bet they *will* come up, so. . .

 

Very good questions. At what point in the process is the villain considered "eligible" for the Pressure Cooker?

[Metaphysician]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

You know, to an extent, a good portion of this debate is moot, as the odds Mega Evil is capable of causing casual slaughter on the magnitude described, and yet is also capable of being contained by a hyperbaric chamber? Small.

 

Just look at the long list of major Champions villains. Among the mega villains, the only one for whom this would be a significant impediment is the Warlord, and his main escape option is "rescue from outside." Ditto but moreso for Dr Destroyer and Istvatha ( and she could always use her D-travel to go somewhere with immediate medical facilities, in the unlikely event she were imprisoned ), Takofanes doesn't breath, Menton is going to just mind control the whole facility, Gravitar could power skill a "gravitationally-retained high pressure air bubble" eventually. . .

 

Stepping down the threat scale, you still have people like Firewing, who doesn't need to breath, Holocaust, who could probably *absorb* the high pressure to supercharge himself, Zarran has a life support spell. . .

 

Put simply, villains of the power scale for the "Mega Evil" scenarios to be relevant, are generally going to find the hyperbaric chamber a minor impediment at best.

[Querysphinx]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

I find it hard to reconcile "overriding priority is public safety" with "better a hundred guilty men go free than a single innocent man be convicted".

 

These people are already convicted. Once the D.O.C. gets hold of them, the question of guilt/or innocence (from a legal standpoint) has already been decided, barring appeal. It is not the D.O.C.'s job to decide guilt or innocence. It is the D.O.C.'s job to protect the public.

 

The simple fact is that our society does strike a balance between the protection of the innocent and the rights of the convicted. I'm not convinced it is reasonable to say that society would fall right in behind the Pressure Cell.

 

I haven't been talking about pressure cells per se for the last few posts. I've been talking about "method X". Method X is any one-size-fits-all method that can contain a supers but could potentially harm them and limits their access to emergency services. Whatever Method X is, it is the most effective solution modern, real-world technology can provide.

 

Our society does strike a balance. The civil rights of prisoners are, by definition, curtailed when they are convicted of crimes and sentenced to prison. Being in prison is a limitation on their rights. The more violent and unmanagable the offender, the greater the curtailment of their rights. Work release and parolees have many fewer restrictions than the guys in ad-seg. It stands to reason that a violent super criminal, being incredibly unmanagable would have his rights restricted even further than ad-seg.

[Captain Obvious]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

I haven't been talking about pressure cells per se for the last few posts. I've been talking about "method X". Method X is any one-size-fits-all method that can contain a supers but could potentially harm them and limits their access to emergency services. Whatever Method X is, it is the most effective solution modern, real-world technology can provide.

 

I think the public will have different tolerances for different methods. A pressure chamber might be more outrageous than a system that releases a sleeping gas when a seismic sensor picks up heavy impacts or scraping, even if that gas has a fairly high potential for damaging side effects. The gruesomeness of the method and the chance of injuring an inmate by accident will affect the public's attitude.

 

And of course, as mentioned earlier, it depends on current events...if an inmate escaped a prison not using Method X and committed one or more gruesome murders, public opinion might very well accept keeping him and his dermis in separate cells for the length of the incarceration.

[SKJAM!]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

Calculus might fake having some sort of medical condition that would cause him to die if pressurized like that--he has the INT and skills to pull it off.

 

I'd imagine that the DOC's research division would have people whose job it is to figure out worst-case scenarios for any new technology application and invent countermeasures. After all, it may be necessary to restrain Iron Lion with a pressure cooker cell due to his inhuman strength, but since he's in for marijuana possession rather than mass murder, it'd look bad for the system if a slight accident could execute the poor bastard.

[Querysphinx]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

Calculus might fake having some sort of medical condition that would cause him to die if pressurized like that--he has the INT and skills to pull it off.

 

I'd imagine that the DOC's research division would have people whose job it is to figure out worst-case scenarios for any new technology application and invent countermeasures. After all, it may be necessary to restrain Iron Lion with a pressure cooker cell due to his inhuman strength, but since he's in for marijuana possession rather than mass murder, it'd look bad for the system if a slight accident could execute the poor bastard.

 

Yeah, there's also the issue of custody levels. There's no reason that all supers would be confined to super-max levels if they were not deemed to pose an escape risk. Some percentage might be a good fit for general population (i.e. normal cells) or even minimum security (dorm rooms).

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

Calculus might fake having some sort of medical condition that would cause him to die if pressurized like that--he has the INT and skills to pull it off.

 

I'd imagine that the DOC's research division would have people whose job it is to figure out worst-case scenarios for any new technology application and invent countermeasures. After all, it may be necessary to restrain Iron Lion with a pressure cooker cell due to his inhuman strength, but since he's in for marijuana possession rather than mass murder, it'd look bad for the system if a slight accident could execute the poor bastard.

 

Faking injury would seem a very easy way to deal with the Pressure Cooker. They have to shut down the pressure system to get someone in. Having shut down the pressure, the prisoner is now free to use his/her powers to escape while the cell is not pressurized. And it has to be de-pressurized at some point. Otherwise the villain is in 24/7 solitary - no relief, no exercise, no fresh air, nothing. That will be even easier for civil rights groups to attack. As well, we can't search the villain or his cell for illicit possessions (hey, even if a teleporter can't port himself in, he can port objects in) or perform any kind of maintenance ("the toilet's not working"; "the security cam's out").

 

-

[Drhoz]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

Solution to a lot of these objections to the Pressure Cooker - robots. Robot medics and maintenance, and telepresence waldos for the human warders working outside. A couple of especially tough hired supers strolling the corridors probably wouldn't go astray.

[Hagadorn]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

How would Stronghold Imprison Radon, My highly radioactive glass cannon in an armoured containment suit.

 

Hmmm... Well, They could just make his suit totally immobile. Then leave him there. His total lack of the need to eat/sleep and his huge lifespan would do the rest.

 

Of course, his energy blasts aren't based on his Containment suit so he could blast his way out of his own suit... But then his radiation starts reacting with the surrounding enviroment and he explodes himself into perma-stun...

 

Damn, this is depressing thinking of how to shut down your own character. Also, First post, yay.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

Solution to a lot of these objections to the Pressure Cooker - robots. Robot medics and maintenance' date=' and telepresence waldos for the human warders working outside. A couple of especially tough hired supers strolling the corridors probably wouldn't go astray.[/quote']

 

Kind of blows the theory that the pressure cooker is the reasonable budget option, though.

[TrinSarda]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

Going back a bit to Mega-Evil. His lawyer is getting him a nice, regular cell, arguing for the dismantling of all high pressure prisons and generally appealing on his behalf, right? What kind of moron breaks out and slaughters a bunch of kids then? Either he wants to be sent to a high pressure prison, because it will be a challenge to break out of or something, or he is a complete idiot and therefore surely not intelligent enough to have escaped, so someone (probably a person trying to get high pressure prisons instituted) set him loose.

 

If any of my superheroes thought that if they turned in their supervillains then they would go to a high pressure prison, then they would likely do one of a few things.

 

A) Just stop arresting bad guys. Sir Killalot is kidnapping the mayor's daughter's history class? Then I'll knock him out and drop him off somewhere far away from other people.

 

Very publicly protest the high pressure prisons, and stop doing anything superheroic at all, at least in the countries that had high pressure prisons. Powerball is stealing all the gold in Fort Knox? Well, I guess that high pressure prison idea wasn't so cheap in the long term, now was it? Do something about it? I will when you will, bub!

 

C) Join forces with nicer/more logical/honorable supervillains and other like-minded heroes to actually break supervillains out of these prisons safely. Only some of my heroes would turn them back in at the next police station, and keep repeating this till the supervillains were sent to a normal prison. Ah, Seargent! Here, I have Onyx-Sabre back in custody! You didn't know he was out? Of course not. I only broke him out an hour ago.

 

D) Build prisons in their secret pocket dimensions/space stations/etc and keep prisoners there, with some of the team on guard at all times. Yes, Mayor we did get Octo-blast. Yes, we caught him red-handed. Your custody? Oh, I couldn't allow that. We're superheroes, not supersoldiers, sir, your orders don't mean a thing.

 

On the other hand, my superheroes would spend at least as much time working on humane ways to imprison supervillains as they do on stopping them.

 

Also, I would note that because Tony Stark had Shulkie injected with Gamma-suppressing nanobots, stopping her from transforming to be a superhero, she took him to court and had a ruling made that depriving a super powered person of their powers without permission was a violation of their human rights. This meant that when Leader was captured, instead of using Tony's suppressors to turn him back into a nice, but average, guy, they had to allow him to stay as the Leader, which in turn allowed him to escape. Shulkie and I maintain that having the power suppression outlawed was the right thing to do.

[SSgt Baloo]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

All except (TCWOAN) and Lance O'Bannon, the Singing Cowboy (LOBtSC), would be easy to confine in stronghold.

 

TCWOAN would be remanded to whatever Super-Animal Control organization had jurisdiction. Whether they could hold him would depend entirely upon how much they could learn about his powers. Frankly, His best shot would be to make nice with his keepers in the hope they get careless. Plus he wouldn't bolt at the first opportunity so as to lull them into a false sense of security. After they noticed he didn't seem interested in leaving, they probably wouldn't watch him so closely. He'd wait his opportunity and escape only when he could be sure he'd be long gone before his absence was discovered.

 

LOBtSC would be hard to incarcerate because of his luck. He'd probably stay put if he had given his word, but he would work the system to his advantage. By the time he was done, a significant proportion of the prison population would probably be part of the LOBtSC's "Straight Shooter's Club" and would be well on their way to making restitution for their crimes, changing their evil ways, and legitimately earning time off for good behavior (and not just because they were misbehaving and not getting caught.

[Barbara vdB]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

Miss Chaos-(teleporter)- tell her that as long as she stays there, she doesn't have to b e the Edge's Primus liaison.(anything for peace and quiet)

 

Felicity- Curiosity- anything behind security, Comp beh- steal security devices. Powers- fast evolution. Don't lock the door. Give her the job of updating Striongholds security.

 

Smoke - put her in a guards room with a good quality coffee machine. people to pat her. coffee to drink. toys.

[Kal'El Wayne]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

He's a British citizen so is Stronghold an American prison? He'd just get deported to Britain, where he'd be given a full pardon.

 

If Stronghold is a Punisher style badguy with an imprisonment theme instead of killing, then putting him in a cell that is tough to escape should be enough. Heck, if you get his employer, or a British noble to tell him that they would prefer him to stay imprisoned for now, telling him where to stay would be enough to make him stay there. Of course, the hard part is that if you imprison him without the permission of the British nobility/government then you'll also have to fight off a horde of supervillains, superheroes and possibly also the British armed forces.

[bubba smith]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

stronghold is the name ofva prison designed to hold super-powered criminals,not a super-hero

[The Weapon]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

ACA? Google provides:

 

Association of Canadian Advertisers

Association of Canadian Archivists

Association Canadienne d'Acoustique

Alberta Conservation Association

Alberta Construction Association

Allan Crawford Associates

ACA Assurance

Applications of Computer Algebra

Oh, there we go...American Correctional Association, right at the bottom.

 

ATUOOA *

 

And you're assuming this organization would accept the pressure cell.

 

 

 

Lawyer: "The ACA will also be named in the suit."

 

 

How long will it take to bring emergency medical personnel in to deal with a medical emergency? Real prisons do have medical personnel on site, but an extended time period to acclimatize them to the pressure would prevent anything resembling a quick response. There would certainly be complaints about the process, and likely organizations bringing pressure on political types to issue a ban on the process until it can wind its way through the courts.

 

 

Waldos don't need to be acclimatised. A waldo is a device that mimics the actions of the users hands, allowing manipulation of objects in a dangerous enviroment without exposing the user. Conventionally the dangerous enviroment is hot/high pressure/radioactive but one containing a supervillain qualifies. In the event of a medical emergency the Waldo, complete with equipment enters through the pressure doors. Sure there's a delay while the outer door closes, pressure is equalised and then the inner door opens but it's seconds not minutes.

[Kal'El Wayne]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

In that case, Stronghold, being an american prison, cannot hold Sir Johnstone, because he would be deported back to England, where he would be given a full pardon and have his new 'criminal record' expunged. Then he would likely come back to America.

[Teflon Billy]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

In that case' date=' Stronghold, being an american prison, cannot hold Sir Johnstone, because he would be deported back to England, where he would be given a full pardon and have his new 'criminal record' expunged. Then he would likely come back to America.[/quote']Not to bring politics in here, but where do you get the idea that he would "have" to be extradited back to the UK?

 

If he committed/was framed for a crime that got him locked up in Stronghold, then that is where he would go.

 

TB

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

In that case' date=' Stronghold, being an american prison, cannot hold Sir Johnstone, because he would be deported back to England, where he would be given a full pardon and have his new 'criminal record' expunged. Then he would likely come back to America.[/quote']

 

First off, I believe only those enjoying diplomatic immunity are exempt from trial and punishment for crimes on foreign soil. Second, assuming that immunity exists, I believe such individuals can be deported and barred from reentry, which would be the likely result of a crime serious enough to warrant Stronghold imprisonment being exempted from prosecution due to diplomatic immunity. Third, in respect of more serious crimes, most nations waive that immunity - the alternative being an intrenational incident.

 

Now let's move to more exciting plot developments:

 

- it seems the answer to imprisoning this character is for him to be imprisoned secretly, denying knowledge of his wherabouts to UK authorities.

 

- so, after conviction, he gets deported instead of jailed because the UK raises a big fuss. Imagine the wonderful press for both character and country.

 

- then he comes back, flaunting the US justice system. That seems likely to be even worse received - perhaps a team of patriotic americans not gov't affiliated will take a shot at him anyway.

 

- he keeps getting deported and coming back - is the UK harbouring a terrorist? Are they REALLY harbouring terorists? I don't know - where are all the WMD's that were in Iraq? Let's go look for the terrorists! Or perhaps the UK authorities would prefer to turn the character over in a show of international cooperation...

 

Simple summary: politics is very much a two edged sword.

[Kal'El Wayne]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

(Bugger, they're on to us.)

 

Nothing to see here, move it along!

 

On a more serious note, the reason he would 'have' to be extradited is because he has diplomatic immunity as issued by British authority. So, yes, if he was in some way sentenced to be locked up in Stronghold, then that is where he would be locked up. But he wouldn't be sentenced to time in Stronghold in the first place.

 

Also, if the whole prison of Stronghold was British and he was sentenced to time in it, his high reaching (ie 60% of government) contacts would likely pardon him. If not, then he would have at least one superhero/supervillain contact breaking him out everyday. However, if his high reaching contacts said that, for their sake, they would like him to stay for the duration of his sentence, then he would, no matter who tried to free him. Of course, thanks to his lower contacts (prison guards and crooks) he would probably end up living at least as well in prison as he did outside. Maybe better than he did outside, since outside he spent a lot of time being a typical butler.

 

I did not know that a diplomat could be barred from reentry. If he is barred, then he probably doesn't care that much, since he was only in America because his employer lived there. He's much happier to be a butler (and sometime superhero) in Britain, the land he calls civilisation. He'd still get a pardon, though.

[Nagisawa Takumi]

Re: How would Stronghold imprison your character?

 

Harold "Hal" Fleisner is kinda useless without his MACH 5 power suit. So take it away from him.

 

(It's stands for Mechanically Assisted Combat Harness. I just thought of that now. >.>)