terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

[Guest steamteck]

In the Terminator movies and shows, the organic shell/disguise etc can be damaged destroyed without hurting the robot beneath. in fact blowing all the "people" away often seems to do almost nothing.

 

Without its "person suit" the terminator obviously can no longer blend etc.

 

My question is how to model this basically cosmetic damage that gives it an increasing distinctive appearance. Should there be some relation to damage to COM loss and gaining distinctive appearance.

 

right now I use ablative armor linked to Com loss Is there anyway other than winging it to link it an increasing distinctive appearance. Any brilliant ideas. Anyone already done something like this

[Ragdoll]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

Disadvantage: Terminator; Concealable (With Disguise Skill or Major Effort), Extreme.

 

I'd say that'd cover it. If you want, the character's Comeliness score would apply only when they were disguised. Once that disguise is torn away partially or completely, everyone can see you're some kind of unnatural monster or cyborg and the Disadvantage takes over. It doesn't matter if the left half of your face, for instance, looks like Arnold or Summer Glau, the other half is all metal and red glowing eyes, and such.

 

I suppose you could simulate it with the ablative armour thing you mentioned before and the Com drain, but it's a rather complicated affair. The above IMO at least seems to cover the effect you're looking for. Just Make a notation that if the character takes so much body to whatever part, that that part is now 'exposed' and the character's disadvantage is in full effect, until it can be repaired in some way.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

Disadvantage: Terminator; Concealable (With Disguise Skill or Major Effort), Extreme.

 

...

 

 

I might go one step further than this.

 

Go ahead and assign disadvantages appropriate for looking like a walking erector set.

Then purchase a limited shape shift to cover this.

The shape shift ability itself is what becomes less and less effective with battle damage.

The built in disguise skill helps mitigate this as well.

 

example:

 

29 They Look Like Us!: Shape Shift (Sight, Touch and Smell/Taste Groups), Cellular, Imitation, Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), Persistent (+1/2) (72 Active Points); Affects Body Only (-1/2), Always On (-1/2), Limited Power Easily Damaged - but can 'heal' if not completely destroyed (If completely destroyed a new subject can be copied with enough time.; -1/2) - END=0

[Guest steamteck]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

Hyper-man , I like that. That's not a bad plan at all.

[prestidigitator]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

Yeah. Hmm. Can Ablative be applied to Shapeshift?

[Lord Liaden]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

Yeah. Hmm. Can Ablative be applied to Shapeshift?

 

That was going to be my suggestion as well. Not strictly according to the rules, but IMHO this would model the Special Effect very well.

 

I've used Ablative in the past for non-defense Powers that would logically become increasingly unreliable or otherwise break down gradually under the stress of physical attacks.

[Guest steamteck]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

I like the shapeshift with the ablative applied to it. think that models what I want.

[薔薇語]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

In the Terminator movies and shows, the organic shell/disguise etc can be damaged destroyed without hurting the robot beneath. in fact blowing all the "people" away often seems to do almost nothing.

 

Without its "person suit" the terminator obviously can no longer blend etc.

 

I'm tempted to just call the loss of COM the Special Effect of the Terminator's Accidental Change.

 

Accidental Change: Being Shot, stabbed or otherwise damaged 14- (Common)

 

14-, as opposed to always, because some attacks, even though they are capable of ripping flesh, don't always do so. Depending on the likelihood of it being in danger of such attacks, one might adjust the commonness of the Disad.

 

La Rose

[tesuji]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

my issue with the ablative shapeshift approach is cost.

 

even if we assign a 25 pt disad for the "walking erector set" then you wind up with a 25 pt disad and a 29 pt power whose combined function is "sometime you look non-human" and PAYING points for that problem seems counter intuitive.

 

its a problem so the net should be "gain points for the problem" not "pay for the problem".

 

this assumes you are concerned about cost. If you are not concerned about cost why go thru the shenanigans to "model" it at all. Just DEFINE it and move on, right?

 

I would simply resolve this as a distinctive features.

 

How often does it crop up? Assign a frequency.

for a combat model, fairly frequently. For an infiltrator, not so often.

 

obviously the reaction is very strong among humans. So i would likely give it a "limited group" and "extreme reaction" set of values.

 

and go from there.

[Doc Samson]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

I would also just houserule that Ablative can be taken on Shapeshift. It seems to fit well.

[Kenn]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

3 Flesh Suit part 1: +3 BODY, limited power: not protected by 'natural' rPD & rED(-1)

2 Flesh Suit part 2: +6 COM, linked to Flesh Suit part 1.

 

For every 1 BODY lost, the character loses 2 COM.

 

Less expensive than the Shapeshift.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

my issue with the ablative shapeshift approach is cost.

 

even if we assign a 25 pt disad for the "walking erector set" then you wind up with a 25 pt disad and a 29 pt power whose combined function is "sometime you look non-human" and PAYING points for that problem seems counter intuitive.

 

its a problem so the net should be "gain points for the problem" not "pay for the problem".

 

this assumes you are concerned about cost. If you are not concerned about cost why go thru the shenanigans to "model" it at all. Just DEFINE it and move on, right?

 

I would simply resolve this as a distinctive features.

 

How often does it crop up? Assign a frequency.

for a combat model, fairly frequently. For an infiltrator, not so often.

 

obviously the reaction is very strong among humans. So i would likely give it a "limited group" and "extreme reaction" set of values.

 

and go from there.

 

 

But in the context of the source material not all Terminators have human tissue shells. In the future, many are shown with just the 'internal' skeleton. Perhaps not all are capable of taking on the shells without further modifications. In that case paying points for the shapeshift ability makes perfect sense.

 

As far as the 29 points I came up with earlier, I'm sure we could add a few more limitations, tweak the senses affected, etc.. to reduce this total. I wasn't worried about those details when I made that post. I just wanted to show a gerneral example of how it could be done.

[Guest steamteck]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

Heck sure you can knock it down more including adding ablative but I like your shapeshift option because I can set it up as an add on power to the basic fleshless terminator.

[CTaylor]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

I'd build it with a disadvantage: as he takes body he's revealed to be a robot. That's how I did it in a Champions module getting dust on my computer shelf right now.

[Sean Waters]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

I'd go the Hyper-route, with a tweak or two - you can make it pretty cheap:

Human Skin: 16 AP 4 Real

Shape Shift (Sight and Touch Groups), Costs END Only To Change Shape (+1/4) (16 Active Points); Extra Time (6 Hours, Only to Activate, Character May Take No Other Actions, -2), Affects Body Only (-1/2), Limited Power Power loses about a fourth of its effectiveness (Body damage cumulatively turns power off, partially repairable over time, but needs special equipment to do it properly; -1/4)

I didn't include smell/taste because the dogs suss them every time. I didn't think ablative worked, because, well, if you're house ruling it anyway...and ablative is all or nothing: a tiny nick that gets through defences has the same effect as a bucket of napalm.

 

Cheap though.

[jtelson]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

Maybe something like Shape Shift Linked to Body?

 

Maybe just Comliness Linked to Body?

[CTaylor]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

I think a Disad works fine: you default originally to looking and smelling human, but if you are hit with any attack that would do body to an ordinary human, you lose some of that flesh incrementally until you have nothing but metallic endoskeleton. After all, looking and smelling like a human being is a default power in Hero: you have to pay or get disads to be otherwise.

[Ninja-Bear]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

Boomers the the Invasion: Target Earth supplement just had this disadvantage

 

10 points Distintive Feature: As he takes damage to the artificial skin it doesn't repair.

 

5 points Distinctive Feature: Just doesn't act right.

 

Have you considered images? And put a bonus to the roll on a limitation? Something like +6 to make the roll 18- unharmed then subtract say -1 per 1 body done. Just thinking that when the terminator loses some skin, in the right circumstances, he still isn't a scary robot. Only when he loses all skin is it apparent that he is not noramal.

 

While thinking of powers how about additional PRE when the skin does come off ? To really make the scary robot.

[Guest steamteck]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

Boomers the the Invasion: Target Earth supplement just had this disadvantage

 

10 points Distintive Feature: As he takes damage to the artificial skin it doesn't repair.

 

5 points Distinctive Feature: Just doesn't act right.

 

Have you considered images? And put a bonus to the roll on a limitation? Something like +6 to make the roll 18- unharmed then subtract say -1 per 1 body done. Just thinking that when the terminator loses some skin, in the right circumstances, he still isn't a scary robot. Only when he loses all skin is it apparent that he is not noramal.

 

While thinking of powers how about additional PRE when the skin does come off ? To really make the scary robot.

 

Lots of great ideas. I like the extra PRE idea quite a bit.

[tesuji]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

But in the context of the source material not all Terminators have human tissue shells. In the future, many are shown with just the 'internal' skeleton. Perhaps not all are capable of taking on the shells without further modifications. In that case paying points for the shapeshift ability makes perfect sense.

 

Sorry but i dont get this one bit.

 

A terminator that is always metal showing has distinctive features with a not concealable and very high frequency of occurance.

 

a terminator who has skin covering most of the time has more concealable and lower frequency.

 

the baseline is, after all, no dictinctive features. you dont have to pay points to "look normal". that is the default.

 

you seem to have redefined the baseline for chargen to "IS A TERMINATOR" for free and now want them to pay for human-like appearance?

 

how much shapeshift would a normal human need to buy under these conditions?

 

 

As far as the 29 points I came up with earlier, I'm sure we could add a few more limitations, tweak the senses affected, etc.. to reduce this total. I wasn't worried about those details when I made that post. I just wanted to show a gerneral example of how it could be done.

 

one can always slap lims on a power. i have even known those who just keep piling on lims, that are then ignored, until they get the cost low as they want.

 

for me, i want to get an accurate cost, one that reflects the utility.

 

and to me - "looks like an inhuman killing machine that is hated by most people" isn't a positive trait. (though it might help you with a presence attack) so i dont start out thinking "how much should you pay for this.

 

As for how it could be done...

Suppress running 2d6 (Standard effect -3") +1/2 0 end +1/2 persistent +1 IPE 30 ap -1/2 self-only -1/2 always on = pay 15 cp

 

as opposed to just buying a physical lim disad and gaining 5-15 cp?

 

Which do you prefer for a human who has a base move of 3"?

[Hyper-Man]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

The situation described by the OP is really not that different than the often debated one of of Marvel's Daredevil (his blindness and super-power that compensates for it).

 

We're just switching 'appearances' for 'senses'.

 

Since it is highly likely that any use of a 'Terminator' in an RPG will be as a Non-Player Character, I don't see that it make much difference whether the final balance occurs on the positive or negative side of the character sheet.

 

I believe the OP is just looking for an easy to use 'in game' mechanic to track the effects of damage on the appearance of the terminator. I think the recently mentioned idea of Images (with Self Only) is probably even better than Shapeshift.

[Guest steamteck]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

I believe the OP is just looking for an easy to use 'in game' mechanic to track the effects of damage on the appearance of the terminator. I think the recently mentioned idea of Images (with Self Only) is probably even better than Shapeshift.

 

Exactly what I wanted. Something to kind of nail the effect down for me so I could use less game time processing power on it. I"m using your basic suggestion tweaked with the ablative as an add on to my base "fleshless terminators". I'm also incorporating a PRE decrease which also "ablates" away as suggested making it scarier as its damaged.

 

For my purposes this thread has been great! I can always count on you folks for tons of great ideas!

[Fenixcrest]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

I've done a variation of this with demons and lycanthropes. There's no real point build for them, but I guess I'd call it some kind of 0-point talent:

When they take damage that doesn't actually "hurt" them, they still look like they've taken the damage. So, you shoot a werewolf with an elephant gun that's not loaded with silver ammo, and it looks like you've blown off half his torso, but in a couple of seconds it's all grown back/stitched itself together.

 

If it's for a player character, though, I think the Shape Shift with a limitation to give it a cumulative self-dispel from damage, like what Sean Waters posted, is pretty elegant in a setting where looking like a robot is socially harmful.

[nexus]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

I forget, can a Susceptibility effect be something other than Damage? If so you could give the Terminator builds a susceptibility to intense physical damage (perhaps over a certain DC or amount of Body rolled not inflicted in a turn) that drains their Comeliness with a slow recovery rate. Maybe Phys Lim that once is' completely gone, it's gone.

[Guest steamteck]

Re: terminator where thepeople scrapes with damage

 

I forget' date=' can a Susceptibility effect be something other than Damage? If so you could give the Terminator builds a susceptibility to intense physical damage (perhaps over a certain DC or amount of Body rolled not inflicted in a turn) that drains their Comeliness with a slow recovery rate. Maybe Phys Lim that once is' completely gone, it's gone.[/quote']

 

Yes you can have a Susceptibility that does something other than damage so that certainly is a possible build also. Maybe not as written a drain but I could see that working for me.