THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

[Steve Long]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

I know this is not likely to go but please consider taking a hard look at the various FH weapons in regard to Str Min, Damage, and OCV mod for play balance.

 

Even if I agreed with your opinion on this subject (and I absolutely, positively do not), I'm certainly not going to change material from a book that came out in August in a book that comes out in November.

 

 

These ideas push the book from just equipment to all common things which costs money in a game.

 

Sorry, but this is a book about equipment, just equipment, nothin' but equipment. Money systems, real estate, and related matters are all interesting subjects, but they won't be appearing in this particular book.

[alms66]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

One of the best equipment books I've ever seen is Rolemaster's "And a 10' pole". They list every piece of equipment by era, with price fluctuations through time and all kinds of improvements to various items through time. Granted, they just had to produce row after row of charts, not show how to build the equipment.

[Escafarc]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

One of the best equipment books I've ever seen is Rolemaster's "And a 10' pole". They list every piece of equipment by era' date=' with price fluctuations through time and all kinds of improvements to various items through time. Granted, they just had to produce row after row of charts, not show how to build the equipment.[/quote']

 

Love this book but don't really see the need for HERO version. Would like to see some more on Resource Points though.

[BobGreenwade]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

One of the best equipment books I've ever seen is Rolemaster's "And a 10' pole". They list every piece of equipment by era' date=' with price fluctuations through time and all kinds of improvements to various items through time. Granted, they just had to produce row after row of charts, not show how to build the equipment.[/quote']Yeah, some good idea on monetary prices would be a Good Thing -- though I can certainly see that it would be an overwhelming bit of work to fix a monetary price for each item based on historical trends, just as it is for fixing a weight/mass for each.

 

Are there websites for finding out the costs, weight, dimensions, and such for individual items? If there are, there are probably at least three people on these boards who know at least a few of them. Listing some in an Appendix, and then referring the reader to that page wherever the matter comes up in the text, would probably be more than sufficient.

 

And perhaps some simple general rule for determining the monetary costs for items, or even multiple suggestions, would be helpful. For example, during a Fantasy Hero game I once ran I had some good success with AP x RP as the basic monetary cost for weapons, armor, and other equipment.

[dsatow]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

Sorry, but this is a book about equipment, just equipment, nothin' but equipment. Money systems, real estate, and related matters are all interesting subjects, but they won't be appearing in this particular book.

 

I would at least seriously think about revamping the monetary system. Money is treated like equipment by many players. I've seen them use it to affect the loyalty of minions, purchase better equipment to get better rolls, etc. But to just say, "fix this" without a suggestion on how it could be fixed would be kind of lame, so I have a suggestion, though I don't know how you may take to the idea. I have seen this style of system in games work ok.

 

Alternate money rule suggestion:

 

In the game, people would have an 14- "skill" to purchase anything in the world. Dependant on restrictions of sale or expense, the skill roll would rise or drop. The GM would decide on a base line for wealth in a game. Thus, if the GM decides $100 is the average expense, anything around $100 would require a 14- or roll to purchase.

 

For cheaper things, a bonus of +1 will be added for every halve of the expense. Thus something which costs $50 would be +2. Something which costs $20 or below would be +3. Doublings of cost would work in reverse where $200 would be -1, $400 would be -2, etc. There would be no limit to the upper level costs.

 

Penalties may be associated with the role due to rarity, unforeseen problems, etc. imposed by the GM. GMs may also bypass rolls which are greater than 14- and just say they succeed to speed play.

 

Wealth people would buy levels to increase their wealth at +1 per 3 points. A very wealthy person might have a +10 to their roll ($102,400 in fun money!).

 

Poor people would get a -1 to the roll per 3 points. So poor would be 9 points, 11- and Impoverished would be 18 points, 8-.

 

When using money to increase chances with a skill, estimate how much it would cost for a bonus to the roll and then convert that to a penalty to the wealth roll.

 

Ex: Alex is trying to determine how the fibers play a roll in the death of Bob. Getting better lab equipment would give him a better roll. The GM rules Alex would need to spend at least $800 or -3 to Alex's wealth roll. Alex needs to make the wealth roll 11- in order to afford the equipment to analyze the fibers. Alex rolls a 12 and fails. Guess he shouldn't have bought that game console last week.

 

Ex: Carl is bribing David, a bum, for info. He starts with $20, but David isn't budging. Normally $20 would buy simple info. Carl raises it to $50 which should be +1 to the bribe but David still isn't budging. At $100 mark, Carl needs to start rolling. At +2, David seems tempted but the NPC responds "$100 won't get me far enough out of town.". Carl tries for $200 and barely makes his roll. The GM responds he has only about $250 in his wallet since he barely made his roll. Luckily, at +3, David accepts.

 

Anytime someone purchases an expensive item such that their roll is not 14- or if the GM indicates it will temporarily decrease their wealth, their roll can be dropped by 1 or more for a period of time until their finances recover. Thus a person buying dinner for a friend could spend $200 on a very nice meal at -1, but hurt their finances by 1 for the rest of the game arc. A person spending $1600 for a party at -4 might hurt their finances by 4.

 

Penalties to the roll generally recover at a rate of 1 per week or whenever the GM says their finances have recovered.

[alms66]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

Well, if we're going to throw around ideas about wealth...

3 things make it up:

Wealth on hand (cash or goods)

Income

Debt

 

Each level you buy of them doubles the base value, set by the GM. You can add modifiers, positive or negative, for things such as "Wealth on hand" - Cash Only, Income - No Job (meaning something other than a job earns you money), Debt - loanshark, etc.

Nice and clean and then you can just treat money as money, if it buys you equipment, it's ok, because you paid points for the money to buy the equipment.

[BobGreenwade]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

I'm with Steve on this one, guys -- systems for handling money in a game is better left to genre books, or (we can hope) APG2. It just doesn't have that much to do with equipment. (It does affect equipping your character, at least indirectly, but not enough IMO to warrant devoting several pages to the topic.)

 

What's done with money in this book should be limited to what something would cost in a typical Fantasy (Turakian Age), Pulp (1930 USA), Modern (2010 USA), and Sci-Fi (Terran Empire) settings, depending on the respective availability, with perhaps ancient China/Japan for Martial Arts weapons and a few other bits. Given the amount of work that would mean for Steve, I'm not sure it even needs that much -- just some general guidelines on how to figure it out, such as what I suggested above re: finding Internet resources and using simple tricks like AP x RP.

 

As for real estate, a redirect to have the reader look at TUBa would probably suffice.

[ideasmith]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

I would like to see writeups of normal equipment, such as a camera, a cell phone, and a backpack.

[whitekeys]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

Well, we've had some discussion about things that are not in the book..

 

Lets discuss something that is in the book. To be honest, I'm not sure what stats are really needed for most equipment. Weapons are obviously a different story, but they're also rather straightforward, and I'm sure Steve wouldn't have too much trouble going through a couple of books and assigning damage classes to mannequin arms and human-sized meat grinders. Computers perhaps, or computer-like electronics such as cell phones, PDAs, voice-controlled computer glasses, pens that are bombs, communication headsets, scanners with different senses. General James Bond-type stuff.

 

Batman type stuff: hang gliding capes, boomerang bombs, tool belts, SHARK REPELLANT!!

 

Medical supplies that potentially heal BODY or STUN, like sedatives, or anti-biotics, salves and bandages, bio-gels (like in Mass Effect), andrenaline shots, and other types of 'positive- and negative-effect' drugs.

 

Miniature Robots. I had an idea that a medic had a set of spider-like robots (like those 'Roaches from Minority Report) that were programmed to help him do surgeries.

 

Perhaps different body- and power-suits could count as held equipment. Different type of space suits which obviously have life support, jet packs, and some sort of resistance to radiation and the like, Mining suits which have drillbit arms and reverse-thruster feet, 'Mech suit, like the one's Marines wear from StarCraft, Thief clothes with false pockets, boot-knives, reversible, camouflaged or even armours that are built for 'quick release' disrobing.

 

A list of Special Materials: Mithral, Dragonhide, Ironwood, Titanium Carbide, Wootz Steel, Tetraosmia <---(I made that one up, but you get the picture)

 

And of course, the mundane crap: animal call, ascender/slider, ear plugs, fishing tackle, ice ax, jewler's loupe, lanters, magnets, money belts, percolator, periscope, snorkel, snowshoes, general tools, backpacks, caltrops, crowbar, grappling hook guns, locks, telescope, whitsles, ropes and cables, manacles, smoke bombs and flash grenades, mace.

 

Kits and Outfits: Thieve's kit, healer's kit, disguise kit, climber's kit, navigator's kit, demolition kit, swat outfit, desert/winter outfit, climbing outfit, science/research kit, communications kit,

 

Magic Items ... i won't list 'em

 

And of course, the mundane crap: animal call, ascender/slider, ear plugs, fishing tackle, ice ax, jewler's loupe, lanters, magnets, money belts, percolator, periscope, snorkel, snowshoes, general tools, backpacks, caltrops, crowbar, grappling hook guns, locks, telescope, whitsles, ropes and cables, manacles, smoke bombs and flash grenades, mace.

 

Last, but not least.. everyone's favourite: Sharks with fricken lazer beams attached to their heads!

[whitekeys]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

My sincerest apologies if any of the above list was already layed out in the rules, already published in a supplemental book, or was just plain silly to suggest. I'm fairly new to the Hero System and the forums.

[gojira]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

One thought I had reading the gun lists in Hudson City:

 

I'd like to see a short explanation of what each item is. For most gun, I have no idea what they really are. How big, how common, and who likes to use them and why. I remember GURPS High Tech had something like this. Each gun got a one paragraph write up explaining when the gun first appeared, a little about its initial intended fuction or the inspiration for its introduction, a mention of how its use evolved over time, and who now is the major user(s).

 

These were very tight, brief blurbs. Short to write, but probably a lot of work to look up and edit. I really do hope you are able to find the time to add these however because it's a lot of work for me to do it instead. If this isn't possible for ALL items but might be possible for some, I'll take the some rather than have none at all.

 

--

 

About the organization of the book: #1 sounds fine although #3 is kinda tempting too. I do like the idea of including more than one listing (kinda like the way there are three listings of spells in Tuala Morn), it's handy to look up stuff based on what type of selection criteria I have in mind.

 

 

On optional stuff, if you get a chance to do some Victorian stuff, Steampunk would also be appreciated. Basically, higher powered and more fantastic equipment than the "Weird Science" stuff for Pulp. Think Girl Genius.

[The Main Man]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

Chalk me up in support of organization idea #1.

 

Moving on, I suppose that options for modifying given items or even whole categories to other genres could be neat. Example: rules for making "guns" more suited for Superheroes, or making martial arts weapons better suited for Dark Champions: The Animated series. And so on and so forth.

 

What about Post Apocalyptic equipment? Similarly, what about rules for improvised equipment, or at least sidebars for describing how to makeshift particular items?

[Vondy]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

I would like to see a few prototypical black powder weapons with notes on how to use them in play. A brown bess, colt dragoon 1848 revolver, etc. An age of sail canon, maybe built as a multipower allowing different kinds of shot (ball, grape, chain, etc) would be cool, too. A very few examples would be sufficient to extrapolate from. Also good, a discombobulation gun, HG Well's time machine, and some clockwork/steampunk/weird science goodies.

[Vondy]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

One thought I had reading the gun lists in Hudson City:

 

I'd like to see a short explanation of what each item is. For most gun, I have no idea what they really are. How big, how common, and who likes to use them and why. I remember GURPS High Tech had something like this...

 

I think the first printing of 2300AD, when it still had the traveler tag on it, handled this welll. Each weapon had a picture, stat-block, and a few short sentences. There were approx. three weapons per column. It worked well. On the other hand, steve tends to pack massive amounts guns/weapons into books. It would probably require a Hero Guns 6E Catalog, and probably moderately thick, to get everything into one book.

[Vondy]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

I'm with Steve on this one' date=' guys -- systems for handling money in a game is better left to genre book...[/quote']

 

Agreed. Conceptually this is a "splat book o' gear." On the other hand, equipment for minting/printing/forging money might be interesting. I'd probably handle it as a hand wave, but some people might want it.

[BobGreenwade]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

Agreed. Conceptually this is a "splat book o' gear." On the other hand' date=' equipment for minting/printing/forging money might be interesting. I'd probably handle it as a hand wave, but some people might want it.[/quote']Yes -- generally I'd handwave this kind of thing, but a single write-up of forgery gear would be cool.

 

Similarly, in most cases I'd just handle forensic discoveries with a handwave, but it would be good to have write-ups of things like ground-penetrating radar, GCMS, and other equipment, as well as reagents such as Luminal and ninhydrin, for when I want to run CSI Hero or something similar. The list obviously wouldn't have to be exhaustive; a half-dozen or so write-ups across a page or two should give a good starting point for expanding into whatever I need.

 

(Reminder to Steve: in unlikely event that you've forgotten, there were some pretty cool equipment write-ups in The Ultimate Skill.)

 

Another thing that may go without saying: I'd like to see every single non-vehicular gadget James Bond ever used. And, ideally, a few that were used by Maxwell Smart.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

One category which may be handy would be sources of artificial light. We went looking for this in a game yesterday, and ended up locating it in Fantasy Hero, but it seems like lighting is relevant in most, if not all, genres and gear for creating light would be appropriately discussed in this source.

[Steve Long]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

I would at least seriously think about revamping the monetary system.

 

Perhaps I was unclear before, so let me try again.

 

The HSEG is about equipment, just equipment, nothing but equipment. It will not cover Money or monetary systems in any way, shape, or form.

[Steve Long]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

My sincerest apologies if any of the above list was already layed out in the rules, already published in a supplemental book, or was just plain silly to suggest.

 

No worries at all, wk. Much of what you suggest is in fact already going to be in there (great minds think alike and all that, dontcha know ), though certainly not all of it.

[Steve Long]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

I would like to see writeups of normal equipment, such as a camera, a cell phone, and a backpack.

 

Generally speaking, the book's not going to do this. For the most part I think gamers are comfortable adjudicating the effects of mundane real-world equipment without the need to know what sort of Limitations I'd use to build a cell phone. I'd rather save the page space for things I think are more useful to have in print, for whatever reason.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

On the topic of weapons, the ship has practically already sailed, but listing the weapons of various eras side by side will doubtless re-spark the debate.

 

We noticed a couple of strange issues in our Pulp Hero game yesterday. First. despite the vast array of guns to choose from, the PC's pretty much all had the same guns, doing 2d6-1 with +1 OCV and a +1 Stun Multiple. Having a lot of variety isn't really all that useful if there is no balance between the choices. Once in a while, a smaller weapon (less effective, but easier to conceal) might get used, but if one or two easily accessible choices are clearly "the best" in typical combat, the other options serve little purpose other than adding page count.

 

Second, the mooks using guns that did 1d6 with a non-modified Stun Multiple would have been better off with a sling (1d6+1 with a +1 Stun Multiple). This kind of comparison is a bit jarring - why did we bother to develop firearms rather than just enhancing our sling rocks?

[Steve Long]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

I'd like to see a short explanation of what each [gun] is.

 

Sorry, but here I'm going to have to disappoint you. This simply requires way too much time, effort, and page space on my part -- especially when we all have the Internet and can almost instantly look up pictures of and information on any gun I've listed. Failing that, there will be books listed in the HSEG bibliography that you can turn to. If I ever get to write a "HERO System Weapons" book, maybe I could manage this, but for the HSEG I'm afraid it's not possible.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

Sorry' date=' but here I'm going to have to disappoint you. This simply requires way too much time, effort, and page space on my part -- especially when we all have the Internet and can almost instantly look up pictures of and information on any gun I've listed. Failing that, there will be books listed in the HSEG bibliography that you can turn to. If I ever get to write a "HERO System Weapons" book, maybe I could manage this, but for the HSEG I'm afraid it's not possible.[/quote']

 

I see two possible users of the book:

 

Gun nuts who already know (or believe they know) this, or will look it up themselves.

 

Game players who will use the weapon with the characteristics they feel will best get the job done, and not care if the damage done by the weapon they have selected is "clearly unrealistic in being more effective than" this other gun in the chart. Their characters "fire a gun" rather than discussing the history and users of this particular model.

 

Given that, spending a lot of page count on individual descriptions of each gun seems like a sub-optimal use of page count.

 

Practically, I'd rather select my character's weaponry from a genre book so I get an appropriate Pulp, WWII or what have you weapon. Will HSEG add anything, or just reprint the charts from the existing books (perhaps updated to 6e, but I don't think anything of note changed which would impact weapon stats)?

[Vondy]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

On the topic of weapons, the ship has practically already sailed, but listing the weapons of various eras side by side will doubtless re-spark the debate.

 

We noticed a couple of strange issues in our Pulp Hero game yesterday. First. despite the vast array of guns to choose from, the PC's pretty much all had the same guns, doing 2d6-1 with +1 OCV and a +1 Stun Multiple. Having a lot of variety isn't really all that useful if there is no balance between the choices. Once in a while, a smaller weapon (less effective, but easier to conceal) might get used, but if one or two easily accessible choices are clearly "the best" in typical combat, the other options serve little purpose other than adding page count.

 

Second, the mooks using guns that did 1d6 with a non-modified Stun Multiple would have been better off with a sling (1d6+1 with a +1 Stun Multiple). This kind of comparison is a bit jarring - why did we bother to develop firearms rather than just enhancing our sling rocks?

\

 

Weight, range, rate of fire, and accuracy, I would imagine.

[megaplayboy]

Re: THE HERO SYSTEM EQUIPMENT GUIDE -- What Would *You* Like To See?

 

One of these days I'd like to see an optional rule for the adverse auditory consequences for firing large caliber firearms inside enclosed areas. My first experience at an indoor gun range was a revelation in this regard. I've read that firing a .50 caliber handgun indoors without ear protection can result in temporary deafness and some permanent hearing loss.