Golden Age: Past or Present?

[Steve]

In many fantasy works (and rpg campaigns) the past is presented as the Golden Age. Magic was more powerful, gods walked the world, and everything was grander. The world now is fallen and reduced from past glories.

 

In other fantasy works (and rpg campaigns), the Golden Age is now and things are better than they once were. Empires and kingdoms grow where once there was barbarism, and learning about magic and the world expands.

 

What world background do you prefer and what have you played in?

[Lucius]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

A Dark Age looking forward to a prophesied Golden Age that still lies in the future.

 

 

Just kidding. But will say what I do NOT like: a total "crapsack" world that's not worth living in and never will be.

 

 

Lucius Alexander

 

An Age of Palindromedaries

[RexMundi]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

Both, but I have odd tastes in setting. The Darker the Grittier the better for me.

 

~Rex

[Escafarc]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

I like a "Renaissance" feel to my games.

[CrosshairCollie]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

In many fantasy works (and rpg campaigns) the past is presented as the Golden Age. Magic was more powerful, gods walked the world, and everything was grander. The world now is fallen and reduced from past glories.

 

In other fantasy works (and rpg campaigns), the Golden Age is now and things are better than they once were. Empires and kingdoms grow where once there was barbarism, and learning about magic and the world expands.

 

What world background do you prefer and what have you played in?

 

I prefer 'The Golden Age is here' of those two options, though I have a fondness for 'The Golden Age Is Coming' as well. I like the idea of barbarism fading away, replaced by civilization and enlightenment. In my last D&D world, f'rex, the 'savage humanoids' (goblins, hobgoblins, kobolds, etc) had made serious advances in becoming more civilized; while still primitive, their culture of 'if you can take it, the other guy didn't really own it' is withering, with only a few hardliners (typically chieftains who use it to keep power) clinging to it. Most nations are ready to drop monarchies, theocracies, and dictatorships in favor of parliaments and republics, and equal rights for all is the order of the day.

 

The PCs often have to deal with people who would try to plunge the world back into its Dark Ages.

[Orion]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

I've never really played in a world where either was happening - I've never had a GM that cared about world background, culture, and history, and this goes for every genre I've played in.

 

My preference, both as GM and player, slightly leans towards the golden age being in the past. It gives better reasons for old ruins and forgotten knowledge to be laying about, and gives the players something to strive for - bring back the glory that was. I have one campaign in development that is based on this idea. I have another that had gods walking the earth and powerful magics and psionics being present in the dim past, but these were Cthulhoid gods, fell beasts, and non-human species. They have little effect other than ruins and very rare artifacts on the world now, so don't really matter.

 

I usually don't pay too much attention to it either way. I'm more likely to assume that a fantasy world has changed little through time, and not much will change in the future. I guess this is because I try to emulate certain periods of history, and so am resistant to anything that could change that feel.

[Kraven Kor]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

I'm fine with either (or the "Golden Age yet to come option") so long as it is remotely well portrayed. Each has different aspects that appeal to me and can inspire a fun character concept.

 

But I think this is such an ever-present trope just due to a glitch in human nature and memory. Most every generation, at some point, looks back on the glories of the past and laments the problems of the present, often with little hope for the future. The "Good Ol' Days" syndrome.

 

Even Forgotten Realms, one of the most epic "High Fantasy" settings I have played in, still has the "Golden Age" of the past despite the seeming wonders of the present.

[CrosshairCollie]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

Most every generation' date=' at some point, looks back on the glories of the past and laments the problems of the present, often with little hope for the future. [/quote']

 

That's very true. That may be why I like the 'the best is yet to come' element ... I hear enough of that in real life.

[teh bunneh]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

My primary fantasy world doesn't have a "golden age" -- past, present, or future. People are good or bad, strong or weak, intelligent or ignorant in the same way that people always were and always will be. Empires have crumbled, and new empires will some day spring up. For some people, today seems like a Golden Age, for others the past looks like it was filled with glories never to be recovered.

 

That said, the current time is relatively peaceful and prosperous, though it wasn't that long ago that a big war tore up the land and reshaped politics for a big chunk of the continent and memories (of the winners, the losers, and the ones caught in between) of that bad time still linger.

[Clonus]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

"Golden age" isn't a synonym for "utopia". (Except in Greek mythology). Generally it just means a time when the culture had a large number of memorable artistic and technological (or possibly magical) achievements, "great thinkers", and local dominance.

[RexMundi]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

I side with Robert E. Howard.

 

~Rex

[Kraven Kor]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

My primary fantasy world doesn't have a "golden age" -- past, present, or future. People are good or bad, strong or weak, intelligent or ignorant in the same way that people always were and always will be. Empires have crumbled, and new empires will some day spring up. For some people, today seems like a Golden Age, for others the past looks like it was filled with glories never to be recovered.

 

That said, the current time is relatively peaceful and prosperous, though it wasn't that long ago that a big war tore up the land and reshaped politics for a big chunk of the continent and memories (of the winners, the losers, and the ones caught in between) of that bad time still linger.

 

From the guy quoted in my signature, my good friend Scott Rockwood:

 

 

Boy and his gun, sorceress and her wand

huddled under the stoop

of a bridge for the freight train above

Rain falls down on the carcasses around

of buildings that have turned to dust

Boy drums on his plate and sings her a song

of worlds moved on, pieces of puzzles to solve

she puts her wand in the ash and persuades a small fire

they danced all night out in the rain showers.

They sang songs of worlds they dreamed,

danced through the puddles;

the stories and puddles grew,

flames took on shapes as the pools seeped in,

the steam of their union took journey on the wind.

Clouds carrying fables to inspire new lands,

to build new empires and watch them wash back into sand.

Remnants sing songs of worlds they've dreamed,

unaware their dreams become Adam and Eve.

 

This song is actually one of the inspirations for my current setting.

[Kraven Kor]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

And by that, my setting has the Golden Age(s) of the Past:

 

- The Age of Dreams before the world was divided between mortal and immortal, tens of thousands of years ago

- When Ulohi ruled all of Telos 3,000 years ago, when humans first re-acquired magic and the first fortress cities were built

 

The Golden Age of the Present; with Noordmar rising to prominence, defeating the most recent attempt by Ulohi to reclaim their former Glory, and the discovery of Aether leading to the current industrial boom. Though this 'Golden Age' is likely already over.

 

And, the Golden Age yet to come - if Noordmar, Feldmar, and Kalanth can maintain the relations they have enjoyed, they could one day put an end to Ulohi for good; possibly even cross the sea and unite all the world, drive the Vaerog from Orohos and free the people of Shaolos from oppression and tyranny as they have for most of the people of Telos.

[Lucius]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

From the guy quoted in my signature, my good friend Scott Rockwood:

 

 

 

 

This song is actually one of the inspirations for my current setting.

 

Wow, is Rockwood actually his birth name? That's perfect name for one who Would Rock.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The palindromedary thinks a name referencing stones and trees like that sounds perfect for a druid or a wizard specializing in the element of Earth

[Gent]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

My settings tend to have a cycle between Golden and Mundane Ages, with an occasional Dark Age in the past(or ending over the course of the campaign).

[Kraven Kor]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

Yup. Scott Rockwood, given name not stage name. "If Rock could; Rockwood."

 

And he has written several songs that I use as inspiration for my Fantasy and/or Sci-Fi games. Hell, "Cycle of Creation" I could see almost being sung by a bard in my campaign world; would just have to change the freight train line

 

Just great lines in his stuff. But Cycle itself is especially appropriate to this thread. That and it reminds me of good old classic rock; Led Zepellin or Jethro Tull or something

[Shadowsoul]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

It's ironic that I'm running a Post Apocalyptic Fantasy campaign. Because I hate the idea of a world which has already passed its golden age. I want to play in the golden age! Magic fading out of the world and magical races retreating into obscurity is, to me, maudlin and depressing. Progress towards democracy and greater magical powers to unleash upon the world is the way to go.

 

Even in my campaign, which is played out in a broken world, the ultimate message is of hope for a brighter future. Also, the fall means that there is even more magic around to play with.

[mhd]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

I'm fine with either, as long as it's more a philosophical question and not the absolute Truth. I always got the feeling that Tolkien's Middle Earth was the latter, where the pinnacle was reached and now it's going down. And the Age of Men is something to lament, instead of yet another change.

 

If there's an ebb and flow of civilisations, that's fine for me, too. Maybe someone already did "all this" (where all this ranges from "smelted bronze" to "went to the stars"), and there has been a cataclysm in the past. Maybe there's just a short "dark age" where things aren't exactly progressing and there's even some stuff lost, but nothing that a few centuries can't cure…

 

The one thing I like the least in a lot of pre-fab backgrounds is something different: stagnation. If your setting is in the "middle ages" for 4000 years, there better be a damn good explanation, and preferably something that my characters can do about.

[Kraven Kor]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

I am guilty of the "stagnation" bit in my setting, to an extent.

 

Gunpowder was discovered on my world nearly 2500 years ago, and steam-powered zeppelin-style airships shortly thereafter, and things have been in a kind of cycle since then, pretty much stuck in an early industrial age. The reason for it is the constant cycle of war and the fact that they never quite mastered 'mass production' - inventors and wizards work much the same, all hand made stuff and jealously guarded secrets passed down from father to son or master to apprentice. And then war would come, destroy most of the industrial capacity of both sides, kill most of the people with the know-how, etc.

 

I'm sorry, my main bad guys are fire worshipers who want to rule all the world, or burn it if they can't

[Nolgroth]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

Hurm. I tend to like "Golden Age in the Past." My tone is generally darkish, yet I always try to present the world as something that the characters can strive to make a difference in. Being that I don't like villainous PCs, that change is generally positive. I think one of my big weaknesses as a GM/Storyteller is that I pile the dark on a little thick. Mostly I want the "big win" payoff to be really significant. Players not ready for the long haul might possibly get discouraged.

 

I have been wanting to try out a truly epic "Golden Age is NOW" fantasy setting but I just can't wrap my head around the concept very well. If the characters are already so epic and powerful, what is left for them to do? At what point does it become Champions in Chainmail?

[Shadowsoul]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

Hurm. I tend to like "Golden Age in the Past." My tone is generally darkish, yet I always try to present the world as something that the characters can strive to make a difference in. Being that I don't like villainous PCs, that change is generally positive. I think one of my big weaknesses as a GM/Storyteller is that I pile the dark on a little thick. Mostly I want the "big win" payoff to be really significant. Players not ready for the long haul might possibly get discouraged.

 

I have been wanting to try out a truly epic "Golden Age is NOW" fantasy setting but I just can't wrap my head around the concept very well. If the characters are already so epic and powerful, what is left for them to do? At what point does it become Champions in Chainmail?

 

If you haven't read the Malazan book of the Fallen yet, then you might find it good inspiration for a dark yet epic campaign. Beings of incredible power walk the earth in the Malazan Age, but many of them are as helpless against the tides of fate as any mere mortal. Also, in the golden age of epicness, it doesn't matter if you are powerful, because your enemies are powerful too.

[Shadowsoul]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

Actually.

 

Here are some Golden Age adventures/campaigns.

 

Wars of the Gods

- The brutal elder gods worshipped by the ancient races are being displaced by a new race of deities that favours humanity. But the old gods are powerful and their younger rivals require champions to root out the monsters and titans that lurk in the dark corners of the world and pave the way for a glorious new civilisation.

 

- Ultimately, the PCs' enemies have been working at the behest of a certain god. Now they are powerful enough to take him on directly and his chief rival in the pantheon is willing to give them the opportunities they need to kill an immortal.

 

- (Lifted straight from Dragonlance). The Priest-King, the word of the gods in mortal form, overlord of the golden age and the ultimate expression of Good, has decided that among the people who don't meet his exacting standards of morality are pretty much all the non-human races and possibly even the gods themselves. It is up the the players whether they stand in the path of his all-consuming crusade ... or join it.

 

 

Children of the Gods

 

- (Stolen from Homer). The world groans beneath the epic feet of the race of Heroes, born from the union of men and gods. So Fate and the Gods conspire to pit the two mightiest kingdoms on earth against each other. Each kingdom can field an immense army of allied soldiers. This will be the war to end all wars. Heroes will fall in bloody ruin and legends will be forged in the terrible crucible of war.

 

- (Stolen from God of War). The gods are your parents. And they are not good ones. It is time to bring justice to the world and work out your daddy issues by taking the fight to Olympus itself.

 

- New gods are chosen from amongst half mortal children seeded in the human population. The PCs have been revealed as such beings. Now they must prove that they are worthy of ascension, ideally by defeating their fellow demigods in war and mighty deeds.

 

- When mortals make mistakes, they make a mess. When gods make a mistake, they make a monster. The party has been recruited to clean up the mistakes of various gods, from transformed mortals to semi-divine abominations.

 

Big enemies

 

- (Taken from the Chronicles of the Raven). This world is one of many and there are creatures which know the paths between them. One such species is the dragon. And unfortunately the mystical powers unleashed by the golden age are as a beacon which has guided a voracious flight of dragons to this planet and now they intend to devastate the entire world and feed on its magic.

 

- The Dark Lord has tried to end the Golden Age too many times already. It is time to corner him and bring him down.

 

- The wonders of the golden age are such that the prince of hell himself has begun to covet them. So he leads an army of demons onto the mortal plane to take those wonders for himself.

Exploration

 

- The golden age is wonderful. But it only exists in a limited geographical area. Now is the time for bold explorers to bring the fruits of the golden age to other cultures and civilisations, whether they like it or not.

 

- There is a phrophecy which says that a power lies beyond the known world which overshadows all the miracles of the golden age. Our heroes must set out in search of it.

 

Civil War

 

- The great magical civilisation of epicness has ushered in an age of arcane enlightenment and crushed all enemies. But there is a growing discord between factions of the nobility, who have very different ideas about how the empire should be run. That conflict will inevitably spiral into war.

 

- A new form of magic has been developed e.g. golem-crafting. But its practitioners refuse to bow to the status quo. They must be made to yield, or crushed, so that the golden age can continue undisturbed. Or. A noble house has begun dabbling in dark powers. They have taken the mighty legacy of the age and twisted it to evil ends. They must be destroyed.

 

Inheritance

 

- (Taken from a couple of different fantasy books). The Dark Lord who threatened the world has been defeated. But the heroes did not succeed in destroying the Dark Army. Instead, they inherited it. Now the golden age is a time of wonder and power, but it sure could use a little more justice. Hey, why don't we ...

 

Legacy

 

- A prophecy states that x mighty weapons must be created to be used by the heroes of the future against a mighty evil that has yet to make itself known. Cue the golden age party hunting the father of dragons to use his right fang to make the Spear of Legend and drowning an entire race of goblins in the sea of tears so that their souls can be bound in service to the Shield of Shadows.

 

- The heroes carve out their own kingdom and ensure that it will be protected against all comers.

 

For more ideas. Try looking at D&D source material for epic level characters.

[Manic Typist]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

Awesome stuff there, Shadowsoul.

[Shadowsoul]

Re: Golden Age: Past or Present?

 

Thanks Manic Typist.

 

I've edited the dragon flight idea as I realise now that I didn't finish it.