Weirdness Magnet

[Laundry Knight]

I have a character that I am defining as an Everyman and Weirdness Magnet. I know that the Everyman concept is in how I portray him, but how would I make him a Weirdness Magnet. By Weirdness Magnet, I mean that things tend to wrong to and around him in annoying and silly but non-hazardous ways.

[Christopher]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

How much of an anoance do you talk about?

The washing machine not working in his downtime? (no game effect)

Or the Key to the Batmobile falling into the sewer, just when they want to chase down the escaping mooks with the loot/clue? (at least additional work to do, or outright failing a non-critical scene)

[Laundry Knight]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

I think the Batmobile example is closer to what I am looking for.

[Christopher]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

I think the Batmobile example is closer to what I am looking for.

Then how about Unluck?

Even 5D6 only has a 1:7,776 Chance to actually get that many levels of Unluck. But 1-2 levels are likely.

 

The Batmobile example would be in the "affects the group" area.

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

This is called Unluck; it's a complication / disadvantage.

[Xavier Onassiss]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

I could be wrong, but isn't Unluck generally considered to be hazardous under the RAW? It causes problems which aren't just weird and annoying, but actually harmful or dangerous. I'm not 100% sure if that's what the OP is going for in this case.

 

I think I'd look at other possibilities. Weirdness Magnet could be a Physical Complication (Frequently, Barely Impairing); or a Social Complication (Frequently, Minor).

[Christopher]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

I could be wrong, but isn't Unluck generally considered to be hazardous under the RAW? It causes problems which aren't just weird and annoying, but actually harmful or dangerous. I'm not 100% sure if that's what the OP is going for in this case.

 

I think I'd look at other possibilities. Weirdness Magnet could be a Physical Complication (Frequently, Barely Impairing); or a Social Complication (Frequently, Minor).

If it is only annoying but not harmfull/hindering (making the adventure or combat more complciated), it's not worth any points.

Of course the genre can have a big influence on that. In superheroic games, even level 3 Unluck will a tops mean your ego get's bruised and your team looses the fight.

In gritty heroic games, even 1 Level could be a death sentence and thus seal the fate for your entire team.

[Laundry Knight]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

I intend it primarily for a comedic effect that will sometimes causes an extra obstacle or two. I think the Social Complication or the Physical Complication matches my concept the best.

[Christopher]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

I intend it primarily for a comedic effect that will sometimes causes an extra obstacle or two. I think the Social Complication or the Physical Complication matches my concept the best.

Then it should not be more than 5-10 points.

[Zeropoint]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

I priced it by building it as a Hunted last time it came up for me, using the lower values because weirdness doesn't want to kill you, just mess with you.

[Laundry Knight]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

Thanks for the advice, guys. I am still trying to get hang of character creation, and I am starting by converting characters from a collection of short stories I've written and am hoping to novelize and publish someday. I don't know if I will ever get a chance to actually play the characters, but character creation tends to be fun in its own right.

[Ragitsu]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

TALKING F****ING DOGS! How could someone pass that up?

 

Sure, your family pet might let slip your character's panty size, but that's a small price to pay for the coolness.

 

Aliens that ask for directions to Taco Bell? Now, I know that contract is around here somewhere...

[Tasha]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

I have a character that I am defining as an Everyman and Weirdness Magnet. I know that the Everyman concept is in how I portray him' date=' but how would I make him a Weirdness Magnet. By Weirdness Magnet, I mean that things tend to wrong to and around him in annoying and silly but non-hazardous ways.[/quote']

 

Pretty much any PC is a Weirdness Magnet. They have odd stuff happening to them all of the time. Things going wrong around the person is most likely a die of two of Unluck.

[Ragitsu]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

Pretty much any PC is a Weirdness Magnet. They have odd stuff happening to them all of the time. Things going wrong around the person is most likely a die of two of Unluck.

 

WM elevates the oddness beyond the usual, though.

[Tasha]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

I could be wrong, but isn't Unluck generally considered to be hazardous under the RAW? It causes problems which aren't just weird and annoying, but actually harmful or dangerous. I'm not 100% sure if that's what the OP is going for in this case.

 

I think I'd look at other possibilities. Weirdness Magnet could be a Physical Complication (Frequently, Barely Impairing); or a Social Complication (Frequently, Minor).

 

It depends on your GM and what you can negotiate. I would allow a couple of dice of Unluck to be called "weirdness Magnet". Having gadgets fail at unopportune moments is unlucky enough, having truly weird things happen can also be bad.

 

BTW No matter how Gritty your game is 1d6 of Unluck should NEVER be lethal. Heck getting 5 pips of unluck in a gritty game shouldn't be lethal. It should be spectacularly unlucky, but not lethal.

[Christopher]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

Thanks for the advice' date=' guys. I am still trying to get hang of character creation, and I am starting by converting characters from a collection of short stories I've written and am hoping to novelize and publish someday. I don't know if I will ever get a chance to actually play the characters, but character creation tends to be fun in its own right.[/quote']

It can be cool in your stories. But for Role Playings games usually have multiple storytellers: The GM and the Player(s).

The character sheet is the "Lowest common denominator" between those two-three parties. A great part of the interaction will be based on this. But not every last flaw, ability or skill has to be written down on it.

You only have to write things down as complciation, if you want the GM to make it part of the story. Complications and Limitations are a request to the GM, to make thsi part of the story. But you can just ask him normally for such small things. Having "wierd stuff" happening to him, could be the Special Effect of him going on adventures.

 

It depends on your GM and what you can negotiate. I would allow a couple of dice of Unluck to be called "weirdness Magnet". Having gadgets fail at unopportune moments is unlucky enough, having truly weird things happen can also be bad.

 

BTW No matter how Gritty your game is 1d6 of Unluck should NEVER be lethal. Heck getting 5 pips of unluck in a gritty game shouldn't be lethal. It should be spectacularly unlucky, but not lethal.

When the lethality is high, even a small penalty to DCV can make the difference between life and death. And small penalties are what this level of Unluck can give you.

[Clonus]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

I have a character that I am defining as an Everyman and Weirdness Magnet. I know that the Everyman concept is in how I portray him' date=' but how would I make him a Weirdness Magnet. By Weirdness Magnet, I mean that things tend to wrong to and around him in annoying and silly but non-hazardous ways.[/quote']

 

 

Hunted: Source of Weirdness.

[Laundry Knight]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

It can be cool in your stories. But for Role Playings games usually have multiple storytellers: The GM and the Player(s).

The character sheet is the "Lowest common denominator" between those two-three parties. A great part of the interaction will be based on this. But not every last flaw, ability or skill has to be written down on it.

You only have to write things down as complciation, if you want the GM to make it part of the story. Complications and Limitations are a request to the GM, to make thsi part of the story. But you can just ask him normally for such small things. Having "wierd stuff" happening to him, could be the Special Effect of him going on adventures.

 

I recognize that neither real nor fictional characters do not cross media well and that it is impossible to make roleplaying character perfectly resemble one from another medium. My exercise is just to see how well I can create characters using Hero, and I am not trying to make RPG and literary versions of my characters be perfect clones of one another. Although, attempts to make some of my characters in Hero has given me ideas on closing story holes that have been troubling me; so, there has been crossover both ways and.

[Ragitsu]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

It is not impossible.

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

I could be wrong' date=' but isn't Unluck generally considered to be hazardous under the RAW? It causes problems which aren't just weird and annoying, but actually harmful or dangerous. [/quote']

 

Yes, you are wrong. Sorry to be the bearer of that bad news. :|

 

At three levels and higher Unluck does start to get less inconvenient / troublesome and more dangerous, and at 4+ levels it becomes dangerous for others around the character with Unluck. But the chances of rolling three or more 6's on the maximum limit of 5d6 is statistically low and thus under most circumstances one or two levels will be rolled.

 

Also, the player doesn't have to take any more than 2d6 Unluck if they don't want to risk truly dangerous situations for their character.

 

 

 

Basic Rulebook:

 

UNLUCK

Improbable and unlucky things happen to a

character who has Unluck. Unluck is worth 5 points

per 1d6 and functions like the opposite of the

Luck Power (BR 55). Whenever the GM thinks it’s

appropriate, he has the character make an Unluck

roll. Every “1” that comes up on the dice equals one

level of Unluck. The more levels the character gets,

the worse the fate that befalls him.

 

6e v1

 

Improbable and unlucky things happen to a

character who has Unluck. The GM should require

an Unluck Roll when the character’s winning

easily in a fight, depending on a sure thing,

succeeding easily, taking a simple task for granted,

and so forth.

 

Unluck is worth 5 Matching Complications

points per 1d6. When determining whether

Unluck affects him, a character rolls his Unluck

dice; each “1” that appears on the dice counts as

one level of Unluck. The more levels of Unluck,

the more intense the effects should be. The

accompanying table gives some suggested effects

for Unluck.

 

Unluck isn’t just a roll — it should affect the

character in minor ways whenever he’s winning

or on top of a situation. A character with Unluck

may also buy Luck: he’s Lucky when losing and

Unlucky when winning (resulting in a very

confused character). The maximum amount of

Unluck allowed is 5d6 (which is worth 25 Character

Points as a Complication). Any more than

this and the character would have great difficulty

staying alive in a dangerous world.

 

The GM should be careful not to overemphasize

this Complication, since Unluck can be

extremely frustrating and annoying. The GM

might roll secretly for Unluck, and let the player

worry about whether it’s working. Usually, the GM

should only roll Unluck once during an encounter,

to give himself a general idea of the outcome.

 

UNLUCK

Levels Possible Effects

1 The character slips and is put at a

disadvantage in combat, the computer

malfunctions, the character loses a

vital clue or piece of equipment, or

a complete stranger picks a fight.

 

2 Bystanders get between the character

and his target, normally friendly people

are unwilling or unable to help the

character, the character’s bow breaks at

an inopportune moment, a vacuum suit

temporarily malfunctions, or an attack

misses its target and injures a friend.

 

3 The character is suddenly Stunned

in a fight by falling debris, another

enemy shows up, a downed enemy is

revived by a spectacular coincidence,

the character’s jetpack shuts off in

flight, or an airlock opens accidentally.

Incredibly bad coincidence is possible.

 

4 or

more

Like three levels, only the bad luck

starts to affect the character’s friends or

comrades. An entire team’s spacesuits

might fail, all ammunition might turn

out to be duds, several Hunteds might

show up simultaneously, and so forth.

[Christopher]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

UNLUCK

Levels Possible Effects

1 The character slips and is put at a

disadvantage in combat, the computer

malfunctions, the character loses a

vital clue or piece of equipment, or

a complete stranger picks a fight.

 

2 Bystanders get between the character

and his target, normally friendly people

are unwilling or unable to help the

character, the character’s bow breaks at

an inopportune moment, a vacuum suit

temporarily malfunctions, or an attack

misses its target and injures a friend.

 

3 The character is suddenly Stunned

in a fight by falling debris, another

enemy shows up, a downed enemy is

revived by a spectacular coincidence,

the character’s jetpack shuts off in

flight, or an airlock opens accidentally.

Incredibly bad coincidence is possible.

Each of the ones I bolded are very dangerous in a Heroic game. Vacuum Suites tend to be the only thing between you and a vacuum death, this bow might been your main weapon, with wich you held the enemy at bay, injuring a friend can be a lot of damage, and being stunned means 1 or more rounds at 1/2 DCV and halved called shot penalties.

 

But you are right about the chances:

5d6 Unluck have a 5:6 chance to Roll one level, but more levels are still very unlikely. But if the GM rolls once per encounter, it will happen.

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

My interpretation is that 1 level is mild, 2 levels is moderate, 3 levels is serious, and 4 levels or more scales upwards.

 

My interpretation is based upon:

 

1) The circumstances under which Unluck should be rolled are specifically "The GM should require an Unluck Roll when the character’s winning easily in a fight, depending on a sure thing, succeeding easily, taking a simple task for granted, and so forth."; this indicates that you don't roll for Unluck when a character is struggling, success is questionable, or their life is on the line.

2) The examples given support mild, moderate, serious, etc.

3) The limit to 5d6 considers 6 levels or more of Unluck to be dooming; thus less than 6d6 is not intended to be dooming. "The maximum amount of Unluck allowed is 5d6 (which is worth 25 Character Points as a Complication). Any more than this and the character would have great difficulty staying alive in a dangerous world."

4) It is a complication / disadvantage worth a certain number of points, and per the spirit of the HERO System's point basis, 5,10,15,20,or 25 points of Unluck should be comparatively as bad as other complication/disadvantages of the same points value. If 2d6 of Unluck, worth 10 points, is interpreted by a severe GM to mean 'you periodically shoot your buddies through the eye and kill them, suffer explosive decompression, break or lose the only thing standing between you and certain death, and will almost assuredly die by your 36th encounter', I think that clearly exceeds the intended scope.

5) A direct statement in the rules description indicates that it is not intended for the GM to over do or escalate Unluck; "The GM should be careful not to overemphasize this Complication, since Unluck can be extremely frustrating and annoying."

5b) and also, it says that "Unluck can be extremely frustrating and annoying", not "Unluck can be extremely lethal and suicidal".

 

 

But, hey, it's interpretative and left to the GM's discretion so if you as the GM interpret it in an adversarial way to effectively be a death sentence for any character that takes even a little bit of it, then so be it. The players in your game would be foolish to take Unluck if your interpretation is that severe, and they'll learn that real quick, making it moot as eventually no one will have Unluck and it wont ever come up.

[Christopher]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

4) It is a complication / disadvantage worth a certain number of points' date=' and per the spirit of the HERO System's point basis, 5,10,15,20,or 25 points of Unluck should be comparatively as bad as other complication/disadvantages of the same points value.[/quote']

15 Points: Vulnerability (x1.5 Body) to All Iron and Lead Weapons; Very common

 

Looks like 15 points of complication can be very dangerous. I wonder what 25 can cause....

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

15 Points: Vulnerability (x1.5 Body) to All Iron and Lead Weapons; Very common

 

Looks like 15 points of complication can be very dangerous. I wonder what 25 can cause....

 

So...you are arguing just to argue then?

 

 

By very common I assume you are including steel weapons and other iron based alloys in that group, vs pure iron.

 

A character taking such a complication in a standard Fantasy HERO campaign would surely be dead very quickly unless they had some very reliable way of avoiding being hit by such weapons. So sure, all things being equal, that is a 15 point complication that is deadly.

 

However, all things are not equal, given that it subsumes several key assumptions that go against the stated intent of the complications in general and vulnerability in particular.

 

1) For starters, complications are intended to be a way to make a character more interesting and allow the player the opportunity to define the kinds of challenges they want their character to face and help shape their character's in-play experience in interesting ways. Complications are not intended to dominate play or to overshadow other aspects of the game.

 

Complications are intended to enrich the game in a fun way, not to fulfill some kind of sadomasochistic purpose or to give adversarial GM's a license to screw over players.

 

If a player wants to take a complication that the GM feels is going to lead to an un-fun, game-damaging outcome the GM should consult with the player to communicate their concerns, make sure the player understands the GM's interpretation and possible outcomes, and either settle on some less severe complication or reach an understanding that the player is accepting responsibility for the eventual outcome of the problematic complication they have chosen.

 

6ev1 pg 416

The GM should remember that Complications

are there to be used — the player chose the

Complication for his character because he wanted

it to be part of the campaign. A Complication

shouldn’t dominate play — not every opponent

needs to have an attack that exploits the character’s

Vulnerability, for example — but they should

come into play often enough to keep the character

on his toes. A GM shouldn’t feel bad if he uses a

lightning bolt against a character who takes 2 x

STUN from Electricity; that’s what the Complication

is for, after all. Think of Complications (and

Limitations) as a way for the player to express

what he wants his character’s role in the game to

be... and then honor his request in a fair, reasonable,

and fun way!

 

2) Vulnerability is explicitly not recommended for Heroic campaigns, precisely because it is more dangerous within the context of a lower powered and lethal setting.

 

Thus, if you chose to allow it, you are choosing to accept the fact that it goes against the received wisdom of the game designers intent, and accept responsibility for outcomes that are outside the intended range.

 

You can't reasonably use an element beyond it's recommended tolerances, then treat the extreme results produces by such usage as normative, and attempt to use that as a basis of argument for using other elements beyond their intended ranges. That's obviously skewed.

 

6e v1 pg414

This section describes the various Complications

a character can take. Not all Complications

are appropriate for every character in every genre.

For example, a knight wouldn’t normally take

Accidental Change, and most normal humans

have no reason to take Vulnerability. However, all

the Complications are presented in a single place

for ease of reference; the GM should make clear

which, if any, aren’t allowed in his campaign.

 

6e v1 pg415

Another thing for the GM to keep in mind is

that Heroic characters usually don’t have access to

as many Complications as Superheroic characters

do. Complications like Accidental Change,

Enraged/Berserk, Susceptibility, and Vulnerability

don’t occur nearly as often in Heroic games.

 

6e v1 pg432

VULNERABILITY

Generally, Vulnerability is most appropriate

for Superheroic campaigns. Players should consult

with their GM before taking it for characters in

Heroic games.

 

 

Finally, I'm sorry but I don't have time to waste arguing about unimportant things, nor the patience. I've already spent more time on this than I care to. I enjoy reasonable conversation and collaboration, I do not enjoy argument for the sake of argument.

 

You can do whatever you like in your games, and interpret the rules whatever way you like; I think your interpretation exceeds the stated intent of the rules as written, but I don't have a problem with that to the extent it does not affect me or my games.

 

So, I disagree with you on this point, and you obviously disagree with me. So be it.

[Christopher]

Re: Weirdness Magnet

 

So...you are arguing just to argue then?

I am simply pointing out that a compcliation that can put you at half DCV and unable to abort is indeed "dangerous", something you seem to disagree with.

The lvl 3 Unluck clearearly lists half DCV situations (falling and being stunned).

 

Loosing the keys to the Bat-mobile propably falls under 1 Level of Unluck (it has to be a vital clue or piece of equip. What is more vital in a car chase than your car?).

 

I am not certain about the lvl 2 unluck. It think it does not mean the entire suite ruptures and you die on the spot. But you propably have a damage that needs to be fixed now - and can only be repaired inside a pressureized area.