Who are The Ultimates?

[UberGeek88]

The Ultimates as presented in CKC seem to be a very well put together team. But most of their seeds suppose an existing relationship between the PCs and the villains. What do The Ultimates do as a team? What do they want? Eurostar are terrorists. The Crimelords are the mercenary team. GRAB are thieves. Where does Binder want the team to go?

[Zen Archer]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

The short answer would be "wherever you, as the GM, want him to".

 

The version in CV2 is proud and paranoid, and seems to be fine with the "money and fame" part of supervillainy as his way of getting back at the world, IMO.

[Dr. MID-Nite]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

The Ultimates I see as mostly wanting the world to acknowledge them as a force to be reckoned with. And they want to be rich....rich is good. I replaced Radium and Slick from the 5th ed version with Tachyon and Anklosaur. Anklosaur is kind of the odd man out, but he knows being on a team of scientists means a much better shot of his armor being repaired or upgraded as needed.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

The Ultimates I see as mostly wanting the world to acknowledge them as a force to be reckoned with. And they want to be rich....rich is good. I replaced Radium and Slick from the 5th ed version with Tachyon and Anklosaur. Anklosaur is kind of the odd man out' date=' but he knows being on a team of scientists means a much better shot of his armor being repaired or upgraded as needed.[/quote']

 

In the 6th ed version of the team, from Champions Villains Vol. 2, Radium left the Ultimates to join his fellow Project Sunburst mutates as followers of the master villain Sunburst. The Ultimates replaced him with Orion, previously appearing in Villains, Vandals, And Vermin.

 

My own use of a (modified) version of the Ultimates plays up their majority complement of scientists, and makes their name more literally applicable. My version of the team see themselves as the future leaders of a scientific elite who will one day take control of the world away from politicians and dictators, guiding it according to their "enlightened" rational vision. To this end they cultivate contacts and followers throughout the global scientific community, attempt to steal new technologies, and research and design super-weapons with which to conquer or blackmail the world.

[Orion]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

Here's the short wiki note on the Ultimates in my campaign writeup. I've had Binder wanting to head into space for years and years. I think I got that idea from some canon sources, as it isn't something I'd normally come up with.

 

Criminal metahumans whose stated ambition is to rule the world. Most activities seem to be organized towards gathering equipment and money needed to rule, rather than grabbing power at this time. The leader, Binder, has a secret agenda of wanting to live on the Moon and control it as a space station or colony. The other members of the group do not know about this. All members of the group are known to the public, but it has not been revealed that they have joined forces.

[Enforcer84]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

In the 6th ed version of the team' date=' from [i']Champions Villains Vol. 2[/i], Radium left the Ultimates to join his fellow Project Sunburst mutates as followers of the master villain Sunburst. The Ultimates replaced him with Orion, previously appearing in Villains, Vandals, And Vermin.

 

My own use of a (modified) version of the Ultimates plays up their majority complement of scientists, and makes their name more literally applicable. My version of the team see themselves as the future leaders of a scientific elite who will one day take control of the world away from politicians and dictators, guiding it according to their "enlightened" rational vision. To this end they cultivate contacts and followers throughout the global scientific community, attempt to steal new technologies, and research and design super-weapons with which to conquer or blackmail the world.

 

Oh I like this, I had a similar group of villains who wanted to control science - Time Master and Beamline are the ones I remember. Now these guys are 4th ed - but Beamline would work attitude and background-wise to bolster the Ultimates a great deal.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

Oh I like this' date=' I had a similar group of villains who wanted to control science - Time Master and Beamline are the ones I remember. Now these guys are 4th ed - but Beamline would work attitude and background-wise to bolster the Ultimates a great deal.[/quote']

 

In fact I borrowed that philosophy directly from Beamline -- it's been his motivation since his 3E incarnation. But there are plenty of criminal scientists in the current official CU who might be drawn to this cause. You could build as large and formidable a team as needed to face any PC opposition.

[Erkenfresh]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

I've used the 5th edition Ultimates many times. I feel like they are just trying to survive against a cruel society that doesn't understand them. Binder, Radium, and Blackstar are pretty much just victims of bad circumstance. Thunderbolt is a bit hot-headed but wouldn't do well on his own. Slick doesn't really want to hurt anyone, he just wants to get rich.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

In their 4E incarnation in Classic Enemies, author Scott Bennie described the Ultimates as a sort of collective ego. As individuals they had all been losers, but as part of the Ultimates they're winners. The current lineup also fits that interpretation pretty well.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

FWIW my past use of the Ultimates as dedicated to rule of the world by scientists (led by them) featured the classic Champions villain Neutron as founder and leader of the team, with his flunky Arc as another member. The death of Neutron's father at the hands of the police, which led him to believe existing governments are incompetent and need to be overthrown, as well as his scientific expertise, would seem to lead naturally to such a philosophy.

 

While Neutron probably would not accept any position but team leader, I don't think this would necessarily cause conflict between him and Binder. Binder's personality description in CKC and CV2 doesn't imply that he needs to be the one in charge. OTOH in the current official Champions Universe, Neutron was a master villain active during the 1970s and 80s who has spent the last couple of decades in Stronghold. One could use that background to give the Ultimates a deep history; they could have been founded by Neutron, but after his capture Binder assumed leadership of the team.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

Here's the short wiki note on the Ultimates in my campaign writeup. I've had Binder wanting to head into space for years and years. I think I got that idea from some canon sources' date=' as it isn't something I'd normally come up with.[/quote']

 

Sounds like you might have picked that up from the 4E supplement, Enemies Assemble, featuring various villain teams, including an upgraded version of the Ultimates. That team had established a base of operations within a cloaked asteroid orbiting the Earth, reminiscent of Magneto's "Asteroid M."

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

Say, Enforcer84, I stumbled across this old post of yours and thought it might be worth a shout-out on this thread:

 

somewhere I made an alternate version of the Ultimates' date=' using their names and giving them a more mystical bent. Their leader was a summoner (Binder, get it?) it was pretty cool, maybe I still have them somewhere. If I find them I will post them to the champions board.[/quote']

[DShomshak]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

The Ultimates seem to be pretty much an all-purpose villain team. Enough of them feel aggrieved at society that you could easily send them on some revenge plot, such as trying to wreck a corporation or country or murder some set of prominent people. Or, their scientific skills make them a good choice for basic "hold the city for ransom with my giant laser" stories. (Or maybe a giant glue gun, considering Binder.) Even without superweapons, they could try to conquer a small country. But nothing prevents them from simple high-end robbery, with or without longer-term plans. Since the group includes some notably smart people, they might be a good group to use for creative and unusual high-end robbery. For instance, wealthy Chinese pay incredible prices for rosewood furniture. It's resulted in lots of illegal logging in Southeast Asia. Maybe the Ultimates hatch a scheme to hijack a truckload of rosewood trunks... or find and cut the trees first to become the world's greatest tree-rustlers. So, how do you steal a forest? (Kind of a goofy example, but I hope you get the idea.)

 

Dean Shomshak

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

One of the things CV3 describes the Ultimates' scientists as doing in their down time, is designing various high-tech gadgets to aid in their robberies, so you'd certainly be justified in coming up with some creative gimmick-based capers.

 

They're also not averse to working for other criminals, or hiring some to work with them temporarily for a particular job. They have a long list of supervillains with whom they're on good terms.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

Does anyone else miss Plasmoid? I always thought a significant part of what made the pre-5E Ultimates "ultimate" was having that monster around to blast heroes. When it wasn't trying to repair broken televisions, of course.

[wcw43921]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

Does anyone else miss Plasmoid? I always thought a significant part of what made the pre-5E Ultimates "ultimate" was having that monster around to blast heroes. When it wasn't trying to repair broken televisions' date=' of course.[/quote']

 

I like what Enemies Assemble! did with Plasmoid, what with Foxbat (!?!) inadvertently repairing it so it became a serious threat to Everything. I figure it would have been a massive "Oh, C&@%!!!" moment for the heroes.

[Zen Archer]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

Does anyone else miss Plasmoid?

 

I was surpised when I saw Plasmoid wasn't part of the team anymore, but I wouldn't say I miss it overly.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

I think Steve Long didn't want to deal with the implications of an official alien race with both the capacity and the desire to create such a thing. Most of the aliens he populated the Milky Way Galaxy with are more mundane. Although he did come up with a similar energy-being, called Plasmarax, in Champions Beyond. But apparently it's the result of a freak accident.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

One thing Binder really wants is to undo his hideous disfigurement. I could see him seeking out Fleshtone to bargain with or compel that monster to restore his original features. Heroes who have just captured Fleshtone might suddenly find themselves under attack by the Ultimates, trying to free him.

[Zen Archer]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

I think Steve Long didn't want to deal with the implications of an official alien race with both the capacity and the desire to create such a thing.

 

I could see that, though wiping the race out and having their tech lost would have been an option there.

 

I'd just figured somebody thought Plasmoid didn't fit the group concept for whatever reason.

[Dr. MID-Nite]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

I do miss Plasmoid somewhat, but I can understand why they removed him. What I can't understand is why they kept Slick...UGH! LOL

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

I do miss Plasmoid somewhat' date=' but I can understand why they removed him. What I can't understand is why they kept Slick...UGH! LOL[/quote']

 

I rather like Slick's Power set and SFX -- pretty unique and interesting IMO. But it would be easy to tweak Slick's past and personality to fit better with the rest of the Ultimates. Instead of a surfing playboy drug-dealer, make him a pharmacologist who designed drugs for organized crime. The new drug which gave him his powers could have been the result of his own experiments. His origin would be much the same, but he'd have scientific expertise to complement his teammates'.

[Sketchpad]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

When I used The Ultimates in my old campaign, I had them fill the role of a Frightful Four/Fearsome Five kind of team. Binder and Blackstar were the constant members, with other members joining and quitting on a regular basis. Membership included: Anklyosaur, Plasmoid, Wyvern, Oculon, Esper, Slick, Charger, Utility, Vibron, Mechassassin, Lazer, Bulldozer, Panda & Raccoon, Green Dragon, Howler, Pulsar, Beamline and The Dash. Most of the members were only there for a few missions on and off, as Binder would recruit them based on the job. IIRC, at the end of the game, they had attracted some major talent and were about to elevate themselves to Masters of Evil/Legion of Doom status.

[UberGeek88]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

After perusing this thread, thanks everyone, I decided that my Ultimates will be the science villains you described. I was looking into Frightful Four and the recent Hulk enemies - the Intelligencia. Unfortunately, I'm at a loss for sufficient plots. The best I can come up with is:

 

The Ultimates hijack a US nuclear submarine (my campaign is set in a combination of Baltimore, MD, Norfolk, VA, and Hudson City [although the first and that last are quite similar already]) in order to build upon it to take on and capture the Aegir, UNTIL's sub. After doing so (really just to satisfy Binder's personal dislike of UNTIL) they then plan on taking their new vessel on to the floor of the Atlantic Ocean in order to set a density-increasing Doomsday device in the water which will spread and disrupt Western maritime trading unless their ransom is paid.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Who are The Ultimates?

 

Looks like it's time to throw up some plot seeds.

 

The Ultimates discover that one of the PC heroes' powers are based on a scientific breakthrough. The Ultimates begin stalking the PC to steal his technology or force him to give up the secret.

 

An environmentalist NPC known to the heroes disappears while investigating rumors of pollution in a wilderness area. The PCs investigate the area and discover a hidden facility where scientists working for the Ultimates are building a new super-weapon.

 

The Ultimates discover or obtain the mutagen in the drug which gave Slick his powers. The next time the team appears, it's backed up by a whole squad of super-flunkies with powers similar to Slick's. But the original Slick no longer feels valued by the rest of the team, and tips off the PC heroes as to what's going on.

 

A scientist previously close to the heroes is seduced by the Ultimates' vision of world rule by a scientific elite. When the heroes crash one of the Ultimates' operations, they discover their friend is now working with the villains! The scientist also passes on any of the PCs' secrets he knows to the Ultimates.