Character Creation Question: Creates with Energy

[MuensterCheese]

As a bit of background information, I will be GM'ing a Champions campaign with 4 11-year-olds.  I don't have a GM to look to, and I have no experience with actually playing the game yet.  But I've read Champions Complete at least 4 times.

 

We were creating the last of the 4 characters Saturday night and his first ability I don't know how to create.  His inspiration is Green Lantern, whom I don't know much about.  This player wants his character to create just about anything with energy.  OK, so he wants a Summon power with Slavishly loyal since he can only summon (create) inanimate objects with this energy.  The area of effect is limited to 1 cubic meter and the range is limited to No Range, since it's always created right in front of him.  And he also needs to move his arms around to create it, so that's the gestures limitation.

 

But now where do I go?  He wants this creative energy to become ANY inanimate object, but sometimes that object looks like a Power to me.  For instance, he wants to be able to create a shield which is Barrier, non-anchored, cannot englobe, restricted shape, no range.  He wants to be able to change that shield to a sword, which is hand-to-hand attack, I suppose.  But he may opt for a warhammer, club, screwdriver, computer, waste basket, candy, sunglasses, keys, and other objects.

 

I have no idea what to do.  I told these guys we could build any character they want, and he comes to me with this.  I based my claim off the Champions advertising.  That's pretty clever, wanting a character that essentially never needs to buy so much as a pocketknife to get by in life, since he can create a temporary one.  But that just seems way over-powered and way too difficult to create.  Assuming I allow him to create such a power, how should I go about it?  Does this power generate other powers?  Do these generated powers get put in a VPP since he can't possibly use them at the same time?

 

I'm at a loss.

 

[Rebar]

You are right to be concerned. This character is about as advanced a concept as one can make in the HG system because it is so infinitely flexible. It has the potential to dramatically slow down game play, which could make it a lot less fun for him, for you and for the other players. Both you and the player will have to learn a new power mechanic every item he creates something.

 

All that is a strong reco that you try to convince him to play something simpler - or all your sakes. But it is doable.

 

That being said, the actual building of the character is simple.

 

 

Power Framework: Variable Power Pool (Cosmic) - take the 'needs no skill' roll and the 'takes no time' advantages.

 

This allows him to wield virtually any power in the book by creating an appropriate object.

Needs a sword? He creates a 3D6HKA - special effect sword

Needs a hammer? He creates a 10D6 HA - special effect hammer

etc.

 

The key steps here are:

- he decides at the moment what object he wants to create

- you ask him what effect it will have "It will bash my opponent, it will stab my opponent, it will allow me to breathe in space"

- you determine what power in the book most appropriately applies (HA, HKA, life support)

- you write up the power (quickly)

- you give him the power and simply declare that he special effect of the power is whatever he asked for (hammer, sword, O2 tank)

- the object disappears once he changes his power pool - he cannot lend that object to someone else.

 

For best results, have him come up with a dozen of his character's most favorite things, and write them up ahead of time. Ideally, this will be applicable 80% of the time ,saving you a LOT of trouble in combat.

[Soleil Noir]

If I were to offer a few bits of advice...:

 

1.) If it were me, I'd recommend against giving a new player a VPP at the outset, just because it can be kind of daunting. 

 

2.) Start with the EFFECT (i.e.; what does the power actually DO for the hero), and then work backwards to assign the appropriate game mechanics.  Have the kid brainstorm for a bit, thinking of different scenarios he might run into (e.g.; terrorists are about to launch an RPG at him, there's a civilian dangling from a window ledge of a burning building, being attacked by animated furniture) and how he'd use the power to overcome the challenge (e.g.; I make a bulletproof shield, I conjure a rope and lower it down to him, I bust out a chainsaw or a blowtorch).  From there, the game mechanics that could be applied will usually be pretty self-evident (e.g.; Resistant Protection or Levels vs. Block, Stretching, H-T-H Killing Attack).  Then I'd convert that bag of tricks into a Multipower with a series of Fixed Slots, one for each gimmick.

 

3.) Once he's got a better handle on how the game works, you might let the player re-work the Multipower into a VPP; or, if he's willing to hand off the game mechanics part to the GM, let him do the VPP and just sit down ahead of time and pre-build the different power stunts you thought up in #2, so it doesn't slow the game down.  When I do a character like that, I'll generally sit down with the rulebook and just go through the entire list of powers, one by one, asking myself, "Okay -- how could I use this particular special effect to make use of THIS power?"

 

4.) As a handy backup if you come up with something at the spur of the moment (e.g.; rather than creating a gas mask or or space suit to avoid a poison gas cloud, he wants to whip up a giant fan to push the cloud away), make sure he's bought the Power Skill, so he can try one-time power stunts (which might later be turned into a new Multipower slot, if it turns out to be useful enough).

[MuensterCheese]

Wonderful advice, from both of you.  And the thread's still open to whoever else wants to post.  That's exactly what I'll say to this new player, since I'm new.  I'll tell him it's doable, but very complicated.  And since his character is new to his abilities as well, we'll start off with a few objects he can master, and everything else takes a lot of practice to make (XP).  This will be the first and only VPP I've had to deal with, and the math looks very confusing to me, but I think I can give it a shot.

 

Since he creates objects that give him powers, I presume that every object will have the Focus limitation.  Since has 40 points left to devote to this ability, I have to do some weird reverse math to see how much protection his barrier is going to give him, how many damage classes he can actually attack with, and what his skill rolls will be when he uses devices (like a key for lockpicking).

[Rebar]

 

 

 we'll start off with a few objects he can master, and everything else takes a lot of practice to make (XP). 

 

If you can get him to agree to add new objects at a moderate rate, then you could start off with a Multipower instead. With a multipower, you add slots, and each slot costs, but it's cheaper than a VPP at first.

 

 

 

Since he creates objects that give him powers, I presume that every object will have the Focus limitation.

No they will not. The focus limitation is there to represent powers that can be taken away or disabled. Your player's powers - including the (green glowing) Tommy Gun and (green glowing) two-handed sword - appear when he needs them and disappear as soon as he's done with them. no one can take them away from him, no one can use them except him, and even if they managed to knock it out of his hand, he could just create another one. This is how the character has defined he wants his powers to work. The focus limitation does not apply here.

 

And this highlights one of the unique things about the Hero Game system. It is less important what a thing IS (a tommy gun), than what it DOES (RKA). Your player has an RKA power, whose Special Effect is that it manifests as a gun.

 

The term Special Effect means "for cinematic effect", not for mechanics. See, it's not a REAL tommy gun. For example, he doesn't really load it with bullets, and he certainly doesn't run out. To fire it, the character will be expending his OWN endurance (a 3D6 RKA is will burn what? 4End every phase, and a LOT more if it's on autofire). If you want the RKA to have bullets like a real Tommy Gun, your player must buy it with the charges limitation/advantage, which means it costs more from his pool.

 

 

Another example: in the original comic strips, IronMan's power suit never got taken away. At worst, he might take some time to change into it while a robbery was in progress - but he was never without it. Were a player in your game to want to buy a power armour suit, and did not want to be troubled with it getting stolen, he would NOT buy it with the focus limitation. He would buy it with the Only in Hero ID limitation, to represent that it takes time to get into it.

 

These would have to be with GM's permission though. If you want him to be suitless occasionally, you could force the focus lim on him. 

 

 

 

 

Back to green glowing guy for a second - if you do want the RKA or HKA to be able to be taken away and used, well, that would be bad. Your player can be turned into an object vending machine - creating and handing out bazookas to his teammates.

 

This can be done - read up on the Power limitation Independent. This is the power that lets you create Real, physical, permanent and distributable objects.But there's a catch - a big one: they're not free. Your player pays the points out of XP, and those points stay with the object. You player will literally be handing out his own XP to other people.

 

 

 

 Since has 40 points left to devote to this ability, I have to do some weird reverse math to see how much protection his barrier is going to give him, how many damage classes he can actually attack with, and what his skill rolls will be when he uses devices (like a key for lockpicking).

 

Yup. Welcome to Hero Games in general, and VPPs in particular. 

[Hyper-Man]

Here is video from Green Lantern the Animated Series: 

 

Here is a 5e pastiche of Green Lantern I made years ago using a Multipower and Elemental Control*.

*Elemental Control framework has been replaced by the Unified Power Limitation in 6e.

 

Here is much more faithful but complicated conversion for 6e.

Green Lantern

and his Power Ring

 

I would echo the statements of others and recommend a less open concept if possible. 

 

GL is essentially a very powerful 'telekinetic' where the use of the power just happens to be very visible.in most cases. Another similar character that you might be familiar with is Invisible Girl/Invisible Woman from the Fantastic Four.  Her power is described 2-fold: the ability to turn things invisible and the ability to create invisible force fields (Force Wall in all versions of HERO prior to 6e/Champions Complete, now called Barrier).

[Greywind]

She can also turn invisible things visible.

[Hyper-Man]

She can also turn invisible things visible.

yeah yeah.. details details

[MuensterCheese]

@Standard Superhero: Those are all great ideas.  I also appreciate you applying the term "special effect", but I'm still trying to wrap my head around that term.

[Rebar]

... the term "special effect", but I'm still trying to wrap my head around that term.

Yup. It's one of the biggest deviations of character creation from other systems.

 

'Fire-based powers' means nothing in HG until you define each and every power for your particular character. You get nothing for free with that label.

And no two characters with the same SFX will be the same either. This goes all the way down to knives and guns. How I buy a knife might be completely different from how you buy the "very same" knife. So the mechanic is the law for how it operates; my knives are throwable and never get taken away from me; yours are usable as clubs and help you with lockpicking.

[Hyper-Man]

@Standard Superhero:...

 

Don't make us start referring to you as Newbie now

[Greywind]

What's that Quixotic Hero #4046?

[Chris Goodwin]

This can be done - read up on the Power limitation Independent. This is the power that lets you create Real, physical, permanent and distributable objects.But there's a catch - a big one: they're not free. Your player pays the points out of XP, and those points stay with the object. You player will literally be handing out his own XP to other people.

 

 

Independent is not in Champions Complete, and was generally removed from 6th edition.

[steriaca]

There is a reason Independent (a -1 limitation, if I remember corectly) was removed from Champions for 6ed. One: It was ment for Fanticy Hero games originaly, to simulate magical 'loot'. Two: It never made sence in any other setting. Three: It was rarely taken by players anyways.

 

Not that you can't add that limitation to your game...it is your game, after all.

[Rebar]

There is a reason Independent (a -1 limitation, if I remember corectly) was removed from Champions for 6ed. 

It was -2.

 

And yeah, I strongly recommend against it, as it can VERY easily unbalance a game.

[steriaca]

Yes it can. One: Your player must rebuild the darn thing with experence points each time it is taken away. Two: When taken away, the hero/player will never see the thing again...in his hands anyways. Three: The GM must at all times track where the object is and where it is. Four: The GM must take the object away. The player was asking for it when he used the limitation in the first place.

[Greywind]

They don't "have to". They could always track down the one they already had.

[MuensterCheese]

What follows are the Powers, Adders, Advantages, and Limitations for this 6e Creative Energy Power Framework, where 'AP' equals Active Points and 'RP' equals Real Points:

 

Prepare to Energize - SUMMON (8 CP for 37 CP object (the Multipower below); +1 slavishly devoted; = 16 AP; -1/2 for two-handed gesture; -1/2 for Extra Time (full phase); = 8 RP)

 

Creative Energy - MULTIPOWER (40 CP reserve; -1/2 No Range as some Range powers are restricted to being created right in front of him; -1/4 this is a greater power Linked to a lesser power (SUMMON); = 23 RP. Note that this Power and the Linked Power cannot be used in the same phase per the instructions since the lesser power takes a full phase to activate.  The desired Power from the SUMMON activates at the beginning of the next Phase as a 1/2 Phase action)

 

Energy Shield - BARRIER (Fixed slot; 3 CP; +27 CP for 27 BODY; +10 CP for Non-anchored; = 40 AP; (do I apply No Range limitation again?); 40/10 = 4 slot points)

 

Energy Club - HAND ATTACK (Fixed slot; 25 CP for 5d6 vs. PD; +1/2 Affects Desolidified = 37 AP; -1/4 HTH Limitation; = 30 RP; 30/10 = 3 slot points)

 

Energy Net - ENTANGLE (Fixed slot; 30 CP for 3d6 BODY/3 PD/3 ED; +1/4 Both take damage; = 37 AP; (do I apply No Range limitation again?); 37/10 = 3 slot points)

 

Energy Disbursement - DESOLIDIFICATION (Fixed slot; 40 AP; -1/2 Cannot pass through solid objects; = 27 RP; 27/10 = 3 slot points)

 

Energy Skeleton Key - Lock Picking Skill (Fixed slot; 3 CP + 5 to roll; = 13 AP; 13/10 = 1 slot point) (Note: doesn't work against locks that require no physical key, such as computer passwords, combination locks, retina scanners, etc.)

 

Slot cost total: 14 CP

Multipower cost total: 23+14=37 CP

Summon + Multipower = 37+8=45 CP

 

Here are my questions:

1. There are two Advantages applied to two different slots totaling 3/4.  Should the AC of the Multipower actually be 70, and the RC be 40?  Or none of the above?
2. Did I cost the Summon power correctly?
3. Did I do the Skeleton Key/Lockpicking ability as a Power correctly?
4. What Limitation would you recommend for having to perform the SUMMON one whole phase before the MULTIPOWER?

You guys are the best support group a Hero newbie like me could have, honestly.  Your feedback and thread posts have been very helpful.

[drunkonduty]

If I'm reading this right then I don't think you need the Summon power at all. The Multipower does what it does without any need for summoning the constructs first.

 

For example: to use the Energy Club the character simply wills an energy club into being as s/he swings their arm. Activating the power is part of making the attack action.

 

As to your questions:

1. Um, I'm not sure. It looks like maths to me. I never do maths without Hero Designer handy (and I'm at work at the moment.)

2. Like I said, I don't think you need the summon at all. If I've misunderstood your post then, sorry, but maths.

3. Your skeleton key looks good to me.

4. Linked + Extra Time. Maybe.

 

cheers. :-)