How would you build...

[Christopher R Taylor]

Doesn't "beam" cover "cannot be bounced" already?

[bigdamnhero]

I had to look it up because I was curious. Per 6e1 p145:

 

Characters often buy Beam attacks with the Limitations Cannot Be Bounced and No Knockback, but they're not required.

[Wardsman]

Doesn't "beam" cover "cannot be bounced" already?

Beam used mean you could not spread the energy blast. Don't know about 6th.

[eepjr24]

Beam used mean you could not spread the energy blast. Don't know about 6th.

That, plus it must always be used at full power and it has reduced effects when trying to make big holes in things, like doors or walls.

 

- E

[bigdamnhero]

Beam used mean you could not spread the energy blast. Don't know about 6th.

The text I quoted is the same in 5ER. I can't find Beam at all in 4ed.

[Wardsman]

The text I quoted is the same in 5ER. I can't find Beam at all in 4ed.

I thought beam popped in third. Maybe in a supplement.

I seem to recall reading it first in an old weapons  supplement. And I don't think it had the can't be bounce on it . But I could be wrong.

[akrippler]

Cool, thanks for the feedback guys.  Im looking for inspiration so you guys should post abilities or spells for fantasy characters.  Heres some more of mine. 

 

10   Martial Trance   6 HTH CSL's (30)         (-1 1 Charge, Continuous 1 Min) (-1/2 Cost END to Maintain) (-1/2 Restrainable)

 

 

----------------

 

5   Protection From Evil (19)   5 PDr/EDr (15) (+1/4 Half END) (-1/4 Visible) (-1/4 Incantations)        

(-1/4 Fails in AMF) (-1/4 1H Gesutre) (-1/4 Only Against Evil)

 

[rravenwood]

I thought beam popped in third. Maybe in a supplement.

I seem to recall reading it first in an old weapons  supplement. And I don't think it had the can't be bounce on it . But I could be wrong.

"Beam" is in the 1986 supplement Gadgets!, which may be its first appearance (I'm fairly sure it wasn't in any Hero Games product prior to 1985, but I won't absolutely swear to it...).  It's also mentioned in 4th edition, although it's just one of the listed examples for Limited Power.

[Wardsman]

"Beam" is in the 1986 supplement Gadgets!, which may be its first appearance (I'm fairly sure it wasn't in any Hero Games product prior to 1985, but I won't absolutely swear to it...).  It's also mentioned in 4th edition, although it's just one of the listed examples for Limited Power.

I just looked at in 5th it is a1/4 must use at full power and cannot spread attack. Nothing about it cannot bounce.

Yep Gadgets had all kinds cool stuff I think that was the first use of NND and AALD.

[bigdamnhero]

It's also mentioned in 4th edition, although it's just one of the listed examples for Limited Power.

Ah, that's why I couldn't find it!

[rravenwood]

Ah, that's why I couldn't find it!

"Beam, where were you?"

"Being sneaky."

 

(Paraphrasing only...)

[Cantriped]

In reply to the original post. 30 APs for 1st level spells, and (imo) +15 APs per level thereafter is a good place to start when breaking down spells into tiers. It's what I typically use.

In an attempt to provide another example for you before I go off on a tangent, while also keeping it within the AP limit: I present the following very shady, but legal in CC/FHC, power construct.

 

Sanctuary as a 1st-level Clerical Spell   Change Environment: Requires an EGO roll at -1 to attack a single designated target within range, Long Lasting (1 Minute) (7 base Active Points)

Area of Effect (1m Radius; +1/4), Megascale (Whole Planet, 1m = 10,000km; +2) (23 Active Points); Limited Range (10m; -0), Instant (-1/4), Conditional Power (Effect ends if the designated target performs a hostile action; -1), Gestures (-1/4), Incantations (-1/4), IAF Expendable ("Small Silver Mirror" Fragile, Difficult to Obtain; -1).

Total Cost: 6 points

 

Explanation: The rules for Change Environment in CC/FHC allow it to require an affected character to make a roll at the listed penalty. Nowhere in the power is it defined what the penalty for failure is, leaving it up to the GM to decide what is fair based upon the type of roll being made. Since EGO rolls are used to resist temptations, an EGO roll to attack the cleric/spellcaster seems reasonable, as it is very tempting to kill the healer/glass cannon first if possible.

The base active point value of the power would be 3 APs before Adders, and the standard range would be 15m. Limited Range makes this spell's range equal to that of 5e Sanctuary. However, since this modifier normally requires you reduce the range by at least 1/2, and we are only reducing it by 1/3, it's value in this case is -0.

The Long Lasting adder makes the duration equal to that of 5e Sanctuary, and since you cannot maintain it via concentration it also takes the Instant modifier so that the power is no longer Constant.

Area of Effect and Megascale as purchased allows the spell to affect the attacker regardless of distance (or as close to it as HERO system can get), as per 5e Sanctuary.

 

This version of the spell is written with the common limitations described in the 5e version of the spell. Gestures and Incantations obviously represent the somatic and verbal components, and the foci is built as an IAF because having a small mirror doesn't obviously provide the benefits indicated by the spell. Mirrors are fairly easy to break, ergo why it is Fragile. Moreover you have to purchase them from a craftsman, you can't just go collect them in a cave like you can with bat guano, ergo why it is Difficult to Obtain.

 

Normally a spell like this would be harder to resist (have a higher EGO roll penalty) if you have a higher primary spellcasting stat, but I simply couldn't think of a good way to work that into the power construct. However CSLs could be used to improve it (as per adding damage) at the rate of plus -1 to EGO Rolls per 9.75 APs (or 4 CLS used to increase Damage/Effect), so characters that would normally have high "Primary Spellcasting Stats" should be encouraged to instead purchase an appropriate number of such CSLs.

 

*Steps up to Soapbox*

You will find that some spells simply cannot be accurately converted into HERO while staying within an Active Point limit. This is because Active points versus Real points are not concepts which apply to how spells are tiered in DnD's spellcasting system. Instead spells are tiered largely depending upon when the designers wanted certain types of characters to gain access to certain spells, and how often they think casters should be able to use them, and not at all based upon how powerful those spells actually are.

This is why Animate Dead might be a 3rd level Cleric spell, and a 4th level Wizard spell, even though the mechanics of the spell don't change. Or why standard Invisibility is usually a 2nd level spell, even though it can be built on the same APs as many far less useful 1st level spells. This is also why certain low-level spells (like Protection from Evil) make you completely immune to powers used by certain high level creatures (like a Succubus).

Moreover, the scaling nature of many spell's effects, and the existence of metamagic feats in certain editions complicate the matter further. For example, a 1st level wizard's Magic Missile isn't nearly as useful as one cast by a 9th level wizard. For another example, one Metamagic feat might improve damage scaling, another might remove a common limitation (like gestures or incantations), or add a small advantage (like transdimensional), and another doesn't really change anything about the spell at all beyond it's special effect. Yet all of these feats will have the same opportunity cost of one feat and increasing an affected spell's level by one tier.

*Steps down from Soapbox*

 

I've been thinking on this for a while, so I hope it was helpful.