How would you build...

[Wardsman]

 

Going through the 5e D&D spells and hit one that is an interesting problem in Hero. I can think of some ways to build it, but they would be quite expensive and I am keeping 1st level spells to 30 active points or less. Would love to hear ideas if anyone has them.

 

 

 

Why not mental illusion non threatening/friend/ally?

[eepjr24]

Why not mental illusion non threatening/friend/ally?

6d6 would get you 21 Ego on average, just enough to make major changes to the setting. But that's without throwing in the AOE needed to make it affect a large enough area. If I was going to go that route I would probably use images instead, versus sight and sounds maybe, area of effect hex, -3 or 4 to PER checks is probably about what you could get.

 

EDIT: Corrected, thanks Marcus.

 

- E

[L. Marcus]

6d6 averages at 21, not 18.

[Nolgroth]

Sanctuary:  (Total: 19 Active Cost, 5 Real Cost) Concealment 16-, Subject to Perception vs. Concealment rolls (+0) (19 Active Points); OAF: Holy Symbol (-1), Spell ends if subject of spell attacks a target (-1), Gestures (-1/4), Incantations (-1/4) (Real Cost: 5) 

 

Note: You will have to add whatever Power Modifiers best fit your duration requirements. Probably Time Limit to simulate the D&D duration.

 

 

Goodberry:  (Total: 3 Active Cost, 2 Real Cost) Healing BODY 1 point (3 Active Points); 10 Charges (-1/4)

 

Note: Flavor to taste (pun most definitely intended) with Power Mods to construct the spell. I don't have the D&D books easily accessible to me, but something along those lines should work. Also, if the GM insists on Simplified Healing, then it will be a base of 5 Active Cost with Standard Effect to get 1 Body out of it. Either way, a pretty inexpensive spell. As it should be.

[eepjr24]

Sanctuary:  (Total: 19 Active Cost, 5 Real Cost) Concealment 16-, Subject to Perception vs. Concealment rolls (+0) (19 Active Points); OAF: Holy Symbol (-1), Spell ends if subject of spell attacks a target (-1), Gestures (-1/4), Incantations (-1/4) (Real Cost: 5) 

 

Note: You will have to add whatever Power Modifiers best fit your duration requirements. Probably Time Limit to simulate the D&D duration.

Needs UBO. And I am not sure what other GM's use when granting skills to others, but I use the same limitations as if it was in a focus, so it starts at a 9- roll. Other than that, though, I like your construct, I am going to look at modifying it a skosh to base the "Perception" roll on Ego instead, to fit the spell concept. Something like:

 

Sanctuary: Concealment 15-, Subject to Perception vs. Concealment rolls (+0), Uses EGO for Perception base roll (+1/4), UBO (+1/4) (29 Active Points) OIF: Holy Symbol (-1/2), Ends if target attacks or casts a spell (-1), Gestures (-1/4), Incantations (-1/4), Time Limit: 1 Minute (-2), Limited Range: 10m (-1/4) 5 Real Points

 

Goodberry:  (Total: 3 Active Cost, 2 Real Cost) Healing BODY 1 point (3 Active Points); 10 Charges (-1/4)

 

Note: Flavor to taste (pun most definitely intended) with Power Mods to construct the spell. I don't have the D&D books easily accessible to me, but something along those lines should work. Also, if the GM insists on Simplified Healing, then it will be a base of 5 Active Cost with Standard Effect to get 1 Body out of it. Either way, a pretty inexpensive spell. As it should be.

Except that allows the caster to cast a spell 10 times, not give out berries that can be used out of his sight / range. Had a good bit of discussion on this one and I am still not happy with the constructs I have seen. But I can admittedly be rather picky about things.

 

- E

[Nolgroth]

Needs UBO. And I am not sure what other GM's use when granting skills to others, but I use the same limitations as if it was in a focus, so it starts at a 9- roll. Other than that, though, I like your construct, I am going to look at modifying it a skosh to base the "Perception" roll on Ego instead, to fit the spell concept. Something like:

 

Sanctuary: Concealment 15-, Subject to Perception vs. Concealment rolls (+0), Uses EGO for Perception base roll (+1/4), UBO (+1/4) (29 Active Points) OIF: Holy Symbol (-1/2), Ends if target attacks or casts a spell (-1), Gestures (-1/4), Incantations (-1/4), Time Limit: 1 Minute (-2), Limited Range: 10m (-1/4) 5 Real Points

 

Yeah. I was just posting that as an option in lieu of Invisibility, which is too powerful for a simple spell like Sanctuary. Flavor to taste.

 

 

 

Except that allows the caster to cast a spell 10 times, not give out berries that can be used out of his sight / range. Had a good bit of discussion on this one and I am still not happy with the constructs I have seen. But I can admittedly be rather picky about things.

 

So add Clips to it. 1 clip of 10 charges. You can make things as hard as you like. Or you can find an approximation that you, your GM, and group are comfortable with. Goodberry is a simple little spell and trying to complicate it is sort of counter-intuitive. 

[Richgee]

Just a thought dnd healing spells heal hit points, hero ones heal body. Healing 10 hit points is trivial in dnd, but a 10 body heal is major in hero. When looking to convert healing spells you need to look at the comparative impact of the spell. If as I do you consider a standard 75 base point hero to be roughly on par with a level 10 dnd character, then with good berry in hero you are looking at a spell that would heal roughly 50-70 percent of their total "hit points". In dnd to get the same effect you would need to generate 30-40 points of healing for the same effect.

 

When trying to model dnd healing spells against body for balance I always as a rule of thumb reduce the effects by about a factor of 3 with some vaiance. So in this case good berry would heal 1 body with only 3 charges if I was modeling it.

[eepjr24]

Just a thought dnd healing spells heal hit points, hero ones heal body. Healing 10 hit points is trivial in dnd, but a 10 body heal is major in hero. When looking to convert healing spells you need to look at the comparative impact of the spell. If as I do you consider a standard 75 base point hero to be roughly on par with a level 10 dnd character, then with good berry in hero you are looking at a spell that would heal roughly 50-70 percent of their total "hit points". In dnd to get the same effect you would need to generate 30-40 points of healing for the same effect.

 

When trying to model dnd healing spells against body for balance I always as a rule of thumb reduce the effects by about a factor of 3 with some vaiance. So in this case good berry would heal 1 body with only 3 charges if I was modeling it.

I am guessing you have not played D&D 5e, where sleeping overnight restores all your HP?

 

- E

[Wardsman]

I am guessing you have not played D&D 5e, where sleeping overnight restores all your HP?

 

- E

No wonder it gets compared to a video game.

 

I just divided hit points by level. Possible adding a full hit point level before division to hero body. 

[Richgee]

No I've not seen 5e dnd, and with that kind of approach to damage I'm quite glad to have avoided it. It always was hack and slash, but rules like that reduce it to the rpg equivalent of a video game where you miraculously heal after every boss fight. That really highlights the difference between body and hit points.

[Hyper-Man]

Another option is extra dice of Presence Attack (5pts per D6) on a trigger. I think something like this can fit within 30ap. It wont work on the strong willed, but then again I am assuming the 1st level D&D equivelent isnt meant to either.

 

 

Yep, PRE would probably be doable. I think I went with Invisibility on the build, it seemed most effective.

 

- E

 

15 Sanctuary: Aid  PRE 5d6 (30 Active Points); Limited Power Only to project "Don't Attack Me!" (-1) - END=3

 

It's basically a bonus to a Presence Attack of "I Surrender". This actually matches the original spell pretty well.

1. The character using it would negate the 'surrender' if they attack someone while this is in effect.

2. Presence Attacks can optionally be defended by EGO (the closest analogy for WIS in HERO) instead of PRE.

3. The fade rate of -5 points per Turn actually lasts pretty long compared to the original's "1 round per level of caster".

 

HM

[BoloOfEarth]

Hope nobody minds me posting another "how do you build this" in this thread - it seems like the OP's question has been covered several different ways.

 

Maybe it's out there and I'm just not finding it, but is there any existing way to replicate the "Shield Other" spell from D&D?  Basically, having one person willingly take some of the damage taken by a teammate.

 

And on a related (but flip-flopped) note, how about a spell for the evil Big Bad to force some of the damage he's taking onto one of his minions?

[Richgee]

you could buy it as a straight healing, ranged +1/2, time delay when recipient takes body +1/4 side effect 1d6 nnd rkd -1/2. Then add in your usual spell stuff.

[eepjr24]

Hope nobody minds me posting another "how do you build this" in this thread - it seems like the OP's question has been covered several different ways.

 

Maybe it's out there and I'm just not finding it, but is there any existing way to replicate the "Shield Other" spell from D&D?  Basically, having one person willingly take some of the damage taken by a teammate.

 

And on a related (but flip-flopped) note, how about a spell for the evil Big Bad to force some of the damage he's taking onto one of his minions?

Building it is easy:

 

50% Resistant Damage Reduction, PD and ED, UBO (+1/4) (75 Active Points) Side Effect: Caster takes any damage negated by the power on others (-2), Gestures (-1/4), Incantations (-1/4), IIF: Platinum rings on caster and target (-1/4), Limited Range: Must stay within 50m of caster (-1/4) 19 Real Points

 

Building it on the normal cost basis for a 2nd level spell is harder.

 

- E

[eepjr24]

you could buy it as a straight healing, ranged +1/2, time delay when recipient takes body +1/4 side effect 1d6 nnd rkd -1/2. Then add in your usual spell stuff.

Trigger would not handle it, it only resets per phase. Multiple hits in a phase would get more damage through. 

 

- E

[BoloOfEarth]

Building it is easy:

 

50% Resistant Damage Reduction, PD and ED, UBO (+1/4) (75 Active Points) Side Effect: Caster takes any damage negated by the power on others (-2), Gestures (-1/4), Incantations (-1/4), IIF: Platinum rings on caster and target (-1/4), Limited Range: Must stay within 50m of caster (-1/4) 19 Real Points

 

Building it on the normal cost basis for a 2nd level spell is harder.

 

- E

 

Pretty much how I imagined it would be.  Just wasn't sure if there was an "official" version.

 

And on a related (but flip-flopped) note, how about a spell for the evil Big Bad to force some of the damage he's taking onto one of his minions?

 

Maybe can do this the same way, but with an automatic Side Effect (-0) that affects the nearby environment (read:  closest minion within 50 meters) and not himself? 

[eepjr24]

Pretty much how I imagined it would be.  Just wasn't sure if there was an "official" version.

 

 

Maybe can do this the same way, but with an automatic Side Effect (-0) that affects the nearby environment (read:  closest minion within 50 meters) and not himself? 

Nothing in RAW about affecting just one minion like that. But I would allow something like that, maybe as a AVAD against all allies within 10 hexes or something like that. Divide it up evenly, perhaps? Probably only worth 1/2 as much a limitation.

 

- E

[bigdamnhero]

What about:

 

Sanctuary:  Change Environment (-5 to Sight Group PER Rolls, -5 to Normal Hearing PER Rolls) (25 Active Points); 4 Continuing Charges lasting 1 Turn each (-1/2), Limited Power Only when being targeted (-1/2) [12 RP]

 

I've also used Mind Control with Trigger (when targeted) for this, but resetting the trigger becomes an issue and even with only a +1/4 Trigger you're still only going to get 5d6 at most.

[bigdamnhero]

Maybe it's out there and I'm just not finding it, but is there any existing way to replicate the "Shield Other" spell from D&D?  Basically, having one person willingly take some of the damage taken by a teammate.

 

And on a related (but flip-flopped) note, how about a spell for the evil Big Bad to force some of the damage he's taking onto one of his minions?

The former I usually see as a Side Effect on rDef. The latter is Reflection.

[BoloOfEarth]

The problems I have with using Reflection are:

1. It would stop all damage, whereas I'm basically looking at a "Shield Other" type effect where he shunts some (but not all) of the damage to a minion
2. To to that with Reflection, you'd need Any Target.  And if you're doing that, why not just redirect the damage at an enemy instead?  The Big Bad would have to overdose on "idiot pills" to hit his own people if the option is there to hit the enemy instead.

[bigdamnhero]

Valid points. You'd have to put a big "Only To Redirect To Own Side" Limitation on it, which makes no sense except as a way to model a certain effect.

 

Maybe something more like rDef with a Side Effect, but the Side Effect affects his Followers rather than himself? Having a Side Effect that affects a different character is a Big Ol' Flashing Stop Sign IMO, but it might be appropriate in this case. (Especially if its an NPC build.)

[Richgee]

How about 50% resistant damage reduction 30 points. Usual magic spell penalties, plus side effect closest ally takes 50% of total damage as nnd kd -3/4, requires a blood oath of loyalty to have been freely given by person who takes the side effect damage -1/2.

 

This would significantly reduce the cost of the spell plus act as a point for pause before you give your loyalty oath to anyone.

[IndianaJoe3]

Maybe it's out there and I'm just not finding it, but is there any existing way to replicate the "Shield Other" spell from D&D?  Basically, having one person willingly take some of the damage taken by a teammate.

 

How about Barrier with the Feedback Limitation?

 

Interposition:  Barrier, 0 BODY (up to 1m long, 1m tall, and 1/2m thick), Trigger (Activating the Trigger is an Action that takes no time, Trigger resets automatically, immediately after it activates; +1) (6 Active Points); Time Limit (Extra Phase, Instant; -3), Feedback (-1), Cannot Englobe (-1/4), Restricted Shape (-1/4)

[akrippler]

Hey this topic is really cool I wanna talk more about this kind of stuff (building fantasy setting powers) but I don't think I should create a whole new topic.

So I'd love to see more people throw out ideas on powers and if your feeling outgoing critique some of my powers.

 

So this one, I built a arcane knight type character and in the setting real wizards and sorceresses are extremely powerful.  So I was going for something to quickly incapacitate unarmored dangerous foes.   The idea is I carry two small baseball sized iron spheres and if things get sketchy and the guy doesn't have a worthy helmet on, I can chuck it at their head for hopefully enough stun damage to actually "stun" them. 

 

5   Iron Sphere Throw (22.5)   HA 2d6 (10) (+1/2 Str Based Range) (+1 NND Headgear)         (-1 2 Charges Recoverable) (-1 OAF) (-1/4 Beam) (-1/4 Cannot be Bounced)         (-1/4 No Knockback) (-1/4 8 Str Minimum) (-1/4 Cost END)

 

Did I do this right? So the HA is 2d6, I can get another 2d6 from my Strength right?  I'm wondering also if I did the endurance cost correctly.  I think it should work like a regular weapon right? Only pay endurance for the strength used not for the power plus the strength? 

 

I noticed this thread was rezzed but if I don't end up just talking to a wall Ill post more. 

[Doc Democracy]

I like the idea. I am wondering how often you will be able to use it as headgear must be quite common, possibly I would live with metal head protection, allows you to get those using leather etc.

 

Other than that, I think it is a nice supplementary ability