Advice regarding a power build?

[Ragdoll]

Hi. I need some advice regarding a power build. Would the following power build be acceptable in a campaign, or is it too abusive?

 

The idea was to mimic superman's ability to soak up damage, but still be able to to be knocked into sleepy land, given enough effort. Still, this build seems to make a character 'extremely' difficult to bring down. It's essentially made for a brick template. A sort of absorbtion/pseudo telekenetically enhanced strength template.

 

The character is a music lover with a good amount of non combat skills. I had points left over, so I put the extra ones into improving her non combat skills, and 'adding' some combat skills like a combat skill level or two.

 

Here's the power build:

 

20 Elemental Control: Psychokinetic/Energy Absorbtion Field

a-13 Absorbtion 8D vs PD; Half points to Stun, Half to END, Linked to Armour (-1/2).

b-13 Absorbtion 8D vs. ED; Half to stun, half to END, linked to Armour (-1/2).

c-78 Armour: 46 PD/46 ED; Only protects up to amount rolled on Absorbtion (-1/2)

d-13 Damage Reduction 75% PD Non resistant; Stun only (-1/2).

e-13 Damage Reduction 75% ED Non resistant; Stun only (-1/2).

 

Her strength is about 50, with the no effects figured characteristics. Her PD and ED are both 2, so her theoretical maximum protection is 48 PD/ED and 46 rPD/rED

 

The non resistant damage reduction and stun only, represents the superman like ability to shrug off 'most' things, unless either a 'real' concentrated effort is made, or someone brings a very powerful weapon, and hits superman with it..usually..he's knocked out maybe damaged some...but not killed outright..not unless a concentrated effort is made.

 

So, is this build 'too' powerful? Is their anything the community might suggest be added or removed?

 

Any comments are appreciated.

[BNakagawa]

Good luck getting that approved.

 

Assuming you're getting hit with 60AP attacks, let's just throw a vanilla 12d6 EB at it.

 

Well, you absorb 28 points on the average, your defenses are 30 total, you take 12 stun, which is reduced to 3. Your absorbtion then returns up to 14 Stun and 28 end.

 

So you're going to build a character that doesn't get damaged by an average roll on a 24d6 attack? That's a pushed Grond Haymaker and you didn't take a single stun pip?

 

I don't think so.

 

$0.02

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

Some other issues:

 

1. All the powers in the EC must cost end. Thus the Damaged Reduction & Armor can't go in.

 

2. Linked to Armor is not a disadvantage since the Armor is always on. Only if the Armor costs end or had some other disadvantage would the linked work.

 

The general idea isn't bad but this is 'too powerful' for most games IMO. BNakagawa hit the nail on the head. Being able to shurg off 24d6 attacks is more than a bit too much.

 

Just look at the active points of defenses on this build. You have over 218 active points between the damage resistance and the armor.

[farik]

I personally don't like it because it doesn't seem like an "Elemental Control" to me I mean mechanics aside I don't like the fact that it's just a huge stack of defenses not really a framework of powers simulating some kind of thematic power.

[Ragdoll]

Originally posted by BNakagawa

Good luck getting that approved.

 

Assuming you're getting hit with 60AP attacks, let's just throw a vanilla 12d6 EB at it.

 

Well, you absorb 28 points on the average, your defenses are 30 total, you take 12 stun, which is reduced to 3. Your absorbtion then returns up to 14 Stun and 28 end.

 

So you're going to build a character that doesn't get damaged by an average roll on a 24d6 attack? That's a pushed Grond Haymaker and you didn't take a single stun pip?

 

I don't think so.

 

$0.02

 

Oookie. That reasoning is a bit scary, I didn't 'quite' realize how powerful I'd made it, but I had a nagging suspicion. Thank you for that insight and example.

 

Originally posted by Vanderbilt_Grad

Some other issues:

 

1. All the powers in the EC must cost end. Thus the Damaged Reduction & Armor can't go in.

 

2. Linked to Armor is not a disadvantage since the Armor is always on. Only if the Armor costs end or had some other disadvantage would the linked work.

 

The general idea isn't bad but this is 'too powerful' for most games IMO. BNakagawa hit the nail on the head. Being able to shurg off 24d6 attacks is more than a bit too much.

 

Just look at the active points of defenses on this build. You have over 218 active points between the damage resistance and the armor.

 

Yes, I can see how terribly powerful that is, now.

I suppose I could move the Armour and Damage Reduction outside the Elemental Control.

 

I'm curious about your linked to armour comment? You said it doesn't apply because the armour is always on? I was to understand that linked could apply to a power that was always on? Did I make a mistake there?

 

Thank you all for your input. I still like the concept, but I'm trerrible at looking at the 'big' picture, as in, how much damage it could soak up and what would be abusive. Would the community suggest some revisions to this build to make it still a very tough character to batter down, but not so much, that she's shrugging off pushed haymakers from Grond, and later adopting him as a cute pet?

 

For instance, should I reduce the level of absorbtion, and hence the armour maximum? Should I reduce the damage reduction to 50% or 25% rather than 75%?

 

Any help is greatly appreciated, thanks.

 

Ragdoll.

[levi]

There was a character named Charger in Classic Enemies who had a 20/50 ED. This was explained as his having a 50 ED unless an attack exceeded this defense, then it dropped to 20. In a 10D6 world, this meant that most caracters had to push to exceed his defense, thus overloading him and almost guarenteeing (sp?) a KO.

 

I have the feeling this is similar to what you want. A character that can shrug off most attacks, but is at least stunned by a very powerful or pushed attack.

 

In a 12D6 standard world, I would suggest you buy Armor (20/20) normally and buy Armor (+20/20) with the Limitation: Only v. Attacks that don't exceed total Defense of 40 (-1/4 maybe 1/2 with Generous GM).

 

Example vanilla 12D6 attack = 36 STUN & no damage, good roll = 48 STUN & 28 STUN damage.

 

Hope that helps

[Supreme]

To simulate the post-Crisis/Bruce Timm Animated Superman I'd do:

• 50% Damage Reduction, physical and energy (not vs. magic)
  
• 30 PD and ED resistant and hardened
  
• Wicked high CON (30+)
  

Any more is overkill and probably not allowable by your GM depending on the power level of the game. Actually, my list above is more in line with the Bruce Timm Superman as the current Superman is still able to shrug off nuclear explosions.

[The Souljourner]

Yeah, I guess I don't see why Damage Reduction, some decent armor, and a reasonably high CON doesn't fit the bill. You don't need all this absorption and linked stuff. Straight out abilities will do you just fine.

 

Absorption is a very powerful ability, and one that should be carefully scrutinized. You'd have to prove to me that your character actually *benefits* from getting hit by the attack you absorb, and that's definitely not the case with Superman.

 

If he were made of pure fire, I'd say absorbing fire damage would be fine. To absorb from all physical damage.... I don't know, I can't even think of a special effect that would apply to. Maybe a high tech shield that took the kinetic force and turned it into energy powering itself.... Any way, it's not the kind of thing you should just throw around willy nilly.

 

Supreme's example is a great one for a guy that is just a big pain in the butt to take down. He takes punishment like there's no tomorrow, but your average 12d6 EB will still get through his defenses.

 

-Nate

[Ragdoll]

Originally posted by The Souljourner

Yeah, I guess I don't see why Damage Reduction, some decent armor, and a reasonably high CON doesn't fit the bill. You don't need all this absorption and linked stuff. Straight out abilities will do you just fine.

 

Absorption is a very powerful ability, and one that should be carefully scrutinized. You'd have to prove to me that your character actually *benefits* from getting hit by the attack you absorb, and that's definitely not the case with Superman.

 

If he were made of pure fire, I'd say absorbing fire damage would be fine. To absorb from all physical damage.... I don't know, I can't even think of a special effect that would apply to. Maybe a high tech shield that took the kinetic force and turned it into energy powering itself.... Any way, it's not the kind of thing you should just throw around willy nilly.

 

Supreme's example is a great one for a guy that is just a big pain in the butt to take down. He takes punishment like there's no tomorrow, but your average 12d6 EB will still get through his defenses.

 

-Nate

 

Well, I certainly agree with you, but I never said that it wouldn't fit the bill. In general, though I was interested in making a more unique brick-type than by just using the old armour/damage reduction/high con method.

 

I was looking for something in the power build that kind of divested from the norm, but still kept the special effect of them being reasonably pure. ie: it takes a lot of damage to put her down.

 

I wasn't focused so much on the absorbtion. It does what it does, true, but I was percieving it as an energy aura that surrounded her body that would simply absorb the damage, coupled with her psychokinetic/electrokinetic ability to shield herself from the damage when it slammed into her and was absorbed via the field. In a way, both the absorbtion and armour are just two uses from 'one' power. Her strength is linked to this field as well, being an extention of the field's psychokinetic abilities, which is why I bought the strength as doesn't effect physical characteristics.

 

The damage reduction is another aspect of the armour effect..it not only protects, but cushions to a certain extent, not just blocking the energy as if it were hitting a wall, but letting the energy roll over the field, and stretch across it, sort of creating a cushioning effect.

 

Really all of these individual powers are simply aspects of the field that surrounds her body. While I wanted someone with the ability to take damage like superman but not be knocked out unless a concentrated effort was made, I thought the absorbtion was a rather 'neat' idea to simulate it in a unique fashion. I just wasn't sure about the possible ramifications of absorbtion/damage reduction and armour together at such high levels.

 

I do appreciate all of your input, I've found it to be extremely helpful.

 

Thanks again.

 

Ragdoll.

[Fedifensor]

Originally posted by Supreme

To simulate the post-Crisis/Bruce Timm Animated Superman I'd do:

• 50% Damage Reduction, physical and energy (not vs. magic)
  
• 30 PD and ED resistant and hardened
  
• Wicked high CON (30+)
  

Actually, the BT Superman gets stunned every so often by attacks. I think he'd do fine with a 25 to 30 CON. He should have a good amount of STUN, though...and you're missing one important thing. Superman takes a huge beating in lots of the JL episodes, but comes back to triumph. A 30 REC would go a long way towards explaining this.

[Argus]

Try this

 

I'm not going to do all the math, my book is not handy) but give this a try

 

15 Pd/Ed Force Field. (30 pts)

 

6d6 Absorption PD 1/2 Stun 1/2 Str (30 points) Linked to FF

6d6 Absorption ED 1/2 Stun 1/2 Str (30 Points) Linked to FF

20 PD Armor (30 points) Linked to FF, based on Absorption Roll

20 ED Armor (30 Points) Linked to FF, Based on Absorption Roll

Add your Damage Reduction and your set.

[pinecone]

I just glanced so I may be repeating...Absorb is a perfectly fine way to build a "playable invulnrability" Damage reduction does a good job also...But I personally would balk at Both on the same character, it's just too much...it causes problems the other characters....Probibly you can do just fine with Absorb 8D6 PD> Stun and Body (+1/2) for 60 points (the same cost as 3/4 DR) and the same for ED throw in some Armor linked to Absorb and you likely have a playable damage sponge...or use the DR and Defenses equal to the average Body of an attack and you are also good to go.....Either way in 5th they don't go into a frame work very well so just pay the points and be happy

[freakboy6117]

hmmm I'm working on a character with 9 lives i didnt just want him to regenrate or resurect i was thinking about some very powerful armour with the limitation only when damage would be fatal, so he might be badly injured when he was caught in a bomb blast but the explosion woudl carry him out the window into a mattress factory so would that work?

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

Re: Try this

 

Originally posted by Argus

I'm not going to do all the math, my book is not handy) but give this a try

 

15 Pd/Ed Force Field. (30 pts)

 

6d6 Absorption PD 1/2 Stun 1/2 Str (30 points) Linked to FF

6d6 Absorption ED 1/2 Stun 1/2 Str (30 Points) Linked to FF

20 PD Armor (30 points) Linked to FF, based on Absorption Roll

20 ED Armor (30 Points) Linked to FF, Based on Absorption Roll

Add your Damage Reduction and your set.

 

I personally find this construct problematic as well. First off it's expensive. 150 active points (a lot for defense) and 100 real as written.

 

Seconsly, a roll of 6d6 for Absorption would average 21, so it would be pretty rare for the character to have much less than 20 points of Armor. Given that I'm not sure that the 'Based on Absorption Roll' is really a hinderance in this build ... I personally wouldn't allow this limitation unless the armor were less.

 

Third, the effects are still staggering. Average of 35 rPD & rED on top of the characters normal PD & ED will yeald normal defenses that are likely over 40 each. A 12d6 blast averages only 42 stun. So with this build you would take 2 stun and the absorption would heal quite a bit. Grond's 24d6 attack above would probably stun & take down the PC since it averages 84 stun, but this construct is still pretty nasty.

 

In genearl for absorbers with linked defenses IMO balance is best gotten by only having PD or ED if you have high absorption ... or by keeping it low if you have both.

[farik]

Originally posted by freakboy6117

hmmm I'm working on a character with 9 lives i didnt just want him to regenrate or resurect i was thinking about some very powerful armour with the limitation only when damage would be fatal, so he might be badly injured when he was caught in a bomb blast but the explosion woudl carry him out the window into a mattress factory so would that work?

 

Personally If I was your GM I'd reccomend the Regeneration with Resurection built with Variable SFX and No Conscious Control. Then at my discretion your character will be beaten up nomrally but if your actually killed I can explain how you survived and how hurt you actually are when you stumble back into the scene the amount of regeneration you had would dictate how quickly you stumbled back into action.

[Argus]

Re: Re: Try this

 

Originally posted by Vanderbilt_Grad

I personally find this construct problematic as well. First off it's expensive. 150 active points (a lot for defense) and 100 real as written.

 

Seconsly, a roll of 6d6 for Absorption would average 21, so it would be pretty rare for the character to have much less than 20 points of Armor. Given that I'm not sure that the 'Based on Absorption Roll' is really a hinderance in this build ... I personally wouldn't allow this limitation unless the armor were less.

 

Third, the effects are still staggering. Average of 35 rPD & rED on top of the characters normal PD & ED will yeald normal defenses that are likely over 40 each. A 12d6 blast averages only 42 stun. So with this build you would take 2 stun and the absorption would heal quite a bit. Grond's 24d6 attack above would probably stun & take down the PC since it averages 84 stun, but this construct is still pretty nasty.

 

In genearl for absorbers with linked defenses IMO balance is best gotten by only having PD or ED if you have high absorption ... or by keeping it low if you have both.

 

First, Yes it is expensive, but if a player wants to spend a lot of point of defense.

 

Second the way he's built 21 points of absorption would yeld 14 PD (21 Active points into Armor gives you 14 Points of Armor)

 

3rd. Average PD/ED then would be 29, and yes a 42 point Attack would still do nothing to to the character. But a 44 point attack would.

 

It would make for a very tough character who could handle a lot. But one good NND and good by.

 

As soon as the force field goes down, or if it is already down, the character is toast.

 

I would allow the my build up before I would allow the other.

 

 

A.

[levi]

In the campaign I run, there is a character with Absorbtion tied to his PD, actually the absobtion points go to STR and he has additional Armor bought with the PLim Only up to the active points generated in Absorb by the attack.

 

I can say that short of attacking his Vuln, this guy is rarely put down.