Skills Based on Powers or Background

[Ninja-Bear]

I don’t mind buying the proper Weapon Familiarity for a Super even though I don’t have too.

[Cancer]

On June 22, 2019 at 12:14 PM, Christopher R Taylor said:

.... A good GM will find a way to make the skills matter if possible.

 

... And lot of GMs ... won't.

 

The threads in which I've ranted about this before are gone, I think, but I've concluded based on my experience that unless there are big discounts for background skills (or they are part of required character creation overhead cost, so you have to spend them on something), those are resources just flushed down the toilet.  The more granular the skill system, the less likely any given skill will ever be invoked.  Science and knowledge skills (which almost invariably get really specific) are the banner-carriers here.  And Perception and Deduction are never worth buying, because while in principle those should allow you to spot AND AVOID traps and all but the most diabolical ambushes and figure out AND SOLVE WITHOUT CLIMACTIC COMBAT mysteries but in fact neither is ever permitted to happen; as a player I have had that happen exactly once in the last 30 years at the table.

 

It galls me especially that knowledges and sciences and technologies are hypergranular in HERO but there's only one flavor of Stealth, so the Ninja is always a valuable, powerful character.  Stealth should be about as granular as knowledge, in terms of physical environment, tech level, and social environment.

[greysword]

11 hours ago, Vanguard said:

At character creation, i spend points on background skills and occupational skills.

 

After character creation I wind up spending points on acquiring skills I should have had at character creation but didn't have the points for as well as buying skills that could be used to assist any powers/abilities I have acquired over the course of game play.

 

I agree with this 100%, as I do this as well.

[Gnome BODY (important!)]

1 hour ago, Cancer said:

 

... And lot of GMs ... won't.

 

The threads in which I've ranted about this before are gone, I think, but I've concluded based on my experience that unless there are big discounts for background skills (or they are part of required character creation overhead cost, so you have to spend them on something), those are resources just flushed down the toilet.  The more granular the skill system, the less likely any given skill will ever be invoked.  Science and knowledge skills (which almost invariably get really specific) are the banner-carriers here.  And Perception and Deduction are never worth buying, because while in principle those should allow you to spot AND AVOID traps and all but the most diabolical ambushes and figure out AND SOLVE WITHOUT CLIMACTIC COMBAT mysteries but in fact neither is ever permitted to happen; as a player I have had that happen exactly once in the last 30 years at the table.

 

It galls me especially that knowledges and sciences and technologies are hypergranular in HERO but there's only one flavor of Stealth, so the Ninja is always a valuable, powerful character.  Stealth should be about as granular as knowledge, in terms of physical environment, tech level, and social environment.

Don't even get me started on the Perception/Stealth dynamic in a system with absolute invisibility and supersenses.  No quantity of points put into PER will match a well SFXed Spatial Awareness.  Ever!  No quantity of points put into Stealth will match a well chosen Invisibility.  Ever!  They're absolute effects in a game with skills that do the same thing. 

 

On the subject of background skills, the more I think about it the more I'm thinking that the way to go there is to pick backgrounds such that your background skills are complementary to the skills you care about.  Got a Power: Magnetic Wave Projection skill?  Sounds like you need Science Skill: Electromagnetism.  Want more Acrobatics?  Professional Skill: Gymnast is here to help!  But that gets into the dark waters of concept optimization. 

[Vanguard]

On 6/27/2019 at 4:06 PM, Ninja-Bear said:

I don’t mind buying the proper Weapon Familiarity for a Super even though I don’t have too.

 

I do this in the off chance that the enemy drops said weapon and/or I pick on up during the game.  While it's possible that the GM will say "Hey, that weapon is that type that you always use so you're good" there's the distinct possibility he won't so I like to have my bases covered.

[BoloOfEarth]

On 6/27/2019 at 8:31 PM, Cancer said:

And Perception and Deduction are never worth buying, because while in principle those should allow you to spot AND AVOID traps and all but the most diabolical ambushes and figure out AND SOLVE WITHOUT CLIMACTIC COMBAT mysteries but in fact neither is ever permitted to happen; as a player I have had that happen exactly once in the last 30 years at the table.

 

Having players make PER rolls is a frequent thing in my game (I'd say at least once a game session) and it has helped them discover clues to sort out many mysteries or give them other info they might not otherwise have.

 

As to Deduction, that actually came up last Sunday - I had all the players roll Deduction two different times,  for them to get a handle on what the bad girls** were most likely up to, given the various pieces of info the heroes had gathered.  They were also able to figure out that one of the big-bads has Danger Sense, so they're going to be able to work around that and set up a nice ambush (to be run tomorrow).  Should be a lot of fun.

 

I don't use Deduction all the time, as it seems to me that my basically spelling out a plot takes the fun (and feeling of accomplishment) out of the players figuring things out themselves.  But I've used it to jump-start things when the players seem to have hit a dead end, or to draw them away from going down the wrong roads.

 

**In this particular case, all of the superpowered baddies involved in the current adventure plot are female.

[Ninja-Bear]

Bolo I forgot about Deduction. I use it as a plot mover. The player may be stuck so make a roll cause the character can figure it out.